Iowa’s Tom Harkin jabs Bernie Sanders as ‘establishment’

[Skidmore]

I respect Senator Harkin so much. He was my senator for a lot of years and he always did right by the people of the state.

http://www.bostonherald.com/news/local_coverage/2015/11/iowa_s_tom_harkin_jabs_bernie_sanders_as_establishment

Former Iowa Sen. Tom Harkin — a prominent Hillary Clinton-backer in the nation’s first caucus state — jabbed at her rival today, saying insurgent democratic socialist candidate Bernie Sanders is just as “establishment” as Clinton is.

“Bernie Sanders has been in public office longer than Hillary Clinton, what makes him not establishment?” Harkin told “Morning Meeting” hosts Jaclyn Cashman and Hillary Chabot on Boston Herald Radio. “He’s establishment too. If you want non-establishment you should vote for Dr. Carson or that Trump character.”


Harkin served in the Senate with both Clinton and Vermont Sen. Bernie Sanders — who served as mayor of Burlington, Vt., and in the House of Representatives before becoming a senator in 2007. While Sanders leads in most recent New Hampshire polls, Clinton is ahead in Iowa, which caucuses on Feb. 1.

more

[72DejaVu]

1. Just crawl under there, Tom

Don't make them stop the bus.

[JaneyVee]

22. This made me actually laugh out loud.

Especially since it's the first post and the bus will be arriving shortly.

[randys1]

2. Of course he is. There is one difference, though, between Bernie and most politicians.

He doesnt think like a politician in that he doesnt see the end more about him than the issues.

I truly believe that.

Hillary will do what is right most of the time, but she is also looking at making history.

Bernie is looking at saving it.

[BootinUp]

25. He doesn't think as a politician?

You're either joking or kinda deluded.

[randys1]

57. Example, debate, when given the chance to pounce on Hillary over something like

emails, he doesnt.

When Hillary saw the chance to pounce on Bernie over guns, you could see her eyes light up, literally.

This is NOT a knock on Hillary, all of them are like this.

Bernie doesnt fit that mold, not an opinion, an observable fact.

[Starry Messenger]

3. I hear the wheels approaching...!

[stevenleser]

44. Yep, under the bus goes Harkin! Must be one of those NYC Flexible Busses at least...

[PatrickforO]

4. Well, Tom Harkin is a Clinton surrogate.

No surprise he'll go after Sanders. Notice that he's not going after him on the issues. Because he can't.

[Cha]

67. Sen Harkin is just telling the truth.

[Cha]

5. "Bernie Sanders has been in public office longer than Hillary Clinton, what makes him not

establishment?”

And, he has Tad Devine who managed Dukakis, Gore, and John Kerry.

Thanks Skidmore!

[Agnosticsherbet]

6. He's right. Bernie is not a Washington outsider,

Though he is a party outsider. But washington outsider is only an issue on the right.

[think]

7. Bernie is referring to typical corporate lobbyist backed politicians that sell out

in order to garner the support and favor of the billionaire class.

That's the establishment he is referring to and aggressively fights against. Favoring corporations over the middle class has gotten us to this point where income inequality is so out of control that members of both political parties acknowledge it is a major problem.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/01/23/income-inequality-poll_n_4647599.html

[Thinkingabout]

26. Like himself, sells out to Lockheed Martin for one, oh and his Wall Street banker.

[think]

31. Here's a list of 6 figure paid speeches Hillary gave in the last 2 1/2 years. Enjoy:

[Thinkingabout]

32. Hell, I know about the speeches, she must be good or she would not be getting so many opportunities

To speak. On the other hand she not running out and shouting about Wall Street connections, Sanders is saying he is not involved, it simply is not true. He talks about representing a rural state, Clinton represented a state where Wall Street is located, she was supposed to work for those in NY.

[Fawke Em]

58. I've heard her speak. She's not really that good, but what she does have is access.

And power.

Wall Street eats that up with a (silver) spoon.

[Thinkingabout]

64. Or she could get new batteries and she could give the same speech over and over.

[mcar]

8. K&R

[TheProgressive]

9. His policies prove he is not part of the 'establishment'

Also, he is a statesman. And, you will see that Sanders isn't 'in it for the money'
as 99% of politicians are. No PAC money.

[Thinkingabout]

34. No pac money in which he will claim.

[TheProgressive]

35. Meaning, what?

Do you have some sort of proof to the contrary?

[Thinkingabout]

36. He said he did not have any pac, there are pac for Sanders, is his statement good enough?

[TheProgressive]

37. Does he take money from PACs?

Do you have any citations for this?

