Welcome to DU! The truly grassroots left-of-center political community where regular people, not algorithms, drive the discussions and set the standards. Join the community: Create a free account Support DU (and get rid of ads!): Become a Star Member Latest Breaking News General Discussion The DU Lounge All Forums Issue Forums Culture Forums Alliance Forums Region Forums Support Forums Help & Search

General Discussion

Showing Original Post only (View all)
 

Ken Burch

(50,254 posts)
Tue Jun 13, 2017, 06:15 AM Jun 2017

Democrats have nothing to gain be telling Bernie and his supporters to go to hell [View all]

We need support wherever we can get it.

We need people willing to do the hard work of electing Democrats. Young activist types are the people most likely to do that work, if we simply make them feel welcome and make it clear that this is a place that is hospitable to what they stand for .

And we need to be the party of those left out in the cold by the status quo. Even with the intemperance they sometimes display in expressing their opinions, the people drawn to the Sanders message have a better handle on how to do that and how to connect with the voters we need to win over(without abandoning our current base)than anyone defending the status quo approach against them.

It's simple...if we say we won't stand up to corporate power, if we put the rich man's priority of low inflation and deficit reduction over the people's priorities of full employment, climate justice and an end to poverty(which is what treating Bernie and his supporters must mean), we are choosing to repeat the 2016 result...over and over and over again.

We'll be choosing not to even try to win anymore-because making those choices means making it impossible to increase our vote totals anywhere.

We'll be stuck forever where we were in November-never winning more than 49% in any presidential election (and thus never winning in the Electoral College again)never retaking Congress, never recovering ground in any state legislature). What would we gain be choosing never to be popular as a party again. never to stand for anything again, no longer having any reason to exist?

Why stay with what we know can never work?

That's what fomenting an anti-Bernie backlash means folks...it means choosing permanent defeat.

Bernie will never be our nominee...but we stand for nothing if we make him a prophet without honor and if we drive his supporters away, if we make it clear that his campaign's values will not be part of this party, if we vow(as doing all of that means we must vow)that nothing will change from here on in.

And yes, there are other progressives in the party-but we all know that, if Bernie and his supporters are driven away, those other progressives can never win the argument within the party. The "all that matters is the big donors" faction will always guarantee that the party doesn't take progressive positions on any issues other than those that don't threaten the rich and those that can't liberate anyone.

Do we WANT to be stuck in November, 2016, for the rest of eternity?

Do any of us believe we can win as a party with no passion, a party that can never feel the fierce urgency of now? A party that would NEVER say "We Can't Wait!"?


Of course not. We know better than that.

So why even chance it?


