BET Forum straw poll... Bernie 65% Hillary 23% OMalley 12%

[Fearless]

http://m.dailykos.com/story/2015/11/22/1453074/-Bernie-shows-up-to-BET-Forum-kicks-ass-crushes-straw-poll-Hillary-sends-surrogate-and-video


--------------------

So. Discuss.

[aspirant]

1. Wow, it turns the corporate polls upside down

[demwing]

2. It's unfair

O'Malley came in 3rd while Hillary didn't even bother to show up

[sabrina 1]

8. O'Malley however beat Hillary in the recent Iowa mock caucus poll.

[elleng]

29. See my post below;

this poll was taken only moments after O'Malley's participation in the discussion ended, and I think the audience had inadequate time to digest his policies. He made a real connection, and was much more on point than the others, imo.

[99Forever]

3. Polls are polls.

ALL of them posted here, are done by someone with an agenda. Most of them are done by someone with an agenda.

I don't take a single one of them as fact.

[Fearless]

4. So what are black people's agendas. Do tell.

[99Forever]

5. No thanks, I'll pass on the trollbait.

But perhaps you can come to the 4th precinct in MLPS and get the answers you seek. I'll be there, look me up.

[onecaliberal]

14. A lot of local issues are specific and regional. One local area will

Definitely not be like another even within the same demographic.

[sabrina 1]

9. Looks like from this poll result, they are looking for a candidate they can trust. And looks like

group feels Bernie is the most trustworthy after listening to him speak.

Pollsters have an agenda, as I understood the comment you responded to. Not people, Black or otherwise.

[99Forever]

15. Exactly.

Seemed pretty obvious that was what I was saying.

But then, those that stir, gotta stir.

[sabrina 1]

16. When you had a card to play, even after it's clear it is a losing card, the temptation to

keep playing it every chance you get, must be overwhelming!

Someone somewhere thought that particular card would be a winner.

It wasn't.

If it were me, I would discard it!

[brooklynite]

6. "Straw Poll"

end of discussion

[sabrina 1]

10. Why can't Hillary win even one online straw poll, debate poll, mock Caucus poll?

Last edited Sun Nov 22, 2015, 04:47 PM - Edit history (1)

That is where a majority of people now get their news. You would think she could win some of them once in a while, but she can't seem to do that. Even though, contrary to the excuses made, her supporters do participate in these polls.

Now that there have been so many of them with Bernie winning all of them, someone might be wondering if her campaign resonates only with older, longtime registered Dems and even there Bernie has chipped away at her support and continues to do so as more people are introduced to him.

[brooklynite]

11. Maybe because Clinton supporters are out in the real world talking to voters...

...and not engaging in online one-upsmanship.

Let me make the following observation. For months we've been told that Clinton actually isn't winning; that there was a horde of disaffected viewers, invisible to scientific polls (poll apparently reflected in Facebook posts and Twitter follows) who would show up on Primary day and shock the political establishment. Except that now Sanders has acknowledged that if the Primary was today, he'd lose. That suggests that the scientific polls are correct, and the self-selecting internet polls are not.

[bahrbearian]

12. Talking to the voters in Manhattan ?

[DemocratSinceBirth]

25. Brooklynite lives in brooklyn as his name suggests...Isn't Brooklyn where the plebeians live? /nt

[bahrbearian]

36. How far away is Manhattan? Where Hillary gets her cash.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

37. I left NYC when I was a lil boy but culturally...

I left NYC when I was a lil boy but culturally Manhattan and Brooklyn might as well be separate nations.

[sabrina 1]

17. Well you're here and I see a whole lot of Hillary supporters all over Social Media. Are you saying

Hillary supporters done USE Social Media?

Because if so, you could not be more wrong. They are all over Social Media.

You can be in the Real World today AND be online, considering the technology available.

You can be at the Airport, at College, shopping, walking down the street, you can even be at a Political event, GOTV or just about anywhere in the Real World and STILL be online.

