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sabrina 1

(62,325 posts)
Thu Nov 12, 2015, 03:00 PM Nov 2015

Bernie Sanders' Superb Civil Rights Record the REASON for the Rovian Smears We are Seeing.

This Weeks Corporate Funded Talking Point? Bernie Wasn't Bernie. The arrest record, the CORE leadership. Sssshhhh, they don't want you to KNOW about Bernie's excellent record on Civil Rights AGAIN when it COUNTED.

Does that mean they are beginning to really worry that people ARE finding out about his history regarding Civil Rights?

There really is no doubt about Sanders Civil Rights Record, where he was, what he was involved in during the Civil Rights Era.

So seeing the Rovian attempts to obliterate that history SHOWS US how FEARFUL his enemies are that the PEOPLE will learn about it, as they ARE and maybe wonder: What was Hillary DOING at that same time?

The LATEST TALKING POINT?

You've seen it, a few times now today. Frankly I am encouraged to see the EFFORT and MONEY going into the smear campaign to try to stop Bernie's momentum. You should be too. Because NOTHING says Bernie is WINNING like his enemies desperately turning out talking point after talking point and failing with every single one so far.

?quality=75&strip=color&w=1100

Bernie Sanders a member of the steering committee, stands next to George Beadle, University of Chicago president, who is speaking at a Committee On Racial Equality meeting on housing sit-ins. 1962.

Now the real question regarding that era when two of our Dem Candidates were around. We KNOW what Bernie was doing.

But where was Hillary?

I am hearing that question a lot lately!

Go Bernie! Best Civil Rights Record of almost anyone, not just in THIS campaign, but in Congress!

.

217 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
Highlight: NoneDon't highlight anything 5 newestHighlight 5 most recent replies
Bernie Sanders' Superb Civil Rights Record the REASON for the Rovian Smears We are Seeing. (Original Post) sabrina 1 Nov 2015 OP
Exclusive: College Alumni Raise Doubts About Bernie Sanders Campaign Photo Cali_Democrat Nov 2015 #1
Thanks, THAT'S the Talking Point I'm Talking about. Btw, where was Hillary while Bernie was getting sabrina 1 Nov 2015 #4
Relax. Cali_Democrat Nov 2015 #7
Stalking is creepy! sabrina 1 Nov 2015 #8
Results of jury duty. I think stalking is creepy too. Tierra_y_Libertad Nov 2015 #153
Thank you for the results. I had a feeling it would be alerted. It usually is. sabrina 1 Nov 2015 #171
Did someone say Sanders was winning all fifty states? NCTraveler Nov 2015 #14
I repeat, Stalking is Creepy sabrina 1 Nov 2015 #21
Who is stalking you? NCTraveler Nov 2015 #28
This OP is about Bernie's V Hillary's Civil Rights Era activities. I will repeat Stalking is Creepy! sabrina 1 Nov 2015 #35
Who is stalking you? You brought that up, not me. NCTraveler Nov 2015 #38
If not stalking, you are needling the wrong person LiberalLovinLug Nov 2015 #72
Sabrina1 made the claim she was being stalked. NCTraveler Nov 2015 #76
Yes, it is serious and has nothing to with you. Don''t worry about me, I am perfectly sabrina 1 Nov 2015 #80
Sure thing. I just hate to see such claims bandied about with nothing to back them up. NCTraveler Nov 2015 #83
No it wasn't just a heat of the moment thing. Don't worry, most people know exactly what it's about. sabrina 1 Nov 2015 #87
Doesn't seem like it's being handled fine. NCTraveler Nov 2015 #106
Trust me, it's being handled. Now, if we could keep this thread ON TOPIC sabrina 1 Nov 2015 #107
most ankle-biting _____ are stalkers stupidicus Nov 2015 #189
A pretty accurate description! Thank you! sabrina 1 Nov 2015 #201
you're welcome sabrina stupidicus Nov 2015 #214
We must have been on the same boards lol! I appreciate now all I learned from those right wingers. sabrina 1 Nov 2015 #215
I was a long time Slate/The Fray participant stupidicus Nov 2015 #216
I started out on a totally unmoderated forum taken over by Bush/Fox supporters. At the time it was sabrina 1 Nov 2015 #217
A heat of the moment thing for Sabrina???!!!! bvar22 Nov 2015 #97
I noted that but decided to let that one go. But I will certainly not allow stalkers sabrina 1 Nov 2015 #102
I asked her to show where she was being stalked. NCTraveler Nov 2015 #104
Not your problem. Second request. Could we keep this thread ON TOPIC, which is sabrina 1 Nov 2015 #116
It sounded like you were asking for a link to the claim.. LiberalLovinLug Nov 2015 #92
I asked the poster that made the claim to back it up. NCTraveler Nov 2015 #120
Thanks, it's part of what I was referring to regarding stalking. I believe the goal is to derail sabrina 1 Nov 2015 #122
Did you simply ask the OP Sheepshank Nov 2015 #136
Stalkers are creepy! sabrina 1 Nov 2015 #204
the exact same words I'd used several months ago to one of your Bernie compadres, stalkers Sheepshank Nov 2015 #213
You're way out of line on this thread. Suggest you self-delete b/4 you further embarrass yourself. Scuba Nov 2015 #147
It's a waste of time. zeemike Nov 2015 #85
The problem is, if you have a good memory and remember what has been posted here... George II Nov 2015 #48
If they are going to make such a serious claim, they should back it up a little. nt. NCTraveler Nov 2015 #54
Don't worry, I told you, it's under control. sabrina 1 Nov 2015 #140
What about people who have been shown to SwampG8r Nov 2015 #183
Ding ding ding ding ding ding ding ........ !!!. polly7 Nov 2015 #187
Are you the duer who had her loss of a child mocked? SwampG8r Nov 2015 #191
Yes, I am. polly7 Nov 2015 #192
I'm sorry SwampG8r Nov 2015 #194
No, it's ok! polly7 Nov 2015 #195
We both know now SwampG8r Nov 2015 #196
You're right, it never gets ok. polly7 Nov 2015 #197
One of DU's lowest moments, to mock a mother who has lost a child! sabrina 1 Nov 2015 #205
Yes, that would also fit the category. n/t sabrina 1 Nov 2015 #202
Yeah it is UglyGreed Nov 2015 #49
Prove that somebody said that. Ken Burch Nov 2015 #182
"where was Hillary while Bernie was getting View profile arrested?" George II Nov 2015 #19
Hillary and Bernie are of the same generation. She didn't spend the entire Civil Rights era in High sabrina 1 Nov 2015 #22
In 1962, the date of that photograph, she was only 14 or 15 years old. George II Nov 2015 #24
And then what? What did she do throughout the rest of the Civil Rights era that could even compare sabrina 1 Nov 2015 #27
HOW did "her campaign attempt to Swift Boat Bernie"?????? You keep saying that but then stop there! George II Nov 2015 #40
My best friend was her age. dogman Nov 2015 #115
Since she was a Goldwater girl, floriduck Nov 2015 #50
Then people need to know what her record is. HER campaign chose to go this route. Bernie was sabrina 1 Nov 2015 #64
I completely agree with you. nm floriduck Nov 2015 #79
You are right... ljm2002 Nov 2015 #141
I absolutely agree. This requires an in depth article comparing both candidates, who are from the sabrina 1 Nov 2015 #143
You have got to be crazy Chitown Kev Nov 2015 #179
Super Pacs, not the candidates, btw, Bernie doesn't have a Super Pac due to the fact that sabrina 1 Nov 2015 #203
What a coincidence!!! bvar22 Nov 2015 #78
I just mentioned that many people in High School at the time participated in the Civil Rights sabrina 1 Nov 2015 #82
The majority of my high school friends were also involved. bvar22 Nov 2015 #89
Perhaps it's not swift boating maybe someone else FloridaBlues Nov 2015 #112
Still in high school. Thinkingabout Nov 2015 #139
And? Lots of people who were in High School were involved in the Civil Rights Movement back then. sabrina 1 Nov 2015 #150
Okay, what was Sanders doing for civil rights when he was fourteen? Thinkingabout Nov 2015 #151
What was Hillary doing when she was in High School? She was in High School during the Civil Rights sabrina 1 Nov 2015 #152
The question was what was Sanders doing when he was fourteen for civil rights? Thinkingabout Nov 2015 #175
He wasn't working for Goldwater or any other Republican. sabrina 1 Nov 2015 #206
You need to go back to 1955, what was Sanders doing for civil rights when he was 14? Thinkingabout Nov 2015 #207
Would be interesting to have a breakdown. I saw no way to get directly involved when I-- eridani Nov 2015 #180
Thank you. I do think that people simply know what is right and wrong from a very early age as you sabrina 1 Nov 2015 #208
Hillary? She was trying to join the Marine Corps that day. Scuba Nov 2015 #148
Bam!!!! 840high Nov 2015 #158
That's Bernie. Look at the mouth, nose, jaws, and of course the glasses. brush Nov 2015 #164
No, it's not going anywhere thanks to the people who are making sure these Corporate funded sabrina 1 Nov 2015 #165
wow.... DianeK Nov 2015 #32
Thank you, as I said, stalking other DUers is creepy. And you are correct, it absolutey does no good sabrina 1 Nov 2015 #36
Who is stalking you? rbrnmw Nov 2015 #75
Oh, she has a lot of stalkers. polly7 Nov 2015 #95
Oh no, I toss it where it belongs. sabrina 1 Nov 2015 #174
It's called 'Swift Boating' AgingAmerican Nov 2015 #88
If you take a good look zalinda Nov 2015 #166
Trivial. The college had told Bernie's campaign it was Bernie. Ken Burch Nov 2015 #181
We know it's Bernie. It is called Swift Boating and his supporters cannot give an inch to those sabrina 1 Nov 2015 #190
K/R UglyGreed Nov 2015 #2
How does Time have an axe to grind? RandySF Nov 2015 #3
Since we've already caught Hillary's Super Pac, run by David Brock, attempting to plant stories sabrina 1 Nov 2015 #5
Are You Kidding Me? Time-Warner is Hillary's 7th Largest Donor! 99th_Monkey Nov 2015 #13
And I'm sure, the old Right Wing Smear King, David Brock, already CAUGHT trying to plant sabrina 1 Nov 2015 #39
Exactly. The last time I got the "Bernie can win GE because of RW attack ads will sink him" canard 99th_Monkey Nov 2015 #63
Excellent response, they really are having a much more difficult time with their talking points sabrina 1 Nov 2015 #94
Same axe as Clinton's e-mails Armstead Nov 2015 #101
Actually I disagree wrt these calculated smears against a candidate, planted in the media, as this sabrina 1 Nov 2015 #124
When We Stand Together - No Citizen Need Settle For The Lesser Of Two Corporate Evils - Go Bernie Go cantbeserious Nov 2015 #6
You can say that again and I know you will. sabrina 1 Nov 2015 #11
...^ that 840high Nov 2015 #159
He does not have the best record in congress on Civil Rights BainsBane Nov 2015 #9
You missed a word in my statement, but that's okay. Hint, you are misquoting me. sabrina 1 Nov 2015 #10
Divide the country by talking about black activism? BainsBane Nov 2015 #18
My instant reaction to this story being posted here by the person posting it was randys1 Nov 2015 #29
"whitesplaining" is a crock LiberalLovinLug Nov 2015 #86
Nope, looks like whitesplaining to me randys1 Nov 2015 #93
Okidoky LiberalLovinLug Nov 2015 #100
I am a Bernie supporter as long as he is in the race. This has nothing to do with the 2 candidates randys1 Nov 2015 #103
Fair enough LiberalLovinLug Nov 2015 #130
Why do you support Bernie over Hillary? sabrina 1 Nov 2015 #209
Wall street, bankers, economy, minimum wage, beholding to the randys1 Nov 2015 #211
Yes, those are some of the reasons why I want a candidate who represents the people AND am not just sabrina 1 Nov 2015 #212
It's made up stuff that didn't get much traction. The people who truly care about the issue of sabrina 1 Nov 2015 #146
That worked out so well after Netroots and Seattle, didn't it? BainsBane Nov 2015 #108
They are keeping it up, it seems. randys1 Nov 2015 #109
It's fine to support his record BainsBane Nov 2015 #132
I am even rethinking my position on it but NOT because I doubt Bernie's credibility randys1 Nov 2015 #133
Lol, of course it was. Btw, do you know anything about this 'person' you speak of? sabrina 1 Nov 2015 #113
Who, what? What person? randys1 Nov 2015 #114
Well there you go, even you don't know what you are talking about. And I thought it was just me. Not sabrina 1 Nov 2015 #117
The person is you. Is Berniesupportersplaining better? randys1 Nov 2015 #118
No such thing. 840high Nov 2015 #160
LOL LOL Oh wow, and on a liberal message board no less.... randys1 Nov 2015 #188
I believe I've already stated my position on this. I work with people who actually are doing sabrina 1 Nov 2015 #41
Nobody said that for Christ sake Armstead Nov 2015 #105
The word 'almost' in my statement was ignored by that poster. So you are correct. sabrina 1 Nov 2015 #199
The racially divisive memes have been coming from Hillary's campaign. leveymg Nov 2015 #156
Do you often take offense for imaginary slights? Several paragraphs of outrage based on misreading xocet Nov 2015 #67
Well said BB! mcar Nov 2015 #126
Attacking one's strength, aka "swiftboating" corkhead Nov 2015 #12
rather sad this is what team h learned artislife Nov 2015 #15
No it doesn't work. It only worked on Kerry because they did not fight back. That isn't going to sabrina 1 Nov 2015 #16
Absolutely. And we have to do this on not only DU but on jwirr Nov 2015 #26
Oh definitely. They raised the issue, now we need to compare these two Candidates' history during sabrina 1 Nov 2015 #31
I suggest that the comparison needs to be from 1960 to today. jwirr Nov 2015 #43
Who are you trying to educate, specifically? randys1 Nov 2015 #33
Actually most people who watched the Swift Boat smears against Kerry don't need much sabrina 1 Nov 2015 #42
Voters. jwirr Nov 2015 #44
Which ones? randys1 Nov 2015 #90
Do not much care - here on DU it is just an issue - but the jwirr Nov 2015 #96
I know why these threads are started. Bernie supporters dont need to be reminded randys1 Nov 2015 #98
Since Hillary's Campaign is attempting to Swift Boat a good democratic candidate for the WH sabrina 1 Nov 2015 #111
"But where was Hillary?" George II Nov 2015 #17
Well, she did see Dr. King and shake Dr. King's hand Chitown Kev Nov 2015 #20
Me neither. It's too bad that Hillary's Campaign decided to go the Swift Boat route, because all it sabrina 1 Nov 2015 #25
Thisis the kind of crap in politics Bernie HATES! in_cog_ni_to Nov 2015 #46
Money is what makes it possible. And we can USE their dirty tactics to highlight what has now sabrina 1 Nov 2015 #52
LOL. nt Cali_Democrat Nov 2015 #23
Btw, I know lots of people who were younger than that during that era who were protesting sabrina 1 Nov 2015 #34
In HS age 16, 17 at a local college I heard lectures by Julian Bond, Angela Davis, Bucky Fuller, appalachiablue Nov 2015 #172
Yes, I've talked to many people who were in HS and like you, were very active during that era. sabrina 1 Nov 2015 #173
Now they are trying to swift boat him AgingAmerican Nov 2015 #30
Never forget, it was a shock to me when I learned it, they have the MASTER of SMEARS working sabrina 1 Nov 2015 #45
AND....his fame came from the book he wrote about his smear campaign against Bill and Hillary! in_cog_ni_to Nov 2015 #56
Airc, he was the one who started the whole thing, no doubt for money as the man doesn't seem to sabrina 1 Nov 2015 #62
Swiftboating Bernie is not going to work. in_cog_ni_to Nov 2015 #37
Absolutely. And it raises more questions about Hillary and what she was doing back then than sabrina 1 Nov 2015 #47
Deeply involved in the Civil Rights Movement? Chitown Kev Nov 2015 #53
Bernie Sanders Has an Excellent Civil Rights Record. MineralMan Nov 2015 #51
Nobody is 'browbeating' anyone AgingAmerican Nov 2015 #57
Flashy Signature Line MineralMan Nov 2015 #58
Flashy attempt at changing the subject AgingAmerican Nov 2015 #59
Yes, many Bernie Sanders supporters are browbeating black people Chitown Kev Nov 2015 #68
Define 'browbeating'? AgingAmerican Nov 2015 #71
all the "he marched with King" bullshit? Chitown Kev Nov 2015 #123
It's called the truth AgingAmerican Nov 2015 #125
Sanders, himself said Chitown Kev Nov 2015 #127
Some Hillary supporters are acting AgingAmerican Nov 2015 #128
I don't, really Chitown Kev Nov 2015 #129
List the Racist OPs by Sanders supporters then AgingAmerican Nov 2015 #131
I don't have to Chitown Kev Nov 2015 #134
Given the amount of OPs by her supporters leveling charges of racism against Sanders AgingAmerican Nov 2015 #135
Yes, actually you do unless you want the allegation to be dismissed. That of course is up to you. sabrina 1 Nov 2015 #210
What?? You are calling telling the truth 'browbeating'? I wonder if you realize how much that sabrina 1 Nov 2015 #177
It's been told 46,947,930 times at this blog Chitown Kev Nov 2015 #178
That talking point went the way of the dinosaur quite a while ago. I am offended by smears and lies sabrina 1 Nov 2015 #168
People have a right to the facts. Only then can they make informed decisions. These disgusting sabrina 1 Nov 2015 #60
The Facts Are That He Has an Excellent Civil Rights Record MineralMan Nov 2015 #61
The Fact is that there is a Rovian attempt to hid that FACT. THAT is what this OP is about. sabrina 1 Nov 2015 #66
Well said, MM. Your words will as usual fall on deaf and deluded ears. But they were Number23 Nov 2015 #121
They become more right wing every week AgingAmerican Nov 2015 #55
Yes, they do. To go to the lengths of using Rove's Swift Boat tactics, is about as right wing sabrina 1 Nov 2015 #144
I. Keep. Reposting. This. But. It's. Being. Ignored. whatchamacallit Nov 2015 #65
It isn't being ignored. It's just that people will no longer go into those threads. If you want to sabrina 1 Nov 2015 #70
I did originally whatchamacallit Nov 2015 #73
Okay, I just rec'd it. But part of the reason why it might not have received sabrina 1 Nov 2015 #77
I don't mind at all, Sabrina whatchamacallit Nov 2015 #81
I understand completely whatchamacallit and I love your posts. Not everyone is going to sabrina 1 Nov 2015 #84
I'm not beyond reproach whatchamacallit Nov 2015 #91
I would take any criticism from you the same way, whatchamacallit, and have received plenty from sabrina 1 Nov 2015 #99
If he wants their votes, then yes he does have that responsibility mythology Nov 2015 #110
Well, Sabrina, like you I believe that the establishment is deliberately skewing PatrickforO Nov 2015 #69
Polls of what people really care about say we are not in 'la-la' land. That is why they are so sabrina 1 Nov 2015 #74
yes skewing....la la land may be more real than you imagine Sheepshank Nov 2015 #138
The dumbest part of that smear... dorkzilla Nov 2015 #119
"Did Bernie really march with MLK?"is the 2015 version of birtherism and swift boating. beam me up scottie Nov 2015 #137
They learned well from Rove. And each time they do it reflects badly on their own sabrina 1 Nov 2015 #142
Precisely... MrMickeysMom Nov 2015 #145
Yes, and if they think this time their Swift Boating funded by Corporate money is going to go sabrina 1 Nov 2015 #149
Attack your opponent on his strength. merrily Nov 2015 #154
It worked, BEFORE we all knew about these devious, machievellian individuals. It has lost its sabrina 1 Nov 2015 #155
We need to spread the word as best we can. "The left of the left" has almost zero media voice. merrily Nov 2015 #157
We are. The truth never fails in he face of lies. All we have to do is tell the truth about Bernie's sabrina 1 Nov 2015 #161
"Tell the truth about the truth and tell the truth about the lies." merrily Nov 2015 #162
K&R! KoKo Nov 2015 #163
Doing the right thing for 53 years and counting. Half-Century Man Nov 2015 #167
Yes, he was the right choice to step forward at this point in our history. His record is very hard sabrina 1 Nov 2015 #169
Too often do we confuse notoriety for nobility. Half-Century Man Nov 2015 #170
It Berns them that he is real, proven, and true. senz Nov 2015 #176
Kicked and recommended! Enthusiast Nov 2015 #184
"But where was Hillary?". She was a Goldwater Girl at the time, and they (Republicans) NorthCarolina Nov 2015 #185
Did someone say, "Goldwater Sachs"? jalan48 Nov 2015 #186
I had noticed that myself davidthegnome Nov 2015 #193
Thoughtful post, thank you. The only reason for this OP is because we know that sabrina 1 Nov 2015 #200
K&R H8ers gonna H8 Cosmic Kitten Nov 2015 #198
 