271 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
Highlight: NoneDon't highlight anything 5 newestHighlight 5 most recent replies
all this anti and pro bernie stuff is THE fake news attempt to breed discontent beachbum bob Jun 2017 #1
Yup jberryhill Jun 2017 #2
this will be my first and laast comment on anything bernie sanders beachbum bob Jun 2017 #3
I agree, this is getting very tireing to even see thread. Bye Jim Beard Jun 2017 #34
I'm pro-America. Ken Burch Jun 2017 #4
Exactly! FarPoint Jun 2017 #6
don't have to embrace but definitely quit lobbing grenades beachbum bob Jun 2017 #20
Yeap YCHDT Jun 2017 #39
Do I hear outcry for WOC and their needs and input? justiceischeap Jun 2017 #5
I'm with you on WOC and their needs and input. So are virtually all Sanders supporters. Ken Burch Jun 2017 #7
I supported Keith Ellison justiceischeap Jun 2017 #8
"I also have huge issues with his constant barrage of divisive speech towards the party ..." LenaBaby61 Jun 2017 #12
Same here justiceischeap Jun 2017 #32
Fair enough. Ken Burch Jun 2017 #16
I have plenty of friends that view the 90's very favorably justiceischeap Jun 2017 #33
"Bernie REFUSES to join the Democratic Party" nocalflea Jun 2017 #28
Agreed Gothmog Jun 2017 #112
Any post mentioning Bernie is guaranteed flamebait SecularMotion Jun 2017 #9
Yes. And that is crazy and on its face should be unacceptable Tom Rinaldo Jun 2017 #41
For 25 years, 96% of the time he voted with the Democrats. Hortensis Jun 2017 #149
He still exists. He is still trying to promote democratic ideas. He is still in the news. I still The Wielding Truth Jun 2017 #62
I would love for him to promote Democratic ideas...however attacking the Demoratic Party is Demsrule86 Jun 2017 #122
I do. I understand why. NurseJackie Jun 2017 #191
You don't have to tell Bernie to go to hell. I just do not share his vision. That is my right. Trust Buster Jun 2017 #10
Is this a novel-in-progress or a film script? delisen Jun 2017 #11
"Election Day" as a dark remake of "Groundhog Day"? nt Buns_of_Fire Jun 2017 #14
...and vice versa OKNancy Jun 2017 #13
He's not a presidential candidate now. Ken Burch Jun 2017 #15
issues, maybe but on a personal level OKNancy Jun 2017 #18
i think because he wanted Obama to be primaried in 2012 JI7 Jun 2017 #19
Ding! Ding! Ding! Some of us, myself included, will never get over that. n/t Tarheel_Dem Jun 2017 #90
He did...and we probably would have lost just like in 16...only sooner. Demsrule86 Jun 2017 #235
If he is trying to reshape the party, to what degree does his own personality matter? Ken Burch Jun 2017 #55
LOL! NurseJackie Jun 2017 #60
It's a legitimate question. He's trying to give the voices from below more of a say. Ken Burch Jun 2017 #74
LOL! NurseJackie Jun 2017 #77
Below where? What voices...everyone can express their ideas...but they can't just assume power they Demsrule86 Jun 2017 #236
I gotta lol Control-Z Jun 2017 #116
If he's trying to "reshape the party" NastyRiffraff Jun 2017 #210
Look, I wish he'd join myself. Ken Burch Jun 2017 #216
Okay, I'll try to explain, in simple terms NastyRiffraff Jun 2017 #219
I hear you...but at the same time, it's not just HIM wanting to do this restructuring. Ken Burch Jun 2017 #223
I despise "our revolutio"n which wastes money primarying Democrats...in the age of Trump, they go Demsrule86 Jun 2017 #237
It matters. Your standards may differ personally... NurseJackie Jun 2017 #225
Your analysis is wrong as normal Gothmog Jun 2017 #113
I proved I live in the real world Ken Burch Jun 2017 #115
Please get out into the real world Gothmog Jun 2017 #128
You don't have to be a left-hating centrist to be in the real world. Ken Burch Jun 2017 #138
The real world is a nice place and there are important things to be done in the real world Gothmog Jun 2017 #139
This is abuse. I've proved over and over I'm in the real world. Ken Burch Jun 2017 #141
