General Discussion

BainsBane

(53,032 posts) Mon Aug 25, 2014, 08:23 PM Aug 2014

On Marx and Leftism [View all]

25 votes, 2 passes \| Time left: Unlimited
	I consider myself a leftist, have read Marx, and support many of his core principals
	12 (48%)
	I consider myself a leftist, have read Marx, but do not support his core principals
	1 (4%)
	I consider myself a leftist and have never read Marx
	2 (8%)
	I consider myself a centrist and have read Marx
	1 (4%)
	I consider myself a centrist and have not read Marx
	1 (4%)
	Marx is irrelevant to my concetpion of leftist politics
	5 (20%)
	I consider myself a leftist, have read Marx, and support some of his ideas/analysis
	3 (12%)
	2 DU members did not wish to select any of the options provided.
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107 replies

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On Marx and Leftism [View all] BainsBane Aug 2014 OP

I concur with his analysis of capitalism leftstreet Aug 2014 #1

That capitalism is exploitative by nature BainsBane Aug 2014 #4

Right. That came from his analysis leftstreet Aug 2014 #6

It is an ideology that frames how one understands society BainsBane Aug 2014 #9

Right leftstreet Aug 2014 #11

OK, I think we can more or less agree on that. Now what? Adrahil Aug 2014 #106

I've read The Communist Manifesto a few times and do support some of his principles. TexasTowelie Aug 2014 #2

You don't think one conveys that? BainsBane Aug 2014 #3

Check my ETA. TexasTowelie Aug 2014 #7

I see BainsBane Aug 2014 #8

When Marx and his followers call for the 'elimination of private property,' it is VanGoghRocks Aug 2014 #51

Private property is itself a creation of capitalism BainsBane Aug 2014 #56

Private property was around way before capitalism started muriel_volestrangler Aug 2014 #61

That is not true BainsBane Aug 2014 #65

As an example, the Roman Republic had ownership of land muriel_volestrangler Aug 2014 #70

That could well be BainsBane Aug 2014 #84

Why are you 'certain' of that? muriel_volestrangler Aug 2014 #87

Do you know of documentation of land sales BainsBane Aug 2014 #100

yes: muriel_volestrangler Aug 2014 #102

ummm... the concept of a free holding yeoman or franklin pre-exists the Early-Modern period.... Adrahil Aug 2014 #98

holding land is not owning land. There is a key distinction, as I already made clear. BainsBane Aug 2014 #101

Medieval free-holders DID own their land. Adrahil Aug 2014 #107

Thank you for making that distinguishment between private and personal property. TexasTowelie Aug 2014 #57

Wow, this is a big topic to get into here and maybe not well-suited to this forum. Here's what I can VanGoghRocks Aug 2014 #64

Thanks for the explanation. TexasTowelie Aug 2014 #86

I don't think "From each according to his ability, to each according to his need" is a nomorenomore08 Aug 2014 #5

What is your issue with it, if you're willing to share? Shankapotomus Aug 2014 #12

I said it's NOT a fundamentally bad idea. nomorenomore08 Aug 2014 #15

lol Sorry nt Shankapotomus Aug 2014 #18

That's okay. Didn't mean to snap at you. nomorenomore08 Aug 2014 #19

No worries Shankapotomus Aug 2014 #45

It's never worked when tried. 3rdwaydem Aug 2014 #13

Depends what you mean by "tried." Many would argue that most self-proclaimed Communist regimes nomorenomore08 Aug 2014 #16

because its not realistic. There's no legitimate provision for individual CAG Aug 2014 #20

Very well put CAG! 3rdwaydem Aug 2014 #23

/ignore [n/t] Maedhros Aug 2014 #68

while I agree with what you are saying, I wonder why I don't consider myself a centrist Tuesday Afternoon Aug 2014 #25

It's not either/or. In fact, there is arguably almost no country that is purely capitalist *or* nomorenomore08 Aug 2014 #44

capitalism is based on greed and explitation of labor BainsBane Aug 2014 #46

On those points I am in complete agreement with you. TexasTowelie Aug 2014 #60

If anything leads to "utter corruption and perversion" TBF Aug 2014 #52

Nonsense. The only proscription is against owning OTHER PEOPLE'S means of production eridani Aug 2014 #58

Thats just silly CAG Aug 2014 #59

What's silly about it? eridani Aug 2014 #63

and what are all of those "business partners" supposed to do for money CAG Aug 2014 #80

We've never had publicly owned banks before either eridani Aug 2014 #83

Look! Republican talking points on DU! Maedhros Aug 2014 #67

oh, for god's sake, democrats can't be capitalists now???? CAG Aug 2014 #76

I suspect Elizabeth Warren would agree with my statements, does that make CAG Aug 2014 #82

