The Times' Attempt to Create a Bernie-Russia Scandal is an Embarassment

[Don1]

I think the Sister Cities program was a good idea, even if it was started by Eisenhower.

The Times' Attempt to Create a Bernie-Russia Scandal is an Embarassment

The Times piece describes itself as an exclusive look at documents that depict “the Soviet effort to exploit Mr. Sanders’s antiwar agenda for their own propaganda purposes.” It goes on:

The New York Times examined 89 pages of letters, telegrams and internal Soviet government documents revealing in far greater detail the extent of Mr. Sanders’s personal effort to establish ties between his city and a country many Americans then still considered an enemy despite the reforms being initiated at the time under Mikhail S. Gorbachev, the Soviet general secretary.

Crazy! Bernie Sanders, as mayor of Burlington, Vermont, tried to betray the United States! Wow! Really?

Ah, no:

Nothing in the documents suggests that Mr. Sanders was the only local American official targeted for propaganda, or even that he was particularly receptive to it, though they do describe him as a socialist.

And what year was this taking place?

At the time of Mr. Sanders’s announcement in 1987 that Burlington would seek a Soviet sister city, several dozen other American cities already had such a relationship or had applied for one.

A sister-city program in 1987! Well into the period of U.S.–U.S.S.R détente initiated by … ah … let’s see here … Republican president Ronald Reagan?

And what was Sanders' "anti-war agenda," anyway?

Mr. Sanders reached out to the Soviet Union via an organization based in Virginia, requesting a sister-city partnership with the Cold War adversary in an effort to end the threat of nuclear annihilation.

Bernie Sanders was against nuclear annihilation? Quite a scandal we have on our hands—a mayor participating in the kind of cultural exchange, encouraged by an anti-Communist Republican president, that helped end the Cold War!

[LaurenOlimina]

1. It is.

Sister cities reduced tensions and opened the Soviet Union up to western ideas. LIn this, like so many other things, the Soviets were wrong.

[wyldwolf]

2. stories like this are usually just the first drip.

[LaurenOlimina]

3. In what?

You think they have some old Soviet files that show Bernie was a red? I've wondered that as well.

[wyldwolf]

9. in a series of stories

NY Times either has more already that they're going to drip out, or they're digging for it. So are others.

[LaurenOlimina]

14. I've wondered why it hasn't been found and used.

It seems to me, Hillary would have found it. It needs to happen soon if it's ever gonna.

[wyldwolf]

17. Hillary didn't need to use. Republicans likely have it.

[LaurenOlimina]

19. Hillary's oppo on Bernie is out there. She didn't have it.

[Hortensis]

24. We know she had a great deal, what all who educated themselves

on him knew AND no doubt a bunch more not common public knowledge.

She did not use it because going after him was unnecessary and would have lowered the tone of her campaign, which focused on the GE with Trump. Although the media portrayed it as a horse race, she was so far ahead in so many ways from the beginning that, again, she didn't need to. As the always-frontrunner, she needed to behave like a future president and talk about what we could accomplish, not scrabble around with Sanders.

Btw, you know what the NYT headline reported the Wednesday morning after one state primary when there were literally not enough delegates left unallocated in the coming states for Sanders to win? When what election experts knew for months finally became incontrovertibly technically impossible? The Times reported that Sanders got a big boost from the election the day before, plus the usual articles denigrating her.

So, not only did she not use the material against him, but RW-serving media refused to cover it to promote him as a spoiler and went after her. She's not around now, and the only thing that can save him from more of this is losing definitively enough so they don't bother.

[LaurenOlimina]

25. Her oppo is available.

There would be stories out by now if there were anything in it. I thought Bloomberg had something. He acted like he did and all he came up with was calling Bernie a communist and pointing out his ex-wife and child had been on welfare in the 1970s.

If there is something, it needs to come out soon. I think it will be irrelevant by July.

[wyldwolf]

32. She didn't need to use the nuclear option. It's out there? Show me.

[Don1]

33. The NYT article

says that there were 89 pages of documents, not from Hillary, but USSR, Sister City program, researching this issue. They admitted only thing there was the word socialist.

Now if you are saying that the Russia smears will continue, I agree.

[wyldwolf]

34. the NYT article is NOT Hillary's oppo on Sanders

[Don1]

42. You are repeating me

[LaurenOlimina]

46. Where can I send you about 2 MB of files?

[Hortensis]

36. Denial is the same whether it's something we don't want

to know about someone we like, such as that he's very vulnerable to fake and not-so fake scandals, or of climate change. The truth is what it is.

How could anyone not understand that after what was done in 2016? You do know Hillary's server was a nothingburger, right? That all investigations proved it was? That it nevertheless successfully smeared her for months until we lost the presidency, the senate, and at very least great gains in the house and many state governments?

With more than a little help from Sanders, regarded by Russia as an asset and assisted to make him as useful as possible, who attacked the integrity of Democrats from the left while Republicans pushed the same lies and smears from the right?