I picked a group that has Sanders supporters Gothmog Jun 2017 #147
Why do you assume I do nothing in the real world? Ken Burch Jun 2017 #148
Your posts speak for themselves Gothmog Jun 2017 #164
They are the posts of a progressive who has been active in real-world politics for decades. Ken Burch Jun 2017 #173
I am free to draw my own conclusions from your posts Gothmog Jun 2017 #174
Every movement for change in human history has been called unworkable. Ken Burch Jun 2017 #176
Again, your recommendations would be more believable if you ever worked in the real world Gothmog Jun 2017 #178
I live in the real world. Ken Burch Jun 2017 #185
Again, your posts speak for themselves and tells the world about your real world involvement Gothmog Jun 2017 #192
Excellent advice... NurseJackie Jun 2017 #197
Gothmog never said any such thing Cary Jun 2017 #166
👍 NurseJackie Jun 2017 #169
LOL Gothmog Jun 2017 #183
I heard otherwise. _BravoMan_ Jun 2017 #171
That is untrue. Demsrule86 Jun 2017 #179
Bernie is not running for anything...I like certain Democratic politicians, Demsrule86 Jun 2017 #17
Nah. nt Maven Jun 2017 #21
Perhaps it would be appropriate for Sen Sanders and some of his supporters mcar Jun 2017 #22
+1 brer cat Jun 2017 #27
Amen.... Adrahil Jun 2017 #42
If they keep doing the same thing, Democrats will keep losing. alarimer Jun 2017 #23
'We need support wherever we can get it.' dansolo Jun 2017 #24
Bernie's insults are a gift to us Maven Jun 2017 #30
Hi, Maven... NurseJackie Jun 2017 #81
Back atcha Maven Jun 2017 #99
:) BainsBane Jun 2017 #95
... Maven Jun 2017 #100
:) brer cat Jun 2017 #132
TY Maven Jun 2017 #135
Love your post, Maven! NastyRiffraff Jun 2017 #211
That goes both ways IMHO Proud Liberal Dem Jun 2017 #25
No but it seems that SOME Bernie supporters... nycbos Jun 2017 #26
I think things would work better if WhiteTara Jun 2017 #29
Jesus Christ on a trailer hitch... Fix The Stupid Jun 2017 #35
I'd appreciate you using your inside voice. WhiteTara Jun 2017 #40
Post removed Post removed Jun 2017 #43
When the investigations are complete WhiteTara Jun 2017 #50
Are you sure you're on the right site? Maven Jun 2017 #66
That's what the republicans are saying over and over and over again - "there is no evidence....." George II Jun 2017 #76
It's also what the TYT/Intercept crowd is saying Maven Jun 2017 #79
They're getting their financial support from the same people. George II Jun 2017 #88
Donald Fucking Trump was RIGGED in by the Russians.. Cha Jun 2017 #72
Why do you refer to Democrats as "you" lapucelle Jun 2017 #103
That bothers me too. It's very annoying... NurseJackie Jun 2017 #201
Key word being "support." Orsino Jun 2017 #31
Great post. Unite...don't divide. n/t Fix The Stupid Jun 2017 #36
We have to treasure our divisions... Orsino Jun 2017 #38
We need to be a big tent party and some will get that or not...we will have to carry on without Demsrule86 Jun 2017 #44
And perhaps not be so eager to attack those who might almost be in our party. n/t Orsino Jun 2017 #45
No anyone who is not a Democrat especially in the age of Trump is a freeloader and I have no use for Demsrule86 Jun 2017 #47
I'm referring to making the tent bigger. Orsino Jun 2017 #49
Anyone who wants to join can join the party...if you mean admit Greens to the Demsrule86 Jun 2017 #78
If a green decides to vote Democrat BainsBane Jun 2017 #97
I welcome their vote also...but I will not give them a say in how the Democratic party is run and Demsrule86 Jun 2017 #124
The party's run by those who show up... Orsino Jun 2017 #131
The party is run by those who join it...not voters who show up but are not Democrats. Demsrule86 Jun 2017 #133
If they're not joining, they aren't showing up in any capacity that would grant them a say. Orsino Jun 2017 #134
Agreed...on every point...but I think some who join recently should have some say...new ideas should Demsrule86 Jun 2017 #136