See, that statement tells me how out of touch many of Hillary's supporters are. They don't seem to have moved with the times regarding technology. Not ALL of them obviously considering how many ARE online.

I see Hillary supporters and everyone else online and I never assume they are stuck behind a desktop somewhere. Those days are history.

I assume they are capable of even being at work AND puttng some thoughts online without missing a beat.

If that comment was intended to imply that only Bernie supporters are online and therefore not part of the 'real world', sorry but that's the kind of thing people used to say 20 years or so ago BEFORE the introduction of technology that makes that statement so obviously from the past.

Primary season is about Candidates introducing themselves to the people.

The Primary WON'T be held today. If Primaries were held before people got a chance to learn about Candidates only those with Name Recognition would win.

Obama eg, would not have won at this stage in the 2008 Primary. So what is your point?

[retrowire]

30. THIS

Hillary supporters have just as much access to the same info and polls as Bernie supporters.

Simply put, where you guys at? :/

[sabrina 1]

32. I think it's a lack of enthusiasm. Bernie's supporter are so on fire with enthusiasm for their

candidate. I don't see that in her supporters. They seem to be so unhappy all the time, not promoting their candidate, but bashing Bernie and his supporters. That's fine but it won't help get their candidate elected. We'll just keep on talking about issues, correcting any smears and lies we see, and working to sign up as many more people for Bernie as we can!

[retrowire]

41. Well it isn't so much unhappiness

as it is complacency.

I see a majority of Hillary supporters feel that she's got this in the bag.

Thus, they'll sit at home, twiddle their thumbs and watch their favorite cartoons, comforted by the idea that Hillary needs no help.

That complacency will be her main downfall.

[NanceGreggs]

44. I find it mind-boggling ...

... that you could draw the conclusion that HRC supporters don't spend as much time on-line as BS supporters from the fact that by and large, HRC supporters don't participate in on-line polls.

"See, that statement tells me how out of touch many of Hillary's supporters are. They don't seem to have moved with the times regarding technology. Not ALL of them obviously considering how many ARE online."

That's pretty much like saying that if you don't play on-line games, you're behind the times and don't understand how to use the internet.

Participating in on-line polls is not "using technology" - it is ignoring the technology behind scientific polls simply because they are not reflective of what one wants to see.

In all probability, HRC supporters aren't engaging in on-line polls because they serve absolutely no purpose, and are meaningless in the real world. And in all probability, BS supporters are participating in on-line polls because those are the only polls that show BS ahead of HRC, or gaining any real traction. Ergo, meaningless on-line polls are touted - and desperately clung to - by those who don't want to accept the reality that BS isn't going anywhere.

I'd say that those who cite on-line polls that claim "Bernie is going to win all 50 states!!!" are the people who don't understand how to use the internet in order to source actual data, but instead spend their time searching for something - anything, no matter how removed from reality - in order to convince themselves that the real polls are wrong.

[sabrina 1]

45. Um, I think you intended that post for Brooklyite. I HAVE BEEN ARGUING THAT HILLARY SUPPORTERS

DO SPEND AS MUCH TIME ONLINE AS BERNIE SUPPORTERS!

Sorry to shout but when someone gets something THIS wrong, and lashes out at the WRONG PERSON, I feel that maybe they don't read small print and it becomes necessary to SHOUT.

Btw, Hillary supporters ARE engaging in online polls! Who said they weren't other than a few people here.

[NanceGreggs]

52. I was speaking to ...

... your assertion that that is what Brooklynite was saying - which he very obviously wasn't.

"See, that statement tells me how out of touch many of Hillary's supporters are. They don't seem to have moved with the times regarding technology."

You are equating non-participation in on-line polls with "not moving with the times regarding technology". There IS no technology involved in on-line polls.

"You would think she could win some of them once in a while, but she can't seem to do that. Even though, contrary to the excuses made, her supporters do participate in these polls."

