Why have Democrats enthusiastically disenfranchised their most loyal voting bloc?

[Fumesucker]

The statistics are damning...

http://www.democraticunderground.com/10027307522

According to US Bureau of Justice statistics, between 1980 and 2013, while blacks were 12% of the population, blacks constituted 30% of those arrested for drug law violations and nearly 40% of those incarcerated in all U.S. prisons. Thus some 20,000,000 African-American men have been sent to prison for non-violent “crimes” in the past forty years.

And the Democratic establishment has cheered the drug war, voted for it and made it their own.

Imagine what twenty million more votes for the Democratic party would have accomplished politically, why would any political party want to throw away that sort of voting base?

All for what turns out to be a "big lie" based almost entirely on racism.

One of the reasons I prefer Bernie is that he, unlike the vast majority of Democratic office holders, is not a drug warrior, he wants to end the insanity of the drug war not for political gain but because it's the right thing to do.

[Thinkingabout]

1. Are you sure this has always been Sanders position on the issue, might want to

Research this.

[Aerows]

5. I highly suggest *you* research

the position your own candidate (Clinton) has held. Bernie is against the death penalty, as is Martin O'Malley.

I have no expectation that you will, but hey, hope springs eternal.

[Fumesucker]

26. I think it's telling that no one has disagreed with my premise about the Democrats

Not even the poster your post was replying to.

[Aerows]

27. SS, DD

It's telling, and entirely unsurprising.

[Hortensis]

68. I'll disagree! You chose the REAGANISM ERA from 1980

through anywhere from 2004 to 2008-2014 (depending on the historians), when the entire nation shifted strongly right and hatemongers hid behind "family values" and evangelical "born-againism" to blame the DEMOCRATS for what those people did?

Could your aim be just a tad -- like 180 degrees -- off?

All this anti-Democrat propaganda on Democratic Underground really makes me wonder. For a very long time right-wing propaganda has been imported here that claims the Democrats are also responsible for the "getting off the backs of big business" movement toward fascism and creation of a billionaire class, while notably protecting conservatives from responsibility.

[Fumesucker]

72. Oh, I'm not always anti-Democrat, only when I think they are wrong..

For instance in 2012 when most of DU thought Obama had flubbed the first debate with Romney I posted this..

http://sync.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=1480985

Obama is a long game player and DU is relentlessly about the short game for the most part.

Obama stood aside and let Romney be Romney and now everybody's talking about the bird.

I think it was Napoleon who said not to interrupt when your enemy is destroying himself.

And...

http://www.democraticunderground.com/10021538971#post74

It wouldn't surprise me if Obama is setting up a kind of political "bank shot"

Makes it look like he clean missed in the first debate but I suspect he's setting Romney up to clean his clock in the second debate.

Of course I don't pay any attention to the media at all so my attitude in this matter is not informed by their horse race coverage.

[Aerows]

80. I've not seen such flailing around

attempting to not get the point since folks were avoiding getting stabbed with a bayonet.

Not that I was actually there in the trenches of WWII.

But I digress.

No, Fumesucker, you are a person like myself - if I disagree with the actions of another, I blatantly state it. The "party" isn't a person - it is made up of people. Some tend to forget that. People act in accordance with what their conscience will bear.

I like to keep mine clear enough to sleep at night.

[JDPriestly]

87. OK. So let's agree that the Clinton and Obama eras have continued

to shift the country right-ward.

It's time for a correction. That's what Bernie Sanders with his political revolution is offering us. This is our chance to right our ship of state so that it stops leaning so much to the right.

Clinton signed bill after bill that thrust us to the right.

Obama has not been able to pass the legislation needed to correct us an get us back on balance. He has not been able to get enough Democrats elected in non-presidential national elections to hold Congress.

We do need the political revolution that Bernie Sanders' nomination and presidency will mean.

We cannot wait through another rightward leaning Clinton presidency. We will really end up as a fascist nation if we do that. We need a strong advocate for social and economic change in the White House. Bernie is that. No one else is.

[Hortensis]

93. Clinton was part of his era and definitely too centrist for

my preferences too. But he could not be the liberal president we wanted, and needed, in a conservative era. That's just the way it is.

