I'll just say this, and then I'll shut up for a while:

[MineralMan]

We are in great danger of losing the 2020 election, and for many of the same reasons we lost the one in 2016. You can see it happening here on DU and in the media. Instead of focusing on the current administration and its incompetence and determination to destroy as many elements of our democracy as it can, we are focusing on small differences between our many fine primary candidates for the Democratic nomination for President.

I'm not sure what's behind that, but we are, once again, attacking each other and our candidates on the pettiest of grounds. We seem determined to prove that any candidate who is not our favorite will take the United States down a path to destruction. In reality, it is the Republicans, Donald J. Trump, and the religious dominionists who have inserted themselves in our government who have that destruction in mind.

The differences between any pair of our current candidates in the primary look microscopic, compared to what the Republicans have in mind for the future of our nation and this planet. We are picking at tiny, virtually invisible scabs, and trying to reveal some dread infection under them, when the open, swollen, inflamed wound of the right wing is visible, seeping pus, and threatening to consume the body politic.

In comparison to losing another election to Donald J. Trump, which Democratic primary candidate becomes our nominee is an insignificant thing. All of our candidates, right down to Marianne Williamson, would come into office with the goal of actually recovering from the damage Trump and the Republicans have done and beginning to move in a progressive direction.

I hope we all come to see this and stop fragmenting this party to the point where we cannot defeat a nascent fascist government in the United States. Support whichever candidate you prefer, but remember that, in the end, if we do not act as a coherent bloc of voters and bring others to the polls with us, we will lose the Presidential election in 2020.

Please consider what I am writing here. That is all I can ask. I find myself becoming depressed at what I am seeing here and elsewhere among Democrats. That is truly unfortunate.

[AJT]

1. I agree 100%. It's one thing to have someone you prefer,

it's another to denigrate another candidate.

[olegramps]

90. I can' help from wondering if it isn't Russian controlled.

For those who are engaged in this, including any candidates, I hope that they realize that they are doing the Russians a favor by seriously hampering our chances of prevailing. Their ignorance will only put the Russian and Chinese candidate back in the White House.

[RHMerriman]

2. Seconded...

Seconded...

[Thekaspervote]

3. Thank you mineralman for another "sanity" post!

[genxlib]

4. +1,000,000

It remains to be seen if this breaks out into the general electorate but it is disheartening to see.

[Dennis Donovan]

5. I wrote something similar 6 months ago in an OP...

...it got ZERO recs and tons of snide comments. I hope you have a better experience with your OP.

[Peacetrain]

6. MM this is for you

sometimes its all you can do, and pray we do not blow this election..

[hlthe2b]

7. Yes...

But, in addition, the media (including MSNBC) need to hear from us. They are complicit in the systematic destruction via promulgated and propagated "controversies" between the candidates and their base of supporters.

The media went a long way toward enabling Trump's candidacy and ensuring his Presidency. We need to call them out en masse when they do this. Ironically the so-called "liberal" press quakes when confronted by angry RWers. Maybe it is time they heard louder voices of dissent from the left for those times they are failing us all.

[c-rational]

91. +1

[friend of m and j]

95. I have looked and looked for email...

addresses of the moderators at MSNBC that I like. I am doubtful just sending something to MSNBC will get my thoughts in front of Rachel or Lawrence O'Donnell who I think are the most likely to look at the "The Big Picture". I like most of the others there but consider them more news reporters covering the issue of the day.

I guess I could find them on Twitter but I don't like Twitter and seldom go there.

If anyone has Rachael or O"Donnell's email address please post it.

[Maraya1969]

8. We need a forum rule to make it NOT OK to bash our primary contenders. We're actually not

supposed to bash Democrats in general.

[captain queeg]

9. Agreed. My hope and expectation is that once we select a candidate everyone will get on board.

I’d like to think that’s the case. You know what they say, if everyone voted Democrats would win every presidential election. I think we are going to see the biggest voter turnout in years. The republnzis will do every thing they can to suppress the vote but even with that I predict a landslide. I just hope the RW can suck it up and accept it like we did.

[customerserviceguy]

10. I see where you're coming from

But we do this every election cycle, and I've been here since Kerry-Bush.

One thing we have going for us this time around, last time we thought Trump couldn't possibly get elected, now we know better. That will unify us like nothing else.