Cali_Democrat

(30,439 posts)
1. Exclusive: College Alumni Raise Doubts About Bernie Sanders Campaign Photo
Thu Nov 12, 2015, 03:01 PM
Nov 2015
Exclusive: College Alumni Raise Doubts About Bernie Sanders Campaign Photo
Sam Frizell @Sam_Frizell 10:49 AM ET


At a televised Democratic candidate forum Friday, MSNBC host Rachel Maddow showed Bernie Sanders a black-and-white photo of man with his face turned away from the camera speaking before a civil rights protest. “This is you in 1962,” Maddow said to the Vermont senator.

“Who is that handsome young guy with the dark hair?” joked Sanders. The audience laughed.

There was just one problem: Four University of Chicago alumni who went to school with Sanders tell TIME they believe that the dramatic photo of Sanders, which his campaign has featured on its website and in a promotional video, is not in fact a photograph of Sanders. An archivist at the University of Chicago agreed in January that Sanders was not the speaker in the photo, though the school’s official decision on the man’s identity is still pending.

The alumni say the man in the photo is actually Bruce Rappaport, a fellow student activist with a similar haircut, glasses and stature, who died in 2006. “I can certainly recognize it as Bruce Rappaport, partly because of the curvature of his spine, and I see that tall thin look from the side,” said Richard Schmitt, who was in the class of 1966 and lived near Rappaport in a campus dorm. “When I saw it, I said, ‘That’s Bruce Rappaport.”

Read more:

http://time.com/4108379/bernie-sanders-photo-civil-rights/?xid=tcoshare

sabrina 1

(62,325 posts)
4. Thanks, THAT'S the Talking Point I'm Talking about. Btw, where was Hillary while Bernie was getting
Thu Nov 12, 2015, 03:05 PM
Nov 2015

arrested for protesting Segretated Housing? I'm doing a lot of research on HER Civil Rights era history now, having done it on Bernie.

Got anything to show where she was, what she was doing to help me with that research? So far all I could find was a speech at some college.


I lover the attempt to Swift Boat a good Democratic Candidate, but it won't work this time, as there is an ARMY, hundreds of thousands of them ready to sink that boat and then USE it against those who are trying it.

If I were a Hillary supporter I would stick to the issues..

 

Tierra_y_Libertad

(50,414 posts)
153. Results of jury duty. I think stalking is creepy too.
Thu Nov 12, 2015, 09:30 PM
Nov 2015

REASON FOR ALERT

This post is disruptive, hurtful, rude, insensitive, over-the-top, or otherwise inappropriate.

ALERTER'S COMMENTS

Accusing another DUer of stalking is out of line. Sabrina1 has nothing to back up her ludicrous claim, stop this stuff.

You served on a randomly-selected Jury of DU members which reviewed this post. The review was completed at Thu Nov 12, 2015, 05:24 PM, and the Jury voted 2-5 to LEAVE IT.

