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kristopher

(29,798 posts)
40. I don't agree with your characterization of peer review.
Thu Nov 7, 2013, 07:51 PM
Nov 2013

So I ask (for what, the 4th time) what peer reviewed articles support your claim? I'm not asking for opinion pieces, I'm asking for technical analysis; so it shouldn't matter what journal it is in.

What convinced me was study of the problem from the ground up. I can point you to a couple of authoritative samples that go to the conclusions of what I've studied if you like, but I'd appreciate your admitting that there is no peer reviewed material that supports your view.

I gave you a sample of one nuclear advocacy study (MIT) that couldn't make the case, now let me share another with you. You might or might not have heard of David McKay's "Sustainable Energy Without the Hot Air".

It is about the only high level publication (it's a book) that makes a claim similar to yours, but it is a regional not a global analysis. Nonetheless it serves as another example of how the results are not easy to come by.

McKay is a respected researcher. His book that purports to make a numbers based study of the energy alternatives available to the UK. He lays out estimated "numbers" for all of the alternatives including demand in the first section. Next he has a section where there is a discussion of the meaning of the numbers, then, to support the first section, the final section gives hard data from reliable sources.

Here is how he fudges it.

...Let’s talk about energy consumption and energy production. At the moment, most of the energy the developed world consumes is produced from fossil fuels; that’s not sustainable. Exactly how long we could keep living on fossil fuels is an interesting question, but it’s not the question we’ll address in this book. I want to think about living without fossil fuels.

We’re going to make two stacks. In the left-hand, red stack we will add up our energy consumption, and in the right-hand, green stack, we’ll add up sustainable energy production. We’ll assemble the two stacks gradually, adding items one at a time as we discuss them.

The question addressed in this book is “can we conceivably live sustainably?” So, we will add up all conceivable sustainable energy sources and put them in the right-hand, green stack.

In the left-hand, red stack, we’ll estimate the consumption of a “typical moderately-affluent person;” I encourage you to tot up an estimate of your own consumption, creating your own personalized left-hand stack too. Later on we’ll also find out the current average energy consumption of Europeans and Americans. (pg 22)


Section one, where he is "estimating", proves conclusively that renewables cannot do the job.

Section three, which contains the real data, shows his "estimates" to be pure fiction.

Look for yourself. It will take some time, but it's right here http://www.withouthotair.com/

That is, I'm afraid, about as good as it gets in the area of supporting the claim you've made.

On the flip side, everyone from the IPCC, to the UN, to the IEA, to the National Academy of Sciences to the California Energy Commission, to the National Labs to Greenpeace has produced a work that validates the belief that we can and will move into the future with renewables.

The best thing they say about nuclear (there are two analysis that agree) is that if we move away from it sooner rather than later, it would have a nearly unnoticeable impact.





"Within five years" for the last 50 years. Warren Stupidity Nov 2013 #1
The technology has advanced a lot recently johnd83 Nov 2013 #5
"the technology has advanced" Warren Stupidity Nov 2013 #6
There really isn't a practical alternative except Thorium reactors johnd83 Nov 2013 #7
alrighty then, your agenda is way out in the open. Warren Stupidity Nov 2013 #8
Lol johnd83 Nov 2013 #11
Yup crystal clear. Wow. FogerRox Nov 2013 #14
Isnt this just a mirror machine. FogerRox Nov 2013 #2
It used to be four years GreydeeThos Nov 2013 #3
Everyones budget got cut johnd83 Nov 2013 #4
That was almost a year ago. 1 + 4 = 5. You do the math. Warren Stupidity Nov 2013 #9
Lacking information why it can be smaller. FogerRox Nov 2013 #10
Did you actually watch the video? johnd83 Nov 2013 #12
In an ignition machine you either raise the temp or the pressure FogerRox Nov 2013 #13
The field gradient is inverted johnd83 Nov 2013 #15
Sketchy? More like they dont exist. FogerRox Nov 2013 #16
Crawl, before you walk, before you run. PamW Nov 2013 #18
pressure & temp vs acceleration FogerRox Nov 2013 #22
Don't believe it. PamW Nov 2013 #17
The truck is just to transport the core to the plant site johnd83 Nov 2013 #19
That 14.1 MeV FogerRox Nov 2013 #23
Has anyone confined a plasma with a magnetic field whose gradients FogerRox Nov 2013 #26
"In my opinion..." kristopher Nov 2013 #20
It is an opinion shared by many engineers johnd83 Nov 2013 #25
So your opinion is backed by the opinion of other nonspecialists? kristopher Nov 2013 #27
James Hansen, Ken Caldeira, Kerry Emanuel and Tom Wigley? johnd83 Nov 2013 #28
You think climate science and global energy use are the same field? kristopher Nov 2013 #29
IEEE spectrum article johnd83 Nov 2013 #32
Sorry, that isn't peer reviewed. It is an opinion piece. kristopher Nov 2013 #34
"Ability" and "Feasibilty" are two different concepts johnd83 Nov 2013 #36
Then you should be able to show peer reviewed analysis that support your claim. kristopher Nov 2013 #37
Yes, but not from journals you would be happy with johnd83 Nov 2013 #38
I don't agree with your characterization of peer review. kristopher Nov 2013 #40
I have done many peer reviews johnd83 Nov 2013 #43
Clean energy is every bit as settled as climate change. kristopher Nov 2013 #45
It still doesn't change the number... johnd83 Nov 2013 #46
Did you even read what I wrote about the study? kristopher Nov 2013 #47
Huh? johnd83 Nov 2013 #48
What I mean is... kristopher Nov 2013 #49
I skimmed through "Electricity from Renewable Resources: Status, Prospects, and Impediments" johnd83 Nov 2013 #50
Another "I'd rather not have to admit I'm wrong" tangent, eh? kristopher Nov 2013 #51
Cheap fusion? Oh, God no, I hope not... hunter Nov 2013 #21
I think that is the main reason that I don't agree with a lot of people here about energy johnd83 Nov 2013 #24
Pushing the core problem of our civilization deeper into the future is not my idea of a "solution." hunter Nov 2013 #30
We still consider "freedom" to include reproduction johnd83 Nov 2013 #31
"Current nuclear energy" is a catastrophe waiting to happen. GliderGuider Nov 2013 #35
Alrighty-then johnd83 Nov 2013 #39
Firstly, the tech has not advanced particularly intaglio Nov 2013 #33
Thats exactly why there has been more interest in the proton Boron 11 fuel recently FogerRox Nov 2013 #52
Back it up with facts, now it is worse than thin. ... CRH Nov 2013 #41
Magnetic Fusion, please repeat after me, ... CRH Nov 2013 #42
... Did you watch the video? johnd83 Nov 2013 #44
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