Is Bill Clinton Deliberately Sabotaging Barack Obama?

[Purveyor]

WASHINGTON - Is Bill Clinton deliberately sabotaging U.S. President Barack Obama?

That was the big question in the U.S. capital on Wednesday, the day after the former president once again parted ways with the Obama campaign on a crucial election issue — the extension of the George W. Bush-era tax cuts.

Clinton, who's been campaigning for Obama ahead of the November election, told CNBC that those tax cuts should be extended temporarily at the end of the year, even for the wealthiest Americans.

That's in direct opposition to the Obama administration's approach to slashing the country's mammoth US$15.7 trillion national debt. The White House wants those tax cuts to expire for Americans earning more than $250,000 a year, saying the country's richest people must contribute to efforts to rein in ballooning federal deficits.

MORE...

http://www.globalnews.ca/is+bill+clinton+deliberately+sabotaging+barack+obama/6442655599/story.html

[MjolnirTime]

1. Jesse Jackson won in South Carolina, too!

[Liberal_Stalwart71]

2. YES!!!!!

[EC]

3. He went off message when he was

stomping for Hillary too, was he sabotaging her?

[Liberal_Stalwart71]

5. YES!!! ABSOLUTELY!!!

Look, we all know that Bill Clinton opened his mouth too much during the 2007-2008 Democratic presidential primaries which hurt Hillary Clinton. Many folk wondered then whether or not he had deliberately misspoken. Bill Clinton is an impeccable campaigner. He is well spoken. He is passionate. He is a masterful politician. I don't believe for one second that these were mistakes. Remember him getting caught on tape cozying up to Paul Ryan? This man is shrewd and calculating!

However, given his behavior during those primaries and the most recent remarks, I remain unconvinced that he is not purposefully trying to sabotage this president and the election. And I'm not the only one who holds this view.

Just sayin'...

[Wait Wut]

4. I'm not willing to call it sabotage.

Off his rocker, maybe.

[GoCubsGo]

32. Or, having his words taken out of context.

And, while I didn't hear/read what he said, I am hearing that this is exactly what happened.

[Wait Wut]

33. Yeah...I saw that, too.

Although, he does tend to wander off the trails on occasion. It looks like it was a false alarm, this time.

There are so few links I can click on from work, so I often only get pieces of stories. Hoping the boss is ready to move into the 20th century soon. Yes...20th.

[boxman15]

6. He's not sabotaging Obama, he's just being stupid. That's it. nt

[FBaggins]

17. The former president had his share of character flaws...

...stupidity was never one of them.

[boxman15]

29. Not saying President Clinton is stupid.

He's a very smart man, but these slip-ups in the national media are just plain stupid. They give easy ammunition to the right. That's why this is mind-boggling. He's smarter than this.

[FBaggins]

35. He IS smarter than this.

Which is why it doesn't make sense to assume that they're "slip ups".

[Cali_Democrat]

7. He's allowed to express his own opinion

[ZombieHorde]

9. I don't think anyone is saying otherwise, but thanks for the legal reminder. nt

[Cali_Democrat]

12. No problem!

[Lionessa]

8. Or is Barack Obama on board, but politicking by saying otherwise?

He rolls over so fast, I oft wonder if he hadn't always wanted the outcomes to remain status quo.

[Liberal_Stalwart71]

15. And so did Bill Clinton but you say nothing about that. Just bash the president!!

[Lionessa]

21. Clearly I'm unhappy with both. Deal with it.

[Liberal_Stalwart71]

22. No! This country has to deal with it! These policies are destroying it!

[Lionessa]

30. Policies of every president since Reagan are destroying it, have been, and apparently will continue

to. I think WI sort of kicked any hope of change, it's really a matter of learning how to deal, at my age, there will be no change in my lifetime.

[otohara]

10. The Job Creators Hooey

it doesn't work, so why extend?

[FSogol]

11. Sabotaging Obama by saying it "would be calamitous for the country to elect Romney"?

Clinton is a great campaigner. The repubs are afraid of him. They are pressuring the press to marginalize him with the type of nonsense you are posting.

[Drunken Irishman]

13. I think a part of him is, yes...

I have a feeling there is a part of Clinton who doesn't want to see Obama win because it might damage his legacy as the last successful Democratic president. Clinton's biggest thing going for him right now is that he sees himself as the Democratic Ronald Reagan - a very popular two-term president.

He's also THE successful Democrat in the eyes of the media. You hear it all the time. "The last two-term Democratic president...the last successful Democratic president...the only Democrat to win reelection since FDR..." blah, blah, blah - stuff like that strokes his ego and he knows if Obama wins, all that goes out the window. If Obama wins reelection November, he'll have four years to cement himself as the last successful Democratic president, the last Democrat to win reelection and so on and so forth. Clinton won't have near the claim to fame as he has now and while I get it sounds remarkably spiteful for him to think this way, I can't help but get over the idea he does.

