2016 Postmortem
Related: About this forumMEDIA WATCH: WHY IS MEDIA COVERING UP WHO WON DEMOCRATIC DEBATE, ACCORDING TO POLLS?
http://eastcountymagazine.org/media-watch-why-media-covering-who-won-democratic-debate-according-pollsOctober 15, 2015 (San Diego) After the CNN-hosted Democratic presidential candidate debate Wednesday, all major polls--including CNNs own poll--showed Bernie Sanders the winner by wide margins. Yet post-debate coverage by CNN and other major media almost unanimously declared Hillary Clinton the winner.
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Right after the debate, a CNN poll found 81% of viewers thought Sanders won. A CNN-Facebook poll, no longer findable on the CNN website, at one point had Sanders on top with 75% of the vote, Clinton with 18%, OMalley and Webb with 3% and Chafee with 1%.
Yet CNNs post-debate coverage included articles titled Hilary Clintons Big Night on the Debate Stage and Best of Hilary Clinton from the Dem Debate. When viewers complained about the obvious distortion in coverage compared to polls, CNN started deleting critical comments leading new commenters to compare the tactics to Russia, as Media Equalizer reported.
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Time magazines poll: Sanders 59%., Clinton 12%. U.S. News live blog poll : Sanders 82%, Clinton 12%. Google Consumer Surveys poll conducted for IJ Review, (founded by a past advisor to ex-Republican presidential candidate Mitt Romney): Sanders 43.7%--15 points ahead of Clinton. Fox 5 San Diego TV: Sanders 78.77%. Google Trends also found Sanders won as the most-Googled candidate post-debate in all 50 states. Sanders was also the most-discussed candidate on Facebook, followed by Clinton then Webb, U.S. News reports.
We could not find a single poll that put Clinton in the lead, nor any of the other contenders. Yet the major corporate-owned media blithely fawned over Clintons victory.
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Follow the money
According to the Pulitzer Prize-winning fact-check site Politifact, (image, right) Time-Warner, which owns CNN, is the 7th largest donor to Clinton's campaign. Her top donors also include primarily banks and corporations -- the very institutions Sanders has railed against and seeks to regulate. Tellingly, two of her opponents, O'Malley and Sanders, criticized Clinton in the debate her opposition to breaking up big banks -- footage not shown on the major networks. (Sanders' major donors are predominantly in labor, education, and civil justice.)
Besides direct donations by some media outlets to the Clinton campaign, Politico in May reported on media donations to the Clinton Foundation. Those include NBC, Viacom (owner of CBS), the CEO of Fox News, a top ABC anchor, the New York Times, the Washington Post, Reuters news service, an anchor for PBS, and many more amounting to millions of dollars in media money.
Conspiracy or coincidence?
brooklynite
(94,748 posts)If it makes you happy to vote in online polls, knock yourself out. No reputable polling organization would stand by them. They're clickbait for the relevant website sponsor.
bkkyosemite
(5,792 posts)the corporate media. She will do their bidding. You keep trying to make sense of this stealing of democracy just so your candidate can win at the cost of the people's right to fair debates and elections. She is bought and you supporting her well........
AgingAmerican
(12,958 posts)The corporate media fears Bernie Sanders and will do anything in it's power to marginalize him.
JaneyVee
(19,877 posts)1StrongBlackMan
(31,849 posts)AgingAmerican
(12,958 posts)wyldwolf
(43,870 posts)AgingAmerican
(12,958 posts)That's pretty obvious, per the article.
wyldwolf
(43,870 posts)OH they love how many people came to the site and click buttons. Suckers. LOL.
AgingAmerican
(12,958 posts)wyldwolf
(43,870 posts)Still doesn't make them true
AgingAmerican
(12,958 posts)wyldwolf
(43,870 posts)But every ONLINE poll where people can vote multiple times is inaccurate.
AgingAmerican
(12,958 posts)...is because Sanders supporters voted multiple times? How many times did Hillary supporters vote? Do you have any evidence to back your hypothesis?
wyldwolf
(43,870 posts)Votere have to meet certain criteria - age, location, citizenship and in many cases party affiliation. And, of course, a voter gets one vote.