You know, if you're going to win a war, the first thing is to identify your enemies. And your allies. Not to mention, although I guess it needs to be be done, to recognize the army marching with you.

I know you have not because you're calling Bill Clinton rightward leaning and say things like "no one else is." RIGHTward? No one else?! Really?

I don't know where you were in the 1990s, but those of us who voted were trying to hold back the nation's march to the right that had started over a decade earlier. I remember the 1994 midterm election, like 2010 a disastrous sweep by the right that took both houses of Congress. And look at all that'd happened before then and since.

If you were involved then you would not be saying this stuff now. At least it's hard to imagine that you could be. For sure, if you ever took a good look at today's conservative leadership and what they are trying to do, you couldn't arrive at those dangerously mistaken conclusions.

Bill Clinton is not right wing and not even close to fascist. BUT, most of today's GOP candidates are strong to extreme right in ideology and have no intention of stopping the transfer of power from the people to the corporation and a ruling business class. I.e., the move to fascism.

The next president could name up to FOUR Supreme Court justices. THAT's the ground that has to be held no matter what.

"Fascism is definitely and absolutely opposed to the doctrines of liberalism, both in the political and economic sphere." Benito Mussolini.

[George II]

61. The OP doesn't mention the death penalty.

[Aerows]

78. The death penalty is

inextricably linked with our justice system.

We've been executing black human beings at a rate far higher than white and Latino (though they also get treated with their own massive share of prejudice) human beings.

That makes it a significant part of criminal justice reform.

Human beings.

[George II]

79. Next....didn't Sanders (not Clinton) vote for the legislation that enabled....

.....the mass incarceration in the United States?

[Aerows]

81. Oh. Changing the subject.

I brought up the death penalty, because it is a significant issue. It's not my fault you have no rejoinder but to move the goal posts.

Nice try.

[George II]

82. No, it's not "changing the subject" or "moving the goal posts" - the subject is the incarceration...

....of 20,000,000 African Americans, and after your red herring I just tried to get it BACK to "the subject".

You brought in the death penalty (i.e., changed the subject) and then avoided the question about a candidate that you presumably support who voted for legislation that is responsible for most of those 20,000,000 AAs being incarcerated. You evaded my attempt to return us BACK to the subject.

I'd say you were the one who changed the subject and ultimately moved the goal posts and, then attempted to throw those two things on me.

Didn't work.

[Aerows]

83. Good grief.

You must think I'm an idiot. I'm not going to do your research and your thinking for you if you are not willing to grasp what I stated. I don't have enough patience today to do so.

Have a nice day.

[George II]

84. .

[sabrina 1]

16. Oh, we have, and the answer is 'yes'. Btw, where has Hillary been on law and order? I have

researched that also. But have you?

[Armstead]

22. For starters...

Voted NO on military border patrols to battle drugs & terrorism.
Amendment to set up a task force on counter-terrorism and drug interdiction and allow military personnel to help patrol U.S. borders.
Bill HR 2586 ; vote number 2001-356 on Sep 25, 2001

Voted NO on subjecting federal employees to random drug tests.
Drug Demand Reduction Act: Vote on an amendment to require that anyone hired by the Federal Government is subject to random, unannounced drug testing.
Reference: Amendment by Taylor, D-MS; bill by Portman, R-OH.; Bill HR 4550 ; vote number 1998-443 on Sep 16, 1998

Legalize medical marijuana.
Sanders co-sponsored the States' Rights to Medical Marijuana Act:

Title: To provide for the medical use of marijuana in accordance with the laws of the various States. Summary: Transfers marijuana from schedule I of the Controlled Substances Act to schedule II of such Act. Declares that, in a State in which marijuana may be prescribed or recommended by a physician for medical use under applicable State law, no provision of the Controlled Substances Act shall prohibit or otherwise restrict:

Source: House Resolution Sponsorship 01-HR2592 on Jul 23, 2001

Exclude industrial hemp from definition of marijuana.

http://www.ontheissues.org/Domestic/Bernie_Sanders_Drugs.htm

-------------------

[Phlem]

24. yea. getting tired of this. That is all we do is research.

