Democratic Primaries
Related: About this forumHow One Employer Stuck a New Mom With a $898,984 Bill for Her Premature Baby
This is the crap system some of our candidates are defending.
Dignity Health said its employee, an ER nurse, failed to meet the deadline to add her premature newborn to its health plan, so she was responsible for the medical bills. It rejected her appeals for a year until ProPublica called.
Lauren Bard opened the hospital bill this month and her body went numb. In bold block letters it said, AMOUNT DUE: $898,984.57.
Last fall, Bards daughter, Sadie, had arrived about three months prematurely; and as a nurse herself, Bard knew the costs for Sadies care would be high. But shed assumed the bulk would be covered by the organization that owned the hospital where she worked: Dignity Health, whose marketing motto is Hello humankindness.
https://www.propublica.org/article/how-one-employer-stuck-a-new-mom-with-a-bill-for-her-premature-baby
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
BeyondGeography
(39,382 posts)We could do nothing but threads like this all day, every day.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
TexasTowelie
(112,453 posts)I can only gather that you think that it is okay to bash Democrats.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Fix The Stupid
(948 posts)Not the real life example of how your healthcare system is fucked?
No empathy for this woman and her baby?
Cold, cold stuff. But not surprised...
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
TexasTowelie
(112,453 posts)Yes, I do empathize with the woman and her child, but that comment is definitely bashing Democrats. It can't be interpreted in any other way.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Merlot
(9,696 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
MrsCoffee
(5,803 posts)That they would say, hey, way to go, let's make sure we can keep screwing people like this?
Or do you think that each and every one of them has a plan to better our healthcare system so that no one ever has to go through this again? Whether you agree or not with their chosen direction, I can guarantee it's in the direction of bettering the system and not making this woman's experience the standard of care.
You are trying to paint Democrats as the party that is behind this bullshit bankrupting system and that is not even in the same realm as the truth. But it does hurt. It definitely hurts to see this kind of misinformation spread about our candidates.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Merlot
(9,696 posts)Not sure how pointing that out is "trying to paint Democrats as the party behind" works.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
MrsCoffee
(5,803 posts)Your talking points are stale.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
bluecollar2
(3,622 posts)About 10 times and upon reflection I can't agree that it can be interpreted as "bashing Democrats."
Why can't it be just a statement of fact?
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
TexasTowelie
(112,453 posts)and not believe that it is bashing Democrats. Democrats are responsible for the enactment of Medicare and children's health insurance programs throughout the country. The ACA also expanded medical coverage to millions of American systems that were previously uninsured. Calling those programs crappy deserves to be ridiculed.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
bluecollar2
(3,622 posts)First sentence.
But we disagree on the interpretation...so be it.
In the end all that matters is that we vote for the Democrat.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
TexasTowelie
(112,453 posts)We have a diverse membership here and people are going to disagree with each other. It would be rather bland here if it just became an affirmation party and we lived in a bubble.
And yes, what truly matters is that the vote for the Democrat to get the Orange Terrorizer out of office. My brother who is a Trump supporter admitted to me today that he is fed up with Trump's pompous ego-building bullshit and if we nominated Biden, then he might vote for him. That's actually a major step as far as I'm concerned.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Hortensis
(58,785 posts)Universal healthcare is the position of ALL our liberal Democratic candidates AND the position of the Democratic Party.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Response to TexasTowelie (Reply #2)
aidbo This message was self-deleted by its author.
TexasTowelie
(112,453 posts)The comment bashes Democrats and can't be interpreted in any other way. The fact is that you are choosing to ignore the comment made in the OP and that you would rather personally attack me instead.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Response to aidbo (Reply #6)
BannonsLiver This message was self-deleted by its author.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
aikoaiko
(34,184 posts)It happens a lot here.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
TexasTowelie
(112,453 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
aikoaiko
(34,184 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
TexasTowelie
(112,453 posts)This isn't one of those occasions where it is worthwhile to do since my response would only appear briefly.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
dalton99a
(81,599 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
greyl
(22,990 posts)Example:
Contact Information Name: Sadie Bard
Email Address: fake@gmail.com
Your company is despicable.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
TidalWave46
(2,061 posts)"This is the crap system some of our candidates are defending."