Back to Sanders and now, they had no useful "dirt" on Hillary, so they manufactured fake scandals out of nothing. Just imagine what they'd have done with photographs of Hillary visiting Russia and talking with some of the KGB agents who would have been assigned to spy on and strike up relationships with Sanders on his visit?

Here, from today:

Link to tweet

The other day Nance pointed out that Russia's undoubtedly been digging up whatever they don't already have on Sanders. They're promoting Sanders to reelect Trump and take the house back. If he were to get anywhere near the GE, they'd all be on him like a pack of hyenas on a rabbit. And this time even losing may not save him. They're hitting the "commie extremist" theme very heavily to smear Biden and other Democrats.

[Me.]

37. That Nance Quote Is So On The Money

As you know, many of us have been trying to bring this info forward.

[LaurenOlimina]

38. It's weird... I keep saying we should see it if they have something...

Malcolm Nance would if there was something there.

Nobody should sit on it.

[Hortensis]

40. VP Biden is running to save our liberal progressive democracy

from destruction by RW extremist powers. Sanders is on his agenda only as someone to be kept from causing too much damage to the party.

Because Sanders was and is running on the Democratic ticket. We can't stop Repub/Russia from using Sanders to smear our entire party -- which they already are -- but we're not about to reveal and shine a light on any genuine unsavory truths about him ourselves, any more than we were in 2016.

[LaurenOlimina]

41. That's nonsense.

How is it better if " we're not about to reveal and shine a light on any genuine unsavory truths about him ourselves?" Then we are just aiding and abetting. They still smear the party (with this unseen "it&quot only now, we knew and covered it up. Brilliant!

I stand by my assertion that if there is a there there, it should come out.

[Hortensis]

43. How can anyone watch how just having a private server

was blown into a giant completely phony scandal instrumental in defeating the entire Democratic Party -- but not see that Sanders' refusal to get a job and support his child could be enormously damaging? Bad character anyone? Btw, at one point in that same period of his life, he was also stealing electricity because his power had been cut off. Because he wasn't working and didn't pay his bills. I love the American success story that someone can spend a couple of decades finding himself and then become a U.S. senator anyway; I'm all for that. But in his case those are just a couple of details in a frequently unadmirable picture, including even slovenly living conditions.

This was long ago, and after he finally got his first steady job at 39 or so and his child's mother had improved their conditions without him, that part of his picture improved. He became a mayor! (And the new picture of visits to Russia and Central American socialist revolutionaries began.)

But these are NOT harmless details for a man running for president. Democrats expect our presidents to be of very good character and judgement. Only the Republicans elect people whose reputations, true or completely false, are as scumbags, criminals and traitors.

Hillary was already proven by 25 years of hostile investigations to have been honest and hardworkin, but fell to character assassination anyway. Sanders is no Hillary. He's provided material for dozens of missiles that are being readied to launch against the Democratic Party. And against Sanders himself also, of course, if they decide he's more useful to them as a demon than a puffed-up spoiler.

Btw, it's not exactly beyond Putin himself to brag about just what use they've made of Sanders, how and to what ends. Just the kind of good joke Putin loves, piling public humiliation on top of the rest of the damage.

[LaurenOlimina]

44. Well, if we are moving off of this story and on to electability,

I think Joe has LOTS of old positions to worry about. That's why I'm voting for Bernie. Trump's ads will look like Bernie's ad on social security, only they will run down anita hill, the crime bill, nafta, the iraq vote, desegregation, etc. And they will be used to suppress democratic turnout via facebook. It will be awful.

I've got to make the best of two bad choices. That's why I wish this nefarious Soviet connection would drop already. I'd like to take it into account. Before I vote... Tomorrow.

[Hortensis]

48. I believe you really should learn more about Biden

before you repeat those things.

Every time a politician lies, it's a betrayal of those who trust him. And embracing lies is always wrong, without exception.

[LaurenOlimina]

50. I agree.

[Todd79]

45. There are enough pieces of evidence

There are enough pieces of evidence to truly paint him as such, like support for limiting freedom of the press.

In a piece headlined “The socialist evolution of Bernie Sanders,” a Journal editor named Elliot Kaufman traces Sanders' on-again, off-again support for left-wing dictatorships, from Cuba’s Fidel Castro to Nicaragua’s Daniel Ortega of Sandinista fame. As Kaufman wrote, in 1985, as mayor of Burlington, Sanders visited Nicaragua: On returning to Vermont, “he called its Soviet-backed leader, Daniel Ortega, ‘impressive’ and said it ‘makes sense’ for the regime to suppress newspapers given the threat from the U.S.-supported Contra insurgency.”

https://amp.usatoday.com/amp/4706779002


I haven’t transcribed all his interviews from the 1980s, but yeah, there are videos and recordings of him supporting government takeover of private land and business (much more than is commonly known today).

[LaurenOlimina]

49. "enough pieces of evidence to truly paint him as such,"

That's what it comes down to for me, second guessing who the GOP can best gaslight. After Hillary, anyone is fair game. She was the most vetted candidate I had ever seen.

