Bernie Sanders
Related: About this forumSomething my husband said last night
crystallized the whole difference between Bernie and Hillary, at least as I see it.
Bernie asks what kind of government we want to have. He asks what kind of country we want to live in.
Hillary tells us what kind of government we can have, she tells us what kind of country she wants us to live in.
Why do so many not want to have the conversation about what we want to see? We may not get it all, what with an obstructionist congress (who won't work with anyone without an R after their name), but it is still a good thing to have a vision of something the people want, rather than a vision of what corporations want.
djean111
(14,255 posts)And we would be told that is buy-partisanship at its finest.
FreakinDJ
(17,644 posts)Obama pushed chained CPI pretty hard for quite a while. Hillary will make similar deals with the right in order to "get things done".
Bettie
(16,129 posts)they would work with her if she turns a hard Right and does as she's told.
Which, I'm terribly afraid she will, if elected.
But, in any case, Bernie needs to stay in, even if he doesn't win so we can HAVE the conversation.
I just don't get why Hillary people are so angry that the questions are being asked.
anothergreenbus
(110 posts)It's embarrassing to have to admit the person you idolize is actually just another corrupt politician. So you fight tooth and nail to cover it up.
dchill
(38,546 posts)tex-wyo-dem
(3,190 posts)tularetom
(23,664 posts)She's the role model for corrupt politicians. The patron saint. Best since Tricky Dick. The Clintons have taken corruption to a stage previously unknown in American politics.
Aquavit
(488 posts)So to speak...
grasswire
(50,130 posts)The only thing missing here are the gold teeth.
840high
(17,196 posts)50% just want a woman.
AlbertCat
(17,505 posts)This may be the most important thing Sanders has done: Change the narrative.
The GOP has been in charge of the narrative for a long time...even throughout Obama's terms.
It's so great that enough people have come over to Sanders side to over-run the media darlings so they have to cover him and people hear and see him.
Clinton could never have done such a thing alone. She's riding on name recognition. The media could go on for months and never cover a word she said, but just cover all the baggage from the past.
brewens
(13,622 posts)progressive to a point on some issues, but they are not liberal. Also many that are just blinded by the woman in the White House thing.
A lot are older and retired, or reasonable well off and secure or they are close to it. At least seeing a fairly secure retirement ahead. They have theirs and aren't willing to take any risks.
They will be the first to go with something like Paul Ryan's Medicare voucher plan. It was 55 that he had the cutoff at wasn't it? As long as they are grandfathered in, screw everyone else!
rhett o rick
(55,981 posts)those in poverty. I think some think that the super wealthy like the Clintons are destine by God to take care of us ignorant peons.
Betty Karlson
(7,231 posts)Yes, amazing how that works.
TTUBatfan2008
(3,623 posts)...Bipartisanship to drag us into more unnecessary wars. Bipartisanship to outsource our jobs overseas via un-American trade agreements. Bipartisanship to make Lloyd Blankfein and his bank buddies even wealthier than they already are at the expense of everyone else.
Fawke Em
(11,366 posts)or did you mean to make a statement about who buys Congress?
djean111
(14,255 posts)Most of Congress, IMO, has been "bought" because of our corrupt elections system.
tblue
(16,350 posts)merrily
(45,251 posts)I don't know how much he will deviate from his core principles.
Bettie
(16,129 posts)are what most people want or close to it.
merrily
(45,251 posts)Bettie
(16,129 posts)actual human people and responds, not with "this is how it will be" but with examples of how his ideas will bring about the things that they are talking about or with slight course changes to include more people without watering down his core message.
tazkcmo
(7,302 posts)Soooooooooooo 2008! Billionaires, you can't have it all but that's only because you already have it and Sec Clinton will ensure you keep it.
Rebkeh
(2,450 posts)Bettie
(16,129 posts)but I have no desire to be eviscerated by people whose anger at the victory march/coronation not happening overrides their understanding that there is a primary process.
Rebkeh
(2,450 posts)Maybe at a better time, when the pendulum swings back.
randr
(12,417 posts)We tell them my voting for whomever fits our model best.
The fact that Bernie is asking is a start.
thereismore
(13,326 posts)not possible and now she is hitting us over the head with her wisdom, which I personally reject.
Her fingers are all over the wars in Iraq and Libya, which makes her an absolute NO as far as I am concerned.
highprincipleswork
(3,111 posts)cantbeserious
(13,039 posts)eom
Iol59
(25 posts)My husband,family and friends all Dems supporting Bernie say we have to vote for Hillary if she's the nominee. My arguments aren't convincing enough and I' m being accused of basically electing Trump! What the hell? I'm hoping people get their heads out of their a**** and go vote for Bernie.Because if it's not Bernie it's the same old same old.Definition of insanity is doing the same things over and over again and expecting a different result.
Fawke Em
(11,366 posts)appalachiablue
(41,177 posts)characteristics while remaining a strong leader with conviction and determination.
Pauldg47
(640 posts)Did you see how he manhandled Friedman in Congress?
Doitnow
(1,103 posts)Response to Bettie (Original post)
Name removed Message auto-removed
Helen Borg
(3,963 posts)GoldenMean
(49 posts)Elect a leader who has lived his life by the Golden Rule
Or any of the others who believes that gold rules
Elect a leader who believes that our founding fathers established a nation on the principle of We the people sharing a goal of promoting general Welfare for all.