Juror #1 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: No explanation given
Juror #2 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: Does the alerter not think that stalking is creepy? I think stalking is creepy. Sabrina1 doesn't say CaliDem is stalking her. Me thinks someone might be protesting too much.
Juror #3 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: No explanation given
Juror #4 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: No explanation given
Juror #5 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: No explanation given
Juror #6 voted to HIDE IT
Explanation: No explanation given
Juror #7 voted to HIDE IT
Explanation: I agree with the person who alerted. With nothing to back it up, Sabrina is being childish and making false accusations.

Thank you very much for participating in our Jury system, and we hope you will be able to participate again in the future.
 

NCTraveler

(30,481 posts)
28. Who is stalking you?
Thu Nov 12, 2015, 03:46 PM
Nov 2015

I truly don't remember anyone here making such an outlandish statement about Sanders winning fifty states. Someone would lose credibility if they had done so. Who knows. I might have even made a mocking post in such a thread. If said poster is correct would you share the link with me. Seems to be something you and the other poster are aware of, I'm not. If you and the other poster have a history of stalking one and other I'm not aware of it either.

sabrina 1

(62,325 posts)
35. This OP is about Bernie's V Hillary's Civil Rights Era activities. I will repeat Stalking is Creepy!
Thu Nov 12, 2015, 03:51 PM
Nov 2015
 

NCTraveler

(30,481 posts)
38. Who is stalking you? You brought that up, not me.
Thu Nov 12, 2015, 03:55 PM
Nov 2015

It's a really simple answer. Is the other poster stalking you? I don't find it Rovian to call out Hillary on her Bosnia story. I don't think it is Rovian here either. I actually think the whole premise is pretty dense. But back to YOUR original reply to me. Who is stalking you? You have made it twice now. I think Sanders at one point was an activist with a positive influence on civil rights. He is back to being an activist again and I think it's absolutely great. Not sure what that has to do with stalking but you brought it up. Who?

I don't think anyone would actually claim he would win fifty states. I simply asked for a link. Very common around here. Do you have the link?

LiberalLovinLug

(14,173 posts)
72. If not stalking, you are needling the wrong person
Thu Nov 12, 2015, 04:41 PM
Nov 2015

If you go back and look, it was not Sabrina that said "Bernie is winning all 50 states". It was Cali_Democrat. And it was said obviously in a sarcastic back-handed swipe to taunt Sanders supporters. Why are you demanding Sabrina provide proof of someone else's weak attempt at ridicule?

 

NCTraveler

(30,481 posts)
76. Sabrina1 made the claim she was being stalked.
Thu Nov 12, 2015, 04:48 PM
Nov 2015

That is very important and is an issue for the administrators and the site as a whole. If you are now foolishly saying I am stalking her, you could prove it amazingly easily. Just pull up her last ten ops and see how many I replied to. It was Sabrina1's claim that she is being stalked. No one else. Additionally, that is a pretty low bar for taunting you have there.

"Sabrina provide proof of someone else's weak attempt at ridicule? "

I am asking her to back up her serious claim of stalking. I agree with you, no one here is foolish enough to promote Sanders is going to win all fifty states in a serious manner. But the stalking claim really is serious. You didn't make the claim, Sabrina1 did.

sabrina 1

(62,325 posts)
80. Yes, it is serious and has nothing to with you. Don''t worry about me, I am perfectly
Thu Nov 12, 2015, 04:55 PM
Nov 2015

capable of handling my own affairs, and have done so for more than a decade with issues like this. Thanks for the concern though, but I will deal with it myself, I'm kind of independent that way!

 

NCTraveler

(30,481 posts)
83. Sure thing. I just hate to see such claims bandied about with nothing to back them up.
Thu Nov 12, 2015, 05:00 PM
Nov 2015

I'm going to assume it was just a heat of the moment thing for you.

sabrina 1

(62,325 posts)
87. No it wasn't just a heat of the moment thing. Don't worry, most people know exactly what it's about.
Thu Nov 12, 2015, 05:09 PM
Nov 2015

Call it phase one of dealing with internet stalking. .


As I said, it's not your concern and I'm handling it just fine right now.

 

NCTraveler

(30,481 posts)
106. Doesn't seem like it's being handled fine.
Thu Nov 12, 2015, 05:41 PM
Nov 2015

I wouldn't be asking who as you have now made the claim multiple times. Your claim. Not mine. Good luck.

sabrina 1

(62,325 posts)
107. Trust me, it's being handled. Now, if we could keep this thread ON TOPIC
Thu Nov 12, 2015, 05:44 PM
Nov 2015

that would be appreciated!

 

stupidicus

(2,570 posts)
189. most ankle-biting _____ are stalkers
Fri Nov 13, 2015, 12:33 PM
Nov 2015

almost by definition, and certainly are so if you define it connotatively. They usually self-ID with non-topical garbage intended solely to aggravate/annoy their obvious betters, and to convince themselves and their cohorts that they really "showed them!" despite leaving that responded to completely unaddressed and unrebutted.

I would bet every high profile poster here has a small collection of ankle-biters/stalkers who conduct themselves in that way.

 

stupidicus

(2,570 posts)
214. you're welcome sabrina
Sun Nov 15, 2015, 07:32 PM
Nov 2015

I use to have plenty of the rightwinger kind when I posted on mixed boards.



sabrina 1

(62,325 posts)
215. We must have been on the same boards lol! I appreciate now all I learned from those right wingers.
Sun Nov 15, 2015, 09:48 PM
Nov 2015

Though at that time never thought it would come in handy on a Dem forum!

 

stupidicus

(2,570 posts)
216. I was a long time Slate/The Fray participant
Sun Nov 15, 2015, 10:06 PM
Nov 2015

mostly the infamous Ballot Box board. In it's waning days, there was next to no moderation whatsoever, so I'm sure you can imagine...
I was hoping to leave all that behind sabrina, but one of the first things I noticed when I started participating here before the 2012 election, was the many similarities in tactics used by the DLC/3rdWay types and their rightwing cousins. Harrassing of the ankle-biting kind figured prominently in their efforts to silence their more/most vociferous opposition.

have a good night

sabrina 1

(62,325 posts)
217. I started out on a totally unmoderated forum taken over by Bush/Fox supporters. At the time it was
Sun Nov 15, 2015, 10:13 PM
Nov 2015

fine to threaten, hijack with viruses, or do whatever possible to silence the 'left'. I learned how to get around all their tricks and didn't just survive, but learned a lot about 'talking points' and tactics which has become very useful. Many of us Dems have noted the similarity between those right wing tactics and the third way. I was watching a conversation a few years where Third Way Dems put forward the idea of 'emulating Rove' who they claimed, knew 'how to win'. It was revealing to say the least. I thought we were supposed to fight dirty political tricksters, not become them.

Anyhow, thanks for your comments, I'm not sorry I had those experiences, it makes it much harder for the would be 'ankle biters' to gain any traction. I'm sure you learned a lot also!

Have a great evening!

bvar22

(39,909 posts)
97. A heat of the moment thing for Sabrina???!!!!
Thu Nov 12, 2015, 05:26 PM
Nov 2015

YOU are the one who attributed that stupid post to her instead of where it belonged.

Maybe a "heat of the moment" thing for YOU?
Sabrina has crossed no boundaries.
YOU have, and owe her an apology and retraction.

sabrina 1

(62,325 posts)
102. I noted that but decided to let that one go. But I will certainly not allow stalkers
Thu Nov 12, 2015, 05:35 PM
Nov 2015

to go unnoticed. I suppose they THINK people are not noticing but that's not my problem. I will call them out each time they appear in my threads with their 'clever' little games. If they don't like it, they have the option to stop. Either way suits me fine!

Thanks bvar, I appreciate your observations as I do all the others since this particular stalking tactic began.

 

NCTraveler

(30,481 posts)
104. I asked her to show where she was being stalked.
Thu Nov 12, 2015, 05:39 PM
Nov 2015

A claim that she made. No one else. Apologize? Dear Lord. What did I do that was heat of the moment. I asked a poster to back up their claim about someone saying Sanders was going to win fifty states. That poster has not been able to back it up. Sabrina1 has made multiple comments about being stalked without backing it up. Apologize. Love it.

Innuendo, insinuation, and no facts. If the op wants to talk Rovian they should stop these things.

sabrina 1

(62,325 posts)
116. Not your problem. Second request. Could we keep this thread ON TOPIC, which is
Thu Nov 12, 2015, 05:58 PM
Nov 2015

Bernie's excellent Civil Rights Record and the attempt by Hillary's Campaign to use old Rovian Tactics, see the Swift Boaters, to try to distort the record.

Do you have anything to contribute to the thread topic? I assure you, I am more than capable of handling stalking situations as I've told you. You seem inordinately concerned about this, even after I have assured you that it is being handled expertly.

LiberalLovinLug

(14,173 posts)
92. It sounded like you were asking for a link to the claim..
Thu Nov 12, 2015, 05:18 PM
Nov 2015

..that Sanders can win all 50 states. When you know full well that no such link can exist, nor did Sabrina ever claim that. So it was a piling on of the original attempt at ridicule.

 

NCTraveler

(30,481 posts)
120. I asked the poster that made the claim to back it up.
Thu Nov 12, 2015, 06:16 PM
Nov 2015

The poster I asked to back up their claim is a Hillary supporter.

sabrina 1

(62,325 posts)
122. Thanks, it's part of what I was referring to regarding stalking. I believe the goal is to derail
Thu Nov 12, 2015, 06:25 PM
Nov 2015

threads, but in fact, they tend to help, inadvertently of course. I use such comments to keep good threads kicked AND to point out things that 'make DU suck'!

I appreciate your comments LiberalLovinLug!

 

Sheepshank

(12,504 posts)
213. the exact same words I'd used several months ago to one of your Bernie compadres, stalkers
Fri Nov 13, 2015, 03:27 PM
Nov 2015

glad you agree.

Regarding the 50 winning states statement. A little research does go a long way. You are so very, very frequently the one asking for people to offer a link to your previous statements, especially the ones you'd like to deny. That one was particularly easy to find and verify for the person I was responding to.

Not sure why decided to jump in and respond , but that's ok. I get that you calling others a stalker while you participate in the very same activity doesn't occur to you to be hypicritical.

 

Scuba

(53,475 posts)
147. You're way out of line on this thread. Suggest you self-delete b/4 you further embarrass yourself.
Thu Nov 12, 2015, 09:05 PM
Nov 2015

zeemike

(18,998 posts)
85. It's a waste of time.
Thu Nov 12, 2015, 05:08 PM
Nov 2015

They come here to run you around in circles and change the subject...make it about anything but the embarrassing subject of what Hillary was and probably still is...a Goldwater Girl.

George II

(67,782 posts)
48. The problem is, if you have a good memory and remember what has been posted here...
Thu Nov 12, 2015, 04:04 PM
Nov 2015

....you're considered a "stalker"!

I don't know how many of my posts have been pulled up from months ago, linked, and dissected, but the last think I would consider that is "stalking".

SwampG8r

(10,287 posts)
183. What about people who have been shown to
Fri Nov 13, 2015, 08:57 AM
Nov 2015

Go to other sites and coordinate attacks on duers with the intent to cause hides and silence them?
And then return to that other site.to high five and brag.
Is that stalking?

polly7

(20,582 posts)
187. Ding ding ding ding ding ding ding ........ !!!.
Fri Nov 13, 2015, 11:33 AM
Nov 2015

(Don't think you're gonna get an answer on that though, sorry.)

SwampG8r

(10,287 posts)
191. Are you the duer who had her loss of a child mocked?
Fri Nov 13, 2015, 01:13 PM
Nov 2015

I referred to it in a Bernie supporters are so mean thread
Sadly I was mocked for objecting to such demented and horrible actions
Classy bunch over at camp weathervane

polly7

(20,582 posts)
192. Yes, I am.
Fri Nov 13, 2015, 01:14 PM
Nov 2015

And the elephant just sat back on my heart ....... I was having sort of a good morning! No worries though, I know well who they are and what they stand for.