That statement is crap. Not one of our candidates is fighting for the status quo. Not one.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Voltaire2
(13,194 posts)is supporting a system that does this sort of nonsense.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
TidalWave46
(2,061 posts)It might feel good to say it. doesn't mean it's accurate.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Voltaire2
(13,194 posts)Please explain how the supporters of retaining the private insurance system are not, whether they admit it or not, supporting the gatekeeping that system does that results in the horror stories such as this one documented by the pro publica article.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
TidalWave46
(2,061 posts)They are looking to give this person, who is probably one of the ones who just loved her work insurance, and option to join a single payer plan. That is what numerous candidates are doing. It isn't fighting for insurance companies. It's just the opposite.
Getting your medical bills paid after personal irresponsibility isn't the horror you are making it out to be.
We are heading to a single payer system. How we get there is being debated. It's a beautiful thing. I personally think those demanding it now and nothing else matters are plants. They know it won't happen now. They are acting like children.
I support both Warren and Biden. That includes their plans for healthcare. No reason not to. It moves us in the right direction. Most of our current candidates want some form of government option that would allow people to shift over to it. Shortsighted people can't see that is where many will end up as people change jobs, look at it as an option, or other reasons.
When the group you are damning is damn near everyone, you might want to look why you are standing alone. That's why I like Warren. Unlike Sanders and the mentality I just stated, she is a coalition builder.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Voltaire2
(13,194 posts)by the proponents of retaining the current system. You are confusing the "public option" with "single payer", they are different.
Biden and Buttigieg are both running on retaining the current system, but offering a public option that competes with the private system. Perhaps over time a good public option that is superior to and more affordable than private insurance will become "single payer", but meanwhile the current system would remain in place, with its horrors.
"Getting your medical bills paid after personal irresponsibility isn't the horror you are making it out to be."
Seriously? Did you even read the article?
Bards saga began, traumatically, when she gave birth to Sadie at just 26 weeks on Sept. 21, 2018, at the University of California, Irvine Medical Center in Southern California. Weighing less than a pound and a half, tiny enough to fit into Bards cupped hands, Sadie was rushed to the neonatal intensive care unit. Three days after her birth, Bard called Anthem Blue Cross, which administers her health plan, to start coverage. Anthem and UC Irvines billing department assured her that Sadie was covered, Bard said.
But Dignitys plan, like many, requires employees to enroll newborns within 31 days through its website, or they wont be covered something Bard said she didnt know at the time.
She thought she had done what was needed, and was told that her daughter was covered. This sort of loophole read the fine print nonsense is typical of how private insurers work.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
TidalWave46
(2,061 posts)And your subject line is flat out wrong. Not the first time in this brief conversation you have gone in that direction.
Yes, I read the article. Horrible all the way around. Worked out in the end even though she didn't properly prepare. Truly has little to do with the issue itself. Her getting her bills covered isn't why we need single payer. We need it because healthcare is a right. You simply confuse arguments. I promise there will be massive problems with single payer. We will work through them and never give up.
I'm moving on. You are looking for a conversation. You are looking to lecture while employing less than honest tactics.
Good day.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Demsrule86
(68,696 posts)it will cover those who's states refused to expand Medicaid and folks with shitty private insurance too...the idea is that anyone can join this plan. This is different than the ACA. And it has a chance to pass ...M4A will never never pass even if we get the Senate and the presidency.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Hortensis
(58,785 posts)murder or dark money in politics because we believe in the right to free speech.
The Democratic Party is committed to universal healthcare for all Americans. All our liberal Democratic candidates support universal healthcare. You know that but you post this.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Uncle Joe
(58,426 posts)Thanks for the thread Voltaire.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
Voltaire2
(13,194 posts)The current system, even with the substantial ACA reforms, is a horror show for its 'clients' over and over again. It doesn't need more patchwork reform, it needs to be abolished.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
dalton99a
(81,599 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Hassin Bin Sober
(26,344 posts)His crime: failing to disclose a visit to a dermatologist for a birthmark on his older kids arm. The birthmark was nothing but it was the loophole the insurance company needed to not pay for the pregnancy.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
emmaverybo
(8,144 posts)proponents often cite, and we all know VA hospital horror stories (closest we have here to a fed run system) but then THOSE stories would be called RW talking points or fake news. And no, a lot of private insurance does not operate this way for millions.