Internet poll takers can be any age, in any part of the world, of any political persuasion or party. All they need is a computer. And they can vote more than once. Additionally you don't even have to be human to vote in Internet polls. Bots can be written to vote in Internet polls. Someone on DU got banned once for doing that very thing.
AgingAmerican
(12,958 posts)The trend is clear and undeniable.
Now, how do you explain away the focus groups mirroring exactly what the online polls showed? What's the spin on that?
wyldwolf
(43,870 posts)The answer is that no journalist worth his or her salt takes those focus groups or online polls seriously.
The former have a handful of people watching the back-and-forth with these little doozers that they can dial up or down, so they're artificially compelled to hang onto every word in a way that no normal person watching a debate ever does. The latter are meaningless.
AgingAmerican
(12,958 posts)The corporate shills and media (who are backing her) insist she won. The people say Sanders slaughtered her. Who is correct?
wyldwolf
(43,870 posts)AgingAmerican
(12,958 posts)Here are 21 polls showing Sanders winning handily. I challenge you to post a single poll showing she won.
Thanks in advance!
1. C-SPAN: Sanders (7.2k) |Clinton (938)
2. TIME: Sanders 60% | Clinton 12%
3. CNN: Sanders 81% | Clinton 12%
4. Drudge: Sanders 61% (126,448 votes) | Clinton 6.74% (13,925 votes)
5. Dailykos: Sanders 59% (7,970 votes) | Clinton 34% (4,659 votes)
6. Slate: Sanders 75% | Clinton 18%
7. Syracuse: Sanders 78.11% (3,190 votes) | Clinton 15.77% (644 votes)
8. Fox5: Sanders 77.35% (30,248) | Clinton 15.86% (6,204 votes)
9. MSNBC: Sanders 81% | Clinton 12%
10. Wishtv8: Sanders 77.65% | Clinton 13.15%
11. Advocate: Sanders 77% | Clinton 19%
12. Nationalreview: Sanders 558 votes | Clinton 39 votes
13. 9news: Sanders 8.9k votes | Clinton 2.2k votes
14. Wwnc: Sanders 78% | Clinton 15%
15. Philadelphia.cbslocal: Sanders 81.03% | Clinton 14.56%
16. Postonpolitics: Sanders 84% | Clinton 10%
17. AJC: Sanders +225 -20 | Clinton +62 -108
18. Controversialtimes: Sanders 84.42 | Clinton 10.39
19. Tcpalm: Sanders 74% | Clinton 18%
20. WRIC 8NEWS: Sanders 75% | Clinton 6%
21. WGY: Sanders 68% | Clinton 12%
Response to AgingAmerican (Reply #12)
AtomicKitten This message was self-deleted by its author.
mythology
(9,527 posts)Online, non-scientific polling is about generating traffic to look at ads.
AgingAmerican
(12,958 posts)1. C-SPAN: Sanders (7.2k) |Clinton (938)
2. TIME: Sanders 60% | Clinton 12%
3. CNN: Sanders 81% | Clinton 12%
4. Drudge: Sanders 61% (126,448 votes) | Clinton 6.74% (13,925 votes)
5. Dailykos: Sanders 59% (7,970 votes) | Clinton 34% (4,659 votes)
6. Slate: Sanders 75% | Clinton 18%
7. Syracuse: Sanders 78.11% (3,190 votes) | Clinton 15.77% (644 votes)
8. Fox5: Sanders 77.35% (30,248) | Clinton 15.86% (6,204 votes)
9. MSNBC: Sanders 81% | Clinton 12%
10. Wishtv8: Sanders 77.65% | Clinton 13.15%
11. Advocate: Sanders 77% | Clinton 19%
12. Nationalreview: Sanders 558 votes | Clinton 39 votes
13. 9news: Sanders 8.9k votes | Clinton 2.2k votes
14. Wwnc: Sanders 78% | Clinton 15%
15. Philadelphia.cbslocal: Sanders 81.03% | Clinton 14.56%
16. Postonpolitics: Sanders 84% | Clinton 10%
17. AJC: Sanders +225 -20 | Clinton +62 -108
18. Controversialtimes: Sanders 84.42 | Clinton 10.39
19. Tcpalm: Sanders 74% | Clinton 18%
20. WRIC 8NEWS: Sanders 75% | Clinton 6%
21. WGY: Sanders 68% | Clinton 12%
DemocratSinceBirth
(99,714 posts)Fearless
(18,421 posts)They don't need to collude to come to the same conclusions.