Star Trek is set in a socialist\communist milieu. (Ever see any money changing hands VanGoghRocks Aug 2014 #69

I was unaware Star Trek was non-fiction and described a real-world, er, CAG Aug 2014 #77

Come on, CAG, where's your imagination? Star Trek is the 'history of the VanGoghRocks Aug 2014 #79

Live long and prosper.... but don't prosper too much, you might be CAG Aug 2014 #81

Oddly enough, I was reading some commentary on the Lubbock Avalanche-Journal TexasTowelie Aug 2014 #88

Because so many Russians are clamoring for the return of the Czar. Viva VanGoghRocks Aug 2014 #66

It is particularly dangerous to progressivism Puzzledtraveller Aug 2014 #91

As an idea it's fine. It's implementing it where things fall to pieces. NT Adrahil Aug 2014 #99

Like I said, nothing has to be an absolute. I just think it's a decent general principle. n/t nomorenomore08 Aug 2014 #104

Well, I certainly agree with that. :) NT Adrahil Aug 2014 #105

I'm familiar with Marxism mostly through intermediaries Shankapotomus Aug 2014 #10

My overall stance is probably quite similar to yours. nomorenomore08 Aug 2014 #17

I think all of us have some beliefs that are far left. I would also say that I am "moderate left." 3rdwaydem Aug 2014 #24

I'm not sure what kind of support you wanted, but....... socialist_n_TN Aug 2014 #14

That's the support I wanted! BainsBane Aug 2014 #35

Hear, hear. I also voted for option #1, fwiw VanGoghRocks Aug 2014 #71

Me too........ socialist_n_TN Aug 2014 #85

LOL. KG Aug 2014 #21

I think reading Marx and subsequent political economists lovemydog Aug 2014 #22

Great suggestions! BainsBane Aug 2014 #26

I had no idea this was such a literate bunch Warpy Aug 2014 #27

The responses are by nature self-selective BainsBane Aug 2014 #28

More precisely than that. Chan790 Aug 2014 #47

Well, they didn't call it the Red Scare for nothing YoungDemCA Aug 2014 #50

They were still pussyfooting around it in AP history in the mid 60s Warpy Aug 2014 #62

I put Marx in the same category as utopian fiction sarisataka Aug 2014 #29

Then you miss his major importance BainsBane Aug 2014 #30

Admittedly I have mostly read his communism writing sarisataka Aug 2014 #31

Foucault is of course enormously important BainsBane Aug 2014 #43

I respectfully disagree. lovemydog Aug 2014 #33

Good points sarisataka Aug 2014 #38

Thank you saristataka. lovemydog Aug 2014 #39

Thanks to you as well lovemydog sarisataka Aug 2014 #42

Excellent point about capitalism as based on Utopian fiction BainsBane Aug 2014 #48

Sigh. Is there anything specific in Marx' and Engels' corpus with which you VanGoghRocks Aug 2014 #72

Several items sarisataka Aug 2014 #89

So much here to take issue with, one hardly knows where to start. You're right that VanGoghRocks Aug 2014 #94

Very astute sarisataka Aug 2014 #103

I think I am more ZombieHorde Aug 2014 #32

What's post left? lovemydog Aug 2014 #34

Hakim Bey is probably the most famous post-left advocate. ZombieHorde Aug 2014 #36

Thank you ZH! lovemydog Aug 2014 #37

+1, post-leftism ftw. joshcryer Aug 2014 #41

I disagree with Marx on implementation, but the core ideas are sound. joshcryer Aug 2014 #40

Anyone who holds that capitalism was either naturally or historically inevitable should study more YoungDemCA Aug 2014 #49

Well, Marx himself viewed capitalism as largely inevitable and *beneficial*, although VanGoghRocks Aug 2014 #73

Haven't read any Marx yet shenmue Aug 2014 #53

My ambition is to read Das Kapital in German before I die. I'm going to have VanGoghRocks Aug 2014 #75

His analysis of capitalism is spot on. BaggersRDumb Aug 2014 #54

I never agree with BainsBane Codeine Aug 2014 #55

1. Cool avatar. Benton D Struckcheon Aug 2014 #74

In his 1903 tract 'What is to be Done?," Lenin argues that the VanGoghRocks Aug 2014 #78

Yes, but it's also pretty clear that Marx probably would have agreed with him. Benton D Struckcheon Aug 2014 #90

In fact Marx did write about his views on the Paris Commune - TBF Aug 2014 #93

Thanks for posting that. Benton D Struckcheon Aug 2014 #96

I have been "accused" of being a Marxist Matrosov Aug 2014 #92

Marxism is excellent at identifying serious problems. Unfortunately, it sucks at realistic solutions Tommy_Carcetti Aug 2014 #95

No option really matches my opinion.... Adrahil Aug 2014 #97