Abolish and wait some years for M4All? EVEN IF M4All were to become law, it will be sometime
before start up. In the meantime, do M4All supporters suggest we do nothing about the healthcare
system we have? Let Obamacare die of attrition? Dont work to regulate private insurance to provide remedies to its more egregious problems? Give up, protecting Medicare and Medicaid?
When we do have the incredibly huge bureaucracy of M4All, it will not all be smooth sailing. There will be many stories, many complaints, frustrations, even deaths. Meanwhile, abolish is just not an answer for the years we will wait to accomplish perfection and we will need progress.
Dem bashing and fear-mongering is not it.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Voltaire2
(13,194 posts)British governments wont touch their NHS.
Also its not single payer its the entire health care system that is socialized.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
emmaverybo
(8,144 posts)and some very unpopular changes. I am making the point that a healthcare system many M4All
supporters point to as a model of socialized care is not without deep flaws and its own horror stories.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Bradshaw3
(7,529 posts)I can post at least 10 times more from our system in answer. I could also post polls about the healthcare system in those countries and whether they would prefer a mainly privatized, extremely profitable to big healthcare one we have. The don't. It is not bashing Dems to say soem favor keeping the current system mostly intact. You obviosuly do. And if you want to knwo real fear, talk to one of the people like the person above who has had their life ruined by an insurance company.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Autumn
(45,120 posts)"kind" enough to give me Medicare rates. Humana. Out of network. Still paying that off.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
Act_of_Reparation
(9,116 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
Hortensis
(58,785 posts)the unnecessary anxiety and dispirit it inevitably leads to.
This is brief, part of our 2016 Democratic Party platform's statement on universal healthcare. It's cautious in not promising everything immediately, but it states our commitment. And you must have heard our liberal Democratic candidates declare their commitment to making it happen in 2021 in much stronger terms at debates and elsewhere.
There's just no reason to swallow the lies that any of them are protecting the giant problem that must be fixed. WE ARE THE GOOD GUYS, AND YOU'RE PART OF A GOOD THING.
Democrats have been fighting to secure universal health care for the American people for generations, and we are proud to be the party that passed Medicare, Medicaid, and the Affordable Care Act (ACA). Being stronger together means finally achieving that goal. We are going to fight to make sure every American has access to quality, affordable health care. We will tackle the problems that remain in our health care system, including cracking down on runaway prescription drug prices and addressing mental health with the same seriousness that we treat physical health. We will fight Republican efforts to roll back the clock on womens health and reproductive rights, and stand up for Planned Parenthood. And we will tackle the epidemics of substance abuse and gun violence, which each claim tens of thousands of lives every year.
Securing Universal Health Care
Democrats believe that health care is a right, not a privilege, and our health care system should put people before profits. Thanks to the hard work of President Obama and Democrats in Congress, we took a critically important step toward the goal of universal health care by passing the Affordable Care Act, which has covered 20 million more Americans and ensured millions more will never be denied coverage because of a pre-existing condition. Democrats will never falter in our generations-long fight to guarantee health care as a fundamental right for every American. As part of that guarantee, Americans should be able to access public coverage through a public option, and those over 55 should be able to opt in to Medicare. ...
BTW, those who lie to you betray you. Reciprocating their contempt is the only smart response.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Act_of_Reparation
(9,116 posts)Or was I ridiculing a ridiculous argument against one of many proposed means to that end?
Now, I might be wrong here (I have it on good authority I'm a fucking idiot), but it seems to me I can both 1) accept that all Democrats are officially in favor of universal healthcare, and 2) be contemptuous of a stupid-borderline-dishonest argument against the universal healthcare program I prefer.
