Can we please wise up to what Putin is actually doing?

[DanTex]

Putin doesn't care who the nominee is, he wants Trump to be re-elected, and in order to accomplish that, he wants to sow discord among Dems and get us to point fingers at each other. And that's what he's doing.

So far, there's been no quantifiable evidence that Putin has intervened in any significant way to help Bernie. The closest I've seen is a website that showed a few hundred retweets of pro-Bernie hashtags. Which is nothing. What Russian intervention looks like is 2016, hacking into Dem accounts and collaborating with Roger Stone and Wikileaks to release hacked materials in damaging ways.

In this primary, the only consequential things that have happened are (A) front-page headlines all over the media talking about how Russia wants to help Bernie and (B) Trump intelligence officials all over the talk shows talking about how Russia is propping up Bernie. Those things don't help Bernie, they hurt Bernie. And they hurt the Democratic Party as well. Which is what Putin wants: Dems to be going after each other instead of after Trump.

Bernie, at this point, is likely to be the Dem nominee, and Putin would like nothing more than for the Dem nominee to be somehow tainted with these kinds of unsavory accusations. We already know that Trump is going to try to paint Bernie as a Russian stooge, he's already started doing that. Democrats should not be helping him do that, we should be pushing back, because everyone knows that the only actual friend Putin has in this race is Trump.

[Botany]

1. "Putin doesn't care who the nominee is ... "

Oh please yes he does and that he is why he is working to make Bernie the
nominee because he would be the easiest to beat.

[DanTex]

3. What is he doing to help Bernie exactly? All I've seen him do is get

headlines published across the media saying "Putin is helping Bernie." That doesn't help Bernie. That helps Trump.

[TwilightZone]

14. "That doesn't help Bernie. That helps Trump."

They're not mutually exclusive. In fact, it's the main point that you intentionally ignore quite consistently.

He's helping Bernie because he believes he would be the weakest candidate against Trump. Same as 2016.

You really think he'd only be helping Bernie if he wanted him to win the presidency? That's hilarious.

[Vivienne235729]

18. +10000 EXACTLY!! How is this not obvious to so many Bernie supporters?

[Butterflylady]

27. Blinders come to mind.

They don't want see any other scenarios other him winning. They don't want to acknowledge the amount of money Russian oligarchs are putting in the GE race. I could go but would do any good.

[LaurenOlimina]

33. "He's helping Bernie because he believes he would be the weakest candidate against Trump."

Speculation. We know he helped Bernie last time to hurt Hillary. This time it could very well be to sow discord amongst Dems. That would be consistent with the Russian doctrine of hybrid warfare.

If you have evidence that, "He's helping Bernie because he believes he would be the weakest candidate against Trump." I'd like to see it.

Right now, it obviously helps Trump, that's why Trump is tweeting about it.

[lark]

28. drumpf believes it, knows it to be true, that's why he fired Maguire.

Maguire told the truth to the Senate, PUtin's thumbs are on the scale for both Bernie and drumpf. Drumpf fired him for letting the cat out of the bag, because he too has been pushing Bernie, at PUtin's request. Drumpf hires people to lie and fires them when they tell the truth. He knows who he can beat and that's the person he and his master wants him to run against in the general.

[JudyM]

19. The IC's assessment is that the Russians are trying to sow discord within our party, that's what

they’re up to. Believing they actually want Sanders to win, and adding to that discord, is playing right into their hands.

[uponit7771]

2. Sanders has no historical swing state appeal outside of MOE, Biden has the most so of course ...

... Putin cares who the winner is.

Come on Dan

[DanTex]

4. That's not what the polls say.

[JudyM]

20. +1

[Butterflylady]

29. Oh, here we go again!

Yeah the polls had Hillary winning to. How'd that go.

[JustAnotherGen]

5. Why is he likely

When only three states have had a primary, caucus, primary/caucus. I think - it ain't over for any candidates until Super Tuesday. This 'inevitable' meme caused discord between HRC and Sanders supporters in 2016. Can we knock it off? Because it sounds the exact same way when Sanders supporters say it - as it did in 2016.

[DanTex]

6. I didn't say "inevitable", I said "likely".

All the data points in that direction. No, he's not a lock. He's just the leader. And that's why Putin and Trump are trying to hurt him.