[Thinkingabout]

38. He isnt supposed to take money from them nor is he to give them instructions.

[Babel_17]

10. "If you want non-establishment ...

... you should vote for Dr. Carson or that Trump character.”

Thank you for your service Senator Harkin but that sounded silly.

[Skidmore]

12. It is accurate.

Trump and Carson are the only two people running who have not been in political office. Most of the others, including Sanders, have been in political office. Sanders has almost done nothing else but hold political office for his entire adult life. He's a politician.

[Babel_17]

21. It's a matter of degree, as Senator Harkin well knows

As does everybody else, I like to think. There's the candidate who's good at being an outsider, the candidate who's the better outsider, and then there's the ideal/perfect outsider.

Is Clinton a good outsider?

Well, either way with that, considering politicians as a class, Senator Sanders is the better outsider. And I won't let Senator Harkin's strawman either/or argument deter me from landing on the choice of the candidate most outside the establishment. We all know President Obama's famous quote regarding having impossible standards.

I respect his service*, but Senator Harkin evidently can't see the forest for the trees.

*I always thought he was a classy, classic, Democrat and wished him well when he ran for the nomination for POTUS.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tom_Harkin

[Skidmore]

48. There is no "perfect outsider."

Sanders is an insider of 40 years. He is a professional politician.

[Babel_17]

50. Wait, what?

That's what I said*, he's the better outsider. Saying that being elected makes you an insider is using tautology.

Relative to Secretary Clinton, he's definitely an outsider, as seen by the Progressives supporting him.

Here's how I/we see it. His not being propped up by Wall Street's, and banking's, big donations is one of the criteria. Then there's a logical progression from there. It's how you behave, the associations you make, work, and that work you, that make you an insider. But this is known. Arguing otherwise, the rhetoric being used, flies in the face of that, and is just an argumentative tactic.

It's kind of amusing, but not as amusing as this.

http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/hillary-clinton-political-outsider-president/story?id=33898281

Hillary Clinton argued today that as president she would be as much a political outsider as any other candidate given that she would be the first female president.

"I cannot imagine anyone being more of an outsider than the first woman president, I mean really, let's think about it," the Democratic presidential candidate said during an interview on CBS News' "Face the Nation."

*Maybe it wasn't clear in my post. "Ideal/Perfect" refers to a standard that one can aspire to, but not duplicate. President Obama's quote references that concept. "Don't let the perfect be the enemy of the good". The perfect being the unattainable Ideal. It's what I described it as referencing impossible standards.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Theory_of_Forms#Ideal_state

P.S. Clinton strongly suggests that being an outsider is something you rate on a scale, while Harkin more or less says it's basically an either/or proposition. He is contradicting her.

[RandySF]

11. .

[AZ Progressive]

13. Bernie's primary backers are unions, not big corporations

The establishment is corrupted with corporate money, not union money. Anyway unions are far more democratically run than big corporations, which are dictatorships.

[Starry Messenger]

16. Which is why it is so great that HRC has the backing of all the largest unions in her endorsements.

More to come, I'm sure.

[AZ Progressive]

19. She's corrupted with corporate money though

[Starry Messenger]

23. Nah.

[Skidmore]

18. Which is it?

A couple of weeks ago, unions were bad and stiffing their rank and file over endorsements. Now they are democratic institutions.

[Starry Messenger]

33. *crickets*

[JonLeibowitz]

46. The distinction is that union members give donations, while...

the union elite have often been endorsing Hillary without consulting their union base.

Actually this makes the contrast between Hillary and Sanders rather clear, don't you think?

[Skidmore]

47. No,

all it says is that some unions conduct their business in one way and some in others. Don't be quick to paint with a broad brush.

[Cha]

66. I've just listed the Unions who have backed Hillary so far.. am I missing any?

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1251&pid=764410

Thanks Skidmore!

[Cha]

65. A Major Labor Union Just Endorsed Hillary Clinton Over Bernie Sanders.. and they just keep rolling

Last edited Wed Nov 4, 2015, 03:07 AM - Edit history (1)

in..