[The Velveteen Ocelot]

11. I don't know whether DU accurately reflects what's going on IRL.

There are only a few hundred really active DUers, too small a sample to be an indicator of the mood of the entire country's Democrats. But I do share your concern that the whole forest could be lost because people are too busy cutting down somebody else's trees.

"I don't like your pine tree. It sheds needles and I'm going to cut it down!"

"Oh, yeah, well, my pine tree is better than your dumb spruce tree and I'm going to cut it down because it has ugly bark."

"Both of your trees are stupid. They're coniferous and I like deciduous trees a whole lot better and I'm going to cut both of yours down."
...

"Oh, wait... where are all the trees? Nothing is growing here. The birds are gone and the soil is washing away. How in the world did that happen?"

What those of us should do who don't want to lose the forest because people think all the trees but theirs should be cut down is continue to call out unnecessary criticism (thinly disguised as "vetting" ) and try to re-aim the focus on Trump, where it ought to be. I think it might have been a mistake to encourage people to select a favorite candidate this soon, because once that happens people tend to get emotionally invested and unable to make objective evaluations - which can lead to susceptibility to malign influences, as happened in 2016 - to our great injury.

[snowybirdie]

12. I just

Said the same (much less eloquently) on Twitter to some of our liberal commentators. Just about ready to cancel podcasts and tv viewing of these folks. They are trying to divide us! We'll lose if we let them. But then if Rtump wins again they'll have higher ratings, won't they?

[RKP5637]

13. I agree and extremely well said!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! United we win, divided we lose! n/t

[TheCowsCameHome]

14. It's what we seem to do best.

Everybody thinks their candidate is perfect, nobody wants to give an inch.

Consequently, we have the likes of Donald J. Trump in the White House as a result.

Say what you will about the GOP, and heaven knows he is a fetid piece of shit, they're sticking by their guy.

[mr_lebowski]

15. Sage words as per usual MM ... +1000 ... divide and conquer is in effect here IMHO

Fundamentally though a major problem is that we're a diverse crowd with various 'camps' we fall into, by nature.

While overall we're greater in number, we're also facing a much more unified enemy ... religion-leaning white people brainwashed over their whole lives to believe PoC, atheists, liberals, immigrants, etc ... are an existential threat, the #1 enemy, and absolutely nothing is more important than 'winning' against us demon hordes.

They will not let themselves be divided, or to lose sight of the 'prize' ... which is winning.

WE DO because we are inherently more diverse and hence divided, with more tenuous bonds between us, than they have.

Otherwise it wouldn't really be close anymore.

That, and the gerrymandering, and the Corporate assistance to their side, and the voter-suppression, and the inherent unfairness of the Senate and Electoral College.

WE HAVE GOT TO STICK TOGETHER.

[notdarkyet]

50. And the Russians.

[LibFarmer]

17. Please send this post to David Sirota

although it probably will have no effect because that person is more interested in reelecting Trump.

[keithbvadu2]

18. Ideological purity.

Ideological purity.

[MFM008]

19. I am going to support whomever

is the nominee.
But don't underestimate the desire to be rid of the maggot in chief.
I believe there is another wave coming at him no matter who the nominee is.

[RobertDevereaux]

23. Very much with you...

Expecting a massive blue wave.

But not presuming so.

[ColesCountyDem]

20. Well spoken!

[Texin]

21. I'm in complete agreement with your, MineralMan.

I don't want to fight with anyone about who's the "purest", the most "Democratic" or even who the best most likely person could defeat DJT. There isn't a one of us who is clairvoyant to know that. I just know that picking our candidates apart will hurt ALL of them in the long run and it will destroy the country, because if the Dems don't pull that miracle out in November 2020, our Republic is dead. The planet is dead and we will be too. All of us. Everywhere.

[aikoaiko]

22. Easy to say given your preferred candidate is in the lead.

[radical noodle]

85. My preferred candidate is not in the lead

but I agree with MineralMan. There isn't a Democrat running who isn't a million times better than trump/pence.

[Butterflylady]

24. Agree agree agree

All thats going on here is feeding the other side with fodder that they will use against us. I read your earlier post about cutting up the candidates that one is not supporting. And of course someone had to comment about that by saying it needed to be done by calling it vetting. So hopefully it will stop, however I have my doubts. I sincerely hope to hear more of your wise assessments.

[skylucy]

25. MineralMan---I totally agree.

[wendyb-NC]

26. I agree, totally.

Very well said, wisdom.