Why don't you give it a try?

[Aerows]

30. Why research things

when you can waste everybody else's time demanding that they do research when you pop off?

Just another way to avoid the issues. Suddenly demand that everybody research the hell out of things, expend their energy, so you can not respond at all.

Tried and true tactic to wear people that disagree with them out.

[hifiguy]

65. I think a simple standard response of

"be your own damned google monkey" is appropriate in such cases.

[Art_from_Ark]

99. You nailed it

[Aerows]

31. There.

Somebody got sucked into your time wasting machine and researched it.

I have no expectation that you will come back and make a comment, because you are probably off in another thread demanding research from them, too.

www.google.com
www.bing.com
www.ixquick.com

Those are places to get you started on your wonderful internet discovery!

[Elmer S. E. Dump]

90. FUD - Fear, Uncertainty, and Doubt. That's all you have. It's not working!!

[leveymg]

2. Bill was all about Sister Soulja Moments and prison construction

Surprised it took this long for someone to admit it. That's a legacy the Democratic Party should reject or risk implosion.

[GeorgeGist]

75. Despite Rector's mental state, then Arkansas Governor Bill Clinton

made a point of returning to Arkansas to oversee Rector's January 24, 1992 execution during the 1992 U.S. Presidential campaign.

[Hydra]

3. It's an extention of the Third Way strategy

Otherwise known as "Where else are you going to go? The Republicans?"

The casual racism, classism and callousness of the establishment has been writ large, especially lately. There is supposedly only one way forward according to them- more of the same.

...Really? That's our only option? Squeeze everyone until they fit in the mold or are dead?

[corkhead]

7. Ironically, that's the problem with having such a gawd awful batch of republicon candidates

They don't mount a serious enough challenge to make the Democratic party ptb want to solicit our votes.

[Hydra]

8. That's what I told the Third Wayers

Because the Grand Ol' Perverts have more or less thrown this election, we have an opportunity to do better. Climate change is going to force us to, as a secondary and even bigger force.

Said third wayer said to me: "Jeb! Booga!"

[longship]

4. The question is: Why has DU turned into a toxic waste dump?

I can hardly stand clicking through most posts because I can see how they will inevitably turn into an elementary school playground, with only bullies and bullied.

Children, grow the fuck up. Play nicely.

That is all I say.

My best to you all.

[Hydra]

10. In short, pay by posting

I didn't used to believe in it, but there are people tearing up the threads with basically nothing to say. Why would someone do that, other than to keep the thread kicked?

[longship]

11. No, I disagree. It is about the bullying.

And it sucks.

This is not about the number of posts. It is about outright childish behavior.

[Hydra]

13. Sadly that's nothing new since 2008

But you are right that it's probably worse than it's ever been sans that particular primary.

[Fumesucker]

14. It's largely driven by maybe forty or fifty posters

I have most of them on "analog ignore" as someone called it recently, I just refrain from responding to them rather than not seeing their messages. If I do happen to respond sometimes I don't let myself get in the multi post back and forth that seems to be so popular in some threads.

DNFTT still works but there are too many here who cannot refrain.

[longship]

18. Well, I have nobody on ignore.

One has to realize that the extent that one ignores is the extent that one does not know what's going on here.

Ignore is merely an excuse.

I ignore nobody.

I apologize for disagreeing, but I respectfully disagree.

My regards.

[Fumesucker]

20. I think you missed my point

I don't "have them on ignore" I ignore them, there is a difference.

Personally I'd rather talk about alien megastructures but that conversation seems to have ended and discussing it with people who don't have much background in astronomy and SF isn't particularly fruitful anyway.

[Fairgo]

38. agreed

In the snark feeding frenzy, I'm nobody's chum.

[aidbo]

55. Snark shark.

[Poeradley]

56. and

saved that photo for later use!

[WorseBeforeBetter]

34. I never really believed it, either. But some who support her now...

were absolutely BRUTAL in their attacks on her back in 2008. Not attacks on policy, but things like her character and intelligence. Well, yes, policy -- they called her a warmonger, too. Suddenly, she's trustworthy, the smartest person in the room, and fit to be President.