Yeah. The parable of the vineyard is lost on some. n/t Orsino Jun 2017 #137
Well said. BainsBane Jun 2017 #96
One side just held a large rally where they couldn't help but bash Dems. SaschaHM Jun 2017 #37
Damn Straight, Sascha! I'm sick of this Orwellian Cha Jun 2017 #73
Yes, but Bernie telling the Democratic Party to "go to hell" maxrandb Jun 2017 #46
I have never seen someone work so hard to make Sanders and his supporters... NCTraveler Jun 2017 #48
There is nothing to be gained by Bernie and some progressives trashing the Democratic Party. hrmjustin Jun 2017 #51
[x] Like for your post...eom Kolesar Jun 2017 #53
Damn right, it's offensive and ridiculous to do so. elleng Jun 2017 #52
No, it doesn't. Not even close. BS keeps insulting Cha Jun 2017 #71
Sorry we disagree, Cha, elleng Jun 2017 #82
He is going to get called out on it. Cha Jun 2017 #83
Many call him out on telling the truth. elleng Jun 2017 #85
Yeah and many many all over the net & twitter call him on his insults. It's Cha Jun 2017 #86
LOL! NurseJackie Jun 2017 #109
Uncertainty, More Than Populism, Is New Normal in Western Politics. elleng Jun 2017 #110
Another "broken record" repeat of Sanders' boring talking points...eom Kolesar Jun 2017 #54
Yep. NurseJackie Jun 2017 #67
+Millions! Cha Jun 2017 #87
Northam just won the VA Democratic primary. lapucelle Jun 2017 #104
I know! Cha Jun 2017 #105
And, there's this.. Cha Jun 2017 #106
I'm very pleased with those results. NurseJackie Jun 2017 #107
I know, right?! Cha Jun 2017 #108
Black voters don't hate EVERYBODY who's connected with Bernie. Ken Burch Jun 2017 #157
I didn't say they did. Not too happy Cha Jun 2017 #158
He said that, not the candidates he supports. Ken Burch Jun 2017 #161
"Black voters don't hate EVERYBODY who's connected with Bernie." Not so sure. n/t Tarheel_Dem Jun 2017 #160
THere was nothing better about Northam. Ken Burch Jun 2017 #144
I don't agree. lapucelle Jun 2017 #150
My support needs to be EARNED. I don't give it away for free. NurseJackie Jun 2017 #56
This +1000! mcar Jun 2017 #68
and one man isn't an ideology BainsBane Jun 2017 #91
You are correct. NurseJackie Jun 2017 #98
The entire situation reminds me of a fan club...not a political movement. Demsrule86 Jun 2017 #125
This, to the inth power! Tarheel_Dem Jun 2017 #101
+1 betsuni Jun 2017 #111
Where and when have "Democrats" told Sanders to go to hell? George II Jun 2017 #57
Yes, thank you! I was wondering the same thing... NurseJackie Jun 2017 #58
Exactly. Straw man. murielm99 Jun 2017 #64
"Why, why and why?" Good questions! I believe I know the correct answers to all three... NurseJackie Jun 2017 #65
We told 'em to think and they thought it was hell Kolesar Jun 2017 #69
I don't think either side should tell the other to go to hell. kentuck Jun 2017 #59
Show me where BS supporters murielm99 Jun 2017 #70
That's what I'm saying. Ken Burch Jun 2017 #75
Nope. NurseJackie Jun 2017 #80
Exactly right. Really wish the OP would be corrected or made to fit explanations Justice Jun 2017 #84
It'll never happen ... NurseJackie Jun 2017 #93
What I posted doesn't have to be "neutral". It simply has to be fair. Ken Burch Jun 2017 #117
LOL! Well, actually... yes you did. NurseJackie Jun 2017 #119
It's only refighting to argue that we should have nominated Bernie. Ken Burch Jun 2017 #145
That's not what your OP is about. Why change the subject... NurseJackie Jun 2017 #163
Not deflecting. Proving my innocence on the charge of refighting the primaries. Ken Burch Jun 2017 #172
LOL ... Yeah right. Sure. Whatever. NurseJackie Jun 2017 #175
If history is a lesson...Bernie voters can't win a primary. And I dispute your election Demsrule86 Jun 2017 #123
Fine, Northam won. Ken Burch Jun 2017 #142
You can't say that for sure. And there is no evidence his abortion views hurt him. Demsrule86 Jun 2017 #152
Nobody else wanted to run. Ken Burch Jun 2017 #155
There was a Democratic candidate...Northam...perfectly fine guy...defended women Demsrule86 Jun 2017 #159