On-line polls have been the subject of many, many discussions here. And by and large, HRC supporters have stated that they don't participate in them. In fact, the few HRCers who have weighed-in in those discussion threads have, for the most part, stated that the only reason they have "voted" in said polls was to find out whether they can vote multiple times - because if said polls do calculate multiple votes from the same participant (which most do), that serves as proof that such on-line polls are useless.

"I think it's a lack of enthusiasm. Bernie's supporter are so on fire with enthusiasm for their candidate. I don't see that in her supporters."

You equate HRC not winning on-line polls with a "lack of enthusiasm" among her supporters - ignoring the fact that what it really speaks to is a lack of enthusiasm for participating in useless on-line polls that are beyond pointless, and serve no purpose - other than to give BS supporters something to point to and say, "See - he's really ahead - it's just those damned real-life polls that are saying he's not!"

[Live and Learn]

21. Funny, we do Benie events every weekend and I have yet to see any Hillary people

campaigning. Maybe they are just invisible.

[Gloria]

61. Or we like privacy and don't post

on social media and take online polls!!!!!

[brooklynite]

34. Okay, try this one...

Maybe the fact that we're winning with real voters (even Sanders agrees that at this point he'd lose), means we don't feel the need to try and make ourselves feel good by "winning" a poll on Facebook?

FWIW - there will be about 40 M Democratic voters next year. Based on current polling, Sanders will have about 16 M (round up to 40%). Let's be incredibly generous and assume that one of the online polls Sanders "won" reflected 50,000 voters. That's 0.3%. In other words, 99.7% of Sanders voters are equally unenthusiastic.

[sabrina 1]

35. Obama would have lost also at this point in the primaries.

Real people vote in online polls. So if you want to go with real people, I'm not sure who you think eg, votes in straw polls.

Or in mock caucuses.

Or, as in the Justice Forum

All are real people despite the effort to deny that.

I'm fine with knowing what real people think.

Airc, the traditional polls thought Romney was defeat Obama.

They were wrong about the Canadian, Uk and Greek elections also.

They are worried about how often they are getting things wrong these days.

I have no faith in those polls. They are not polling large demographics because their methodologies are too old.

[brooklynite]

40. Real people DO inded vote in online polls...

What you fail to grasp is that MOST real people (almost all of them) DON'T vote in online polls.And that includes people voting for Sanders.

The Clinton campaign is work on tried and true strategies of reaching out to voters one on one and in small groups; not spamming blogs with YouTube videos and showing strength through Facebook polls. Maybe we're completely wrong, and will all be caught by surprise. So far, it doesn't look that way.

[Rex]

55. Were you caught by surprise in 2008?

I bet so.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

7. Congratulations to the Senator for his straw poll win./nt

[bahrbearian]

38. And his high approval rating , next to Hillary and her high disapproval ratings.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

39. That makes me happy...

His high approval ratings will be a salve after he is eliminated by Super Tuesday , if not earlier.


< I know what your response is so my response to your response is already planned. You should have left a rare tender moment from me alone>

[bahrbearian]

42. I don't get paid to be here.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

46. Neither do fucking I.

I don't get paid to be here.

Neither do fucking I. Keep raising that ante, though...

[bahrbearian]

47. Ok your just here all the time, LOL

[DemocratSinceBirth]

48. Waiting for you

Ok your just here all the time, LOL

Waiting for you, LOL




Love,
DSB

[bahrbearian]

49. still , must still be on the clock

[DemocratSinceBirth]

50. What clock?

If you can prove I am on the take I will cut off my , errrrr, ear and eat it before I bleed to death.

[bahrbearian]

51. You know I can't prove that unless I could access the DNC data base.

Yes i can take a hide, I know you like to have the last word so have at it.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

53. Wow

You know I can't prove that unless I could access the DNC data base
Yes i can take a hide, I know you like to have the last word so have at it.

The last word is don't make up stuff about me. I would literally bet my , errrr, ear, you don't make stuff up about people to their face, in real life...

What a lousy accusation to say I get paid to post for Hillary here , especially since I have been posting here for twelve years...But coming from you and your ilk it is not surprising.

