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2016 Postmortem
In reply to the discussion: What I'd like to say to anyone who likes Bernie best but is afraid he's unelectable... [View all]jeff47
(26,549 posts)67. I'm afraid it's you who are being shallow.
With regards to the 2008 election. Could near 10% unemployment along with the Dow at what 6 or 7,000, along with Sarah Palin showing repeatedly how incompetent she is have anything at all to do with our favorable result??
Pssst...There was more than one election on the 2008 ballot.
Might want to bother considering that when you're claiming to be the "deep" thinker.
if Hillary had been chosen, could she have possibly lost?
I think she would have had a closer election. Obama's large win in 2008 was partially driven by turning out voters who had stayed home the last several elections. Clinton would not have gotten those voters to bother turning out - they would have stayed home.
Before you answer, do please consider the 1974 election, & Nixon Administration duplicity.
Yes, I really need to turn my calendar back to 1974. It's so relevant to 2016 politics. The Dixiecrats are still totally affecting the Democratic party.
In the 2004 election, if the Democrats had been playing for "Republican-leaning independents" they would have gone with Wesley Clark, they didn't, they went for a New England liberal
No, they went for a candidate who was a liberal in his youth who campaigned as a centrist. Feel free to cite any "crazy liberal" positions Kerry pushed in 2004, oh you deep master of all things electoral.
And I don't know about you, buddy, but in 2000 I never regarded Al Gore as a candidate "playing to Republican-leaning independents"
Gore's campaign was all about being even further to the right than Bill Clinton. Lieberman was VP because he was further to the right than Clinton. Gore shut up about everything he worked for in the Senate in order to push more centrist crap.
Moreover, the 2006, 2010, and 2014 elections were NOT for President -- they're a whole different type of ballgame than the UPCOMING 2016 Presidential election.
Because the DNC doesn't come up with a national strategy in midterms.
And the DNC didn't push for candidates so centrist that they would not even admit to voting for Obama. And before you say "That was just Kentucky", they did the same kind of thing all over the country. 2010 and 2014, they pushed for "Republican lite" campaigns. 2006, they didn't.
Finally, do please provide us with all the "evidence" you have that people calling themselves "Independent" are not all that independent
You might have heard of this thing called "polling". You might also have heard of this company called Pew Research that does a whole lot of it. If you were a deep thinker, you might actually look at a bunch of their polling results and notice the trends.
But you really don't give a shit. You have the orthodoxy handed down on stone tablets in 1972. And it SHALL NOT be questioned. Anyone who loses is a liberal, despite whatever they said in their campaign. Anyone who wins is a centrist, despite what they said in their campaign. It shall always be true.
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What I'd like to say to anyone who likes Bernie best but is afraid he's unelectable... [View all]
rbnyc
Jun 2015
OP
I'm with you. I try not to give much time to the noise machine out there. Work hard
Jefferson23
Jun 2015
#1
I am with you. And - some advice to noise machine - multiple DEEPLY CONCERNED OPs by
djean111
Jun 2015
#2
True and it can take away from legitimate concerns that must be defined by the candidates
Jefferson23
Jun 2015
#20
Absolutely. It is frustrating for many of us, I do believe we have a wealth of available
Jefferson23
Jun 2015
#33
easy for me to say I guess. Here in blue CT Bernie will probably have really high
CTyankee
Jun 2015
#30
I hope that you put your biggest effort into electing Democratic legislators to the Senate and House
jwirr
Jun 2015
#100
It did work. But in 2008 it did not. People are sick and tired of negative campaigning and politics
jwirr
Jun 2015
#104
Better questions might be, "Why assume that large numbers of people who are willing to
winter is coming
Jul 2015
#173
Although we need to get rid of Citizens United, as long as the really big donors
maddiemom
Jun 2015
#39
It is sad that we have to live in a world post Citizens United where money is so important
Gothmog
Jun 2015
#73
Not to mention all the millions of small shareholders aligned against democracy.
raouldukelives
Jun 2015
#48
Small contributions are great and President Obama won in 2008 with small contributions
Gothmog
Jul 2015
#180
Very true. For me its a matter of dying on my feet than living on my knees.
raouldukelives
Jul 2015
#195
Now add in the rest of the super-PACs. Like the Koch brothers that was in the post I replied to.
jeff47
Jun 2015
#138
Perot got 18.9% of the popular vote... Those anti-free trade votes will be back this time!
cascadiance
Jun 2015
#83
Negative advertising works and without a well financed campaign the Kochs would bury Sanders
Gothmog
Jun 2015
#93
Keep in mind that when CU was decided almost everyone here said the same thing.
onenote
Jun 2015
#131
And yet negative ads work and I fear that the Kochs can bury Sanders with negative ads
Gothmog
Jul 2015
#177
Unfortunately that is also true of Hillary. If we are going to fight this fight on a who has the
jwirr
Jun 2015
#98
Not really in that Hillary Clinton should be able to compete with and keep the money fight close
Gothmog
Jul 2015
#176
I wasn't referring to Bernie. She can sell her soul but she is not going to be able to keep up with
jwirr
Jul 2015
#194
Without sufficient financial resources, I fear that Sanders will not be able to compete
Gothmog
Jul 2015
#175
How does work if Sanders lacks the financial resources to respond to negative ads?
Gothmog
Jul 2015
#187
I would not ever do anything to help a Republican in any fashion..they have proven lethal
Jefferson23
Jun 2015
#36
Keep in mind many of us are in states that would not be competitive for Clinton.
jeff47
Jun 2015
#56
In states like your's it is still important to work on local elections - if you can get anyone on
jwirr
Jun 2015
#110
Yes, note I didn't say I would stay home. Just that my president vote is probably meaningless. (nt)
jeff47
Jun 2015
#115
I will be with my daughter on her 18th birthday at her voter registration, she will vote for Bernie
Dont call me Shirley
Jun 2015
#109
That's wonderful about your daughter, so glad to hear it. The uphill battle they've
appalachiablue
Jun 2015
#112
I always took my kids to vote with me when they were little. It rubs off on them!
Dont call me Shirley
Jun 2015
#114
Here is a thread on Bernie's electability, starting with a video of Bernie's own words on the matter
merrily
Jun 2015
#32
If Obama could get 9 million Republicans to switch over to him in '08, why would that
Jefferson23
Jun 2015
#40
The middle class is ripe for the taking, where are they going to go for relief? That is my point.
Jefferson23
Jun 2015
#51
Indies and Republicans seem very receptive to things Bernie is saying, more than Hillary supporters.
merrily
Jun 2015
#68
I favor Bernie Sanders and I am prepared to vote for any Democratic candidate for President.
gordianot
Jun 2015
#46
Powerfully said, thank you. The gutting and abandonment of industrial and small town America
appalachiablue
Jun 2015
#118
I am not afraid that he is unelectable. That is nothing to fear; it's a fact.
Persondem
Jun 2015
#60
Oh, Bernie is great on the issues and I do not mind the Socialist tag one bit ...
Persondem
Jun 2015
#111
And if you are really sincere, do what Bernie does, almost NEVER criticize or even mention
randys1
Jun 2015
#101
I'm worried. Maybe I've watched too many movies like "The Ides of March" and TV series like "House
AikidoSoul
Jun 2015
#106
And your target audience are rank and file Dems ... who already plan to vote for Hillary ...
JoePhilly
Jun 2015
#137
If you elect him, prepare to see him become no more progressive as a President than Obama.
Arkana
Jun 2015
#162
the "inevitability" meme has given way to the "Bernie is unelectable" meme. nt
antigop
Jun 2015
#167