Hey, CNN, when showing Sanders addressing a meeting, do not put a (D) after his name!

[question everything]

[MineralMan]

1. Sanders is running as a Democrat.

Right now, the (D) is appropriate. Later, who knows.

[question everything]

2. No, it is not. Confusing too many voters. Keep the (I) until he changes

Frankly refer to him as "Pretending to be a Democrat Sanders."

One has to wonder, of all the ones who voted for him in 2016, how many even realized that he was using their votes for his own purpose.

(And, no, this is not "bashing a Democratic figure;" he is not a Democrat)

[Tiggeroshii]

4. Are you okay with bashing him?

[MineralMan]

6. Please stop accusing people of bashing Sanders, when they're

just making a point about his flexible party affiliations.

I think that's rude, frankly.

As you can see in this thread, I accept his declaration of being a Democrat for the purposes of this election. I do not accept it as a permanent thing, however, since he has changed it to suit the particular situation.

For now, I accept that he is a Democrat. Later, I'll adjust to what he declares himself to be.

Personally, I prefer candidates who are long-time Democrats and consistently Democrats. That's my preference.

[Hassin Bin Sober]

14. Maybe you should read the post Tiggeroshii is responding to. They brought up "bashing"

[MineralMan]

25. Thank you for your kind suggestion...

[Thekaspervote]

30. Why should he have a D after his name??!! He's already filed to run as an I in 2024 senate race

[Tiggeroshii]

33. If somebody admits to bashing Sanders, and says it doesnt count

Because he is not a Democrat, they are still admitting to bashing him. That being said, it is not an accusation, just a clarification of their admittance to proudly bashing a democratic figure.

[MineralMan]

5. Well, see, the thing is that he had to declare himself as a Democrat

to run this time. He signed a paper to that effect.

The designation is valid, at least for now.

However, the (D) does not change his positions, just his party affiliation for this election.

It's a fine point, but an accurate one.

[ehrnst]

62. Actually, no, when he's acting as a Senator, and not campaigning, he is an "I."

He is only a Democrat when he is campaigning.

So, the OP is correct. It's a fine point, but an accurate one.

WASHINGTON, May 28 – Sen. Bernie Sanders (I-Vt.), along with Kirsten Gillibrand (D-N.Y.), Sens. Patrick Leahy (D-Vt.), Maggie Hassan (D-N.H.), Jeanne Shaheen (D-N.H.) introduced two pieces of legislation to help workers around the country form employee-owned businesses.

https://www.sanders.senate.gov/newsroom/press-releases/legislative-package-introduced-to-encourage-employee-owned-companies-2019

[MineralMan]

63. It doesn't matter.

[ehrnst]

66. Facts matter, especially in the media. (nt)

[MineralMan]

67. Well, that particular fact is not going to be a factor

in this primary race, really. Everyone knows that Senator Sanders is an independent who votes with the Senate Democratic caucus almost all of the time. Everyone knows that he's running as a Democrat because that's necessary, if you're going to run at all.

And nobody is going to base their vote on that detail, frankly. It's only of interest in places like DU, where we pay attention to what doesn't matter and ignore what does matter.

As you can see, I'm a Biden supporter. But, I'm not that because Sanders is an independent. I'm that because I think Biden can beat Trump walking away, and that's the most important goal for 2020.

[ehrnst]

68. Dismissing factual accuracy about a candidates' party affiliation as irrelevant does not

promote credibility.

Something that basic especially.

[MineralMan]

69. I'm not bothered.

Clearly, I know the Sanders story. I'm dismissing the importance of his variable party affiliations as irrelevant, though.

In reality, one of his least effective things is his regular declarations of being a Democratic Socialist. The "Socialism" label is absolutely a deadly one in presidential politics in the United States. And trust me, if he were somehow to get the Democratic nomination, that label will be hung on him by the GOP so often you'll think that was the only strategy they used.

In reality, that would be the only strategy they'd need.

But, not to worry - Bernie Sanders won't be the nominee.

[Kentonio]

65. Maybe you should try actually reading the rules of this site.

It specifically references Senator Sanders and prohibits the bashing you apparently feel you're free to carry out.

[InAbLuEsTaTe]

54. Thank you MM for your fair-mindedness... why some insist on divisiveness, I'll never understand.

Bernie & Elizabeth 2020!!!
Welcome to the revolution!!!

[ehrnst]

59. No, when he only a D when campaigning. Otherwise, he is an I.

If it's a meeting on the Hill, he's an "I."