Wellstone ruled
(34,661 posts)winter is coming
(11,785 posts)WillyT
(72,631 posts)workinclasszero
(28,270 posts)Black helicopters
Juicy_Bellows
(2,427 posts)Unbelievable how I haven't seen one HRC supporter simply say that Bernie had won and the media is trying to spin it in her favor. It's obvious that is what occurred but they can't bring themselves to admit it or they don't give a shit.
Not scientific - granted but to act as if all these polls just happened by magic is not being truthful.
AgingAmerican
(12,958 posts)Integrity and honesty are the first casualties. This sort of thing would have been unthinkable in the Democratic party not long ago. This is how Republicans have always operated. It's pretty disconcerting seeing it coming from the party apparatus.
Juicy_Bellows
(2,427 posts)I blame the money, after it all it does seem to be the one thing they really focus on. We see ISSUES they see I$$UE$.
Cheers!
Go Vols
(5,902 posts)Exactly,but not that long ago to me could be before a lot of voters were born.They can't live it,only read about it.
:/
mythology
(9,527 posts)It's not honest to pass off unscientific polls that have a disclaimer telling you that they aren't accurate because they are self-selected and so have no controls for demographics as some way to verify anything. It's actually dishonest to be using those polls as a way to "prove" that Sanders won or the big scary media is trying to cover it up. It's dishonest because you either know, or should know, your evidence isn't actually proof of what you say.
Honesty is this - until there are multiple real scientific polls, there is no way to tell who won the debate. Neither the pundits nor the useless internet polls can actually determine which candidate(s) will rise or fall in the larger public's estimation. In theory a pundit should have some experience or specialized education to make their opinion more valuable than a random guess, but I haven't seen any studies on that over time. A non-random, non-weighted poll is meaningless because it's not representative of the universe of likely voters.
AgingAmerican
(12,958 posts)CNN's parent company is one of her biggest backers. Time Warner stands to lose political power should Sanders win. Sunlight is the best disinfectant.
The fact EVERY poll and EVERY focus group shows the same thing tells us there is a trend in that direction.
It isn't about 'fact' it's about 'trend'.
hifiguy
(33,688 posts)from their corporate owners. Nothing else matters, especially the truth. The truth is what they make it.
Sunlei
(22,651 posts)frylock
(34,825 posts)now posting about tinfoil hats and black helicopters while they wholeheartedly support the opinions of the very people they have been railing against for decades.
panader0
(25,816 posts)How can anyone defend that? Disgusting!
The curtain is being lifted. My daughter, never much into politics, called me today from Anchorage to
express her outrage. Bernie won, PERIOD.
Uncle Joe
(58,426 posts)Thanks for the thread, AgingAmerican.
Response to AgingAmerican (Original post)
Name removed Message auto-removed
AgingAmerican
(12,958 posts)Not one. Most of them show her losing by magnitudes. The focus group results match exactly the results of EVERY poll.
Coincidence or trend?
kenn3d
(486 posts)A CNN/Facebook poll showed online voters overwhelmingly picking Sanders as the winner.
Now Sanders supporters are saying the poll was deleted completely from CNN. They are claiming the network is hiding support for Sanders to appeal to Clinton and her campaign.
Beyond the poll, users are saying their pro-Sanders comments are being deleted on CNNs Facebook page.
Media Equalizer said it screenshotted comments on CNNs Facebook and saw some had since disappeared. Facebook users are commenting on many CNN posts asking about the poll and their comments.
http://elitedaily.com/news/politics/bernie-sanders-supporters-cnn-delete-facebook/1248597/