Hillary Clinton Was Liberal. Hillary Clinton Is Liberal.

[workinclasszero]

Hillary Clinton Was Liberal. Hillary Clinton Is Liberal.

4:54 PMMAY 19, 2015 By HARRY ENTEN

A bunch of reporters have recently discovered a shocking truth: Hillary Clinton is liberal!

Clinton was one of the most liberal members during her time in the Senate. According to an analysis of roll call votes by Voteview, Clinton’s record was more liberal than 70 percent of Democrats in her final term in the Senate. She was more liberal than 85 percent of all members. Her 2008 rival in the Democratic presidential primary, Barack Obama, was nearby with a record more liberal than 82 percent of all members — he was not more liberal than Clinton.

Clinton also has a history of very liberal public statements. Clinton rates as a “hard core liberal” per the OnTheIssues.org scale. She is as liberal as Elizabeth Warren and barely more moderate than Bernie Sanders. And while Obama is also a “hard core liberal,” Clinton again was rated as more liberal than Obama.

http://fivethirtyeight.com/datalab/hillary-clinton-was-liberal-hillary-clinton-is-liberal/

Just thought I would post this to counter the lie being put forth every day on the Bernie Underground that Hillary Clinton is not a liberal.

[Armstead]

1. A Limosine Liberal

[workinclasszero]

2. WTH that means.....

So was FDR, whats your point?

[Armstead]

4. A term from the 60's

Wealthy people who make their money from investments that screw workers, and then go to fancy cocktail parties to raise funds for worthy charities or "safe" liberal causes.....or even radical causes while clinging to their wealth.

FDR was wealthy, but he also shook things up in ways that were unpopular with his wealthy peers.

(Used both by conservatives and progressives. A different meaning for both, but equally critical of those who live a privileged life but espouse causes that don't threaten their own lavish lifestyle or the system that supports it.)

[brooklynite]

20. Well, that lets me out...

...I don't make my money from investments, and I drive a VW Golf.

Oh, and I work to get Democrats elected to do "safe" things like raise my taxes to pay for a social safety net and infrastructure....and to protect women's reproductive rights...and to bring undocumented immigrants out of the shadows...and to defend the First Amendment even when the speaker is unpopular.

[Rose Siding]

15. It's something Rush Limbaugh calls Barbara Streisand

[Hortensis]

16. And something right wingers call any Democrat when expedient.

[workinclasszero]

43. Oh its a right wing insult for democrats

used by a Bernie follower.

No surprise here.

[tex-wyo-dem]

36. Yep...

A juicy core of platitudes and "charity" towards socially liberal causes with a thick frosting of neo-liberal economic policy and a sprinkling of neo-con foreign policy.

[Cha]

66. Ohhh. so insulting. OUch!

[sufrommich]

3. k&r for the truth minus the hyperbole. nt

[UglyGreed]

5. Keep telling yourself

that, one we all might believe it someday. BTW Poor Harry is too young to know what a real liberal looks like.

[workinclasszero]

7. Bernie fans

never let the facts get in the way of their fantasies, I get it.

[Art_from_Ark]

21. You're one to talk

You had written that Clinton was a traitor to the Democratic Party. What changed your mind? Her "We came, we saw, he died" quote about bumping off Gaddafi? Her laughing about a potential war with Iran? Her role in the Honduran coup? Her pushing for a no-fly zone over Syria? Her trumpeting TPP as the "gold standard of trade deals"? Her promotion of fracking around the world?

[tex-wyo-dem]

38. +1000

See #36 above.

[Bubzer]

29. Here's a bit of fact versus fantasy for you.

From her own mouth, Hillary admits to the truth.

"You know, I get accused of being kind of moderate and center," Clinton told the audience at a Women for Hillary event in Ohio. "I plead guilty."

She's advocated being center-based as a good thing... as if the GOP hasn't completely distorted the political spectrum.

Clinton argued at the Columbus event that being in the "center" is a positive, not a negative.
"I think sometimes it's important when you are in the elected arena -- you try to figure out, how do you bring people together to get something done instead of just standing on the opposite sides yelling at each other," Clinton said.

http://www.cnn.com/2015/09/10/politics/hillary-clinton-democrat-progressive/
We all know how well that's worked out for Obama.


Even during a 2007 debate she muddied the waters by claiming to be a "modern American progressive", whatever that's suppose to mean.

Here's a host of outside opinions on Hillary.