SwampG8r

(10,287 posts)
194. I'm sorry
Fri Nov 13, 2015, 01:16 PM
Nov 2015

Not my intention
I just had my dad pass. You have all my heart .
So sorry both for the loss and for making you hurt again.

polly7

(20,582 posts)
197. You're right, it never gets ok.
Fri Nov 13, 2015, 01:30 PM
Nov 2015

Time helps give you the tools to deal with it better ... it took me years before I was even able to take comfort in the good memories. I felt guilty for even trying, like I was accepting him being gone and I shouldn't do that. I know that sounds strange, but the pain is, always, right there. Please take all the comfort you can right now from people who care - it's so hard, again ... I'm so sorry.

sabrina 1

(62,325 posts)
205. One of DU's lowest moments, to mock a mother who has lost a child!
Fri Nov 13, 2015, 02:59 PM
Nov 2015

After that, nothing said by those who participated in that horrible thread is credible.

 

Ken Burch

(50,254 posts)
182. Prove that somebody said that.
Fri Nov 13, 2015, 07:36 AM
Nov 2015

Oh, and "Huey Freeman" would never support HRC. He'd probably write-in Ta-Nehisi Coates(assuming Huey managed to mke them let him vote at age eight).

sabrina 1

(62,325 posts)
22. Hillary and Bernie are of the same generation. She didn't spend the entire Civil Rights era in High
Thu Nov 12, 2015, 03:42 PM
Nov 2015

School to my knowledge. So what is her record from that era? People are asking, more and more of them. Some have switched from Hillary to Sanders BECAUSE of this issue. So it would benefit her supporters to promote HER Civil Rights Era activities rather than TRY to Swift Boat someone whose record is unimpeachable. Why don't they do that?

sabrina 1

(62,325 posts)
27. And then what? What did she do throughout the rest of the Civil Rights era that could even compare
Thu Nov 12, 2015, 03:46 PM
Nov 2015

to Bernie's well known record? And btw, her campaign's attempt to Swift Boat Bernie has only caused people to ASK that question Which they have now made a legitimate question. So, again, what is her history during that most important era?

George II

(67,782 posts)
40. HOW did "her campaign attempt to Swift Boat Bernie"?????? You keep saying that but then stop there!
Thu Nov 12, 2015, 03:56 PM
Nov 2015

What did she do?

She was just a teenager (14 years old in 1962, 17 year old in 1965), but even at that young age, among other things:

On Civil Rights: 1962: met MLK Jr. preaching a sermon in Chicago

In 1962, Don Jones, the youth minister at Hillary’s church took Hillary and her class to hear a speech by Martin Luther King Jr. The civil rights pioneer preached a sermon titled “Sleeping Through the Revolution,” and the experience gave Jones the opportunity to leave another indelible mark on his pupils. “I wanted them to become aware of the social revolution that was taking place. It was an opportunity for them to meet a great person. Park Ridge was sleeping through the greatest social revolutio this country has ever had.“

In his speech, Dr. King said too many Americans were like Rip Van Winkle, snoozing through the changes happening around them.

That night was one Hillary would never forget, particularly because of the moment after the speech, when Jones shocked the teen and her comrades by arranging to have them briefly meet with King. Later in life, Hillary would remark that these experiences opened her eyes ”as a teenager to other people and the way they live which affected me.“

Source: God and Hillary Clinton, by Paul Kengor

On Civil Rights: 1965: brought black classmates to all-white church

In 1965, Hillary invited a black classmate to attend church services with her at the Methodist church, a move that raised eyebrows. Don Jones later recalled that the Park Ridge Methodist folks were bothered because Hillary seemed to make the move “not out of goodwill” but simply to shock a “lily-white church.” She told Jones she was genuinely interested in her minority classmates, and today, schoolmates like Karen Williamson speak warmly of Hillary: “She was a friend. As a black woman going to Wellesley at the time friends were very welcome. All the black students felt we had a close friendship in Hillary.“ They also sensed something more: ”A lot of us thought Hillary would be the first woman president,“ said Williamson later.

It was Martin Luther King Jr.’s assassination that produced one of the greatest shifts. The trauma seemed to catalyze Hillary’s politics. Nevertheless, her classmates insist she was never a radical. Hillary was more willing to work within the system to change things.

Source: God and Hillary Clinton, by Paul Kengor



dogman

(6,073 posts)
115. My best friend was her age.
Thu Nov 12, 2015, 05:56 PM
Nov 2015

He marched with MLK down our main streets, about 40 miles from where she lived at that time. I really wouldn't have expected a Goldwater Girl to have marched with them. I'm glad she is drifting to a more liberal place in life. She still has a long way to go, but I'll grant that she is still better than any Repub running.

 

floriduck

(2,262 posts)
50. Since she was a Goldwater girl,
Thu Nov 12, 2015, 04:04 PM
Nov 2015

she likely reflected the principles and attitude of Barry Goldwater himself. That would not be the best position to have been in during the civil rights years. And that may be why you don't hear any civil rights support or activities for Hill.

sabrina 1

(62,325 posts)
64. Then people need to know what her record is. HER campaign chose to go this route. Bernie was
Thu Nov 12, 2015, 04:26 PM
Nov 2015

Last edited Thu Nov 12, 2015, 04:56 PM - Edit history (1)

not touting his record, it is simply part of his history. But then Hillary's Campaign decided to try to keep it from AAs by attacking him, Rovian style, on what really is one of his strengths they made HER history an issue also.

So since they raised it, we need to get her record, no lies, nothing like what they are trying to do, just the facts and put it out there and compare it to Bernie's.

Voters have a right to see this now, and let them try to cry about it, they raised it by attempt to lie about Sanders, thinking there would not be consequences to those lies?

This is not the Bush era when the right tried to do this to Kerry.

This is the era of the powerful Social Media where lies die a quick death especially when they are as blatant as this.

ljm2002

(10,751 posts)
141. You are right...
Thu Nov 12, 2015, 08:24 PM
Nov 2015

...they opened the door, now let the cross examination begin!

Wish I could recommend this post.

sabrina 1

(62,325 posts)
143. I absolutely agree. This requires an in depth article comparing both candidates, who are from the
Thu Nov 12, 2015, 08:28 PM
Nov 2015

same era, so that people can judge for themselves, and not allow these Corporate Funded smear campaigns to take control over the TRUTH, as they did with Kerry.

Chitown Kev

(2,197 posts)
179. You have got to be crazy
Fri Nov 13, 2015, 03:48 AM
Nov 2015
But then Hillary's Campaign decided to try to keep it from AAs by attacking him...


Do you have any evidence to back that statement up.

Damn, Hillary really is a superwoman or something.

sabrina 1

(62,325 posts)
203. Super Pacs, not the candidates, btw, Bernie doesn't have a Super Pac due to the fact that
Fri Nov 13, 2015, 02:50 PM
Nov 2015

they are the backdoor for massive amounts of money allowed by Citizens United to continue to flow into our electoral system and as a man who walks the walk, he doesn't not approve of them since he opposes CU.

They bypass the election law limits on donations and donors and what they give to a candidate's super pac, are allowed to be hidden from the public.

Every Democratic candidate who claims to oppose CU should do as Bernie has done, reject them.

Hillary's campaign however has not only NOT rejected them, her campaign is coordinating with David Brock's Hillary Super Pac.

And since you asked for 'evidence' that Bernie is being targeted by Hillary's campaign, Brock was exposed trying to PLANT smears agaiinst Sanders in the Media. Thankfully there are a few actual journalists left who received his 'memo' who did not agree that he had the right to remain anonymous.

Hillary has not condemned that vile sneaky attempt to smear Sanders, so I assume it's okay with her.

Too bad because it so disgusted people that tens of thousands of them donated small amounts of money to Bernie's campaign after the exposure.

He made over one million dollars thanks to Brock's little scheme, in 24 hours. That should demonstrate how sick and tired people are of the money in politics and the kind of people it attracts into our system of elections.

bvar22

(39,909 posts)
78. What a coincidence!!!
Thu Nov 12, 2015, 04:53 PM
Nov 2015

I was 14 when I participated in my first Civil Rights Demonstration and March.

sabrina 1

(62,325 posts)
82. I just mentioned that many people in High School at the time participated in the Civil Rights
Thu Nov 12, 2015, 04:59 PM
Nov 2015

Movement. Interesting that this is being used as an excuse for Hillary.

Hillary was a Goldwater Girl while other teenagers were involved in the Civil Rights Movement. That is a fact.

Now if they want to continue to try to Swift Boat Sanders on THIS issue, they better be prepared to have the TRUTH told about their candidate and stop whining about it.

bvar22

(39,909 posts)
89. The majority of my high school friends were also involved.
Thu Nov 12, 2015, 05:15 PM
Nov 2015

It wasn't difficult to decide that ALL people deserve Equal Opportunity and Equal Protection.

One caveat....I was raised in New Orleans, and while NO is the home of some hardcore racists,
it is also one of the most culturally blended and tolerant cities in the US....or used to be before Katrina.

FloridaBlues

(4,008 posts)
112. Perhaps it's not swift boating maybe someone else
Thu Nov 12, 2015, 05:52 PM
Nov 2015

Those statements didn'tcome from Hillary campaign .
Maybe Bernie thought that was him I mean 55yrs ago a long time to recall a meeting.

sabrina 1

(62,325 posts)
150. And? Lots of people who were in High School were involved in the Civil Rights Movement back then.
Thu Nov 12, 2015, 09:19 PM
Nov 2015

Maybe her campaign should have left Bernie's excellent record alone, because what it did, for me actually, was to start wondering 'what was Hillary doing' as soon as they started trying to destroy his record.

I think frankly since her campaign continues along this nasty Swift Boat route, it's time to get together a thorough history of both candidates at that time and disseminate it widely so that people can decide for themselves, without the Swift Boating, paid for by Corporate dollars.

It wasn't a good idea for her campaign. There's an old saying that unless you yourself are perfect, don't start pointing fingers especially when what you're doing is intended to deceive. You will find a whole lot of fingers pointing right back at you.

Her record from that time isn't very impressive. If I were advising her campaign, which I'm not, I would suggest they not draw attention to Bernie's, which is excellent, even in an effort to distort it, which no Dem should be doing anyhow, because the obvious response will be and has been 'What was Hillary doing back then'? Now if she had been out there, as he was, joining in the protests, getting arrested etc, THEN she could have raised it.

But that wasn't the case.

sabrina 1

(62,325 posts)
152. What was Hillary doing when she was in High School? She was in High School during the Civil Rights
Thu Nov 12, 2015, 09:28 PM
Nov 2015

era and I'll tell you what she was doing, she was a Goldwater Girl. I can assure you Bernie wasn't a Goldwater anything when he was 14.

Thinkingabout

(30,058 posts)
175. The question was what was Sanders doing when he was fourteen for civil rights?
Fri Nov 13, 2015, 01:52 AM
Nov 2015

BTW the civil rights movement was from 1955 to 1968.

eridani

(51,907 posts)
180. Would be interesting to have a breakdown. I saw no way to get directly involved when I--
Fri Nov 13, 2015, 07:08 AM
Nov 2015

--was in high school. I sure saw the need, though. I went to a National Science Foundation summer camp in 1963 held at Southern Illinois University. My roommate took an anthropology course that involved going on digs. After one of them, they all stopped at a hamburger stand to get something to drink after digging in high heat and humidity. The owner would not serve the two black students in the group, so the rest of them all walked out in solidarity. I thought it was great, but no one had any clue about what to do next. I went back to a Catholic high school with only two African American students, and no other minorities of any kind. When I was in college, a number of older students were involved in voter registration drives, and they collected money and clothing. Finally a chance to do something.

