2016 Postmortem
Related: About this forumThose Who Say Bernie Can't Win
To the people who support Hillary, and insist that the words of caution from all the Sanders supporters is merely unnecessary worrying, I ask this:
If Hillary becomes the nominee, which she probably will, and the attacks start coming in the way many Bernie supporters expect them to, what will be said then?
IF Hillary as the nominee is defeated handily or even closely next November what will the Hillary supporters say then? Will there be a day of reckoning, or will blame be placed everywhere, NONE of it aimed at Hillary or her baggage, or the foreshadowed feelings of disillusionment by many Americans, repub or Democrat, who will then state that nothing in the world could have brought them to vote for her.
Will all the Bernie Sanders supporters be able to come here and say en masse....."Told Ya So?" Probably, but I'm guessing the Hillary folks will not be in much mood to be told they were to blame for the election loss. Perhaps fights will develop, and people banned from DU.
While I'm not sure Bernie Sanders will be able to overcome the Powers That Be who have basically already promised the nomination to Hillary, I can't honestly say he has the support of the media if he were nominated, and might also lose to the repub candidate.
What I do feel, is that Hillary has liabilities, and I think her fate is already written. If in 365 days I'm proven wrong, I'll be willing to admit it. I will still vote for her, and while I'm not a big fan, she is still a Democrat, and would be FAR better than anyone on the other side, some of whom are downright scary. But who in their right minds is concerned about CA, where I'm from. CA is not going to decide this thing, and it boils down to the disillusionment of the average voter in swing states, who will decide this election. Not the loyal party faithful here on DU. Their enthusiasm is essential, and I don't think it will be there if she wins the nomination.
I'm relatively certain that if that happens, Clinton supporters will blame the low turnout among Democrats, rather than apologize to the Sanders supporters who maintained that would happen all along.
I'll stand behind the nominee and vote for them no matter what, but don't expect me to be jumping up and down with excitement, since I'm quite worried of the end result being a repub victory, and 4-8 years of taking back President Obama's gains.
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Cali_Democrat
(30,439 posts)then Bernie would never have deserved to be the nominee any ways.
Moot point.
SoCalMusicLover
(3,194 posts)I read an article which mentioned the # of Super Delegates who are already standing behind Clinton. She is supposedly already well on her way to the nomination, even before any Democrats vote.
So if Hillary > Bernie and repub > Hillary, then I guess the Democrats might be screwed either way.
VanillaRhapsody
(21,115 posts)Its one of those issues she evolved on as some here like to say....
lame54
(35,326 posts)I've been hearing from Clinton supporters for months
Don't elect Bernie - he can't win the general
Huh? - if he can beat Hillary he can beat the repug
SoCalMusicLover
(3,194 posts)Bernie Sanders might be less well known, but he has far less anger directed towards him than Hillary. Sure, he probably has some skeletons in his closet, but I doubt the repubs have boxes full of attack issues ready against him, like they do for Hillary.
Say the name Sanders to the average person, and they may respond favorably, or they may not have an idea who he is. But there won't be instant Hatred directed at him, except from the hard core repub base who will attack the Dem candidate, even it were Jesus reincarnated.
There are quite a few Americans who will NEVER EVER EVER vote for Hillary, no matter what. We won't see that on paper until it's much too late. I think that number is too high, and it is an insurmountable hurdle for her to overcome.
I wonder if there were a poll asking all registered voters:
Which Democratic candidate would you NEVER vote for if they were the nominee.
A. Hillary Clinton B. Bernie Sanders
I'm willing to bet the number for A would far eclipse the # for B.
MohRokTah
(15,429 posts)Whenever I read those words in any essay, article, or post, I always disregard everything said.
Everything in any piece is complete bullshit when those word are used.
SoCalMusicLover
(3,194 posts)You don't honestly believe there are people in party leadership who have dedicated their full support to her, and will never allow Bernie Sanders to become the party nominee?
And how about the "powerful" media? It doesn't take a rocket scientist to see how they place Clinton in comparison to Sanders. If he got half as much coverage as Trump, perhaps his % would be closer to Hillary nationally.
Yeah, there are no such people as the "powers that be." The average citizen in this country is in control, while the wealthy and powerful in positions of authority, have no more influence and are never able to manipulate things to fit their agenda.
MohRokTah
(15,429 posts)SoCalMusicLover
(3,194 posts)Not that I'm going to change your mind....no matter.
For me, there is no need to look farther than the 2000 & 2004 elections, to see what the powerful are capable of.
Between their control in Florida and of the Supreme Court in 2000, or those who manipulated the Ohio voting machines in 2004, they usually accomplish their agendas when needed.
Oh wait....I guess the '04 voting machines manipulation theory is just another CT. Nothing to see here.
SoCalMusicLover
(3,194 posts)After 8 years of IDIOT, Mickey Mouse could have won the election if they were the nominee.
If Hillary Clinton is all that, how come a relatively unknown by the name of Barack Obama was able to trounce her? I mean, she had been groomed and had wanted the Presidency all her life, and had worked hard towards that, while a Freshman Senator in office a few years, comes out of nowhere to whip her badly.
Well, Bernie may not be Barack, but Hillary is still Hillary, and the groundswell against her becoming President is probably worse now than it was 8 years ago.
I'm expecting many months of Benghazi & E-Mail attacks. The repubs do not fight fairly, so by November, the average American will have gotten so much of it, they won't know whether to like her or hate her, but they probably won't feel thrilled about voting for her once the repubs have gotten through with her, most likely with the support of the "liberal" media.
edgineered
(2,101 posts)it will be with much regret that my vote for HRC will be cast if she is the nominee. OTOH, regardless of who is on the ballot I will be at the polls all day asking people who cannot vote for the (D) to make a write in vote. Pencils for everyone!
SoCalMusicLover
(3,194 posts)It is going to be mighty difficult to see the Dems winning without FL. Not impossible, but about as must-win as they come.
edgineered
(2,101 posts)Many here will not vote for a democrat. Those voters may also be holding their noses to vote for their republican candidate. Maybe the sign would read, Neither my candidate nor yours is on the ballot today. Take a pencil, and make your voice heard. (or words to the affect) Either way works for me, one more vote for the D, one less for the R.
DanTex
(20,709 posts)That goes for whoever wins the nomination.
DemocratSinceBirth
(99,714 posts)The election will be close...There are no guarantees...The same party has held the White House three times in a row only two times in the past hundred or so years.* All we can say with confidence is it is more likely than not the evidence suggests Hillary Clinton will will win. I am in the deep blue state of California so I am largely immune from GOPU tyranny. It is for my fellow Americans for whom I weep if we lose.
*from memory
