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2016 Postmortem

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Onlooker

(5,636 posts)
Sun Mar 20, 2016, 07:00 PM Mar 2016

Hillary and Bernie, two great candidates [View all]

I am Bernie supporter, but if you read my posts they are generally in defense of Hillary, and sometimes critical of Bernie. I don’t see this race as black and white. I don’t see Bernie as the great Democratic Socialist hope who leads us into a land of plenty or the ignorant idealist who will get nothing done. I don’t see Hillary as the consummate politician who will rewrite Washington or as the Darth Vader who will leave us in misery and embroiled in war.

This is a race between between two great people.

Bernie since his youth has maintained democratic socialist principles, and his principles were a strict litmus test for his action. Even his compromises often came after largely one-man-battle, such as his fight for single-payer health care. For most of his career, he believed in states’ rights. On issues like gun control and gay marriage he believed those should be local decisions. I think that was pragmatic, given his political position. He played a major role in creating the only liberal rural state in the nation, though Washington and Oregon are starting to come on board.

In his role, he had an advantage. He started with a liberal state with a largely homogeneous population, not only in terms of race, but in terms of Wall Street’s influence, of church influences, and even of big media influence. He did not face a strong Christian right or political right. But, to the extent possible he demonstrated in Vermont that progressive principles can work, and work very, very well.

Hillary traveled a different course than Bernie. She started as a Goldwater girl, but then went to Wellesley, the famous feminist college in the Boston area, and corresponded with the great community organizer Saul Alinsky. By her early 20s, she was a liberal Democrat. After she married Bill, she became an advocate for children and families. From there she moved up the ranks of the political establishment, arriving at the place she is now, the frontrunner in the Democratic Primary for President and an archetype for a woman president of the United States.

Throughout her career, she was to the left of center, earning her friends among women, blacks, Latinos, gays, and unions, even though she had her share of missteps and defeats. She has been driven by broad liberal goals and the pulse of her constituencies, not by timeless rock-solid principles. She does not shy away from difficult choices and cannot be beaten down by the machinations of her political enemies. She has been an active part of all the positive that has come out Washington, DC since the 1990s.

Bernie and Hillary are two great candidates. Both will change the United States for the better, but they bring very different qualities to the table. Hillary brings her toughness and the power of the Democratic establishment to wage political battles for political change. Bernie brings his integrity and the power of a social movement to effect political change. Hillary's goals are more liberal than left, and Bernie's are more left than liberal, but these two candidates are far from opposites. They might have very different approaches for bringing about change, but both of them have histories showing that they aim to make our society more equal, just, and safe.