Pay by posting, no lives, some warped need to believe they are "winning" on the internet? Makes me thankful for my life.

[whereisjustice]

19. pfffffft - Hillary is all aboard the Prison Express. And the War Express. And the jobs to Asia

Express - driving the economic problems leading to crime and prison.

[longship]

39. ... A post which is an exemplar of precisely what I posted.

Prison express?
War express?
Jobs to Asia?

Speak freaking a language people can understand.

Compare any Democratic presidential candidate to any from the GOP. I won't be picky; you choose.

Now tell me how any Democratic candidate is in any way horrible.

I am a lifelong yellow dog Democrat. If Hillary gets the nomination, I love her. If Bernie gets it, I love him. Hell! If Chafee gets the Democratic nod, I love him!

What too many are missing is the alternative. Make no mistake, the GOP has morphed into a theocratic mess.

It is really easy to make an argument for ones Democratic candidate without tearing down the Democratic Party itself.

I will wholeheartedly support any candidate who gains the Democratic presidential nomination.

The choice really is that simple.

The alternative is something like Donald "Fucking" Trump in the White House. Or, shudder! Reverend Ben "Fucking" Carson.

Good luck with that. I prefer any of the Democratic candidates. Thank you, President Chafee! (Not that I am a supporter, but I would be if he got the nomination.)

[Scuba]

45. The fact the GOP is awful doesn't make Hillary good. She's just slightly less awful.

[Demeter]

49. NOT really. She should know better, but Greed Rules All

It's a character flaw. It's sure as hell not public service, unless your public is confined to the 1%.

[hifiguy]

66. And remember, kidz, the lesser of two evils

is STILL an EVIL.

[whereisjustice]

51. False alternatives. Clinton is JOBS TO ASIA. Since you have trouble with language...

It isn't the job of voters to behave like indentured employees and sign loyalty pledges while our political organizations leave a bunch of shitty middle-class fucking, right wing candidates for us to blindly accept as the chosen ones.

When you run a Wall Street shill as a Democratic candidate, you are literally suppressing the Democratic vote.

Clinton is a shitty candidate, a literal fuck you to Democrats. A toxic candidate for the 1% popular not for her values, ethics and leadership - but for her dirty tricks, and cynical pandering to Democrats for her own personal gains.

Clinton has been consistantly in favor of virtually every policy driving disparity, inequality and poverty in this country.

Of course none of that matters - "She's a Clinton!" royalty. The only thing between us and Armageddon.

"vote for Clinton or the supreme court gets it"

"vote for Clinton or its Donald Trump"

"vote for Clinton or you are just a hippy liberal"

"vote for Clinton, Asia needs our jobs"

"vote for Clinton - she's not afraid of war"

"vote for Clinton - she's bank"

Good for you - you enjoy being a hostage, in love with your DNC captors. They call it Stockholm syndrome.

Since you have trouble tolerating language and its many forms of syntax and semantics (grammar police much?), you can get someone to translate reply this for you.

As for JOBS TO ASIA here's some help. Maybe you understand one of these languages.

Clinton vai enviar trabalhos para a Ásia

Clinton će poslati posao u Aziju

Clinton inviare lavori in Asia

Clinton enviar trabajos a Asia

Klinton do të dërgojë punë në Azi

Clinton wird Arbeitsplätze nach Asien schicken

Clinton lähettää työpaikkoja Aasiaan

[beerandjesus]

60. Big +1

[Scuba]

69. /\_/\_This right here_/\_/\

[Locrian]

88. nailed it

[WorseBeforeBetter]

35. You brought toxicity to this thread. Fumesucker asked a legit question...

and I'd like to hear some answers.

[longship]

40. Well, I like Fumesucker.

I just despise the lack of unity in our party.
And the rather infantile behavior here on DU.

Sometimes people need to grow up and act like adults. Too much schoolyard antics here these days. It makes DU suck!

No offense intended, Fumesucker.