I mean, you realize that the Democratic Party is us, right? That the candidates do not lead us? That they actually work for us? That they are our employees? That it is completely right and proper, and in no way disloyal, to disagree with them? If it was, we wouldn't be bothering with this primary shit. Or at least, that's how it seems to me. But I could be wrong. Cause I'm so fucking stupid.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
Hortensis
(58,785 posts)statement, so not all bad. I do apologize for mistaking your sarcasm for support of an appallingly dishonest message.
Fwiw, I saw nothing borderline dishonest about this characterization of Democratic candidates that could only subvert confidence in their integrity in those vulnerable.
And, of course, spark outrage against it among the rest of us.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Act_of_Reparation
(9,116 posts)It's just so frustrating to see every internal disagreement we have effectively shut down with calls for "unity" and dire warnings about enthusiasm and confidence.
Is anyone still here after 2016 going to abstain, or vote third party, or vote for Trump? Really?
I mean, I get why we should watch what we say in public, but I don't think your workaday voter is hanging out on DU, reading our commentary so they can make an informed decision on how to vote in the general. This is our place, if there's anywhere we should be able to go to sort our shit out, it should be here. We're going to disagree from time to time (well, probably all the time, cuz we're liberals and that's how we roll). It's fine. It's natural. Disagreement doesn't necessarily lead to disunity or fracture, but people feeling their opinions aren't heard or valued sure as shit will.
So, for what it's worth, while I will likely vehemently argue for the policies I personally prefer, I am still, without a second thought, voting for whoever the fuck runs as a Democrat, no matter how disparate our views. if voting a Democrat in the 2020 general means casting a vote for Marianne Williamson, then fuck it, I'll stick a chunk of quartz up my ass and vote for Marianne Williamson.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
Hortensis
(58,785 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
bluecollar2
(3,622 posts)I thought it was carbon/coal?
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
BeyondGeography
(39,382 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
Voltaire2
(13,194 posts)bit of a hiccup there.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
BeyondGeography
(39,382 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
TexasTowelie
(112,453 posts)I agree with your OP, but saying that for-profit health insurance is the road to hell over-exaggerates the situation and weakens the argument being made. When I see something so ridiculous being written, it causes me to discredit anything else that you write.
Is Satan on the roadside directing traffic?
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
BeyondGeography
(39,382 posts)Im not casting aspersions on the rank-and-file individuals who are caught up in it, but when you have basically 1/5 of the largest economy in the world mobilized around profiting off of our individual needs for health care in a free-enterprise economy with minimal cost controls (made possible by for-profit insurance) we are collectively on the road to hell. They just want to see what our pain threshold is and every year it gets worse.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
TexasTowelie
(112,453 posts)then I would either roll my eyes or I might choose to discuss it with you, but the only way that I can convey my message is through the pixels on the computer screen.
When I see a comment that is as ridiculous, then I'm definitely going to ridicule it. You might as well have stated "any person or company that makes a profit is going to hell" because it is just as ridiculous.
You are your own worst enemy when you make statements that are easily ridiculed and as I said earlier, it discredits the point that you are attempting to make when you exaggerate. Besides, I noticed that your statement was altered from "for-profit health insurance companies" to "we are collectively" on the road to hell. As a Christian, I'm not on the road to hell (or if I am it is for other reasons), so don't include me on your road trip. Thanks.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
BeyondGeography
(39,382 posts)Call it what you will.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
dalton99a
(81,599 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Autumn
(45,120 posts)Go deeper: Millions of workers lose or change health plans every year
By the way, it really is a road to hell for people.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
BannonsLiver
(16,470 posts)Now what we have to do is sell that to the American people. I think it can be done.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
Hortensis
(58,785 posts)We're already most of the way to that goal and are committed to achieving it under the next Democratic-controlled administration.
How dare you smear us this way, Voltaire? There are other forums for this.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Voltaire2
(13,194 posts)I guess universal is whatever we want it to be.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
TexasTowelie
(112,453 posts)are to pay a premium to a private insurance company or to pay higher taxes? That's a dilemma.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
DBoon
(22,397 posts)nt
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Humanist_Activist
(7,670 posts)when the person in question didn't opt for the public option coverage?
Are there going to be controls or limits as to what hospitals can charge, actual price controls built into the system, on top of having a public option of some sort inserted in?
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided