Welcome to DU! The truly grassroots left-of-center political community where regular people, not algorithms, drive the discussions and set the standards. Join the community: Create a free account Support DU (and get rid of ads!): Become a Star Member Latest Breaking News General Discussion The DU Lounge All Forums Issue Forums Culture Forums Alliance Forums Region Forums Support Forums Help & Search

MineralMan

(146,324 posts)
Thu Dec 24, 2015, 11:00 AM Dec 2015

Independent investigation of the DNC incident.

Some here are attempting to construct some sort of conspiracy theory about Kroll being hired to investigate the data breach at the DNC. This theory attempts to look at other organizations that have hired Kroll.

Here's the thing: There are only a few firms who do this type of work on a national basis. No doubt, all of them have done investigations for organizations of which many do not approve. Forensic investigations are commonly performed, in a wide variety of circumstances.

Who a forensic investigation firm has worked with in the past is pretty much irrelevant. Any of the well-known firms have worked for any number of organizations to conduct such investigations. It's very unlikely that there are any firms capable of this investigation who have not worked on investigations for organizations some people do not like.

Since the Sanders campaign has approved of this assignment, along with the Clinton campaign, I assume, it sounds like the principals believe that Kroll can do this job in an independent way.

I can't see the point of constructing a conspiracy theory about it. It's a pretty straightforward sort of investigation.

51 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
Highlight: NoneDon't highlight anything 5 newestHighlight 5 most recent replies
Independent investigation of the DNC incident. (Original Post) MineralMan Dec 2015 OP
Agreed. This is a very specific business with very little competition. napi21 Dec 2015 #1
Yup. I looked up major forensic investigation MineralMan Dec 2015 #3
I can think of 5 right off the top of my head Paulie Dec 2015 #9
As always, MineralMan, your logic is impeccable./nt DemocratSinceBirth Dec 2015 #2
Well, I expect that not all will agree. MineralMan Dec 2015 #5
They just need to look a lil harder. DemocratSinceBirth Dec 2015 #8
They?? Wilms Dec 2015 #44
+1 Agschmid Dec 2015 #4
It's all a conspiracy. NCTraveler Dec 2015 #6
My favorite conspiracy is the lack of media coverage of Sanders Gothmog Dec 2015 #39
Curious Choice of Auditor for Democratic Database Flap Wilms Dec 2015 #7
So, which forensic data investigation firm MineralMan Dec 2015 #10
Nooooooobody else can handle this? Wilms Dec 2015 #16
Pick one and let me know. MineralMan Dec 2015 #21
What does "national scope" have to do with it? Wilms Dec 2015 #41
Upstring. Post #9 answers your question five-fold. Did you miss that? 99th_Monkey Dec 2015 #40
I Was Advised That Sanders Was Basically BLACKMAILED Into Agreeing to The List That Included KROLL CorporatistNation Dec 2015 #47
I just want their findings. PowerToThePeople Dec 2015 #11
I'm not sure they're going to be publicly released, MineralMan Dec 2015 #13
The very fact that Bernie has the highest favorable numbers and Clinton has the lowest Furrfu Dec 2015 #50
Kill the messenger before he/she mounts the horse? GeorgeGist Dec 2015 #12
Messenger? Horse? MineralMan Dec 2015 #14
MineralMan, has there been agreement on the scope of the audit? Will they cover back to, say, Sept.? JonLeibowitz Dec 2015 #15
I have no idea. I'm not privy to anything about the DNC. MineralMan Dec 2015 #22
Here's a thought catnhatnh Dec 2015 #17
is there any reason they can't? restorefreedom Dec 2015 #20
If they feel that they need that, I suppose they could. MineralMan Dec 2015 #23
I have no idea how Sanders feels about it catnhatnh Dec 2015 #24
Nor do I. Frankly, it's up to Bernie Sanders, not his supporters MineralMan Dec 2015 #25
Frankly it was up to the DNC catnhatnh Dec 2015 #28
How about Uretsky? He seems like a stand up guy. LuvLoogie Dec 2015 #34
LBJ took the IRT down to murielm99 Dec 2015 #46
You gotta he kidding? ! nc4bo Dec 2015 #29
Now let me see whether I understand this ... BlueMTexpat Dec 2015 #38
Are you truly that dense? catnhatnh Dec 2015 #43
AGREED!!!! CorporatistNation Dec 2015 #48
both sides should also consider a consultant restorefreedom Dec 2015 #18
It doesn't seem Bernie has any concerns. LuvLoogie Dec 2015 #35
i have a feeling restorefreedom Dec 2015 #36
The big question is scope Paulie Dec 2015 #51
Exactly so ismnotwasm Dec 2015 #19
Debbie Wasserman Schultz broke the DNC contract with the Sanders campaign AgingAmerican Dec 2015 #26
Yah, OK then... MineralMan Dec 2015 #27
Her actions are pretty telling, no need to read her mind AgingAmerican Dec 2015 #42
AGREED!!!!! CorporatistNation Dec 2015 #49
Bush/Clinton/CIA operatives? Really? ViseGrip Dec 2015 #30
yep, Hillarians are fully supportive of whatever "schlonging" they provide BS stupidicus Dec 2015 #31
Solution: Have The Carter Center do it. Spitfire of ATJ Dec 2015 #32
Are they competent to do a forensic data audit? MineralMan Dec 2015 #33
This isn't THAT complicated. Spitfire of ATJ Dec 2015 #37
A Logical Kick Alfresco Dec 2015 #45

napi21

(45,806 posts)
1. Agreed. This is a very specific business with very little competition.
Thu Dec 24, 2015, 11:06 AM
Dec 2015

I guess, no matter what the situation, some will always find negative theories.

MineralMan

(146,324 posts)
3. Yup. I looked up major forensic investigation
Thu Dec 24, 2015, 11:11 AM
Dec 2015

companies. There aren't that many who have nationwide reputations.

I don't think any of them would pass muster with some people.

Paulie

(8,462 posts)
9. I can think of 5 right off the top of my head
Thu Dec 24, 2015, 11:30 AM
Dec 2015

Mandiant (now owned by FireEye) is the gold standard
Neohapsis (now owned by Cisco)
NTT Security
IBM
SecureWorks

At least the didn't hire HBGary!

 

NCTraveler

(30,481 posts)
6. It's all a conspiracy.
Thu Dec 24, 2015, 11:16 AM
Dec 2015

The Sanders campaigns apparent theft is a conspiracy against Sanders.

Polling is a conspiracy against Sanders.

The national media is a conspiracy against Sanders.

Trump is a conspiracy against Sanders.

Yet when they truly get trolled by the likes of Goodman, they cheer.

Gothmog

(145,481 posts)
39. My favorite conspiracy is the lack of media coverage of Sanders
Thu Dec 24, 2015, 02:21 PM
Dec 2015

If only Sanders got the same attention as Trump, then everything would be right in the world.

The fact that Sanders people like HA Goodman is really sad

 

Wilms

(26,795 posts)
7. Curious Choice of Auditor for Democratic Database Flap
Thu Dec 24, 2015, 11:24 AM
Dec 2015
snip

NBC reported that the Clinton campaign was "pleased" with the choice. But Sanders, having spent much of the primary season stumping against Kroll's elite clientele, has not yet disclosed any view on the firm.

snip

Echoing a comparison made by the New York Times and Sydney Morning Herald, Donziger called Kroll "a sort of private CIA for the powerful."

Though hardly a dispassionate voice on the matter, Donziger said he would not classify Kroll as an "objective investigations service."

The firm takes on clients who "have a very specific agenda that requires particular results to be produced regardless of the actual facts," Donziger said in an email.


snip

http://www.courthousenews.com/2015/12/23/curious-choice-of-auditor-for-democratic-database-flap.htm


http://www.democraticunderground.com/1251943044


MineralMan

(146,324 posts)
10. So, which forensic data investigation firm
Thu Dec 24, 2015, 11:46 AM
Dec 2015

would you recommend. You can use Google to search for forensic data investigation companies. The list of major ones is very small. Go look at who they've worked for. You won't like any of them. They've all worked for major banking corporations, other corporations, and organizations of which you wouldn't approve.

That does not mean that their investigations and audits are not independent. Who hires a company to investigate things like data breaches does not taint the company hired to do the investigation.

Claude's and Al's Data Recovery Service doesn't qualify.

 

Wilms

(26,795 posts)
16. Nooooooobody else can handle this?
Thu Dec 24, 2015, 12:31 PM
Dec 2015

Having a hard time buying that. But I agree. Kroll does have a "reputation".

MineralMan

(146,324 posts)
21. Pick one and let me know.
Thu Dec 24, 2015, 01:08 PM
Dec 2015

Google will find them. It needs to be one with a strong national scope, though. If you find one that you approve, after investigating its background, just post it here.

 

99th_Monkey

(19,326 posts)
40. Upstring. Post #9 answers your question five-fold. Did you miss that?
Thu Dec 24, 2015, 03:10 PM
Dec 2015
Paulie (7,655 posts)
9. I can think of 5 right off the top of my head

Mandiant (now owned by FireEye) is the gold standard
Neohapsis (now owned by Cisco)
NTT Security
IBM
SecureWorks

http://www.democraticunderground.com/1251944070#post9

CorporatistNation

(2,546 posts)
47. I Was Advised That Sanders Was Basically BLACKMAILED Into Agreeing to The List That Included KROLL
Thu Dec 24, 2015, 08:53 PM
Dec 2015

:puke" Clinton/Establishment/Corporatist Team ... UNDERHANDED here as well engineering a WHITEWASH at best some kind of engineered execution of Bernie at worst.

MineralMan

(146,324 posts)
13. I'm not sure they're going to be publicly released,
Thu Dec 24, 2015, 11:51 AM
Dec 2015

frankly. Not in full, anyhow. Those findings will be proprietary information of the DNC, the organization hiring the investigator.

Now, the FEC could probably insist that they review the findings, but there is no requirement that they be released to the media.

In the end, this will all be settled through our 50 states' primaries and caucuses. The voters will make their choice of candidates. The rest is just detail.

Once the investigation is complete, though, I'm sure the DNC will hold a press conference about the findings. It may be that the press conference will be held after the first round of primaries. Such audits take time.

 

Furrfu

(32 posts)
50. The very fact that Bernie has the highest favorable numbers and Clinton has the lowest
Thu Dec 24, 2015, 09:00 PM
Dec 2015

makes a huge difference on who's going to be elected.

I would like to ask you to show me one single candidate on the Democratic side that won with high unfavorable numbers.

MineralMan

(146,324 posts)
14. Messenger? Horse?
Thu Dec 24, 2015, 11:53 AM
Dec 2015

What forensic data auditing company would you prefer? I keep asking that, but nobody seems to have an answer. There aren't many with the reputation and ability to handle this job, actually. So, you let me know which one you think should do it.

catnhatnh

(8,976 posts)
17. Here's a thought
Thu Dec 24, 2015, 01:01 PM
Dec 2015

Just for one fucking time why can't the DNC ACTUALLY act like there are two sides and let Sanders pick a second firm to either participate in or at least observe the audit? Doesn't that sound sensible??? And it took me all of 30 seconds to come up with a suggestion that could work for both sides but that worthless clown DWS is either too brain-dead or too clever by half to think of this herself.

restorefreedom

(12,655 posts)
20. is there any reason they can't?
Thu Dec 24, 2015, 01:07 PM
Dec 2015

each side could hire a consultsant to work with the auditor. don't really see an issue with that unless debbie is really trying to put her bias on a neon sign.

MineralMan

(146,324 posts)
23. If they feel that they need that, I suppose they could.
Thu Dec 24, 2015, 01:11 PM
Dec 2015

I don't know how they feel about Kroll handling the audit. Do you?

catnhatnh

(8,976 posts)
24. I have no idea how Sanders feels about it
Thu Dec 24, 2015, 01:14 PM
Dec 2015

But I know EXACTLY how his supporters feel about it and it is his supporters,and Clinton's, are who the DNC is supposed to work for.

MineralMan

(146,324 posts)
25. Nor do I. Frankly, it's up to Bernie Sanders, not his supporters
Thu Dec 24, 2015, 01:15 PM
Dec 2015

to call for this. Perhaps we'll hear from him today. Perhaps not. That's not what this thread is about, though. It's about forensic data auditing companies. I did a search for them, and you can find connections with major corporations and banks for every last one of them that has the ability to handle this job. That is my point.

If you know of one that does not have any such connections, please let me know.

catnhatnh

(8,976 posts)
28. Frankly it was up to the DNC
Thu Dec 24, 2015, 01:18 PM
Dec 2015

to attempt at least the appearance of fairness but they couldn't bother. How sad you think a major candidate should have to request that as if it were an extra pat of butter at a diner...

LuvLoogie

(7,020 posts)
34. How about Uretsky? He seems like a stand up guy.
Thu Dec 24, 2015, 01:56 PM
Dec 2015

I hear he's looking for work, anyway. A high profile audit like this would get him back on track and would go a long way to atone for the DAMAGE done to his reputation by HRC, DWS, DNC, DC, STP, XYZ, PDQ...

murielm99

(30,754 posts)
46. LBJ took the IRT down to
Thu Dec 24, 2015, 08:46 PM
Dec 2015

4th Street USA. When he got there, what did he see? The youth of America on LSD!

LBJ IRT USA LSD
LSD LBJ FBI CIA
FBI CIA LSD LBJ

LOL LOL LOL LOL



BTW
Thanks for the post. Thanks for cutting through the whining.

nc4bo

(17,651 posts)
29. You gotta he kidding? !
Thu Dec 24, 2015, 01:23 PM
Dec 2015

Tyson Foods, Inc. to Acme Fox & Fence Co, Inc.: There's a chicken coop down yonder that's in need of security protection. How about you go on down there, check it out, we gave 'em your business card and a glowing referral. Hush now......remember we ARE the epitome of integrity..... you just remember that.