I was talking about Montana. Ken Burch Jun 2017 #162
The Sanders endorsed candidate lost because of the African American vote Gothmog Jun 2017 #184
We don't have to repudiate Bernie to hold African-American votes. Ken Burch Jun 2017 #187
Sanders goal of remaking the party into his image requires that the party reject its base Gothmog Jun 2017 #188
That is absolutely not true. Ken Burch Jun 2017 #189
The votes in the real world say otherwise Gothmog Jun 2017 #193
Wasn't Bernie the one who slammed "Identity Politics"? NastyRiffraff Jun 2017 #212
Correct. NurseJackie Jun 2017 #190
Good points throughout - but you are talking to some closed minds KTM Jun 2017 #240
Agreed Gothmog Jun 2017 #140
NOr....More Importantly Me. Jun 2017 #154
It's not about making the party "into the image of Sanders". Ken Burch Jun 2017 #156
Ken-you are wrong yet again Gothmog Jun 2017 #168
It's merely criticism when we tell their supporters to go to hell. LanternWaste Jun 2017 #61
Oh-Oh. nt Blue_true Jun 2017 #63
"Telling them to go to hell" BainsBane Jun 2017 #89
It's simply a lie to claim that anyone with my views has called on the party Ken Burch Jun 2017 #118
LOL! NurseJackie Jun 2017 #120
None of us have. Ken Burch Jun 2017 #143
Anytime you bust out the emojis, it is proof you have no argument. Ken Burch Jun 2017 #146
LOL NurseJackie Jun 2017 #165
Additionally, there is zero evidence that your perscription is a winning one BainsBane Jun 2017 #92
Bernie was my choice but what matters most is uniting to defeat Trump and Rs MiltonBrown Jun 2017 #94
Well said. fallout87 Jun 2017 #102
According to a bernie campaign worker, there were a large number of bernie staffers in VA Gothmog Jun 2017 #114
I agree...my family has been in Virginia for years two of my brothers were born there... Demsrule86 Jun 2017 #126
The election is over. We have more important things to worry about than this... Demsrule86 Jun 2017 #121
I have nothing but CONTEMPT for the Independent. Foamfollower Jun 2017 #127
He caucused with the Democratic Party for decades. n/t That Guy 888 Jun 2017 #202
.... betsuni Jun 2017 #129
If we follow the bad advice from some of whom you refer to we will be stuck in November 2016 IE Demsrule86 Jun 2017 #180
I have no idea what the argument is, really. betsuni Jun 2017 #181
Not a bad idea...I happen to love poetry. Demsrule86 Jun 2017 #200
Perriello was just as electable as Northam. Ken Burch Jun 2017 #195
No he was not. He would have been branded as a socialist and Demsrule86 Jun 2017 #199
The voters in Virginia strongly disagreed Gothmog Jun 2017 #203
Ok, you made a poem out of my post...so what? Ken Burch Jun 2017 #194
Hey man, do not disparage my hobby! betsuni Jun 2017 #196
No disparagement of your hobby intended Ken Burch Jun 2017 #207
Agree. ananda Jun 2017 #130
Totally agree. UNITY in 2018 & 2020 will be CRUCIAL. CousinIT Jun 2017 #151
'Make Him A Prophet Without Honor' Me. Jun 2017 #153
Black Voters Will Be Democratic Kingmakers in 2020 Gothmog Jun 2017 #167
I Hope So Me. Jun 2017 #170
Can I tell Bernie to go register as a Democrat? His supporters, if they want to be taken seriously, LuvLoogie Jun 2017 #177
If Sanders wants to remake the party into his own image, he should join the party Gothmog Jun 2017 #186
Why Bernie Sanders is not the answer to every election Gothmog Jun 2017 #182
I didn't say Bernie was the answer to EVERY election. But we can't win if we totally repudiate Ken Burch Jun 2017 #208
Your attempt at analysis is wrong Gothmog Jun 2017 #209
Thank you Gothmob NastyRiffraff Jun 2017 #214
Sanders economic message failed in Texas Gothmog Jun 2017 #220
I've been in the real world for decades. I've proved that. Ken Burch Jun 2017 #224
Again your posts speak for themselves Gothmog Jun 2017 #230
I'm a RETURNING college student. At Evergreen, not U of W. Ken Burch Jun 2017 #231
+1 KTM Jun 2017 #241