H. A. Goodman of The Huffington Post described Hillary Clinton as "neither a liberal, nor a true conservative. Rather, she's an electable Democratic candidate who leans to the right. She's the Democratic version of Mitt Romney. President Hillary Clinton would be a conservative Barack Obama and a somewhat liberal George Bush."[4]

Chris Matthews of Hardball with Chris Matthews described Hillary Clinton as "more of a conservative in a sense of more of a traditional politician from the center, center."[6]

Elizabeth MacDonald of the Fox Business Network said of Hillary Clinton, that "as Hillary Clinton declares war on the billionaire class, her six-figure speeches, deep pocket donors on Wall Street and corporate America from places like Citigroup (C) and Goldman Sachs (GS), already has the presidential hopeful talked about as a “LINO”—a liberal in name only." She also stated that "Hillary Clinton’s progressive leanings are there

Former Congressman Joe Scarborough described Hillary Clinton as "the neocon's neocon. It's going to be fascinating if she decides to run and she gets the nomination, that she will be more of a sabre-rattler and more of a neocon than the Republican nominee. Is that not the case? There's hardly been a military engagement that Hillary hasn't been for in the past 20 years."[7]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Political_positions_of_Hillary_Clinton

If she called herself a moderate, and all those other individuals call her a moderate, then I think that kind of makes her a moderate. She's NOT a liberal. She may have liberal tendencies... but that's far and away not the same thing. I'll even go so far as to say perhaps she's earnestly trying to become a liberal... but the notion that she's always been a liberal? That's pure bunk.

[tex-wyo-dem]

41. Boom! Nt

[berni_mccoy]

6. Actually, she was a conservative republican first

Raised in privilege...That's something she has the other candidates don't.

[Hortensis]

18. A teenage Methodist Goldwater Republican, like her dad. BUT,

raised in privilege? What sites is that Kool-Aid from, huh? Strictly middle class (yes, "privileged" to much of the world, but not to upper class America). Her father was a small business owner (he made drapes), and she attended public schools until the National Merit Scholarship she earned for herself took her to Wellesley College.

Where she discovered she was actually liberal by nature, but still Methodist.

[berni_mccoy]

25. Middle class in that time is privileged compared to what most have today

And lest we forget, she went to the best schools (Wellsley and Yale).

[BlueMTexpat]

35. Hardly a conservative Republican.

But please don't let facts stand in the way of your opinion.

As a young woman, Hillary was active in young Republican groups and campaigned for Republican presidential nominee Barry Goldwater in 1964. She was inspired to work in some form of public service after hearing a speech in Chicago by the Reverend Martin Luther King Jr., and became a Democrat in 1968.

http://www.biography.com/people/hillary-clinton-9251306

Barry Goldwater was actually quite liberal. Although I have always been a Dem, most of the Young Republicans of the 50s and 60s that I knew personally (I came of age in that era) have since become Democrats and are among the more liberal Dems today. Barry Goldwater and JFK were also great friends. http://www.jfklibrary.org/Asset-Viewer/Archives/JFKOH-BMG-01.aspx

The mainstream GOP of the 50s and 60s bears almost no resemblance whatsoever to the Republican party today, as anyone who knows political history or who lived through the times knows well. Bernie was to the left of HIllary then and is to the left of Hillary today. That does not mean that she is not a liberal.

Or is the word "liberal" reserved only to an elite few?

[berni_mccoy]

37. She certainly wasn't liberal.

[BlueMTexpat]

40. We'll have to agree to disagree

but the facts and weight of opinion are on my side - except in the echo chamber of those who apparently consider themselves the purist elite.

[berni_mccoy]

42. Were the facts on your side when she was on the board of executives for Wal Mart?

Or when she stood against same-sex marriage?
Or when she voted for the War in Iraq?
Or when she supported DOMA?
Or when she supported the largest cuts to Welfare in history?

[BlueMTexpat]

45. Well, it's goodbye

from me to you. And my life on Du will be a lot happier, that's for sure.

You do realize how much you are turning people off, don't you? Is that your mission?

Don't bother answering. I won't respond.

[berni_mccoy]

53. Wen faced with the fact that she might not be liberal,your response is not unlike many others

Don't worry, denial is the first stage of grief. This too shall pass.

[Armstead]

8. Not one word on issues of wealth and power in that article

That's where the rubber meets the road. She has not -- until it became politically popular recently -- ,mentioned the concentration of wealth and power that has been steadily marching forward since the 70's.