[Kaiserguy]

27. 100%

Right. This election is one we can't afford to lose.

[iluvtennis]

28. +++ agree

[NBachers]

29. it's going on all over here, with the boilerplate "I'm just posting what the media said" absolution

of responsibility. I'm getting a bit more aggressive at calling it out when I see it.

Well-said, Mineral Man.

[zed nada]

30. Absolute agreement....

...here....

[Bob Loblaw]

32. Thanks Man

nt

[Hekate]

33. What you said, MinMan

What you said

[yaesu]

34. It really doesn't matter how we act, the fascists are going to lie, cheat & steal their way

into the presidency, they will commit crimes, commit treason and probably will murder to keep office. All I am saying is we need a tough candidate that can withstand the criminal mind, pure evil so a nasty primary, which I would rather not see, may be, in the end, more of a help than hindrance.

[Scurrilous]

35. K&R

[shraby]

36. Spot on! I plan to vote my preference in the primary, then the candidate that gets

chosen in the end will also get my vote.
Democratic all the way!

In the meantime the only ones to diss are the ones with an r beside their names. They give us plenty of fodder to chew on because they are so terrible for this country.

We don't need an instant replay with accidentally making it easier for trump etal to win.

One more thought....if we all do this, it will help make any trolls stand out better.

[theophilus]

37. Maybe this setup is made for division? Maybe

we shouldn't be pushing our preference until the primaries actually start? There is way too much time and way too many candidates to keep this from being a train wreck. Some of this is natural and normal. Some is being played from without, imo. Anyway. If we think we are safe in 2020 then we are very wrong. Be kind to one another.

[NJCher]

38. it's part of the process

You need to think in terms of process. It's part of the process to put out various ideas and debate them. It's unfortunate that many don't know how to do this in a civil manner, but you're not going to get anyone to buy into a set of ideas this early in the process. Now is the time for people to debate.

To do otherwise is to do a disservice to the democratic process.

I hate to use a cliche, but if you can't take the heat, get out of the kitchen.

[marylandblue]

39. We don't agree on what the mistakes of 2016 were.

If we don't agree on that, how can we agree on anything else?

[warmfeet]

40. We need to attack the orange

asshole, not each other.

That will increase our chance to win every office in contention.

I will vote for the democratic nominee, as usual.

I support democrats, PERIOD.

Democrats, let us all put aside our differences, come together and throw out the asshole poseur.

[Voltaire2]

41. There are major policy differences.

I want a candidate that will move us forward, that has an articulated vision for an America that works for all of us, that addresses climate change, healthcare, economic inequality, and other issues I think are critical.

I will fight for those candidates until the primaries are over.

[Locrian]

60. same here

climate change, healthcare, economic inequality are the winners of the election.

As for DU? It's a bubble man.... I mean this is nothing like real life - people I talk to in maga land or corporate land, or crunchy yoga granola land are NOTHING like DU. I tell people to not buy into the bubble mentality and conventional wisdom w.o. getting out there and really looking and talking (and listening) to people.

And it will be 1000x worse in 2020 when there's a dem candidate. ALL of the candidates are great - but ALL of them will be relentlessly attacked. There is no "safe" candidate that can be guaranteed unless they can articulate with vision and leadership for the country.

[True Dough]

80. Me too!

While all the candidates are better than Trump, many of them are seeking to move us in different directions. Whether the Dems get control of the House and the Senate will largely determine how much headway can be made toward those proposals. So it does matter which nominee we get!

[marieo1]

43. Clean house in Whitehouse!!

I agree 100% - again you hit the nail right on the head!! Stop all the bickering and infighting and lets get rid of DJT and his cronies!!

[liberal N proud]

44. Too many with a scorched earth mentality

If I don't get my way, I will not vote Democratic is the theme and it fueled a a few elected officials and candidates.

[33taw]

45. I will not write against any candidate running for the democratic nomination.

I have issues with a few, but in the full scheme of things, they are irrelevant..

[Prof.Higgins]

46. Truly! Support policies of preferred candidates, but please don't attack the others. Eop

[bdamomma]

47. i agree too.

We have to unite around our candidate's and whoever it is I will vote for that person. If tRump gets in again by stealing it he will take us down a path and we will never recognize this country called America.

[Rocky888]

48. I agree 100%

And I even sent out emails to top candidates of that same opinion.