It was only later that someone told me that Illinois was actually three states--1/3 New York, 1/3 Iowa and 1/3 Mississippi. I was from the Iowa part and was seriously shocked to find out about the Mississippi part.

sabrina 1

(62,325 posts)
208. Thank you. I do think that people simply know what is right and wrong from a very early age as you
Fri Nov 13, 2015, 03:07 PM
Nov 2015

did. I know that family environment influences young people, but some seem to be able to overcome even that when an issue is about the rights of other human beings.

I think that since the Hillary campaign has been making an issue of Bernie's Civil Rights history since he entered the race, it is past time to do an in depth comparison of both of their records.

Perhaps when they chose this as THE issue to try to attack Sanders with, it should have occurred to them that it would also raise questions about their own candidate's history.

And it has.

brush

(53,778 posts)
164. That's Bernie. Look at the mouth, nose, jaws, and of course the glasses.
Thu Nov 12, 2015, 11:06 PM
Nov 2015

This smear is going nowhere.

sabrina 1

(62,325 posts)
165. No, it's not going anywhere thanks to the people who are making sure these Corporate funded
Fri Nov 13, 2015, 12:18 AM
Nov 2015

smears are exposed for what they are every time they appear.

 

DianeK

(975 posts)
32. wow....
Thu Nov 12, 2015, 03:48 PM
Nov 2015

is there no level that you will not stoop to? I just have to say..this post makes your side look very desparate..you may think you do, but trust me..you do Hillary no favors with such a desparate and pathetic attempt to discredit such an admiral man. Nothing less than disgraceful!

sabrina 1

(62,325 posts)
36. Thank you, as I said, stalking other DUers is creepy. And you are correct, it absolutey does no good
Thu Nov 12, 2015, 03:52 PM
Nov 2015

for their candidate.

rbrnmw

(7,160 posts)
75. Who is stalking you?
Thu Nov 12, 2015, 04:46 PM
Nov 2015

You toss that accusation at every poster who disagrees with you. This is a discussion board not an echo chamber.

polly7

(20,582 posts)
95. Oh, she has a lot of stalkers.
Thu Nov 12, 2015, 05:20 PM
Nov 2015

and they all come across as looking desperate and a bit ............ let's see, I'm trying for a nice word ........... obsessed! That's it!



 

AgingAmerican

(12,958 posts)
88. It's called 'Swift Boating'
Thu Nov 12, 2015, 05:11 PM
Nov 2015

It's what Republicans did to Kerry.

More right wing crap from Hillary supporters.

zalinda

(5,621 posts)
166. If you take a good look
Fri Nov 13, 2015, 12:21 AM
Nov 2015

you will see that the person at the time link is wearing the exact same sweater, glasses, haircut and pants as the above photo. Bruce Rappaport, my butt. This is swiftboating. Did Clinton's team pay these people to say such things, or did they come up with it themselves.

You should be ashamed.

Z

 

Ken Burch

(50,254 posts)
181. Trivial. The college had told Bernie's campaign it was Bernie.
Fri Nov 13, 2015, 07:32 AM
Nov 2015

Even if that isn't him in the photo, he was in SNCC at UofC and worked hard for the freedom movement...as opposed tp HRC, who played no role in it, ever.

sabrina 1

(62,325 posts)
190. We know it's Bernie. It is called Swift Boating and his supporters cannot give an inch to those
Fri Nov 13, 2015, 12:46 PM
Nov 2015

who are going to be spending huge amounts of money to plant stuff like we saw in the media, already caught Brock doing it, to try to destroy him.

This kind of thing should be condemned by everyone, regardless of candidate preferences. It is part os what ha destroyed our electoral system

sabrina 1

(62,325 posts)
5. Since we've already caught Hillary's Super Pac, run by David Brock, attempting to plant stories
Thu Nov 12, 2015, 03:07 PM
Nov 2015

in the media, we KNOW where these planted stories are coming from.

Media will publish whatever they get.

It's certaily an old Rovian trick and Hillary's campaign should be ashamed to be associated with it.

 

99th_Monkey

(19,326 posts)
13. Are You Kidding Me? Time-Warner is Hillary's 7th Largest Donor!
Thu Nov 12, 2015, 03:28 PM
Nov 2015

And they own CNN, who hosted the last debate that Hillary "won" despite
all independent evidence.

sabrina 1

(62,325 posts)
39. And I'm sure, the old Right Wing Smear King, David Brock, already CAUGHT trying to plant
Thu Nov 12, 2015, 03:55 PM
Nov 2015

stories in the media using Hillary's Super Pac, has a few connections to Time Warner especially since Hillary's Campaign has stated that they are 'working in coordination with Brock and his Hillary Super Pac.

All this is the reason WHY we must get the money out of politics. Every day we see more examples like this which are destroying our electoral system as people like Brock who have contributed NOTHING to this country OTHER than engage in smear campaigns, take advantage of that money.

 

99th_Monkey

(19,326 posts)
63. Exactly. The last time I got the "Bernie can win GE because of RW attack ads will sink him" canard
Thu Nov 12, 2015, 04:22 PM
Nov 2015

this was my response, which kinda makes your point as well, about how
Brock's attack ad on Bernie backfired:
http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1251&pid=795269

sabrina 1

(62,325 posts)
94. Excellent response, they really are having a much more difficult time with their talking points
Thu Nov 12, 2015, 05:20 PM
Nov 2015

paid for by Corporations, than they used to. But now that they have RAISED This issue AGAIN, probably planted by Brocks Hillary Super Pac, since we know he is doing this, I think it's time to do a real comparison between these two Civil Rights Era Candidates to see how they compare!

It's funny because initially they were dismissing Bernie's record, making ridiculous claims like 'that was 50 years ago and doesn't count' kind of thing.

I hadn't yet looked at Hillary's record at the time, and wondered how ANY Democrat could actually dismiss that entire era as 'not important'. Now I know! Lol, their own attempts at smears CAUSED people to go look at Hillary's record, and that explained the whole thing.

 

Armstead

(47,803 posts)
101. Same axe as Clinton's e-mails
Thu Nov 12, 2015, 05:34 PM
Nov 2015

They love inane controversies and made up scandals. Sells papers and gets eyeballs.

sabrina 1

(62,325 posts)
124. Actually I disagree wrt these calculated smears against a candidate, planted in the media, as this
Thu Nov 12, 2015, 06:31 PM
Nov 2015

was.

Hillary's emails is an entirely different issue. There was an investigation that warranted some coverage.

But having caught Brock eg, trying to plant LIES in the media, using Hillary's Super Pac, doing what he always has done, see the Paula Jones garbage, we KNOW these are planned smear campaigns which have zero to do with anything OTHER than to try to Swift Boat a good candidate.

I really wish we didn't get this 'both sides' routine when clearly that is not the case. Sick of it frankly.

BainsBane

(53,032 posts)
9. He does not have the best record in congress on Civil Rights
Thu Nov 12, 2015, 03:12 PM
Nov 2015

That is completely offensive. John Lewis bears life-long injuries from having the shit beat out of him in the Civil Rights movement. There are other Civil Rights activists, African Americans who have devoted their lives to the issue. The idea that one white man who marched 50 years ago has a better record than they do is completely offensive.

You really can't stop, can you? This is exactly how you alienate key segments of the public. This level of hero worship is unbecoming and when you make claims like he has the best record on Civil Rights you spit in the face of people who have risked their lives to fight for it. Bernie nor any other white liberal is their savior. They earned their rights by decades--centuries--of activism. And you show that means nothing compared to your desperate efforts to elevate one man above every other human being. Those kinds of claims only hurt his candidacy because they are so clearly false and reveal a stunning level of insensitivity and misinformation on your part.

As for the photos, you don't know who it is because you weren't there. There are people who were there you remember it differently. Regardless of the photo, that you use this as an opportunity to resurrect this whitesplaining about Bernie as more important in regard to Civil Rights than those who have devoted their entire lives to the struggle is unseemly.

How is Bernie's record on Civil Rights better than John Lewis'? Explain that now. You made the claim. Back it up.

sabrina 1

(62,325 posts)
10. You missed a word in my statement, but that's okay. Hint, you are misquoting me.
Thu Nov 12, 2015, 03:17 PM
Nov 2015

As for the rest, not interested in the opinions of people who want to divide this country. They are failing miserably as people are coming together more than ever before to undo the horrible policies that have led us to the point we are now at.

.

BainsBane

(53,032 posts)
18. Divide the country by talking about black activism?
Thu Nov 12, 2015, 03:36 PM
Nov 2015

Instead of insisting one white man who participated in a march fifty years ago has a better record than those who risked and gave their lives? You didn't just divide. You spit in the face of African American Civil Rights activists like John Lewis. You raised the issue, in a completely counterfactual way, and now you refuse to defend your claim that Bernie has the best or "almost" the best record.

What is divisive is to exclude a people from the history of their own struggle because it serves craven political purposes.
Sanders hasn't lived in black skin for one day. Any black member of congress has done more than he has. Any and all of them.

You have nothing to support your claim. No facts, no evidence. What has he done that is so great for Civil Rights? How is voting for the Mintuemen and the Wall being a great champion for Civil Rights? https://votesmart.org/candidate/27110/bernie-sanders?categoryId=40&type=V,S,R,E,F,P#.VkTrR4TydUQ
How is your insistence that he is more important to Civil Rights that the black members of congress not divisive?

There is nothing radical or progressive about the elevation of one man above to this extent. Quite the opposite. It betrays a profoundly conservative (not as in GOP but as in its traditional meaning) worldview, likewise evidenced by the ease with which you write an entire people out of their own history of Civil Rights activism.

randys1

(16,286 posts)
29. My instant reaction to this story being posted here by the person posting it was
Thu Nov 12, 2015, 03:47 PM
Nov 2015

whitesplaining/lecturing to Black folk why they should wise up about Bernie.

LiberalLovinLug

(14,173 posts)
86. "whitesplaining" is a crock
Thu Nov 12, 2015, 05:09 PM
Nov 2015

And you should be smart enough to know that. It teeters on racism itself.
It should not matter if a white person, or a black person, or another color person informs you, or me for that matter, and puts forth their reasons why this candidate or that candidate would be better for the issues that most affect you. The idea that its the messenger that is more important than the message is so counterproductive.

I guess its a conundrum when an AA like Ben Carson says that the ACA, enacted by another AA, is like living in Nazi Germany.


So would this gentleman in this article, Will Crosby, be "blacksplaining" to you?

http://inthesetimes.com/article/18405/building-black-support-for-bernie

Crosby thinks Bernie Sanders is the best presidential candidate for African Americans. “Bernie Sanders is talking about issues that directly affect our community and he’s doing it in a fearless way,” Crosby says. Unfortunately, he adds, Sanders’ message has yet to penetrate into the black community.

LiberalLovinLug

(14,173 posts)
100. Okidoky
Thu Nov 12, 2015, 05:33 PM
Nov 2015

I wonder though how Hillary differs from Bernie when both "whitesplain" their positions and their records on civil rights for you to side with Hillary in the end. Or is it more a matter of siding with "womensplaining" over "mensplaining" to you.

randys1

(16,286 posts)
103. I am a Bernie supporter as long as he is in the race. This has nothing to do with the 2 candidates
Thu Nov 12, 2015, 05:35 PM
Nov 2015

and everything to do with their supporters who are doing all the whitesplaining.

Hillary's supporters havent needed to do much whitesplaining, the others are doing it for them.

LiberalLovinLug

(14,173 posts)
130. Fair enough
Thu Nov 12, 2015, 06:55 PM
Nov 2015

Sorry I assumed you'd be a Hillary supporter.

And although I can empathize with the black community always taking a white person's opinion with a grain of salt (or maybe pepper) based on the history of the two races, I just find any belief system that self imposes a censorship based on the speakers race, sex, orientation, or for that matter anything..height, hair style, attractiveness...to be limiting and I pity those that first look at who said it, and not the validity of what was being said. Or that someone who is the "other" cannot have any insight whatsoever into another groups needs, or at least should never speak it. Its more that I am baffled than that I want to start an argument about it.