[Tiggeroshii]

3. Sanders is running as a Democrat, has caucused with the Democrats for 30 years,

has sponsored Democratic legislation, endorsed Democratic candidates -including the last Democratic nominee, donates all remaining campaign funds to the Vermont Democratic party after his Senate campaign, and is recognized by the DNC as an official candidate running for the Democratic nomination for president who at this point is one of the only guaranteed candidates to qualify for the Democratic presidential debates.

[Nanjeanne]

15. Some of this outrage about Sanders not "being" a Dem makes you wonder if they would be happy

if he simply caucused with the Republicans instead.

[JudyM]

28. Lol, seems that way by the visceral exclusiveness of the rants.

[George II]

18. "donates all remaining campaign funds to the Vermont Democratic party after his Senate campaign"....

That's not correct. He still has $9 million in his Senate treasury and has only given $157,000 to the Vermont Democratic Party.

By contrast, just south of Vermont, Elizabeth Warren has given more than $1.4M to the Massachusetts Democratic Party; .

[Tiggeroshii]

21. Ah, sorry!

I was confused. Although not as much as Warren, it is still a rather significant number!

[George II]

22. To be fair, Gillibrand didn't give the NYS Democratic Party anything after her 2018 election.

[Tiggeroshii]

23. It isn't necessary, but it does show a certain loyalty to the party.

[ehrnst]

46. He votes, represents Vermont and legislates as an Independent, not a Democrat.

He is only a Democrat when on the campaign trail in a primary.

He is always identifies with an "I" when on the job as a career politician.

https://www.sanders.senate.gov/newsroom/press-releases/legislative-package-introduced-to-encourage-employee-owned-companies-2019

Just clarifying that.

[Honeycombe8]

56. But he does identify himself as an Independent. Check out Senate.gov.

https://www.senate.gov/senators/contact

[Champion Jack]

7. yes, because party loyalty is...

...far more important than whats good for the country

[MineralMan]

9. Well, it is important to many voters, though, you see.

More than you might realize. It's important to me, for example, which is why I don't support Sanders in the primary campaign.

My allegiance is a lifelong one to the Democratic Party. I vote for Democrats, and lifelong Democrats, as a rule.

In General Elections, I vote for candidates who are on the Democratic Party line on my ballot.

[Champion Jack]

11. I vote for whats best for the country,

I dunno, I guess that's just me, I like to look at the issues and think for myself.

[MineralMan]

12. What is best for the country is Democrats winning elections.

It's very simple, really.

[Champion Jack]

13. whats best for the country are ideas

It's not a sports event.

[TwilightZone]

20. Ideas accomplish nothing if they can't be implemented.

In our current political reality, there are two options on a national scale.

Only one of them will implement ideas that are best for the country.

[Tiggeroshii]

24. That could be arguable now, but for most of a good 60 years or so after Lincoln, they were both

fairly bad for the country. It was the new ideas that changed things.

[ehrnst]

50. What "new ideas" is Bernie putting forth?

Because I'm not seeing any that haven't been put forth by Democrats long before him.

And I see far, far more achievements by Democrats going back a ways.

[Tiggeroshii]

52. Same as Warrens.

Tax the rich, end corporate corruption. Regulate. These ideas are only "new" in the sense they have not been done on any real significant level for a very long time.

[ehrnst]

58. "Ideas have not been done"

What do you mean by that? That they have not been talked about? That they have not been acted on? That they have not been put into being via legislation?

By very long time, do you mean since we had the House and Senate?

The ACA, passed in 2009, holds insurance companies accountable for spending 80% of premiums on health care. It got health care to people who didn't have access to it. So that was 'done.'

In July 2010, Dodd/Frank Wall Street regulation legislation, and The Consumer Financial Protection Bureau were, as you put it, "done." Did you miss those?

How exactly does government "end corporate corruption?" That's like saying that police need to "end crime." Dodd/Frank and the CFPB laid out the new rules. Warren didn't just talk about ideas, she got the CFPB into existence.

Regulate - can you be more specific on which regulations? The Obama administration passed many regulations to protect the environment, perhaps you missed those too? http://www.environmentalintegrity.org/trump-watch-epa/regulatory-rollbacks/

[LanternWaste]

26. Thankfully, you're the only one arguing as much...

[ehrnst]

61. So are you saying that he's not loyal to the party? (nt)

[vsrazdem]

8. Sanders is running as a Democrat, that's how it works. If he was running as an I - he would

be a third party candidate.

[brooklynite]

10. Sorry, Disagree

While he is an Independent Senator, he's a Democratic candidate...at least that's what the Democratic Party says...

[Hassin Bin Sober]

16. He's running as a Democrat. He's caucused with the Democrats for decades.

He’s part of the Senate Democratic Leadership

[ehrnst]

45. He votes and identifies in the Senate as an Independent, not a Democrat

He is only a "Democrat" when on the campaign trail in a primary.