[Dennis Donovan]

4. It was a stupid hit piece

My home town had a sister city in the USSR at the same time Burlington did. Our mayor traveled to the USSR as well.

IIRC, none of this resulted in a gulag being built in my hometown.

[Just_Vote_Dem]

5. The article proved Bernie was naive

While he was good-naturedly trying to do the sister city thing, the Russians were using it for propaganda. They had little interest in actually sharing with us. They are NOT our friends and don't want to be.

EDIT: It could be that some want peace, but there is a contingency there that doesn't.

[Don1]

7. No it didn't.

It was a good program that helped end the Cold War.

[brutus smith]

11. Naive to try to prevent nuclear annihilation? Oh, Ok.

[beachbumbob]

13. sanders not naive with is invovlement with socialist worker party and the fact that organization

had ties to marxist and communist parties as well. there is a history

[LaurenOlimina]

20. I find it funny how Bernie's name is a red flag to some.

[beachbumbob]

23. it should be based on his accomplishments (lack of) while pursuing pie-in -sky policies

[LaurenOlimina]

26. I have no Idea what "it" is Bob.

[onetexan]

16. Agree. It showed that way back then Russia was already looking for Useful Idiots

and Bernie may have fallen for it given back then he was a nobody and struggling to find his way in politics. This is a man who had no real job before making a career in politics, and has little to show for his 30 years other than the renaming of a couple post offices. He conned lots of people to send in $27 to support his campaign of nonsensical ideas, and to enrich himself with millions from his book deals after 2016. In my mind he is no different than Russia's Useful Idiot in the WH right now.

[Just_Vote_Dem]

18. Yes, the naivety was my point, thank you! n/t

[Mister Ed]

6. Yes. The story contained nothing damning of Bernie.

But the headlines would make a casual reader almost think that Bernie had been exposed as a Soviet agent.

[Tom Rinaldo]

22. I fear that the headline WAS the purpose of the story

Kind of like it not mattering if Ukraine actually investigated Biden as long as publicity was generated saying that they would. The headline will be tweeted, and few will do the research to debunk the story that this thread has.

[LaurenOlimina]

27. yeah...

It's kind of red baiting.

[Kahuna7]

8. Bernie believes that Russia should be a NATO member. nt

[brutus smith]

15. Wasn't Biden in favor of the "reset" with Russia?

[Kahuna7]

31. I'll match simplistic with simplistic. Apples and oranges. nt

[LaurenOlimina]

28. Not anymore I bet.

[grantcart]

10. Yes I agree

[tman]

12. I'm for Biden but it's a dumb story

And it just feeds into the narrative that the 'establishment' is against him, it breeds more resentment and cheapens the reality that Trump really is in bed with the russians.

This race is nearly over. Lets not go there.

[Don1]

21. It does cheapen the reality that Trump is weirdly pro-Putin

You are right.

It also makes our Party look paranoid, like saying everyone is a Russian agent.

[rainin]

29. Why did Obama jokingly refer to him as "comrade"

at the Correspondence dinner in 2016? There is usually a backstory to those jokes and we know he knew of Russian interference in the election by then.

[Blue_Tires]

30. It's not the "sister city" thing which was commonplace back then

it's the other stuff...

[Demsrule86]

35. We were essentially at war with the Soviet Union back then...not good. However,

very old in a different time.

[MrsCoffee]

39. That Russia is helping his campaign and he knew and said nothing is an embarrassment.

That while knowing that they were helping him, he tried to pretend that Russian bots may be trying to hurt his campaign is an embarrassment.

I’m embarrassed for him. I think his health is affecting his judgement.

[Happy Hoosier]

47. Except it fits a pattern.

If this were all, then it would be a BS story. But it's not.

[Don1]

51. Except that no, not really.

It takes time and energy to debunk something and here in this article, the crap about USSR as it applies to the sister city program is debunked.

If you want to talk about other made up things that are part of a deliberate Russian narrative smear, like the Dean scream was a smear, or Al Gore invented the Internet was a smear, then it deserves a whole other thread to discuss and debunk.

So, here, either admit the NYTimes was hogwash or defend it.

[Happy Hoosier]

52. You may think that... but the truth is...

Bernie has said and done thing many will see as sympathetic to the Soviets, Cubans, et al. You can get mad about it, but the record is there, and it WILL be hyped, exaggerated, and IMO! Would crush him in the GE. If you’re explaining, you’re losing.

[NurseJackie]

53. Also... in the PRIMARY... if you're explaining, you're losing.

[NurseJackie]

54. VIDEO: "Bernie Sanders in 1985 praising Socialism"

[Happy Hoosier]

55. That will leave a mark. NT

[Gothmog]

56. I strongly disagree-this article explains why Russia and Putin have been supporting sanders

Link to tweet

Link to tweet

Link to tweet

[Aaron Pereira]

57. The Times made it look like they were exposing a Soviet plot from a spy novel.

Really comical attempt on their part to smear Sanders. When his supporters complain about bias in the media they can point to disinformative material like this as "exhibit A".