[JustAnotherGen]

11. Likely / Inevitable

The thing to remember? Folks on the coasts have a mean streak of 'state's rights' (I see it in NJ politics quite a bit - hence Murphy's popularity) -

If you are a solid Sanders supporter - be very careful in your interactions. You are dealing with someone like me - think its fucking great that Murphy acts like a liberal SMART version of Trump and does shit like take down the Mississippi State flag at Liberty State Park, and flips the bird at Trump on immigration, and sues the Fed Gov because it's fun (literally like Trump . . .

I'm doing 'opposite day' along with a lot of Democratics in NJ

We (the Democratic Voters) - we the people on the left of all stripes need to come together NOW.

I'm a blue dot in a sea of red - nothing pisses a trump voter in a Porsche (Hunterdon County NJ - it's not economics - it's racism out here) that an anybody but Trump T-Shirt in the Shoprite on a Sunday morning.

Trust me - I did it yesterday!

[Botany]

12. "And that's why Putin and Trump are trying to hurt him (Bernie)."

Do you really think anybody is gonna buy that codswallop?

[TwilightZone]

15. He must.

He posts about it about fifty times a day.

[DanTex]

22. It's obvious. Look at how much they've done already.

Nobody can name any example of Bernie actually being helped by Putin in any material way. On the other hand, the Bernie-Putin association being front page news is obviously being used against Bernie.

[Botany]

23. Nobody can name any example of Bernie actually being helped by Putin in any material way.

Except for:

Giving time to pro Bernie people on R.T..

Pushing the meme that Bernie is inevitable.

Poll manipulation.

Facebook manipulation.

Twitter manipulation.

Having bots post pro bernie stuff on discussion boards.

And God only knows what else.

[katmondoo]

7. Really?

[TCJ70]

8. The thing that bugs me is people blaming Bernie for Putins actions...

...like he has some power to stop it. He doesn't and he's not to blame for others actions. I mean, what is he supposed to realistically do about it?

[mopinko]

10. lead. he is supposed to lead.

fire people who are nothing but shit stirrers.
moderate his fan pages better.
vet his donors, and return those that smell.

tell the truth. be transparent.
and show us your plan to outsmart them in the general.

tough talk and $5 will get you a vente at starbucks. that's it.

[58Sunliner]

16. Amen.

[TwilightZone]

17. That about covers it.

It's really not complicated and those things should be part of any campaign.

[greatauntoftriplets]

26. Nailed it.

[TwilightZone]

9. "there's been no quantifiable evidence that Putin has intervened"

Mueller Report.

It's naive to believe that they did it in 2016 and wouldn't do it again in 2020. Burying our heads in the sand isn't going to help.

[rzemanfl]

32. Hmmm. Maybe that explains the talking

point. Thank you.

[58Sunliner]

13. Sure-Putin-through RT-is funding some of Bernie's most vocal supporters.

Take a good look at that. What hurts us is low voter turnout. Nevada numbers are scary.We have to start there. Bernie thinks moderates don't win, yet 2018 showed that he was so wrong. Bernie has a fantasy that only he can save us. That is delusional. Where have I heard that before?????? We lose down ballot with Bernie. Bernie voted against the Magnitsky Act and could not be bothered to vote for sanctions. So if it was a repuke what would a dem do?

[boston bean]

21. Putin's end game is to pit fringe against center.

Period end of story.

That is the discord he wants to achieve. Not dem against dem or repug against repug.

He wants the minority rule the majority. Doesn’t matter if it is dem or repug.

That is where the chaos thrives.

[Fresh_Start]

24. we understand he is propping up Bernie in 2020, just like 2016 nt

nt

[NurseJackie]

25. Nervous?

[rzemanfl]

30. What is with this "quantifiable" talking

point? Was it in a memo?

[apcalc]

31. We don't know exactly what is being done by Putin.

We do know that he worked with Manafort, Stone, Trump Jr and a whole cast of others to undermine Hillary and sow discord. In addition , trolls ,robotic and otherwise, were used to pollute the website discussions, like this one and social media.

Further, they were and are injecting cash into the NRA and individual R’s campaigns, possibly the entire RNC.

It cost us the last election, imo

Who is doing what now? We don’t know. It is my belief that there are new players.

Is it massive? Yes. Almost guaranteed.
They want to win, and they cheat in as many ways as possible to do so.

This ain’t beanbag.

[mopinko]

34. seth abramason tweeted yesterday, i think, that the money was saudi.

and the uae. putin was in on it, but it was m.e. money.
he's been pointing the finger at the saudis for a while.

[apcalc]

35. Yes, that does not surprise me. Thanks for reminding me of that connection. BIG money.