The rest of the time - when legislating, voting or representing Vermont in the Senate, when on the Hill, he is an "I," not a "D."

https://www.sanders.senate.gov/

Just saying.

[Kurt V.]

53. lol

[InAbLuEsTaTe]

55. That makes Bernie a Democrat... to keep insisting otherwise just divides people

when we need to be united in defeating the fascist occupying the White House!!


Bernie & Elizabeth 2020!!!
Welcome to the revolution!!!

[CentralMass]

17. 'I am a member of the Democratic Party': Sanders signs loyalty pledge for 2020 bid'

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/elections/2019/03/05/sen-bernie-sanders-signs-pledge-declaring-democrat-2020/3074461002/

"WASHINGTON – Sen. Bernie Sanders signed a pledge, required under new Democratic National Committee rules, that declared he was a Democrat and would serve as one if elected president, according to media reports. "

[Hortensis]

19. Sanders: "I am not now, nor have I ever been, a liberal Democrat."

He's always been very solid on that and we all know it, so why fight it? Don't insult the man.

[aidbo]

27. Your OP is not the insult you mean it to be.

[question everything]

29. Did not mean to insult. Just stating a fact

Yes, he is democrat - small d. and a Democrat while manipulating the Vermont primaries. But if they don't care - he seems to do it every time - their problems.

[earthshine]

31. Would you rather he run for president as an I?

It would split the Democratic party.

Be glad he's running as a D.

[question everything]

34. No. I'd preder that he put his affiliation where his campaign is

change to a Democrat - the way he does for Vermont Senate primary - and stay there.

It is not as if he cannot be his cantankerous self as a Democrat. It is not as if he will have to follow certain rules. We are Democrats, remember? But by insisting on staying an Independent and running in our race he really is mocking us. "I am not a Democrat and almost got to be the nominee; may still be, so what are you going to do about that?" Well, it irritates me. Should everyone.

[earthshine]

35. I disagree with a few of your points.

> It is not as if he cannot be his cantankerous self as a Democrat. It is not as if he will have to follow certain rules.

I think as a Dem in the Senate, he'd have to take some direction from Chuck Schumer.

I think he's realized he has a better influence on politics and on the Dem party as an I.

> he really is mocking us.

I have been voting Dem since 1982. I do not in any way feel mocked.

I feel it is wrong to take politics personally. I choose my candidates based on platform, not identity.

> "so what are you going to do about that?"

These are your words; not his.

[ehrnst]

36. Those are the only choices?

[earthshine]

40. None of the choices are yours.

[ehrnst]

41. I didn't say they were... you said "would you rather"

and I pointed out that you gave only two options.

[earthshine]

42. But the "you" I was referring to is not YOU.

So, Bernie isn't doing what YOU want? Too bad for YOU.

[ehrnst]

43. So, when you said "you" it wasn't actually "me."

Thank you for clearing that up.

[ehrnst]

47. .....

You deleted before I could answer:

earthshine (1,568 posts)

44. Thank YOU for further ambiguity.

YOU need to interpret "YOU" as "ME." Didn't you learn that as a child?

Enough of YOU.

I learned civility and manners as a child. Didn't you?

[ehrnst]

49. Yes, I saw where you posted it instead...

In that other back and forth about what "you" meant.

[Skya Rhen]

32. CNN showed a part of Bernie's speech but not a second of Joe's HRC speech...

I have been stuck on CNN, all day, and absolutely no footage of his well-delivered and inspiring remarks. If he had made a gaffe, I guarantee they would have had an endless loop of it playing, though.

The same goes for MSNBC, which I watched on Sunday - no clips of Joe, just that of other candidates.

I hope that I stop hearing complaints about Joe receiving more coverage than others- it’s a fallacy and these are perfect examples...

[LibFarmer]

37. Perhaps add a T or a C

T for temporary.
C for conveniently.

[question everything]

39. I like your sense of humor and welcome to DU

We can use more humor here.

[BlueTsunami2018]

51. But he's running for the Democratic nomination as a Democrat.

What should they put instead?

This is kind of a weird post.

[question everything]

57. Put an (I). When they show him speaking in the Senate they show an (I)

At least, on CSPAN

I can see someone watching him in the Senate with the (I) and then on CNN (and perhaps elsewhere) on the campaign with the (D) and that someone is completely confused.

[ehrnst]

60. He's only a "D" when on the campaign trail. When he is on the job as a career politician

he identifies as an "I."

[Trumpocalypse]

64. Maybe the should put (DC)

Democrat of Convenience