Just a bit. I do think he wants Obama to win, but there are parts of Clinton who would rather he lose to prove to the world that everything he said in '08 was true and that the Clinton Brand will continue to be the only successful name brand in the modern Democratic Party.

[FSogol]

14. "doesn't want to see Obama win because it might damage his legacy"

Do you really think Clinton is that childish?


Successes for Obama (and the Democratic Party) only help Clinton and his causes.

[Drunken Irishman]

19. I don't think it's childish. I think it's human...

People like to be liked. Clinton continues to be a dominant figure in the Democratic Party and really, from 1992-2008, was THE dominant figure in the Democratic Party. That's a long time to be the Big Dog and if Obama wins reelection, I think a part of him realizes that won't be anymore. A reelected Obama instantly becomes the new face of the new Democratic Party, just as Clinton became that face with his reelection in '96. What I mean, is that no one looks to Jimmy Carter as the face of the Democratic Party, even though he's still alive and could almost be called the Wisdom of the Party because of his age. They don't consider him a successful president and though personal opinion of him as strengthened over the years, many Americans still look at his presidency as a failure. It's similar with H.W. Bush, and almost every one-term president whose career wasn't cut short by death (like JFK).

Clinton, by way of winning a second term, instantly became the go-to guy for Democratic Golden Years. We have heard ever since '00 that every candidate in someway needs to be like Clinton. In 2000, Gore lost because he distanced himself from Clinton. In '04, Kerry lost because he couldn't connect like Clinton. In '08, '10 and now '12, Obama has constantly been compared to Clinton.

You don't think Clinton likes that? Hell, I would like it. If Obama loses in November, his presidency will be looked upon similar to that of Bush Senior and Jimmy Carter. Maybe a mix of both. Not necessarily a failure, but hardly anything more than just a footnote in history (once you get beyond the whole first African-American president). If that happens, Clinton will remain the face of the party until either a successful Democrat comes along and wins or he dies and even the latter, his legacy will remain. It's why Reagan continues to be propped up as the ideal Republican, even though two Republican presidents have been elected since his term ended. One did manage to win a second term, but that just exasperated the whole deal and his father is often saddled with an awful economy in the early 90s, even if he did lead us to our first foreign policy victory since WWII.

I'm not saying this is causing Clinton to actively root against Obama. I still believe he wants him to win. But I also believe a part of him, maybe 25% of him, would smile a bit if Obama lost in November because he would know his legacy remained and that he can turn around and say, "see, we shoulda elected my wife..."

That's what I think, anyway.

[Whisp]

37. I wouldn't say childish, but selfish, yah

I do.

I know you weren't asking me but I thought I'd throwin a chip anyway.

[Happydayz]

18. You nailed it!!

I've been saying this ever since the 08 elections. Bill Clinton, imo, doesn't want to see another 2 term democratic president and especially not the guy who beat his wife. I don't agree with Clinton being a good campaigner for others, only for himself. The 2008 primaries is prime example of him being a horrible campaigner for his wife, that was an epic fail. I know Obama and Axelrod know what Clinton is up to, he's probably being shut down as we type. Bill "Jessie Jackson won SC too" Clinton needs to be fired as an Obama surrogate asap!! If Obama were to lose this election(God forbid) Clinton would be the main one gloating and celebrating, its sad.

[leftynyc]

20. I can't believe people are getting

sucked into believing this nonsense. The media is doing all it can to create a firestorm between two Democrats so they don't have to report on what a joke Romney is and people on this board are only too happy to oblige them. I thought we were smarter than this.

[Liberal_Stalwart71]

23. I can walk and chew gum at the same time. Yes, Romney is a joke. And...

I honestly believe that Bill Clinton is deliberately trying to sabotage President Obama for the reasons that some have already stated.

[leftynyc]

24. So you must also believe that the President

is too stupid to see this and keeps asking for Clinton's help. Why is it President Clinton's job to keep his mouth shut about his positions? Was his appearance on CNBC as a Pres Obama surrogate? Are the Dems who don't support the President's escalation of the war in Afghanistan also deliberately sabotaging the President? Is nobody allowed to have their own opinion during an election year?

[Liberal_Stalwart71]

26. Yes, in a way, I believe that President Obama has been incredibly naive, from Day 1

when he put all these DLCers in the White House and other positions of power. Yes, I think he was naive to believe that everyone had his best interests at heart and agreed with his platform. Yes, I certainly think he was naive to try the same *TRIANGULATION* policies that Bill Clinton tried with *this* particular Republican Party--a party that emphatically stated OUT LOUD that they wanted to destroy him.