Or any of the others who believe that our nation was established to promote warfare
Paka
(2,760 posts)"Welfare vs. Warfare, Golden Rule vs. gold rules."
Blus4u
(608 posts)Eom
Fast Walker 52
(7,723 posts)which doesn't get enough attention.
NorthCarolina
(11,197 posts)Why start at $15/hr in the minimum wage fight when you can, instead, start negotiating at $12/hr? Which position do you think would be more in line with what corporate interests would allow?
Why expand ACA to include Universal Single Payer for all Americans as a right, when you can instead tweak the system but still allow plenty of room for the for-profit insurance middleman in the mix? Which position do you think would be more in line with what corporate interests would allow?
Why vote for a candidate who espouses diplomacy when you can instead opt for one that is all about regime change and war as the vehicle for progress? Which position do you think would be more in line with what corporate interests would allow?
Why vote for a candidate that wants to put a college education in the grasp of every American with the wherewithal to attend when there is a danger that in doing so you might also end up paying for Trumps kids to go to the community college of their choice? Forget the greater good because, well, Trumps kids. Which position do you think would be more in line with what corporate interests would allow?
There's more but why bother right? Because it's ALWAYS all really about which position is in line with what corporate interests would allow.
LibDemAlways
(15,139 posts)against free public college is particularly disingenuous. She wants to deny every deserving student in the US an opportunity to attend college tuition free on the off chance that a millionaire might send his kid to Cal Fucking State. Chelsea went to Stanford, one of the most elite private schools in the country. That's the type of university wealthy kids attend. But if a few millionaires' kids end up at a state school and don't have to pay, is that really any reason at all to deny the masses? Ridiculous. I wish Bernie would excoriate her on that one because she richly deserves it.
Ino
(3,366 posts)then his/her kid is entitled to the free state college too.
Raster
(20,998 posts)...a valued contributor to society. ANY KID! Sending kids to college is an investment in society, and enriches all of our lives.
It's time to stop using education as an inticement or the lack of education as a punishment. And most important: it's time for our government and agents acting with the blessing of our government TO STOP MAKING A PROFIT OFF OF EDUCATION. NO MORE OUTRAGEOUS STUDENT LOANS!
It's time to END ALL FORMS OF DEBT SERVITUDE, ESPECIALLY EDUCATION DEBT SERVITUDE!
Ino
(3,366 posts)"what corporate interests would allow" is the same as what "legislators who are bought by corporate interests" would allow. And that includes Hillary as Corporatist in Chief.
WillyT
(72,631 posts)oldandhappy
(6,719 posts)Vinca
(50,310 posts)Bettie
(16,129 posts)He's a smart guy and, in my opinion (biased though it might be), the best one around. Of course, after 26 years of marriage, I'd better think that, right?
Duval
(4,280 posts)mother earth
(6,002 posts)they are willing to give us.
Enthusiast
(50,983 posts)Auggie
(31,194 posts)TIME TO PANIC
(1,894 posts)People are sheep. They think, if they kiss enough ass, they'll get a piece of the pie.
I refuse to grovel any longer.
erlewyne
(1,115 posts)Amen and Amen
The three Amen's were in agreement with all three of your points.
I am very comfortable with you and would love to
have your children in the house with my children (grand children)
AlbertCat
(17,505 posts)B-b-but we want to see a woman president....
or something....
libdem4life
(13,877 posts)Javaman
(62,534 posts)Bernie talks to us, Hillary talks AT us.
saidsimplesimon
(7,888 posts)WHEN CRABS ROAR
(3,813 posts)is ourselves.
Response to Bettie (Original post)
INdemo This message was self-deleted by its author.
pugetres
(507 posts)nailed it.
K&R
1monster
(11,012 posts)Is it GMTA, osmosis, or sharing?
I hope to see the Bernie campaign pick it up.
Bettie
(16,129 posts)the husband and I were talking on our way home from Madison (saw the Stephanie Miller show there) and this just came up.
SoapBox
(18,791 posts)No...More...Clintons.
Ferd Berfel
(3,687 posts)Baobab
(4,667 posts)Thats a quote from Frank Zappa*, but its true.
Hillary knows better than anybody because their scheme was cooked up during the Clinton Administration.
Are you familiar with the literary construct of "selling your soul to the devil" forever for some pleasure in this life?
Basically, trade deals like GATS - starting in 1995, tried to irreversibly give away our rights to public services, and also our ability to change things in the future, or at least GATS tried to, but the US wasnt able to deliver to countries on the other side of the bargain, jobs until now. So several sets of talks, the DohA development Agenda, collapsed. To make it politically deniable Crises had to be created in health care, education, IT services, etc, to put the necessary millions of jobs on the services table through the magic of the WTO government procurement agreement.
http://www.ictsd.org/downloads/2008/06/cassim_steuart_part3.pdf
Does that make any sense to you? Do you know anything about the Trade in Services Agreement?
mhatrw
(10,786 posts)"Sure, other countries have all these things. But that's why we focused all our energy on you poor, easily manipulated suckers!"
GreatGazoo
(3,937 posts)GWB said that and people jumped on it but how is what Clinton is doing now significantly different?
And the media is doing all they can to help stomp down the hope. It is like they are afraid that if that genie gets out of the bottle they won't be able to get it back in.