Nikki Haley Has No Idea What She's Talking About

[Uncle Joe]

The former U.S. Ambassador to the United Nations Nikki Haley decided to Log On to the World Wide Web tonight to teach 2020 presidential candidate and Medicare for All proponent Sen. Bernie Sanders a little something about how things work around the world, something she should know about as you know, the former UN Ambassador.

Haley retweeted a post by Sanders comparing the insane cost of childbirth in the US—an average of $12,000—to that in Finland, where childbirth costs a reasonable average of $60.

(snip)

Haley, one would have assumed, understands that the amount paid by healthcare consumers does not equal the actual cost of the services provided. It’s not that Finland is only spending $60 on each woman who is giving birth. It’s that the women themselves are only paying an average of $60 at the point of service.

(snip)

Beyond her apparently deep misunderstanding of how paying for healthcare works for normal people, Haley’s other bright idea was to allege that apparently Finnish healthcare is terrible in general, which is obviously false. According to the U.S. News and World Report 2019 Best Countries survey, Finland literally has the best public healthcare system on Earth. But this is just one magazine’s survey data. By other measures, like life expectancy, the U.S. ranks lower than Finland. And a Bloomberg index found that the U.S. had one of the least efficient healthcare systems in the world, while Finland ranked at number nine.

(snip)

https://splinternews.com/nikki-haley-has-no-idea-what-shes-talking-about-1833453764

[samnsara]

1. well i was right with her when she told sanders to lay off womens health care.....

...but then she went off the deep end and finland had to nurse her injuries with a dose of good ol finnish socialized medicine.

[vlyons]

2. actually people in Finland pay more than $60

because they pay taxes. And so do corporations. Also for-profit insurance companies are not skimming money off the top to manage and administer medical claims. The not-for-profit gov administers the healthcare system.

[Uncle Joe]

5. Here is a nice little article from an American that lived in Finland, although it's

from 2014

(snip)

The real question is whether Finns and foreigners living in Finland get a value for their tax dollars. I am sure we could debate this back and forth for days. Finland isn't the highest taxed country in Europe, but it is apparently near the top 5. It also ranks up with the highest tax rates anywhere in the world. Finland currently has a corporate tax rate of 20%, a maximum individual marginal tax rate of 53% and VAT (Value added Tax) of 24%. It is a progressive taxation system, so as your salary increases the tax rate increases as well. There also seems to be less of a range of incomes, with a larger median as opposed to folks all over the place like in the United States.

The question is a bit more complicated than meets the eye. There are social services like efficient bus services, free education, including university tuition, disability benefits, health care for everyone, long maternity and paternity leaves and other benefits, etc. Many people do benefit from the system.

(snip)

Another field that in most countries is paid for and managed by governments is infrastructure, that is roads, public transportation, etc. There seems to be quite wide network of trains, buses. etc. and they are typically clean and on time. It seems like there is always some construction going on in the roads, but generally they are in good shape, snow is plowed timely during the winter, etc. There are also many public sports fields, and areas from ice rinks at most school yards or soccer fields during the winter to many trails, swimming halls, etc. that are also used by Finns often.

Many more topics and comparisons could be covered, but the ultimate question is, does the taxation system really benefit those people who live here in Finland? The topic could be answered each way. For me being an American who has moved over here to Finland 2.5 years ago, I have struggled a bit accepting the high taxes. I wonder if my tax money is really being wisely spent? Is the health care system optimal enough to justify costs? Are the social benefits offered here worth it for most folks? Coming from States I can appreciate the social benefits as I think it overall makes a more trusting and egalitarian system. It is definitely not a "dog eat dog" world out there and everyone is given a fair chance. However, I also feel like sometimes the taxes are a bit excessive for what I am really getting out of the system. I think the answer lies in what you value as a person and society. Are you someone who would rather go about things alone without much government assistance or someone who appreciates social services and is OK paying for them in order to benefit the entire society? I think people in Finland are definitely paying a high premium to live in this society, but then they can sleep at night knowing that they will never have to worry about losing health care coverage and can send their young children to school by themselves because of the overall security and safety of the society here. At the same time we can't build roads and train tracks with private money. So some things have to be paid by taxes. Is the USA still a good place to live and raise a family? I am personally fairly neutral on this. I actually like a little of both systems. We might not often realize what services and programs we use. It is really a tough issue with no real right or wrong answer and it really comes down to which society you prefer living in. However, I suggest that one looks more deeply into the question of how taxes affect society as a whole and not just their own personal income. There are repercussions in a society that has wealth spread too wide and one that has all the wealth in the middle. Bottom line is that there is no perfect utopia tax heaven. I think Finland's system works for some and America's system works for some. What is your opinion?

http://scandinavianinterlude.blogspot.com/2014/03/why-does-finland-pay-some-high-taxes.html

[KansasKali]

3. Or she does understand and is just trying to confuse the issue.

I think she is counting on people just reading her response and not understanding the original point Sanders was making.

[Miguel M]

4. Which is very easy to do, considering the political vocabulary of tRumpsters.

The only way for all this to happen is the abject poverty of good education.