Ken, not everything is about you. Cary Jul 2017 #271
Very cogent, Gothmog... Hekate Jun 2017 #232
California is leading the fight against trump is so many different ways Gothmog Jun 2017 #233
California is heavily Latino, and the coast is mostly liberal. As soon as you get inland, though... Hekate Jun 2017 #239
I keep asking this question of people without an answer.... George II Jun 2017 #213
You might want to check the grammar in that sentence. Ken Burch Jun 2017 #215
Probably not, I'm stuck on my phone...but, George II Jun 2017 #217
"those we're losing TO"? Ken Burch Jun 2017 #218
By magic La Lioness Priyanka Jun 2017 #256
LOL NurseJackie Jun 2017 #222
I have to say upon reading your posts...something jumps out at me...you seem to think Sen. Sanders Demsrule86 Jun 2017 #234
Message auto-removed Name removed Jun 2017 #198
The funny thing about some of the posts here against Sanders That Guy 888 Jun 2017 #204
How did Bernie do in the CA primary again? La Lioness Priyanka Jun 2017 #206
Uh...he lost. Expecting Rain Jun 2017 #221
He lost, but it was a very close vote Ken Burch Jun 2017 #227
she won in 2008 against Obama also JI7 Jun 2017 #228
I know. A close finish then. I accepted her as nominee and worked hard in the fall for her. Ken Burch Jun 2017 #229
400,000 is NOT a "very close vote" brooklynite Jun 2017 #238
Neither is 43% a small segment of the vote. KTM Jun 2017 #244
Why is it so hard for people to see that, if we blend the best ideas of Bernie's campaign Ken Burch Jun 2017 #248
Ken in the real world, these platform planks have failed Gothmog Jun 2017 #257
I've proved I live in the real world. Ken Burch Jun 2017 #261
Your posts again speak for themselves Gothmog Jun 2017 #264
I've proved I've participated in the real world for decades. Ken Burch Jun 2017 #266
Your posts speak for themselves and your platform has lost every time it was tried Gothmog Jun 2017 #268
it's always news to me that 7 point margin is close La Lioness Priyanka Jun 2017 #245
53% to 46% is a fairly close outcome. Ken Burch Jun 2017 #246
it's amazing how you can read the mind of HRC voters who clearly voted for her in large nubmers La Lioness Priyanka Jun 2017 #247
OK, a lot of them liked her as well(nothing I'm saying here is an attack on her, y'know). Ken Burch Jun 2017 #249
why can't you stop demeaning all her voters as not having liked her La Lioness Priyanka Jun 2017 #250
I accept that she won the nomination...I campaigned for her in the fall...why isn't that enough? Ken Burch Jun 2017 #252
Lol yeah there is nothing sexist at all denying that 7 points is hardly a victory La Lioness Priyanka Jun 2017 #253
I said it was a victory. And I accept that er supporters had the right to vote the way they did. Ken Burch Jun 2017 #254
You started a thread on Bernie and his supporters La Lioness Priyanka Jun 2017 #255
Great post Gothmog Jun 2017 #259
Ken how did the Sanders supported candidates do in New York, Florida, Montana and Virginia? Gothmog Jun 2017 #258
No Dem could've won that seat in Montana. The guy we did run cut the margin from 20 points to 6 Ken Burch Jun 2017 #260
You had an opponent who committed assault and battery Gothmog Jun 2017 #262
The assault and battery occurred on election eve. Ken Burch Jun 2017 #265
The Sanders endorsed candidate still lost the election day vote Gothmog Jun 2017 #267
Those voters had issues with Bernie as a person-none of those groups are anti-left. Ken Burch Jun 2017 #270
LOL. ok, then. La Lioness Priyanka Jun 2017 #205
Look, folks, it's simple: 1) Vote for the most progressive... Beartracks Jun 2017 #226
It doesn't matter. romanic Jun 2017 #242
Its a sad statement about this forum.... KTM Jun 2017 #243
Agree!!! I like Bernie, and, also the Democratic Party! n/t RKP5637 Jun 2017 #251
Exactly nt retrowire Jun 2017 #263
The river flows both ways, Ken... Blue_Tires Jun 2017 #269
Latest Discussions»General Discussion»Democrats have nothing to...