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/machinists-union-endorses-hillary-clinton_55ce33d5e4b07addcb42e9a9

Machinists Union Endorses Hillary Clinton for President

http://www.goiam.org/index.php/news/press-releases/14828-machinists-union-endorses-hillary-clinton-for-president

International Longshoremen's Association latest labor union to endorse Hillary Clinton

http://www.startribune.com/longshoremen-latest-labor-group-endorsing-clinton-candidacy/339120121/

International Union of Painters and Allied Trades Endorses Hillary Clinton for President

http://www.iupat.org/wp/hrcendorse/

Teachers Union Backs Clinton for President

The National Education Association follows the American Federation of Teachers in endorsing the Democratic front-runner.

http://www.usnews.com/news/articles/2015/10/03/powerful-nea-teachers-union-endorses-hillary-clinton-for-president

EDIT for MORE:



Hillary Clinton Gets Backing of Major Union of Government Workers

http://www.nytimes.com/politics/first-draft/2015/10/23/hillary-clinton-gets-backing-of-major-union-of-government-workers/

[mhatrw]

14. And Hillary is an outsider because she is female!

awesomely facile stuff

[Rose Siding]

15. "or that Trump character"

God love him

[brooklynite]

17. I was in Des Moines this weekend, and the bus service was pretty sparse...he might have to wait

[Bluenorthwest]

20. Tom Harkin was a DOMA yes voter, while Bernie voted no.

That tells me which of the two is the better man.

[cyberswede]

24. I love Harkin, but that's ridiculous.

[onecaliberal]

27. I don't care who has been there longest. I care about what they stand for.

I care that no corporate money is flowing to the campaign. I care about the policy. And even though I have everything I need, millions don't and for those people Bernie IS the only one who will not sell them out. HRC owes a lot of favors to a lot of corps. Her policy positions just don't line up with what is best for the country. She also displays questionable judgement sometimes.

[bravenak]

28. Its true. Years and years.

Not much in the way of significant legislation.

[Thinkingabout]

29. Yes Sanders has been in Washington for twenty five years, if he isn't an insider by now it is time

To get out and let someone in there who wants to work for a change, the people of Vermont deserve a congressional member who works.

[Trajan]

30. I want to thank you two for being out there in this

And now you're gone ...

Click ..

Go Bernie!

[restorefreedom]

39. thats rich bwahahahaha

how about some commentary on the issues, mr harkin?

oh, don't want to discuss those, i understand....

[Skidmore]

49. I'll take commentary from

Senator Harkin any day. He's a good and decent man.

[restorefreedom]

53. i would love to hear him on the issues.nt

[Skidmore]

54. I'm sure you'll hear more from him.

I believe he was addressing a misperception here.

[restorefreedom]

56. i look forward to his policy ideas. nt

[Doctor_J]

40. The hillarians are only good for comedy at this point

Nothing useful to say, ever.

[AgingAmerican]

41. He doesn't know what 'establishment' means

The 'establishment' is the status quo AKA what conservatives seek to preserve.

[SunSeeker]

42. K & R

[Cha]

43. bernie likes to pretend.

[Eric J in MN]

45. Politicians who are establishment voted for the Iraq War

...and the Patriot Act
...and NAFTA.


Bernie Sanders voted against each of those.

[Vinca]

51. Bernie is many things, but "establishment" isn't one of them.

That actually made me laugh out loud.

[VanillaRhapsody]

52. Tom Harkin is right

nobody that has been in govt for 40 yrs...is "outside"...

[NCTraveler]

55. Sanders carreer shows he is all about the establishment one day.....

and in opposition to it the next. He knows who his base is. He is more politically savvy than some give him credit for. We aren't talking savvy at the presidential level. Savvy about ensuring reelection providing for a lifetime in public office. He handles his base very well.

[Skidmore]

62. Indeed.

No one is saying he is naive about getting into and retaining office. He is not perfect and he does have blind spots when it comes to some groups and issues.

[Zorra]

59. Meh. Sen. Harkin, (D-Monsanto)?

Top 5 Contributors, 2005 - 2010, Campaign Cmte

Contributor Total Indivs PACs
Herbalife International $55,606 $44,900 $10,706
TPG Capital $39,900 $39,900 $0
Interpublic Group $36,100 $36,100 $0
Goldman Sachs $28,780 $28,780 $0
Monsanto Co $28,250 $18,250 $10,000

http://www.opensecrets.org/politicians/summary.php?cycle=2010&cid=N00004207

[Skidmore]

60. Senator Harkin, (D-ADA)

[Bluenorthwest]

63. Senator Harkin, (D-DOMA)

The man voted that I should never be allowed equal rights. He is endorsing a candidate who last week said that vote was for our own good.
The DOMAcrats have been on my shit list since '96.

[William769]

61. Kick & highly recommended!

[jfern]

68. But Hillary is an outsider because she's a woman?

Only in bizzaro world