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Indeed. I will proudly support either as our nominee. PeaceNikki Mar 2016 #1
Well Said! gainesvillenole Mar 2016 #2
Kumbaya and why I totally disagree insta8er Mar 2016 #3
Well, Hillary is quite popular around the world ... Onlooker Mar 2016 #12
And meanwhile we can send American troops and bombs to go and liberate some poor country insta8er Mar 2016 #13
FDR kept us out of Europe until genocide of Jews and others was well under way Onlooker Mar 2016 #14
Some people forgot that FDR was a pioneer in global trade Hereiam2005 Mar 2016 #35
You've just made a series, not of generalisations, but of half-truth generalisations. Joe Chi Minh Mar 2016 #71
You said "Bernie" (meaning Senator Sanders), and "libertarianism" in the same breath there. staggerleem Mar 2016 #36
On foreign affairs, Bernie is closer to Gary Johnson than to Obama Onlooker Mar 2016 #38
Where did you get that idea ? There are helpless, second-world countries Joe Chi Minh Mar 2016 #37
Bra-vo farleftlib Mar 2016 #69
Despite the direness of the topic, LOL. Joe Chi Minh Mar 2016 #70
K&R NCTraveler Mar 2016 #4
I agree with only half of your post pdsimdars Mar 2016 #5
That's nice Onlooker Mar 2016 #9
Looking objectively at their records, bernie is way better. Vattel Mar 2016 #56
I don't agree with any of your post ... Onlooker Mar 2016 #63
Hillary has a great resume, but she's not a great candidate. reformist2 Mar 2016 #6
Way too much sanity for a GD:P op. JaneyVee Mar 2016 #7
Kudos! A great model for both sides. nt LAS14 Mar 2016 #8
Message auto-removed Name removed Mar 2016 #10
Unity bot whatchamacallit Mar 2016 #11
Many Bernie "supporters" UglyGreed Mar 2016 #18
I'm a Bernie supporter, and I will be voting for Hillary if she's the nominee, but..... marmar Mar 2016 #15
Homework Assignment DownriverDem Mar 2016 #17
Sorry, but I know how she is, from a leftist perspective. marmar Mar 2016 #20
again we see the condescending argument from an HRC supporter navarth Mar 2016 #21
Amen my brother marmar Mar 2016 #29
Go Bernie liberal from boston Mar 2016 #54
Lol RANGERMAN89 Mar 2016 #31
I wish folks really knew Hillary DownriverDem Mar 2016 #16
I think we DO know Hillary marions ghost Mar 2016 #25
We know her, believe it. Supported & met her twice, BC once. 2008 Burndown uncovered all. appalachiablue Mar 2016 #60
2008--a big turn off marions ghost Mar 2016 #64
One great candidate PowerToThePeople Mar 2016 #19
Excellent post, and extremely rational. Amimnoch Mar 2016 #22
You are aware that you have a rec list and people can see it? Right? Autumn Mar 2016 #23
You didn't read my first paragraph, did you? Onlooker Mar 2016 #24
Surrreee. You know, this old Latina woman right here was a supporters of Hillary in 08. Autumn Mar 2016 #28
Apparently some people think you can't support Hillary Hereiam2005 Mar 2016 #34
You mean like FDR ? And JFK ? Joe Chi Minh Mar 2016 #42
Uh huh Read it. Looked at your recs and transparency page and your other posts. merrily Mar 2016 #59
I'm not a hero worshipper Onlooker Mar 2016 #61
Uh huh. merrily Mar 2016 #62
Thank you. shadowandblossom Mar 2016 #66
Bernie Butter - the low, low, low-priced spread. I won't buy it. I wouldn't even accept it free. merrily Mar 2016 #58
I never looked at someone's Rec List... Ino Mar 2016 #65
Bernie = good candidate. Hillary = not a good candidate, therefore ... ThePhilosopher04 Mar 2016 #26
I completely agree with your sentiment ... salinsky Mar 2016 #27
What you said. wryter2000 Mar 2016 #41
I have no problem voting for either. zappaman Mar 2016 #30
K&R nt LostOne4Ever Mar 2016 #32
Glad to finally meet an educated Bernie supporter Hereiam2005 Mar 2016 #33
Welcome to DU wryter2000 Mar 2016 #40
Thank you wryter2000 Mar 2016 #39
No, you're spouting nonsense. This will be an election race between ... DrBulldog Mar 2016 #43
I don't think either one is all that great of a candidate. bigwillq Mar 2016 #44
Agreed. I support Clinton, but think Sanders is giving a good speech in AZ right now. spooky3 Mar 2016 #45
K&R Dem2 Mar 2016 #46
I Agree. Supported Obama Over Hillary In 2008. TomCADem Mar 2016 #47
"I am Bernie supporter, but" = didn't really need to read the rest. djean111 Mar 2016 #48
that's hogwash in the form of a thin veneer of evenhandedness stupidicus Mar 2016 #49
I suspected without reading the replies... auntpurl Mar 2016 #50
Voted for Bernie March 1st and he won my state. mountain grammy Mar 2016 #51
This is a great post. Thank you so much. yardwork Mar 2016 #52
I will take a PASS on whom you support. merrily Mar 2016 #53
If Hillary takes the nomination, then I DEMAND ... nikto Mar 2016 #55
I agree IrishEyes Mar 2016 #57
The character of our candidates is the real story of this election randr Mar 2016 #67
Thanks Mary Mac Mar 2016 #68
I am definitely pro-Bernie rather than anti-Hillary gollygee Mar 2016 #72
Kick! LAS14 Mar 2016 #73
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