Have a good day

randys1

(16,286 posts)
211. Wall street, bankers, economy, minimum wage, beholding to the
Fri Nov 13, 2015, 03:13 PM
Nov 2015

wrong group.

All the reasons that I assume you do.

Potentially Middle East as well.

All of the issues that Hillary is not likely to improve on that he would (assuming he could get cooperation, and he wont) are very important.




However...there are many other issues that they agree on or that they are vastly different from the rightwing assholes.

Which is why I want to make sure both are strong candidates going into the real fight.

sabrina 1

(62,325 posts)
212. Yes, those are some of the reasons why I want a candidate who represents the people AND am not just
Fri Nov 13, 2015, 03:20 PM
Nov 2015

focused on the Presidential race. Electing actual Dems not Third Wayers as well as Bernie is absolutely vital to make sure that he does have support in Congress.

The past two mid terms have demonstrated that the people will no longer accept candidates who say one thing in campaigns, then vote the opposite way once elected.

Bernie will win the nomination absent any Corporate funded campaigns against him. Which is why, IF people actually do want someone who represents THEM over Wall St, they will make sure those campaigns go nowhere.

Unlike when Kerry was running and Dems did nothing to expose the smear mongers until it was too late.

No more can people afford to allow these smears to go unchallenged, unless of course they do not want to change the direction of this country.

sabrina 1

(62,325 posts)
146. It's made up stuff that didn't get much traction. The people who truly care about the issue of
Thu Nov 12, 2015, 08:49 PM
Nov 2015

racism are not found on internet forums attacking people and lying about good Democratic Candidates. They are far too busy working together with as many allies as possible to try to end the horrific police brutality and bigotry, which btw, I never see discussed here.

I and most of us who have long been trying to get attention for this issue, don't waste time here engaging in the garbage that is intended only to divide people.

Thankfully it has remained only something a very tiny group of disgruntled people still drag around trying desperately to get some attention in order to waste time and energy which is far better directed at doing constructive work that has a chance of success in the Real World.

randys1

(16,286 posts)
109. They are keeping it up, it seems.
Thu Nov 12, 2015, 05:49 PM
Nov 2015

To be honest, I believe Bernie is by definition and default superior to any living white politician when it comes to civll rights.

But this is merely my inexperienced opinion.

Yet I dont think that is what many AfAm are looking at, his dedication isnt questioned, I dont think, but his abilities are. Is he able to accomplish anything in the current environment?

Personally I think the teaparty hates Black people so much they wont cooperate with anybody ever, but it isnt up to me to tell the AfAm community what to think, good thing too.

BainsBane

(53,032 posts)
132. It's fine to support his record
Thu Nov 12, 2015, 06:59 PM
Nov 2015

and his candidacy. While I disagree with your assessment, good people can disagree. But when it's taken to those kind of exalted levels, it becomes absurd and counterproductive. That's what led to the whole #berniesoblack thing. Evidently some refused to pay attention to any of those concerns. That, I submit, is one problem with only considering views and information that confirms one's preexisting beliefs. It shuts out the concerns of large groups of people and makes for a very narrow and sometimes counterproductive approach.

randys1

(16,286 posts)
133. I am even rethinking my position on it but NOT because I doubt Bernie's credibility
Thu Nov 12, 2015, 07:03 PM
Nov 2015

but that I am learning what matters to those most affected.

Why it matters, and so on.

It is an education for a white guy, believe me

My privilege allows me to make observations that may not have any credibility whenever it comes to race.

sabrina 1

(62,325 posts)
113. Lol, of course it was. Btw, do you know anything about this 'person' you speak of?
Thu Nov 12, 2015, 05:54 PM
Nov 2015

I get such a kick out comments like yours, frankly.

We all do now.

But keep up the good work, you have no idea how effective it is for us when we are signing people up for Bernie, to show them these kinds of comments.

sabrina 1

(62,325 posts)
117. Well there you go, even you don't know what you are talking about. And I thought it was just me. Not
Thu Nov 12, 2015, 06:01 PM
Nov 2015

to worry, t happens to all of us one time or another.

sabrina 1

(62,325 posts)
41. I believe I've already stated my position on this. I work with people who actually are doing
Thu Nov 12, 2015, 03:57 PM
Nov 2015

something about these issues. Not with those who only pop up during elections.

Feel free to continue whatever it is you are trying to do.

 

Armstead

(47,803 posts)
105. Nobody said that for Christ sake
Thu Nov 12, 2015, 05:40 PM
Nov 2015

Saying that Sanders had a history of support and involvement in the civil rights era has absolutely NOTHING to do with John Lewis.

Nobody is saying that Sanders swooped in off the clouds and single-handedly led the Civil Rights struggle of the 60's. Jeeze that is beyond distortion. nSanders was one among many, many people who participated in that larger struggle. NO ONE is suggesting otherwise.

Yes some people disagree with Lewis's endorsement of Clinton. But so what? No one Nobody (at least nobody reasonable) is saying Lewis's history is wiped out because he made an endorsement today that some disagree with.

My Gawd,

leveymg

(36,418 posts)
156. The racially divisive memes have been coming from Hillary's campaign.
Thu Nov 12, 2015, 09:38 PM
Nov 2015

The contest isn't between Lewis and Sanders for greatest Civil Rights icon, it's been Hillary and Bernie for the Democratic nomination. So please don't try to convoluted the two.

In the nomination contest there is no question that HRC has the more RW record on issues such as criminal justice and war and peace issues thst directly and negatively impact the lives of POC along with the rest of America.

xocet

(3,871 posts)
67. Do you often take offense for imaginary slights? Several paragraphs of outrage based on misreading
Thu Nov 12, 2015, 04:34 PM
Nov 2015

a post is unfortunate to say the least.

sabrina 1

(62,325 posts)
16. No it doesn't work. It only worked on Kerry because they did not fight back. That isn't going to
Thu Nov 12, 2015, 03:34 PM
Nov 2015

happen here. I want to know what HILLARY was doing while Bernie was getting arrested for protesting segregation.

It will work if people continue to go into those threads and give them any attention whatsoever. The way to end these Rovian despicable smears is to start OPs that tell the truth.

jwirr

(39,215 posts)
26. Absolutely. And we have to do this on not only DU but on
Thu Nov 12, 2015, 03:45 PM
Nov 2015

the internet as well. Education is our tool.

sabrina 1

(62,325 posts)
31. Oh definitely. They raised the issue, now we need to compare these two Candidates' history during
Thu Nov 12, 2015, 03:48 PM
Nov 2015

the Civil Rights era. Using every Social Media account people have to do so.

sabrina 1

(62,325 posts)
42. Actually most people who watched the Swift Boat smears against Kerry don't need much
Thu Nov 12, 2015, 03:59 PM
Nov 2015

educating, they know what it is when they see it. How despicable though for any Democrat to support such tactics.

jwirr

(39,215 posts)
96. Do not much care - here on DU it is just an issue - but the
Thu Nov 12, 2015, 05:25 PM
Nov 2015

voters who are not setting on the computer all day all need to see that there is a difference between the candidate.

If you are implying that I want to educate black people well think again. I want to educate all voters.

randys1

(16,286 posts)
98. I know why these threads are started. Bernie supporters dont need to be reminded
Thu Nov 12, 2015, 05:27 PM
Nov 2015

about his record.

White Hillary voters either already know or take the position that her record is equal to Bernie's

There is only one group these are targeted at and we both know it

sabrina 1

(62,325 posts)
111. Since Hillary's Campaign is attempting to Swift Boat a good democratic candidate for the WH
Thu Nov 12, 2015, 05:50 PM
Nov 2015

I imagine that is what you are talking about.

Her Civil Rights Record is not equal to Bernie's which of course is why we are seeing these attempts to smear Sanders.

Since that is the route her campaign wants to take, now we will be seeing HER record, not smears, we don't engage in lies and smears, her REAL Civil Rights Era record.

George II

(67,782 posts)
17. "But where was Hillary?"
Thu Nov 12, 2015, 03:34 PM
Nov 2015
"Now the real question regarding that era when two of our Dem Candidates were around. We KNOW what Bernie was doing.

But where was Hillary?"


Excuse me, but in 1962 Hillary Clinton was in High School at the age of FIFTEEN!

Chitown Kev

(2,197 posts)
20. Well, she did see Dr. King and shake Dr. King's hand
Thu Nov 12, 2015, 03:37 PM
Nov 2015

at 15 years old, too.

I can't believe that this remains an issue, though.

sabrina 1

(62,325 posts)
25. Me neither. It's too bad that Hillary's Campaign decided to go the Swift Boat route, because all it
Thu Nov 12, 2015, 03:44 PM
Nov 2015

has done is raise questions about her own history during that era. But people will allow Swift Boating no doubt paid for by Corporate money, to go unchallenged THIS TIME.

We saw what happened when Kerry decided not to respond to it.

in_cog_ni_to

(41,600 posts)
46. Thisis the kind of crap in politics Bernie HATES!
Thu Nov 12, 2015, 04:01 PM
Nov 2015

So what if that one picture isn't him (though I think it is him - the hand gestures! Look at them AND the sweater) and who really gives a rats ass? No one does! Except The Hillpack and David Brock.

PEACE
LOVE
BERNIE

sabrina 1

(62,325 posts)
52. Money is what makes it possible. And we can USE their dirty tactics to highlight what has now
Thu Nov 12, 2015, 04:06 PM
Nov 2015

become one of the top issues in this campaign, getting the money out of politics.

I wouldn't be surprised if Brock and his Hillary Super Pac planted this story as he tried to do before with another attempt to smear Bernie, but got caught Red Handed.

We do indeed need to USE their money to demonstrate why getting the money out of politics is so important. Dry up those Corporate funds and we won't be seeing people like Brock going after it anymore. It would instantly rid DC of the army of cockroaches that hover around during election season willing to do ANYTHING to get their hands on some of that money.

sabrina 1

(62,325 posts)
34. Btw, I know lots of people who were younger than that during that era who were protesting
Thu Nov 12, 2015, 03:49 PM
Nov 2015

while in High School.

appalachiablue

(41,132 posts)
172. In HS age 16, 17 at a local college I heard lectures by Julian Bond, Angela Davis, Bucky Fuller,
Fri Nov 13, 2015, 01:37 AM
Nov 2015

Last edited Fri Nov 13, 2015, 02:12 AM - Edit history (1)

John K. Galbraith, Wm. F. Buckley, Abby Hoffman and others. I also participated in civil rights and anti war demonstrations there. Activism and involvement at that young age by many was not uncommon, you're right. I'm younger than Hillary by more than 6 years.

sabrina 1

(62,325 posts)
173. Yes, I've talked to many people who were in HS and like you, were very active during that era.
Fri Nov 13, 2015, 01:41 AM
Nov 2015

Being in HS certainly isn't an excuse for not being involved, especially in that period of our history.

 

AgingAmerican

(12,958 posts)
30. Now they are trying to swift boat him
Thu Nov 12, 2015, 03:48 PM
Nov 2015

They have absolutely no shame in their attacks from the right.

Right wing ruins minds.

sabrina 1

(62,325 posts)
45. Never forget, it was a shock to me when I learned it, they have the MASTER of SMEARS working
Thu Nov 12, 2015, 04:01 PM
Nov 2015

for Hillary's Campaign, coordinating with it actually, David 'blinded by the money' Brock. Anyone who would use that sleazy smear campaigner, who ever thought he had changed his ways, is beyond contempt imo.

in_cog_ni_to

(41,600 posts)
56. AND....his fame came from the book he wrote about his smear campaign against Bill and Hillary!
Thu Nov 12, 2015, 04:09 PM
Nov 2015

That, IMCPO, makes her hiring him REALLY, REALLY sick.

If anyone out there wants to read David Brock's book about what he did during Whitewater, it's "Blinded by the Right." Read it and then ask yourselves why would that man be let anywhere near the Clinton campaign?