[peggysue2]

49. On the money, MM!

It cannot be said enough times: all of our candidates are superior to the unfit man squatting in the White House at the moment, in addition to the traitorous party enabling Trump's corruption, cruelty and incompetence.

If that's not enough to stop the constant bickering and nitpicking then we do, in fact, risk losing 2020, only to face a 2016 redux.

And if that happens?

All bets are off for the country and the future. And that's Everyone's future. We either get this right or we all go down in flames.

[CatMor]

51. Please don't shut up ..

what you wrote is exactly what had to be said, if we want to win.

[Frustratedlady]

52. Thank you for your post. I was just sitting here trying to recover from an attack on a candidate...

and wishing people would be more cautious when commenting on a Democratic candidate's error.

`Nuf said.

[Eliot Rosewater]

53. All part of the plan by Putin and a few here in our country

KGB and others pretend to support lets say Kamala, then they proceed to attack Liz and her supporters.

Or they pretend to be Joe supporter and attack Pete, etc.

They do it here and elsewhere.

Yeah, gonna be real bad...NOBODY who supports ANY of our D candidates will ATTACK our other candidates. If they are who they say they are that is

[unitedwethrive]

54. The great thing about Progressives is that they tend to be thoughful and intelligent...but that can

also be a detriment when we start to overthink things. This is exactly what you are describing. We are overthinking all the tiny differences between Democratic candidates. The internet era doesn't help, since every little disagreement is magnified. An individual who gets attacked once online will remember it for a long time because it seems so personal compared to the generic group labeling and attacks of years past.

[Mike Nelson]

55. I think it will get worse...

… worse than previous divisions. But the coming together will be more healing than previous healings... I expect the Democrats to get behind the nominee more assuredly than ever before.

[pazzyanne]

56. Personally, I can't take another 4 years of tRump!!!

Thank you, Mineral Man, for pointing out what needs to be done to lessen what happened in 2016. Divisiveness in our ranks will not help us elect a Democrat, and I mean any Democrat in 2020. We have to put our energy into electing the Democrat in the race, no matter who it is.

[angstlessk]

57. Hear, here.

[BigmanPigman]

58. I wasn't here during the 2016 primaries

but I did post a DU Poll last week and asked which was most important in this election; Do you pick a candidate based on their policies or who you think will defeat the GOP candidate. 74% said they choose a candidate to defeat tRump over a candidate based on policies. The replies said they felt this way since most of the Dem candidates have the same policies in general and unless we beat tRump no candidate will be able to implement any of them.

[Funtatlaguy]

59. Support our eventual nominee with all your heart, mind, & soul.

[MineralMan]

61. Thank you, everyone, for your comments,

kicks, and recs. Having read them all, I feel a little more hopeful.

[FakeNoose]

66. Please DON'T shut up EVER!

Mineral Man, you are one of the highest caliber posters on DU and we respect your honest opinions. Most of us agree with you most of the time. You are a careful, thoughtful, considerate writer, and I make a point of looking for your posts whenever I come on here. Several times I have changed my mind to your way of thinking after reading something you have written.

Thank you, and don't shut up!

[MineralMan]

67. I won't. I just shut up while this thread was

Gathering comments. Thanks for your kind words. I'm here for the duration, I promise.

[redstatebluegirl]

62. Thank you!

[pangaia]

63. MM. I hope you never shut up....

[pandr32]

64. This is why I post as undecided

I actually do have a favorite, but like I've told my now adult Democratic children (who like different candidates) we've still got a long row to hoe and anything can happen between now and the end of our Primary process. My favorite may change.

We need to be open to supporting whoever wins with everything we are and all we've got. It won't be easy to do that if any of us sours because our candidate didn't make it and we've become convinced none of the others are up to par--especially if we start to believe the condemning things that are starting to be charged.

With any luck, all our losing candidates will go on fighting like hell for the Democratic Party and to further our goals as well as to undo the damage done over the last few years to our Nation and alliances.

[Leith]

65. Hear Hear!

I have left my candidate preference and "undecided" mainly because I will vote for the Democrat regardless of who gets the nomination. Of course I prefer some few over the others, and there are a couple I would really have to hold my nose to vote for.

I will not speak ill of any of them.

The D beats the r in every box I check in the voting booth, no matter whose name it follows.