[Fumesucker]

41. It's OK, I understood your remark wasn't aimed at me

We've already discussed this before though, the party isn't unified because everyone but the absolute nutty right is in the Democratic party these days..

"I am not a member of an organized political party, I'm a Democrat" -Will Rogers

[longship]

42. I love the Will Rogers quote.

And no worries between us either. I like your posts. Well, most of them anyway.

[Fast Walker 52]

63. welcome to the internet

I think DU is better than most places and really not bad at all.

Ignore childish shit. There's plenty of good discussion to be had.

[frylock]

91. It wasn't this bad in 2004..

I'll leave it to our viewing audience to determine the common denominator between today and 2008.

[whereisjustice]

94. as disparity, inequality and an oppressive authoritarian Democratic Party continues to alienate

the middle class and below with trickle down, corporate first policies in order to appeal to conservative money, it will get worse.

Education, Health care and other costs are still spiraling out of control as wages flat or in decline.

DNC can't keep rolling out shit bombs like Clinton and expect roses at her feet.

[aidbo]

6. Pragmatism.

[aspirant]

9. Why doesn't the first Black President

give a Blanket Pardon for these 20 million AA potential voters?

[riderinthestorm]

12. +10 million!!!! Nt

[Fumesucker]

15. Presidential pardon is only for Federal crimes and most of the convictions are not Federal but state

[aspirant]

21. How many were Federal?

Can Governors give pardons?

[Fumesucker]

23. I don't know the absolute numbers but Federal is a fairly small percentage of prisoners overall

In my state the Governor can give a pardon, that may vary from state to state according to their particular constitution.

[jeff47]

53. Yes, governors can give pardons, but that won't help.

The governors who might be receptive to pardons are Democrats, in states that will be voting for the Democratic nominee.

[jamzrockz]

50. Cos that would be a silly thing to do

I think non violent offender prisoners related to the drug war should be released. And I am talking about prisoners of all races. I think non violent should be the keyword here.

[whereisjustice]

17. Political opportunity and political convenience. What's a few million poor in prison

when it helps make Democrats look tough on crime?

See - all for a good cause.

Thank you poor people for taking one for Team Clinton!

[AOR]

37. +1

for a healthy dose of cynicism and truth.

[Scuba]

46. + another

[hifiguy]

67. +1 nt

[NonMetro]

25. Not Really. Republicans Are The Ones Who Started The Drug Wars To Get Votes

And it worked. While it is true there have been Democrats in high places - your "establishment" Democrats? - who have gone along with it, there isn't much they could have done about it, anyway - because the millions of people who vote for Republicans, and put them in office in large numbers, support the drug wars and mass incarceration, too. So does Wall Street.

Democrats would not disenfranchise any part of their own coalition - and that doesn't even make sense - but they have been largely powerless to prevent it from happening. What we're witness to is the triumph of conservatism. Let's not blame the victim for the crime.

[Fumesucker]

28. Politicians have been falling all over themselves for the last forty years to get tough on drugs

Democratic and Republican alike, the exceptions are remarkable for their extreme rarity.

[kelliekat44]

29. What we should be fighting for is the restoration of voting rights for ALL those released from

Federal prison. I believe that states differ in voting eligibility for convicted felons who have served their time. One can see why it was and still is important for states to build and fill their prisons and thereby deny voting privileges to millions who would probably not vote Republican. This ought to be one of the planks is the Dem platform to restore voting rights to released felons.

It would be interesting to see how state incarceration facilities line up with gerrymandered voting precincts all over the nation. Remember, the prison populations count as residents for apportionment purposes. It would also be interesting to see if any states gained representation because of this. I believe a few states lost representation because of dwindling populations over the past decade.

Instead of bickering and trying to lay baggage on the President for shit he is not responsible for, we ought to contact our candidates and ask them to support voter registration and restoration. All for candidates running ought to make this an issue.

[Fumesucker]

33. I never mentioned the President

But now that you bring him up you might recall that there was a contest to submit questions to the White House and cannabis legalization was a winner and Obama blew it off with a joke.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2009/03/26/obama-takes-pot-legalizat_n_179563.html

The White House's innovative Open for Questions forum has produced plenty of substantive questions on wonky issues. But roughly midway through, the president preemptively took one of the more popular and provocative questions of the bunch.