[Scuba]

9. Hillary is a liberal in the same way Bristol Palin is a virgin.

[workinclasszero]

12. Those pesky facts again.....

"Clinton also has a history of very liberal public statements. Clinton rates as a “hard core liberal” per the OnTheIssues.org scale. She is as liberal as Elizabeth Warren and barely more moderate than Bernie Sanders."

http://fivethirtyeight.com/datalab/hillary-clinton-was-liberal-hillary-clinton-is-liberal/

[Scuba]

14. Pro-war, pro-Wall Street, pro-fracking, pro-Keystone XL, pro-H1B Visas, pro-TPP.That's a "liberal"?

Not in my book.

[Hortensis]

19. Maybe your book needs an unbiased editor? I really don't see her

as hard-core liberal either, but she is definitely solidly liberal.

[Scuba]

23. Pro-war, pro-Wall Street, pro-fracking, pro-Keystone XL, pro-H1B Visas.That's "solid liberal"?

You need a new dictionary.

[tex-wyo-dem]

44. She's, at best, somewhat socially liberal...

Although she's only recently "evolved" on LBGT issues.

Economically => Neo-liberal

Foreign policy => hawkish Neo-liberal leaning towards Neo-con

[Hortensis]

50. For the most part, HRC has moved with the electorate,

but always stayed left to centrist as THAT range shifted.

It might be helpful to do a little immersion in right-wing ideology -- for perspective. Almost all moderate conservatives have been purged from national government and from most of our red state offices and legislatures. The people running our country for the GOP are now virtually all strong to extremist right.

I get that you want HRC to have been what would have been considered far left over most of the past quarter century's shift to the right, but she would not be with us today if she had gone that way. That she's just not a hard-left kind of person, however, does not mean she's ever been with the conservatives.

BTW, I've always been liberal and will die liberal, but neither I nor most liberals today would meet these "criteria" that have been so carefully set to exclude Hillary. So funny, when the right has been sliming us all with "the L-word" for decades.

[tex-wyo-dem]

54. I never said she was...

"With the conservatives", but to call her a liberal is a real stretch. She's basically carbon copy of her husband...right-leaning centrist.

She may have some socially liberal cred, but the economic and foreign policies she has historically supported, IMO, has been extremely damaging to this country and the world. I don't think i could ever forgive her for her impassioned speech on the Senate floor in support for the IWR, for instance.

[Hortensis]

60. Well, if there had been a strong, effective liberal block

that was rebuilding America while HRC was working with the right to sabotage our greatness, I wouldn't forgive her either. But that was not the case.

I don't like where we've been, but I do not think that, out of so many to choose from who were there, loading all this resentment onto THE 2016 DEMOCRATIC FRONTRUNNER FOR THE PRESIDENCY is half as principled as some choose to imagine it is.

The next president will name at least TWO and as many as FOUR justices to the Supreme Court, who still will be there long after many of us here are senile or dead.

Appointing young justices who can impose a strong conservative and/or libertarian ideology on the nation for at least the next 30 to 40 years is THE great shining hope of a desperate right, which now already has fewer voters than the left. Winning the presidency isn't their chief goal, taking the Supreme Court is.

[NorthCarolina]

10. Move over Ghandi, that "Liberal" Goldwater Girl is to the left of you.....

[mcar]

11. Yes she is

So is President Obama, for that matter.

[Cosmic Kitten]

13. Political Expediency!

[99Forever]

17. Bullshit. Clinton is a neoliberal. Period.

End of story.

[Cosmic Kitten]

22. Ah ha! Neo-librul That changes everything

[PowerToThePeople]

24. Agree

And they used to be known as Republicans.

[daleanime]

26. And yet the people refuse to do what they are told to.....

[Baitball Blogger]

27. War Hawks are not Liberal.

She is a social Liberal, perhaps, but leans right for Wall Street and warmongering.

[TBF]

33. And that is the issue -

the limousine liberals are only concerned about social/gender issues. I've even seen certain members *who shall remain nameless* try to re-brand "third way" as someone who doesn't support civil rights. It is the strangest thing I've ever seen.

We must demand equality in ALL sectors - gender, race, religion - and ECONOMIC. It's not an either/or proposition.

Thankfully Bernie sees this and has chosen to run for president because no other candidate is acknowledging this truth.

And it is the reason I support him and do not support any other candidate running.