[MineralMan]

68. I show my current preference in the spirit of

full disclosure only. As the question asks, if I had to vote today, I'd vote for Joe Biden.

[Beartracks]

69. Most important post ever. Thank you, MM. n/t

[MineralMan]

70. Thanks. You're too kind.

[Grasswire2]

71. yes, and Dems are doing the oppo research on our own candidates.

Just stop.

Media is non-stop on the horse race, too.

I'm turning those segments off.

Why don't they focus on corruption on the right? It's much more juicy than jabbing Dems.

[Hassin Bin Sober]

72. Yay!

[MineralMan]

74. A while has passed.

[Hassin Bin Sober]

77. Drat!

[Autumn]

93. My how time flies.

[Peacetrain]

88. alrighty now!!

[quickesst]

73. The way I see it....

Not only is Joe Biden not attacking the other candidates, he's just about the only one that's not attacking Joe Biden.

[mnhtnbb]

75. It might be helpful to look at the ticker at the top of the Democratic Primaries Forum

It indicates that 37% of DU'ers who have made a choice in the Primaries Forum indicate they are UNDECIDED about a candidate. That percentage is far ahead of the top three candidates: Warren 17% Biden 13% Harris 10%.

It's way too early to be depressed about fragmentation, IMO. I, for one, who am undecided about a candidate at this point, have no intention of not supporting the eventual Democratic candidate.

It's very early in the race. Cheer up.

[forgotmylogin]

76. I was a little put off to see people bashing Joy Reid this morning for being in the Kamala camp.

Saying that MSNBC was now a "no watch" channel. I get that people in a Biden thread are for Biden, but why eat ourselves from within?

[MineralMan]

78. I didn't read those threads.

So, I'm not sure what was in them. I don't really follow media people much.

[at140]

79. Relax, after the nominating convension is over

They will all campaign for the nominee.
Presidential elections have been a blood sport since Abe Lincoln era and even before.

When the highest office in the land is the prize, candidates will fight like crazy. But once the nominee is decided, civility returns pronto.

[brooklynite]

81. Allow me to assuage your fears...

The average voter isn’t paying attention right now.

[DallasNE]

82. Not Sure How To Read This Issue

I'm sure some of this is thin skinned in-fighting but I expect a fair amount of this is Trump supporters posing as a Democrat to stir up trouble. I would think that all non-Trumpers know to keep focused on Trump and pay no attention to the snipping.

[flamingdem]

83. Let's make sure we compliment all candidates

five times more than we diss them!

[lunamagica]

84. K&R for visibility

[TexasBlueDog]

86. Cogent, well written and true.

No one can really argue with your premise but your conclusion couldn't be more on point. We are people of fire, we believe with every fiber of our being, we will do what needs to be done to make sure our country remains on track. We pick a candidate from our position of passion. We can't not care about our choice, it's fucking who we are.

The party needs to get it's head out of it's ass and begin to force out the people who can't win. I promise you people are saying and doing things to stand out that will be featured ads in a general election. OP's whole point is to focus. 20 candidates dissipates our power every day. Like the OP I've probably said enough. Without concentration and focus how will the battle end?

[olegramps]

92. Are these people actually running for president or only looking for exposure?

Only a handful of candidates can raise enough money to make a real attempt or have any real national standing. The rest are mediocre at best.

[Martin Eden]

87. Assessing the candidates is necessary

I don't think that can be done without pointing out weaknesses and flaws, as well as strengths and likelihood of victory.

The important thing to remember is to be civil to each other and fair to our candidates. Let's not blow some blemish out of proportion with outrage and demonization.

Circular firing squads are counterproductive to our common goal.

[Autumn]

89. One poster suggested we just pick a name out of a hat. Maybe this angst would all go away.

That might make it easier on those who are convinced of the invincibility of one man.

[wsbradshaw]

94. No they're not

No they're no. One candidate doesn't support Medicare for all or the green new deal. In fact he has said nothing will change if he is elected. Don't want to be accused of candidate bashing so I won't name him. I think we can win with a real progressive and have real change.

[Joinfortmill]

96. MineralMan

Amen.

[BlueIdaho]

97. This should be mandatory reading

For all elected Democratic figures. Park the fucking egos and win in 2020.

[Gothmog]

98. I am also worried-trump can easily win re-election

We have to stop attacking each other and focus on trump. Under many models, trump will win re-election so long as the economy does not crater