The query, which received more than three million votes, was: "With over 1 out of 30 Americans controlled by the penal system, why not legalize, control, and tax marijuana to change the failed war on drugs into a money making, money saving boost to the economy? Do we really need that many victimless criminals?"

Obama actually interrupted the M.C of the event -- Jared Bernstein, chief economist to the Vice President -- in order to tackle the topic. He kept his answer brief.

"There was one question that voted on that ranked fairly high and that was whether legalizing marijuana would improve the economy and job creation," he said. "And I don't know what this says about the online audience, but ... this was a popular question. We want to make sure it's answered. The answer is no, I don't think that's a good strategy to grow our economy. All right."

[Bluenorthwest]

48. Only 11 States potentially prevent felons from all future voting. 2 States let them vote in prison

and never restrict their franchise-Maine and Vermont. Yes, Vermont. 20 States restore voting rights to felons post prison, parole and probation, 4 after prison and parole and 13 + DC after the term of incarceration alone.

Alabama, Arizona, Delaware, Florida, Iowa, Kentucky, Mississippi, Nevada, Tennessee, Virginia and Wyoming a felon might lose voting rights permanently but some of those have variables depending on the crime, the time, etc.

http://felonvoting.procon.org/view.resource.php?resourceID=000286

[Fumesucker]

54. Are you arguing that makes it OK for Democrats to support the racist drug war?

How would the 2000 election in Florida have turned out if so many black males had not been disenfranchised in that state?

[Bluenorthwest]

95. Obviously I do not think that don't be a jerk. You and the other poster did not know the facts

and so I offered them to you. I know facts because I have spent years on this subject, the one you affect to care about.
Not all States disenfranchise people with records. Two States, including that of our own Bernie Sanders, allow prisoners to vote while in prison. On the other end of it, you have States that impose permanent voting bans.
This means that people in their States could be doing a great deal to improve those rules. Those two States should be all 50, allowing voting to all. You, as I recall are in the South. Chances are your State has heavy punitive laws. Here prisoners can't vote but once you do your time you vote.

Also here we are currently actively expunging the records of people with marijuana convictions because marijuana is no longer a crime.

So how about your State? Expunging any records?

To be effective, you have to know things. Rhetoric and arm waving serves the arm waver. It is also very, very bad in my opinion to post anything that might make a reader believe they have no right to vote. Ex cons reading this site or current prisoners should in fact know the facts and not hear rhetoric which could lead them to not taking the steps to vote.

You have a tendency to think very terrible things of people who are the exact opposite of what you throw at them.
So. A few Southern States use private jails locally. People in those locations could really get stuff done...

[kelliekat44]

92. He didn't blow it off. He answered and his answer was no.."not a good strategy to grow our economy"

To grow the economy you need jobs with good wages and lower rents and mortgages. We would not be able to "grow" our way out a poor economy by growing more weed and legalizing it. We may want to legalize it or at least de-criminalize weed for other reasons including medicinal reasons. And how many jobs would be created by growing weed. Weed farmers would soon go the way of traditional farmers...bought out by mega agribusinesses and making money for the 1% again.

And there are other long-term issues to think about before taking the step to legalize pot. But it would do very little to grow the economy. Wait until you see the outcomes from the states that have legalized it. The jury won't really be in for at least five more years.

[Bluenorthwest]

96. He was wrong. Colorado is seeing great benefit to the economy, as is Oregon.

Colorado has the fastest growing economy in the
United States,

According to the Department of Revenue, 16,000
people were licensed to work in the marijuana
industry as of December 31, 2014, though not
all those with licenses may be actively working in
the industry.
Jack Strauss, an economist at the University of
Denver, assessed the economic impact of two
dispensaries in Denver, Evergreen Apothecary
and Colorado Harvest Company.