It can only be because he knows all the Rovian tactics and how the game is played.

sabrina 1

(62,325 posts)
62. Airc, he was the one who started the whole thing, no doubt for money as the man doesn't seem to
Thu Nov 12, 2015, 04:22 PM
Nov 2015

have any principles that I am aware of. He introduced the world to Paula Jones airc, then used the Right Wing Noise Machine as he called it to plant the 'story' in their various networks of media online and on TV, Talk Radio.

This REEKS of Brock frankly. And I think it's time to review this smearmonger's history which nearly brought down a Democratic Presidency.

As for the Clintons now associating with him, yes, I find that to be utterly appalling.

Airc, when he made his first overtures to them, they ignored him. It was way, way too late, he had made his money, then made more writing his book, then was 'rewarded' for his defection with MM

l don't believe in rewarding morally corrupted individuals.

Anyone who thought he had changed, knows now that people like him, without ethics or morals for the most part do not change. After he was caught trying to use his old tactics, planting lies about Bernie in the media, exposed by two Bloomberg Journalists.


So that one failed, and this has his names written all over it. I'm sure he was a student and admirer of Rove.

in_cog_ni_to

(41,600 posts)
37. Swiftboating Bernie is not going to work.
Thu Nov 12, 2015, 03:54 PM
Nov 2015

He's got the entire force of the internet and Millennials behind him. Their hit jobs will be answered immediately and sent to the dust bins of history!

Or, in the case of the DU Hillpack, it will make their Master Bernie Hit List to be recycled over and over and over again.

Great post!

PEACE
LOVE
BERNIE

sabrina 1

(62,325 posts)
47. Absolutely. And it raises more questions about Hillary and what she was doing back then than
Thu Nov 12, 2015, 04:02 PM
Nov 2015

they apparently EXPECTED! It's time to take a close look at what she was doing while Bernie was deeply involved in the Civil Rights Movement.

Chitown Kev

(2,197 posts)
53. Deeply involved in the Civil Rights Movement?
Thu Nov 12, 2015, 04:06 PM
Nov 2015

I don't think so.

Doing what a lot of other students at The University of Chicago were doing at the time...yes

MineralMan

(146,310 posts)
51. Bernie Sanders Has an Excellent Civil Rights Record.
Thu Nov 12, 2015, 04:05 PM
Nov 2015

That's clear. Still, people of color will vote for the candidate they want to win. Browbeating them will not alter their decisions. Truly it will not.

Hillary Clinton has also done an excellent job, and is recognized for that by anyone who has paid attention.

As for being where MLK was while being a young white guy, I was, too. I stood in the crowd in Montgomery and heard him give his "How Long" speech after driving to be there from California at age 19. That, however, does not mean that I'm a civil rights hero. I"m far from that, despite supporting that movement all my life.

Many people were involved in those days, in one way or another. That, in itself, is not a qualification for support from people of color. There are many factors that go into that support. Many factors, indeed.

Chitown Kev

(2,197 posts)
68. Yes, many Bernie Sanders supporters are browbeating black people
Thu Nov 12, 2015, 04:35 PM
Nov 2015

and as someone who is quite informed about Sanders' record, I am offended by it.

 

AgingAmerican

(12,958 posts)
71. Define 'browbeating'?
Thu Nov 12, 2015, 04:40 PM
Nov 2015

Stating opinion on issues that affect African Americans is not 'brow beating'.

Chitown Kev

(2,197 posts)
123. all the "he marched with King" bullshit?
Thu Nov 12, 2015, 06:26 PM
Nov 2015

I mean, it's not like you are going door-to-door saying it; it's being talked about on blogs and in twitter. Constantly. As if black voters owe Bernie Sanders their vote because of it.

I'm informed...as every black poster on this blog is.

 

AgingAmerican

(12,958 posts)
125. It's called the truth
Thu Nov 12, 2015, 06:42 PM
Nov 2015

He did march with king. It isn't bullshit. It is a fact.

You cannot level accusations of racism against Sanders or his supporters and expect no push back. Sorry, politics doesn't work that way. It never has and never will. We will not 'sit down and shut up' and take accusations of racism, sorry.

Every time her supporters call Sanders 'White Supremacist' or 'racist' they will be reminded that he has the strongest civil rights record in this election, and that he marched with fellow Democratic Socialist Martin Luther King Jr, because facts are stubborn things.

Chitown Kev

(2,197 posts)
127. Sanders, himself said
Thu Nov 12, 2015, 06:46 PM
Nov 2015

that he was "way, way back there."

and I don't really give a shit what Sanders supporters will take and what they won't take. Some Sanders supporters are acting and behaving in a very racist way.

Chitown Kev

(2,197 posts)
129. I don't, really
Thu Nov 12, 2015, 06:50 PM
Nov 2015

I'm not a Hillary supporter.

But I will say that I can count the number of times on one hand that a Hillary supporter has approached me (online) with racist bullshit.

I can't say the same for some Sanders supporters.

Chitown Kev

(2,197 posts)
134. I don't have to
Thu Nov 12, 2015, 07:03 PM
Nov 2015

and besides, every post that I make refers to an outrageously racist post.

If you choose not to believe that no Sanders supporter is racist, that's your business. When a number of AA posters at this blog and other places are saying that...I mean, I would think that at least a little self-inventory would be done.

 

AgingAmerican

(12,958 posts)
135. Given the amount of OPs by her supporters leveling charges of racism against Sanders
Thu Nov 12, 2015, 07:13 PM
Nov 2015

Almost all of them backed up by phony strawman accusations, it's obvious that racist tripe against AAs in regards to the primaries is from Hillary supporters trying to drive support away from Sanders.

The number of Hillary supporters here pretending to back Sanders (I support Sanders, but...) is more proof. IT's what they do.

Apparently it's working too.



sabrina 1

(62,325 posts)
177. What?? You are calling telling the truth 'browbeating'? I wonder if you realize how much that
Fri Nov 13, 2015, 03:39 AM
Nov 2015

statement proves the point I made in the OP. THANK YOU!

So tellling the truth about Bernie's excellent Civil Rights record is browbeating!

I'm almost speechless.

I guess it demolishes the Talking Points intended to HIDE his Excellent Civil Rights Record, so there is that.

Chitown Kev

(2,197 posts)
178. It's been told 46,947,930 times at this blog
Fri Nov 13, 2015, 03:44 AM
Nov 2015

Where is his civil rights record hiding exactly? Whom are you telling this to and why?

sabrina 1

(62,325 posts)
168. That talking point went the way of the dinosaur quite a while ago. I am offended by smears and lies
Fri Nov 13, 2015, 12:22 AM
Nov 2015

as someone who is quite informed on the subject.

sabrina 1

(62,325 posts)
60. People have a right to the facts. Only then can they make informed decisions. These disgusting
Thu Nov 12, 2015, 04:16 PM
Nov 2015

tactics are designed to do to good candidates what was done to Kerry and this time they will not work. Because AAs are finding out for themselves, maybe BECAUSE of these despicable tactics, who was standing up when it was necessary, and who is attempting to keep that information from them.

We are definitely working to make sure these old Swift Boat Right Wing tactics backfire on those low enough to use them.

I remember the night when those liars began their Swift Boating of Kerry. We saw the post on FR offering to 'supply info that woud take Kerry down'. It was deleted when people began to figure out where it began and who they were.

Not going to happne to Bernie. Kerry waited too long and the lies stuck.

Bernie has an army of supporters who are not going to let these things go the way Kerry did. So no use attempting to 'appease' 'cajole' or smear those who want the money out of our political system because THIS is what it is used for.

MineralMan

(146,310 posts)
61. The Facts Are That He Has an Excellent Civil Rights Record
Thu Nov 12, 2015, 04:17 PM
Nov 2015

I agree with that. It's beyond question.

sabrina 1

(62,325 posts)
66. The Fact is that there is a Rovian attempt to hid that FACT. THAT is what this OP is about.
Thu Nov 12, 2015, 04:32 PM
Nov 2015

And until they STOP these lies and Corporate Funded smear attempts, hundreds of thousands of people will be all over Social Media, NOT being paid, volunteering to destroy and whenever possible, as in the last one that was exposed, cause them to BACKFIRE.

Bernie doesn't engage in these tactics.

But we know that when a Campaign does, it must be exposed. Unlike what happened with Kerry. In fact I think it may be time to document the Swift Boat campaign, which as I said, started to our knowledge, when they went to FR with their 'story'. Then used as is happening now, their 'media' contacts to spread the lies.

Not going to happen again. It is a #1 Issue in this campaign. The dirty political tactics PAID for by Corporate Funding facilitated by Citizens United.

Spreading these lies only makes it possible for people to highlight how damaging that money is to fair elections.

We thank them for providing the examples.

Number23

(24,544 posts)
121. Well said, MM. Your words will as usual fall on deaf and deluded ears. But they were
Thu Nov 12, 2015, 06:22 PM
Nov 2015

poignant nonetheless.

 

AgingAmerican

(12,958 posts)
55. They become more right wing every week
Thu Nov 12, 2015, 04:09 PM
Nov 2015

Her supporters know no shame. It speaks volumes to their integrity.

sabrina 1

(62,325 posts)
144. Yes, they do. To go to the lengths of using Rove's Swift Boat tactics, is about as right wing
Thu Nov 12, 2015, 08:35 PM
Nov 2015

as anyone can get.

whatchamacallit

(15,558 posts)
65. I. Keep. Reposting. This. But. It's. Being. Ignored.
Thu Nov 12, 2015, 04:32 PM
Nov 2015

Mainly because it debunks the ever popular "It's Bernie (and his supporters) fault he's not resonating with PoC" meme.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1251&pid=797516

This guy pretty much lays out the truth of the matter. For various reasons beyond Sanders' control this demo won't vote for him. All the other noise we've been hearing for months is divisive propaganda.

sabrina 1

(62,325 posts)
70. It isn't being ignored. It's just that people will no longer go into those threads. If you want to
Thu Nov 12, 2015, 04:38 PM
Nov 2015

get attention for these excellent comments, just some advice, don't put them in those talking point threads. People are refusing to kick them.

But start your own OP so that people get the facts. They will be lost in flame bait threads as more and more people realize that kicking them is what they want you to do and they don't care whether you are posting facts or not. Also a lot of people have then on ignore.

That thread you posted in is a perfect example of a talking point, nothing more.

sabrina 1

(62,325 posts)
77. Okay, I just rec'd it. But part of the reason why it might not have received
Thu Nov 12, 2015, 04:51 PM
Nov 2015

much support is that, and I hope you won't mind my saying this, it does acknowledge a talking point which has little basis in fact as evidence by who was quite happy to kick it.

The ONLY problem Bernie has with AAs is NAME RECOGNITION. Same as he had with everyone else.

Any other claim is a lie. To ackowledge the tallking points only strengthens them.

Bernie's support from AAs and other minorities, is growing by the day as evidenced on Social Media where each day I have to add Minorities for Bernie to my follow list and I can't keep up with them as more and more minorities learn about him for themselves.

The 'he has a problem' with AAs meme is just that, it's a lie. I am eg. working with longtime family friends from Virginia AA family, who are working there to introduce Bernie to AAs who never heard of him, but once they do, are enthusiastic about him, and when I show them some of what has been posted here, they just sigh. As I've said and will say again, none of those on this forum claiming to speak for AAs have any influence or right to make that claim.

Hope you don't mind my offering my opinion. I didn't kick it myself because it did feed into that meme.

whatchamacallit

(15,558 posts)
81. I don't mind at all, Sabrina
Thu Nov 12, 2015, 04:59 PM
Nov 2015

My purpose for reposting it wasn't to validate that opinion per se, but to point out to the original poster that if what this guy says is true, it works against the Bernie sux with PoC meme. I tend to agree with you, the more unadulterated exposure Bernie gets with all demos, the more people support him. Simply, I was using a respected AA pundit's opinion (factual or not) as a counter argument to the it's all Bernie's fault meme.

sabrina 1

(62,325 posts)
84. I understand completely whatchamacallit and I love your posts. Not everyone is going to
Thu Nov 12, 2015, 05:06 PM
Nov 2015

be as honest as you are and will jump on things and take them out of context which I have learned the hard way after so many years dealiing with the right back in the old Bush era.