Perhaps that means I'm not a "liberal". If so, then fine. My parents were factory workers - we never did think much of folks who rode around in limousines anyway.

[bread_and_roses]

28. She is the perfect embodiment of Hedges' walking dead "Liberals"

Last edited Tue Nov 3, 2015, 12:26 PM - Edit history (1)

http://www.truthdig.com/report/item/once_again_--_death_of_the_liberal_class_20121112

... It fights for nothing. It stands for nothing. It is a useless appendage to the corporate state... [betraying] the core values they use to define themselves—the rule of law, the safeguarding of civil liberties, the protection of unions, the preservation of social welfare programs, environmental accords, financial regulation, a defiance of unjust war and torture, and the abolition of drone wars. The liberal class clung desperately during the long nightmare of this political campaign to one or two issues, such as protecting a woman’s right to choose and gender equality, to justify its complicity in a monstrous evil. This moral fragmentation—using an isolated act of justice to define one’s self while ignoring the vast corporate assault on the nation and the ecosystem along with the pre-emptive violence of the imperial state—is moral and political capitulation. It fails to confront the evil we have become.

emphasis mine

Drones. Cluster bombs. Bombing civilians. Welfare "reform." NAFTA and now TPP. A myriad of other assaults too long to list.

(edit "to" - "too&quot

[stupidicus]

47. funny how they have no rebuttal to the inarguably obvious

like that, and just move along like it wasn't posted.

Like with their rightwing cousins, they've largely been reduced to the positive reinforcement they supply each other in lieu of any critical examination or successful defense of the issues she has championed.

It's like that "WE"RE #1" BS rightwing nationalists are so fond of.

It simply doesn't hold up unless it is confined to things we'd be better off without, starting with an obscenely large military budget

[Autumn]

30. Hillary Clinton says she is a moderate. Do you think she is a liar?

I wouldn't vote for someone who lies about things like that.
http://www.democraticunderground.com/1251761411

I think a person should pick a stand and stick to it.

[ohheckyeah]

58. That would be like

a scientist who denies climate change regardless of changing info.

When things change and new info is available changing one's mind isn't flip flopplng. It's what smart adults do.

[Autumn]

63. Oh yeah sure because moderate one week and Progressive the next without making a changes in any

stand you have taken is just "what smart adults do", especially if they are saying things just to get voters to vote for them. That's why the really smart voters look at what a politician does not just what a politician says.

[ohheckyeah]

64. LOL

Pick a stand and stick to it - that's bright.

[Autumn]

65. Is it hard for one to figure out if one is a moderate or a Progressive? It was easy for me.

[INdemo]

31. And were those Reporters

From MSNBC and from
The Clinton News Network
"She is as liberal as Elizabeth Warren"
First of all Elizabeth Warren is not owned be Goldman Sachs,the Corpirate Mafia or Wall St. as Hillary is.
Just saying Hillary is a liberal doesn't make her a liberal.
I challenge you to list 10 (Ten) reasons why you believe Hillsry is a liberal and provide examples to back up that list.
Here is my list
Whoops I can't think of any

[ThePhilosopher04]

32. The Clinton Spin Machine in full force ...

It's almost as if someone flipped the switch right after Bernie clearly won the debate. Media has been in overdrive since trying to drive the narrative. This country is truly fucked.

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

34. There are no facts, only interpretations. Friedrich Nietzsche

Was she a "hardcore liberal" when she voted for Bush's wars?

[workinclasszero]

39. Hillary Clinton is a Hard-Core Liberal.

Hillary Clinton is a Hard-Core Liberal.

http://ontheissues.org/Hillary_Clinton.htm

[Fearless]

46. Bwahahaha!

[raindaddy]

48. Hillary's a social liberal and an economic moderate...

What you won't see from Hillary Clinton. She won't regulate the banks.. She's against Glass Steagall. She's against breaking up the too big to fail banks. She's against expanding Social Security benefits and squishy on lifting the payroll cap on the payroll tax.

What you will see is appointments of Wall Street and corporate insiders throughout her administration... Along with the same third way excuse we've been given ad nauseam, "who knows Wall Street, big oil, etc better than someone who's been in the business?"

So if you're a social liberal and a conservative when it comes to the economy and foreign policy, Hillary's you candidate. But if you're telling yourself Hillary an across the board liberal you're fooling yourself.