Workers at the
two dispensaries receive an average wage of $17
per hour. Strauss found that the economic impact
of the two dispensaries amounted to 280 jobs
and $30 million in total economic output between
January 1, 2014 and June 30, 2014, and that the
two dispensaries contribute 10 times the tax
revenue of either a typical restaurant or retail
store.
https://www.drugpolicy.org/sites/default/files/Colorado_Marijuana_Legalization_One_Year_Status_Report.pdf

Colorado has hundreds of dispensaries.

[zentrum]

32. Great Question.

[MasonDreams]

36. Don't blame me i voted for Jimmy Carter

[lovemydog]

43. That's a great question Fumesucker.

If I vote for Sanders or O'Malley in the primary that will be one of the main reasons.

This hellacious drug war must end. It's over. We lost.

We should start releasing people from prisons. I'm pretty radical in this regard. I'm a prison abolitionist except for violent repeat offenders and humongous thieves like Wall Street crooks.

For non-violent crime I'm much more into restitution or alternative sentencing that includes education like anger management or drug rehabilitation.

[eridani]

44. In Michael Moore's movie, the Senate blowing off the black members of the House who wanted--

--voter disenfranchisement to be investigated in 2001 was really, really sad.

https://c5c5c5.wordpress.com/2011/04/13/michael-moore%E2%80%99s-fahrenheit-911-deceptions-3/

[raouldukelives]

47. Yes, one of the most striking, of many striking moments, in that film. nt

[Admiral Loinpresser]

57. That is how the 2000 election was stolen. n/t

[arcane1]

77. And Kerry had a guy kicked out and tased for asking about disenfranchisement.

Funny how that's come up twice for me today. Well, not "funny" as such.

[fredamae]

52. Democrats are a fearful lot

politically speaking of course, But-let's face it...no matter the report, no matter the Dems excuses---errrr..."justification"...it Still boils down to a "Follow The Money" ... situation.
As long as We allow(ed) them to do this...decade after decade after decade....Billions and Billions and Billions of dollars have been earned for Private Prisons, New Hires for these ever expanding prison populations, Drug Treatment Centers, Drug Testing Kits and Labs, Big Pharma, Private Food Service Contractors, Free to Very Cheap Prison Labor making goods to Sell and Call Center Jobs etc, etc, etc.
Laws, Rules and Policies were created by our elected officials at Every level of government-Not for the Good of Society...but for Greed.

You see, these Prisons...alone charge Us an average of $3000.00 Per month for Room/Board-alone. Them there are extra "fees" for this/that/the other thing. Plus, when for instance-they make clothes
http://www.prisonblues.com/About_Us.html
The prisoners are paid a few pennies to construct them and the Prison makes Big..(a few years ago I read an article that stated these jeans were selling for $350.00 a pair in CA Boutiques). ...and I understand these facilities then Charge the Prisoner a Room and Board fee also and it is taken from a paltry "paycheck".
I don't know how this all shakes out in the end for Prison Profit...but I will make a "guess"-it isn't all that great for the guy sewing the clothes and it certainly sucks for the tax payer if one is concerned about How our tax dollars are invested and whether or not We get a ROI for said investment..

[Jester Messiah]

58. Naked political calculus.

Read it as: "I don't have to be great for you, or even good for you. I just have to be better than my nearest competitor, and rely on you to take the least-bad option. So you can pretty much just take what you're given and like it."

Worst part is, it's a hard theory to disprove. To disabuse them of the notion, one has to be willing to accept a worse outcome in the short to mid term than one might otherwise have got.

[Eleanors38]

59. The WOD, of course. "No one calling me SoftonDrugs©". Any questions? Thank you. Nt

[George II]

62. If he wasn't, as you put it, "a drug warrior", he should not have voted for the legislation...

...that enabled that mass incarceration in the 1990s and beyond.

[hifiguy]

64. When you take money from for-profit prisons

ya gotta keep your owners satisfied.

[Roy Rolling]

70. Ahhh...the Fox News Question Mark

Just say something bigoted with a question mark and it's a reasonable insult. Simply put, it is not true that "Democrats enthusiastically disenfranchised their most loyal voting bloc".

National political parties can be train wrecks. But don't make the same mistake as they do by using straw man arguments to justify bigoted positions. Saying all Democrats think a certain way is prejudice.