We rub you back, you rub ours. Haha. Shhhhh.

<wink-wink>

Let's wait and see how this plays out. They could be slimey as hell but still maintain an appearance impartiality and honesty (like DWS, DNC, NGP VAN and HRC). Right?

Btw, I agree with you.

BlueMTexpat

(15,370 posts)
38. Now let me see whether I understand this ...
Thu Dec 24, 2015, 02:07 PM
Dec 2015

There is a breach of the DNC database making privileged data accessible.

The Sanders campaign is able to access privileged data of the Clinton campaign. And does.

But somehow it is the Sanders campaign that should pick the firm to audit the event? (Obviously that's not what happened; it's what you seem to be arguing should happen.)

Imagine if the events had occurred the other way around. Hillary and her campaign would be virtually tarred and feathered by some here on DU. Some have been doing that all along and will likely continue doing so.

But hey, please go with your proposal. If Sanders wants to spend his campaign's money for a second audit, why not?

It makes as much sense as anything else about this situation - which really doesn't amount to much in the grand scheme of things anyway.


catnhatnh

(8,976 posts)
43. Are you truly that dense?
Thu Dec 24, 2015, 03:21 PM
Dec 2015

my poll suggests a firm approved by Sanders should " either participate in or at least observe the audit" and your reading comprehension gets " the Sanders campaign that should pick the firm to audit the event? ".

The only remaining question is did you read my post or not???

restorefreedom

(12,655 posts)
18. both sides should also consider a consultant
Thu Dec 24, 2015, 01:05 PM
Dec 2015

of their choosing to work alongside the firm, to be paid by each campaign. hopefully that would put to rest any concerns


LuvLoogie

(7,020 posts)
35. It doesn't seem Bernie has any concerns.
Thu Dec 24, 2015, 02:01 PM
Dec 2015

Once the results are in, though, and it confirms malfeasance by Sanders Campaign operatives, I'm sure Weaver will object at that point and will claim that they were never informed of the proposed auditor until after the audit started.

restorefreedom

(12,655 posts)
36. i have a feeling
Thu Dec 24, 2015, 02:03 PM
Dec 2015

weaver is holding more cards than he is indicating. no way they would continue to push this lawsuit unless they had some evidence of a prior breach. and if there was a prior breach, we don't know yet who accessed whos data.

no way is dws hands clean in this.

Paulie

(8,462 posts)
51. The big question is scope
Thu Dec 24, 2015, 09:05 PM
Dec 2015

if the scope is investigate only Sanders team access, then that's what the report will return.

Will the scope be the integrity of the system, the access controls for both the clients and the custodian vendor, and any access before, during or after the system update by the vendor, and change and software release workflow controls?

The client who commissions the report gets to comment and suggest changes to the wording. Findings are "clarified" before final presentation.

Bottom line, you think the scope should be broad or very very narrow?

 

AgingAmerican

(12,958 posts)
26. Debbie Wasserman Schultz broke the DNC contract with the Sanders campaign
Thu Dec 24, 2015, 01:16 PM
Dec 2015

In an effort to destroy him. The Clinton campaign jumped right in with her. It's a conspiracy. Its the tip of the iceburg.

MineralMan

(146,324 posts)
27. Yah, OK then...
Thu Dec 24, 2015, 01:18 PM
Dec 2015

Whatever you say...I have no insight into the DNC, nor to Shultz's thinking. If you do, then please outline it.

 

AgingAmerican

(12,958 posts)
42. Her actions are pretty telling, no need to read her mind
Thu Dec 24, 2015, 03:20 PM
Dec 2015

She started her shit before he even announced. I don't expect any Hillary supporters to admit it.

CorporatistNation

(2,546 posts)
49. AGREED!!!!!
Thu Dec 24, 2015, 08:55 PM
Dec 2015

Does anyone here question the use of the word "democracy" when describing what passes for the American Political System?

 

stupidicus

(2,570 posts)
31. yep, Hillarians are fully supportive of whatever "schlonging" they provide BS
Thu Dec 24, 2015, 01:45 PM
Dec 2015

they adopted the "the ends justify the means" rationale of their rightwing cousins from the day the 3rdway/DLC was born.

MineralMan

(146,324 posts)
33. Are they competent to do a forensic data audit?
Thu Dec 24, 2015, 01:53 PM
Dec 2015

I don't know. It doesn't seem to be part of their mission, based on my visit to their website. Such audits are pretty technical, really. It's a specialized thing.

Latest Discussions»Retired Forums»2016 Postmortem»Independent investigation...