[blackspade]

49. There is an opinion piece devoid of data.

I might buy some of it if there was actual data to back up the writer's opinion.
None of the links provided in the piece go to the actual data 'cited.'
And he glosses over the fundraising part with nearly no commentary.

While I can buy that she is more 'liberal' than 70% of already conservative Democrats, Clinton is not a liberal in the classic sense.
That said, I'm glad she is tacking heavily to the left for the primary, It will make it harder for her to backtrack during the general, but I suspect she will try. Most likely she will backtrack on the economic issues because that is what her main constituency cares about, but there is also a good chance that she will backtrack where social issues pinch doner profits.

I guess we will see if she manages to clinch the nomination.

[AgingAmerican]

51. She says she is a 'moderate'

Moderates aren't liberal

[workinclasszero]

56. See reply 39

eom

[BlueCaliDem]

55. She's always been more liberal than Barack Obama. I knew that early on.

But my decision to vote for Obama was the fact that he could beat the Clinton juggernaut, and if he could that, he could beat the Republicans. For me, Obama's and Clinton's policy differences weren't that different. But his skill at defeating the well-funded Clinton machine fascinated me. I reasoned, if he could beat that machine, he could beat any Republican. That was one of the major reasons why I chose Barack Obama. We couldn't afford another Republican in the White House, and he'd make sure none would get there.

Now I feel there is no other Democratic presidential candidate strong and skilled enough to defeat the Koch machine, except Hillary Clinton. There is no other candidate for the nom who is as experienced, as skilled, as knowledgeable, and as strong as Hillary Clinton. And my admiration for her has only risen. She is perfect to be the next president for these United States. In fact, with SCOTUS hanging in the balance, I would welcome a President Hillary Clinton's appointees in the mold of Bader-Ginsberg and Breyer - two of President Bill Clinton's appointees who have served the country very well.

She listens to the people (poll-testing). She doesn't talk AT people, she actually listens and talks with them. She's NO radical (neither are the majority of Americans, by the way), and she's promised to continue and expand on President Obama's policies (something Sanders has yet to claim).

She's the best Democratic presidential candidate to have in order to defeat the Republicans in the general election.

[workinclasszero]

57. She's the best Democratic presidential candidate to have in order to defeat the Republicans in the

general election.

Totally agree. The first thing I look for in a democratic candidate for President is, can he or she actually beat the republican?

I don't care how good the candidates views are. If they cannot beat the republicans, I move on.

We have got to do everything in our power to keep teahaddists out of the white house and not in charge of picking SCOTUS candidates.

[BlueCaliDem]

59. If a candidate can't win against the Republicans, it doesn't matter how good their

policies are because losing the election means those wonderful policies will never come to fruition. Candidates will promise all the rainbow-farting unicorns they can get away with, we know that, so I make it a point to, first, see how their colleagues rush to offer their support and then watch whether the candidate has what's necessary in order to win against the formidable Republican money machine. Like you, if they can't at least pass these two litmus tests, I move on.

[AOR]

61. You post this like it has some profound relevence...

who cares ? At this point in history the concern should be who is being exploited and who is doing the exploiting. More concerned with who stands with labor and who stands with capital and the owners than who is calling themselves whatever. The battle of the actual left is against the owners, the ruling class, and labor over capital in all things.

One either stands with and supports capitalism, ruling class policies, and the mechanisms of the owners or one stands with the working class and solidarity of ALL workers. One can't be a mealy-mouth lapdog for capitalism and the ruling class when it suits their personal needs, job status, and lifestyle and pretend and claim to support the other. That is the biggest problem with what passes for the "left."

You can disagree, but the facts on the ground don't lie for an ever increasing majority of the workers and the poor. Capitalism does not elevate the working class. It expropriates from and impoverishes the working class and there is not a single narrative - that deals in objective material reality - that proves otherwise. That is what matters.

[Vattel]

62. she has been liberal on some issues but on others she has been more moderate or conservative.

Her current rhetoric is pretty liberal but her record, not so much. In terms of her record, I would say:

Abortion rights, liberal. War, conservative to moderate. Capital punishment, moderate. War on drugs, moderate to conservative. LGBTQ rights, moderate (finally became liberal in 2013). Animal well-being, conservative. Environment, moderate. Economic justice, moderate. Providing for the needy, moderate. State surveillance, conservative to moderate.

Overall, she has been a moderate, not a liberal. But maybe my standards for being a liberal are higher than the average American's.