[bahrbearian]

56. What your alert, fail

[DemocratSinceBirth]

57. " What your alert, fail"

What your alert, fail

-bahrbearian

I didn't alert on you...Keep making stuff up about me , though...It reveals more about you than it can ever reveal about me.

"...Yes i can take a hide, I know you like to have the last word so have at it."

-bahrbeatian

I thought you said I could have the last word...If I were any more up in your head I would have to pay rent, lol

You picked the wrooooong poster to bully and make stuff up about.

[bahrbearian]

58. You picked the wrooooong poster to bully and make stuff up about.

Please continue

[DemocratSinceBirth]

60. I will... I am logging off for the evening.

I am sure you will have more insults for me and prevarications about me after I log off after telling me I can have the last word:

"...Yes i can take a hide, I know you like to have the last word so have at it."

-bahrbearian

I will check My Posts in the morning for more of your poison missives. Hit me with your best shot. You picked the wroooong poster to pick on.


Love,
DSB

[valerief]

13. I wish they lumped all the candidates in their poll in one group instead of dividing them

up by party. Yeah, I know, primary, blah, blah. However, I'd like to see how Bernie ranks against Carson in a poll of this group.

[GreenPartyVoter]

20. Yes, I am more interested in D vs R polls too!

[Cheese Sandwich]

18. Great result. There's no denying Bernie made a connection there.

I actually posted something similar because I didn't notice this thread until just now.

I just wanted to say...


http://www.ibtimes.com/bernie-sanders-bet-presidential-forum-democratic-candidate-talks-blacks-lives-matter-2195154

[AzDar]

19. K & R

[Enthusiast]

22. I'm happy with those results.

[Uncle Joe]

23. Kicked and recommended.

Thanks for the thread, Fearless.

[elleng]

24. The straw poll, 'DrumRoll,' was taken moments (if that) after O'Malley ended his interview.

In my opinion, there was inadequate time for the audience to 'digest' his policies, positions, and experience, which are vastly superior to those of the other candidates. Had there been more time, he would have received a higher number.

[cprise]

28. Getting the 'last word' is usually considered an advantage.

IMO, it makes the result all the more interesting.

[elleng]

33. It would have been, IF there had been adequate time to digest AND actually obtain their 'votes.'

I suspect that didn't happen.

[MH1]

54. I don't think 12% was a bad showing, under the circumstances.

People are just getting to know O'Malley. The media has mostly acted like it's a two-person race, so people have to adjust their thinking to consider this other guy that they really don't know all that much about.

He has just around 3% in the national polls. Getting so much higher a result after a forum where a large number of people probably already had their minds made up when they walked in the door, seems like a very good sign to me. (Was there a pre-forum poll, or did they ask whether people had changed their preference after hearing the candidates speak?) If the average support for O'Malley is hovering around 3-5% for people who don't know much about him, but after hearing his positions that jumps up to 12%, that's a very good sign.

[elleng]

59. Thanks for your thoughtful analysis, MH1.

I'm annoyed at the 12% because his performance, substantively, was so much better than the others', imo.

I consider the national polls are worthless at this point, locals IA and NH and SC and NV much more telling. I don't know whether or not there was a pre-forum poll. I really like the idea of DrumRoll-type, poll of a limited group after a particular event (in spite of the predictable skepticism here,) saying how much they liked him after he discussed his policies and previous performance.

I really think such fora, with AAs, could be very valuable, and I wonder whether others are planned.

[elleng]

27. I would like to suggest to those interested in what's happening on the ground

that those who would disparage the results of a 'mere' 'strawpoll' and would like everyone to ignore what happens day to day, as the ELECTORATE LEARNS about candidates, are the foolish ones.

[sibelian]

31. Not much TO discuss, I'd say.

Pretty obvious conclusion to draw - one side thinks black people are voting machines, the other doesn't and black people can tell.

[AtomicKitten]

43. Wonderful. So pleased his message resonated.

[jfern]

62. kick