I've learned to focus only on the positive. Even to contradict their talking points I found out by using them as a foundation for a discussion, feeds them and they will make sure to use them that way.

So now I post the FACTS about Bernie, THEN slam the lies, but never in their threads. Too bad we all had to learn to watch out for the deviousness that devours our system, especially people who are naturally honest and themselves would never engage in such tactics.

But sadly we do have to be aware. We don't have the funding and Super Pacs, Think Tanks etc to fight for Bernie, so we have to do it ourselves.

Love your posts, didn't in any way mean to criticize YOU, I was just pointing out how careful we have to be because not everyone is interested in honest discussion and likely to twist our words!

whatchamacallit

(15,558 posts)
91. I'm not beyond reproach
Thu Nov 12, 2015, 05:17 PM
Nov 2015

I admit half the stuff spontaneously issued from my virtual pie hole deserves criticism. And you have my blessing to call me on it anytime

sabrina 1

(62,325 posts)
99. I would take any criticism from you the same way, whatchamacallit, and have received plenty from
Thu Nov 12, 2015, 05:28 PM
Nov 2015

people I respect and tried to absorb it and remember the mine field we are trying to negotiate, sadly. I like to hear from people I respect on what I might be doing wrong, we all do. I don't, however pay much attention to people I do not respect for whatever reasons.

 

mythology

(9,527 posts)
110. If he wants their votes, then yes he does have that responsibility
Thu Nov 12, 2015, 05:50 PM
Nov 2015

There is no conspiracy blocking Sanders from forming a more effective message message to minority voters. He's the one who needs their votes.

PatrickforO

(14,574 posts)
69. Well, Sabrina, like you I believe that the establishment is deliberately skewing
Thu Nov 12, 2015, 04:37 PM
Nov 2015

polls, swiftboating and coming up with meme after meme to discredit Bernie and destroy his candidacy.

This is why I've often said on posts here that the establishment and its billionaire backers may be in for quite a surprise when the votes begin coming in.

Are we in 'la-la' land? I think not. But we'll see, won't we?

sabrina 1

(62,325 posts)
74. Polls of what people really care about say we are not in 'la-la' land. That is why they are so
Thu Nov 12, 2015, 04:43 PM
Nov 2015

desperate to keep people from learning about the ONLY candidate in the race who represents them.

And the reason why we must destroy their well-funded lies and smears everywhere we see them.

Because in the past, they worked, destroying candidates who could have taken this country in a whole different direction.

They are getting more push back now than they ever did before with these old smear campaigns.

We the people have some powerful tools at our disposal that we didn't have in the past, the Social Media for one, which thankfully they tend to dismiss.

So no, we are not in denial about anything, but it is going to be a huge fight to keep them from distorting and smearing those who we know and the people now, will be the best choices for this country.



dorkzilla

(5,141 posts)
119. The dumbest part of that smear...
Thu Nov 12, 2015, 06:16 PM
Nov 2015

is that they’re making an issue out of a picture that may have been of a guy who worked by his side "The alumni say the man in the photo is actually Bruce Rappaport, a fellow student activist with a similar haircut, glasses and stature, who died in 2006.”. They’re trying to make an issue out of something that, if true, was an honest mistake (the guy next to the podium is NO DOUBT Bernie though).


So they know these guys looked similar and were both devoted to the cause and worked tirelessly for Civil Rights. Both men were there. One picture may have been misattributed to Bernie but he WAS STILL DOING WHAT HE SAID HE WAS DOING. IT’S NOT LIKE BERNIE LIED, YOU KNOW, LIKE BEING UNDER SNIPER FIRE IN BOSNIA.

Honestly, this is seriously idiotic. Smells a fuckuvalot like desperation.

beam me up scottie

(57,349 posts)
137. "Did Bernie really march with MLK?"is the 2015 version of birtherism and swift boating.
Thu Nov 12, 2015, 08:07 PM
Nov 2015

Rove is jealous he didn't think of it first.


sabrina 1

(62,325 posts)
142. They learned well from Rove. And each time they do it reflects badly on their own
Thu Nov 12, 2015, 08:25 PM
Nov 2015

candidate because if they think this campaign will ignore these Swift Boat campaigns, as happened with Kerry, they are mistaken.

MrMickeysMom

(20,453 posts)
145. Precisely...
Thu Nov 12, 2015, 08:47 PM
Nov 2015

I'm glad to see this action memorialized. Most any thread pointing to what Sanders continues to do throughout his career gets a predictable response in the form of disrupting commentary.

It DOES mater WHO does WHAT WHEN and most of all - WHY.

Because Bernie Sanders has always been true to these goals. Simply put, Hillary has not.

K&R

sabrina 1

(62,325 posts)
149. Yes, and if they think this time their Swift Boating funded by Corporate money is going to go
Thu Nov 12, 2015, 09:12 PM
Nov 2015

unanswered, as it did with Kerry, they forget what era this is. This isn't back in the Bush era when there was no Social Media for the people themselves to use, to speak of. There were blogs, like this, but nothing to compare to the tools the people now have to combate the Corporate Funded Smear Campaigns we are seeing on a regular basis lately.

Brock was caught and exposed trying to plant negative, lying stories about Bernie in the media.

The result was a complete backfire, earning for Bernie tens of thousand of donations to his campaign.

THIS latest Swift Boat attack, was no doubt planted also. It is so typically ROVIAN that you know it wasn't just a few old 'friends' of Bernie's.

When it looks like a duck etc.

And Bernie needs and will need even more in the future the better he is doing, a rapid response to these Corporate Funded smears.

I notice also that when his supporters fight back all of a sudden we get 'both sides are doing it'. NO, they are NOT. Only ONE side is doing this the other side is responding, and that too is a fact.

sabrina 1

(62,325 posts)
155. It worked, BEFORE we all knew about these devious, machievellian individuals. It has lost its
Thu Nov 12, 2015, 09:38 PM
Nov 2015

effectiveness, now that sadly, we are no longer shocked, as we once were, that such people exist and tamper with our democratic system, using these evil, deceptive tactics to try to control it.

Who unless they themselves are equally evil, like Rove, would even have thought there were minds that occupied themselves with how to deceive and destroy, rather than build a nation into something better?

I wish I had never learned about them, but then I'm glad I did. Because it was our 'innocence' that allowed them to succeed.

sabrina 1

(62,325 posts)
161. We are. The truth never fails in he face of lies. All we have to do is tell the truth about Bernie's
Thu Nov 12, 2015, 10:02 PM
Nov 2015

Civil Rights record, and keep telling it and also, tell the truth about the lies.

sabrina 1

(62,325 posts)
169. Yes, he was the right choice to step forward at this point in our history. His record is very hard
Fri Nov 13, 2015, 12:24 AM
Nov 2015

to distort though for smear mongers trying is what makes their living. Still, it must be frustrating for them that it's getting more and more difficult to do with a candidate like Sanders and a population who is sick and tired of the entire rigged system.

Half-Century Man

(5,279 posts)
170. Too often do we confuse notoriety for nobility.
Fri Nov 13, 2015, 01:01 AM
Nov 2015

Being well known is not an endorsement of character.
Wielding power for the sake of wielding power isn't leadership. Leadership says, "Let us do this", not "I'll get this done".

I require no savior, but I'll lend my strength to a partner.

 

NorthCarolina

(11,197 posts)
185. "But where was Hillary?". She was a Goldwater Girl at the time, and they (Republicans)
Fri Nov 13, 2015, 09:45 AM
Nov 2015

don't do black issues. So you can't blame her for not being involved in issues important to PoC during the period of time she was involved with the Republican Party. She modified her public views once she changed parties, and it became fashionable for conservative Democrats to do so.

davidthegnome

(2,983 posts)
193. I had noticed that myself
Fri Nov 13, 2015, 01:15 PM
Nov 2015

You know, I've never really seen any indication that Sanders is actually racist. I've never seen any indication that he is sexist (the "shouting" comment, I think, has been taken out of context) either. Neither Clinton nor Sanders appear to have any record of being a terrible bigot.

I wish the criticism could be a little more honest. I'm sure that there are supporters, on both sides, who do not do their candidates justice, who are indeed guilty of racism, sexism, general ignorance and stupidity, but as far as character goes, I think the candidates themselves are pretty solid.

I find it really kind of ironic that a lot of the same people who supported Obama for President and are now supporting Sanders are being accused of not liking, or not giving a damn about black people. I find it ridiculous beyond words that Sanders is accused of the same thing. Are there people on both sides of this debate who are unpleasant? Absolutely. What gets to me though, is that there are so many baseless accusations that get thrown around without being challenged.

Having said that... where was Clinton during the civil rights era? Being a kid, most likely, doing kid stuff, most likely. She may have been a child of wealth and entitlement, but I don't see any reason to doubt that her heart was in the right place in regards to civil rights. It was before my time - and I don't know what I would have done myself had I been alive during that time. Today, I absolutely support civil rights movements - but in my teens? Well, I wasn't really that well educated, I was terribly self involved and mostly focused on playing video games.

Are we going to criticize what people did before they were even old enough to vote? If we are, I'm kinda screwed too. You know, there is a strength, a wisdom that comes (or at least CAN come) from the foundation of experience, which I believe both Sanders and Clinton have, but doubt that either of them had in any significance before they were adults.

Can't we just stick to the real issues? Let's raise the minimum wage, let's bring back some sensible regulation, maybe spend a little more money on things like... oh, I don't know, education, infrastructure, health-care - and let's maybe spend a little less money giving tax relief to billionaires. Let's do what we can to improve the status of our environment, to slow down climate change. Let's bring an end to the wage gap. Let's bring about laws that equally apply to everyone - so black people aren't being beaten to death by racist asshole cops. We will find these things - and others, easier to accomplish, if we stop fighting among ourselves. Even if we simply maintain more honest debates among ourselves.

I have my reasons for voting for Sanders, primarily, it is that he represents my own point of view in regards to fairness, equality - and the economy, than Clinton does. I think that Sanders has some great ideas for healthcare, for education, for so many things. I think Clinton has some good ideas too. If all things were more equal in regards to wealth, in regards to corporate influence, I might be far more tempted to vote for Clinton than I am.

Corporations, corporate money... they are taking over, overruling law, common sense, justice, fairness, the worship of such seems to be replacing generosity, good will, empathy.

The real issue for me in this campaign is whether or not the power of money and corporate influence can even be challenged. I think Sanders has proven that it can. That's a good thing for all of us who aren't billionaires.

sabrina 1

(62,325 posts)
200. Thoughtful post, thank you. The only reason for this OP is because we know that
Fri Nov 13, 2015, 02:03 PM
Nov 2015

corporate funded entities, Super Pacs, have been caught trying to plant smears against Sanders in the media. We also know that the Corporate money in politics, is used, millions of dollars in every election, to stop people like Bernie who is challenging the system.

Sadly the Super Pac run by David Brock who was exposed trying to smear Bernie, without having his own name attached to it, works in cooperation with the Hillary campaign.

Bernie has no Super Pacs as they are the means by which Corporate Donors can get around the Campaign Finance laws and pour money into these Super Pacs, anonymously and in unlimited amounts. Citizens United made this possible.

And we know that the talking points re Bernie, obliterating his Civil Rights record, come from the Hillary Campaign.

It would be nice if Hillary herself condemned all of this, as Bernie does.

But she hasn't. As for what she was doing which has only become a question since her campaign began attacking and actually lying about Bernie's record? She was a Republican working for Goldwater, while other High School students were involved in the Civil Rights movement.

No one was making an issue of any of this, until the nasty, daily attacks began against Sanders and his supporters.

That's what happens when you decide to go on the attack, rather than stick to the issues. People begin to look at YOUR record also.

Thanks for your post ...

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