[Fumesucker]

71. Up until very recently Democratic politicians have been enthusiastic drug warriors

If you go back and look at the history of drug prohibition it was all about who was using particular drugs. Opium was Chinese, Marijuana Mexicans, Cocaine blacks.

Racism and bigotry, alcohol kills twice as many Americans as all illegal drugs combined but it's consumed by the upper classes so of course it's not bad.

http://www.salon.com/2015/10/19/forget_the_war_on_drugs_alcohol_ruins_more_lives_than_all_other_drugs_combined_partner/

In big picture terms, the wealthiest and most educated people are most likely to drink. A Gallup poll released earlier this year confirmed that more affluent Americans drank more often than their poorer peers. “Whereas eight in 10 adults in these socio-economic status groups say they drink, only about half of lower-income Americans and those with a high school diploma or less say they drink.” (There was a racial component as well: 69 percent of non-Hispanic whites say they drink alcohol, compared with just 52 percent of nonwhites.) The reasons for the class discrepancy are likely varied; Gallup theorizes that greater means leads to more frequent involvement in activities that involve drinking, such as going on vacation, dining out and socializing with coworkers.

[Major Hogwash]

73. Not only did they promote the drug war, they promoted the private prison systems!!

They're the most corrupt jackholes in the world, busting black men for cocaine that was not in powder form, and then getting them sent to private prisons, which in turn, made kickback donations to their political campaigns to keep the money rolling in!!!!

The incarceration rate for black men went from 22% in the 70s, before the drug war started, to almost 31% at the end of the century.
They not lonely promoted the drug war, they helped to increase the rate of incarceration for black men by almost 40% in just 20 years!
And not just for sentences of 5 or 10 years, but for life!!

[rhett o rick]

74. What is astounding is the number of Democrats (?) that say they support social justice for

a number of issues, choose to support the status quo that has put us where we are today. They put their allegiance in the 1% who has orchestrated this mess. They do so for a few weak, hollow promises of social justice.

[Maedhros]

97. They are choosing only to see one aspect of racial justice -

namely, racially-motivated violence.

They are ignoring other aspects of racial justice - such as economic oppression - because their chosen candidate is complicit in perpetuating them.

[rhett o rick]

98. The 1% has Think Tanks (read Conspiracy Tanks) that figured out that if the throw the

Democrats a bone or two (social justice issues) then some Democrats (conservative ones) will be soo happy they will ignore the 1%'s looting of the wealth of the 99%. Poverty is increasing and yet the conservative Democrats are in denial about it.

[Maedhros]

100. The so-called 'social issues' are used by the Parties to corral votes from their respective bases.

Big Money could not care less about (e.g.) whether LGBTQ persons have equal rights or not - it just doesn't impact their bottom line. But they do know that LGBTQ rights can be used to scare voters into supporting candidates - liberals are made afraid that those rights will be curtailed, and conservatives are made afraid that those rights will be expanded.

As long as we continue our headlong flight toward the Randian Corporate Paradise, Big Money is content to let the social issues go whichever way they must. That's why they are pouring so much money into the "liberal" Hillary Clinton, because they know that she won't cut off the gravy train despite whatever social issue she uses to pander to the liberal base.

[rhett o rick]

101. What is amazing is that those focused on social justice issues pretend that poverty

isn't a social justice issue because they know that the Oligarchy and HRC won't help with that problem. Poverty does does effect the bottom line for the 1%. HRC is a member of the 1%.

[guillaumeb]

76. Number 1, The prison industry is a growth industry.

Number 2, William Clinton was an enthusiastic participant in the "tough on crime" war.

Number 3, refer back to number 1.

[randr]

85. No doubt about it--Clinton moved the Democrats into prison business

Hillary maintains this corruption by her acceptance of private prison money.
Besides of the fact that Bernie is the only politician in my long life to tell the truth, I have serious issues with anyone who support the barbarism of our current penal system.

[onecaliberal]

86. Because they are owned by the same corps that own the republicans.

They don't give two shits about anyone or anything.

[Uncle Joe]

89. Kicked and recommended.

Thanks for the thread, Fumesucker.