Yes, indeed, I think President Obama has made some incredibly stupid mistakes due his naivete, perhaps a bit of arrogance. That may cost him the White House for another four years.

But in addition to the president's naivete, I STILL think Bill Clinton is deliberately trying to sabotage him. Yes, I do.

[Lionessa]

31. +1

[Drunken Irishman]

25. I don't know, lefty. Seems Clinton has to walk back a lot of statements...

And it just isn't this election cycle. Remember the damage he did to Hillary's campaign in '08?

[leftynyc]

27. I think if every one of my statements

was parsed, truncated or misinterpreted (deliberately), I'd be in big trouble also. There is a reason Pres Clinton is the most popular politician in this country.

[Drunken Irishman]

28. That's why we're not in politics...

We have to think before we speak. Clinton might mean well, but he does put his foot into his mouth a bit too much. Far more, I believe, than a typical surrogate should.

Bottom line, don't veer off the script. Bush tax cuts bad. They should expire. Bain bad. Obama good.

Basic stuff. :p

[Happydayz]

36. Link, I've never heard that Clinton is the most popular politician in this country.lol

I don't see how that's possible, the rethugs hate him, blacks have cooled off of him and don't support him as much as they did prior to the 2008 primaries. Last poll I saw, said Hillary was the most popular politician. But its easy to popular when you aren't in the White House, it used to be Condoleezza Rice use to be the most popular politician when she was in that position as well. You Clinton apologist would never agree with this thread anyway.lol But to everyone else, what Clinton is doing is obvious, because many of us watched while he did the same exact thing to his wife. I'm sure Obama and Axelrod have already contacted him and may even fire him as a surrogate. Like I said in another thread, Bill Clinton is only a good campaigner for himself, not so much anyone else including his wife. And that speaks volumes.

[leftynyc]

41. Yeah - I'm sure it's just the people

on DU that have the savvy and smarts to figure out something so ridiculous. Anyone you disagree with is an "apologist", anyone who strays from your purist reservation is the enemy. It's why this board is not taken seriously by either side. So take your "everyone else knows" nonsense and live in your fantasy world. I couldn't possibly care less.

[Happydayz]

57. Oh, you care alright

Because had President Obama made these same "mistakes" as you call them, I'm sure there would be 10 or so threads bashing him about it. Again, if Clinton sabotaged his own wife's campaign, want makes you think he wouldn't try to do the same to Obama? Clinton, knows that no one takes a 1 term president seriously. And will do anything to remain the only 2 term democrat president we've had in decades. This is the cold hard truth that many Clintonites don't want to acknowledge. They don't want to see their hero in a bad light, but the media knows, DU knows and rethugs as well. Like I said before, its sad to see one democrat try to sabotage another so blatantly. Especially, with this election being so important, with rethug obstructionist everywhere.

[leftynyc]

59. Nonsense - that is all I have to say about that (n/t)

[Liberal_Stalwart71]

38. Clinton is the most popular politician in the country because he is good at selling himself...

when it benefits him! When he has to work on others' behalf for their campaigns, he sucks. He did the same to Kerry as he did to Hillary and now Obama. All of the sudden, he misspeaks! He never seem to misspeak when he was campaigning for himself.

I'll tell you why: because Bill Clinton cares about one thing: BILL CLINTON!!!

[leftynyc]

42. And if he wasn't out there shilling

for others, people would be complaining about that. The very second someone has an opinion of their own, they're the enemy. If the President (who I will enthusiastically be voting for) is so fragile that others cannot share their own opinion, we're in real trouble.

[Liberal_Stalwart71]

44. Well, if he essentially agrees with Republicans--which you have apparently given him a pass for

--then he shouldn't call himself a surrogate for the Obama team.

This is amazing to me. This guy does all these Republicans things: chatting it up with Paul Ryan and getting caught; being the "other son" of George and Barbara Bush; calling Mitt Romney's tenure at Bain "stellar," and now quipping that we should extend the life of the Bush tax cuts, even for the wealthy?

Come one, leftynyc. Please be honest. If this were Barack Obama you would lose your mind, but it's Bill Clinton, so he gets a pass? Why? Please be honest.

[leftynyc]

49. No - I wouldn't lose my mind at all

I've been following politics way too long to let a politician get to me. They all make deals. If it gets the issue off the table when other things are so important, I'm good with that. I'm far more concerned with the pubs war on women than I am about tax cuts. Far, far more concerned.

[Liberal_Stalwart71]

51. I have followed and been very active in politics my entire life, too! These are NOT mistakes!

They are deliberate!

[leftynyc]

54. And that's where you lose me

You're talking about a President who put two liberal - very liberal - judges on the supreme court. You'll never get me to believe he's trying to undercut Democrats.

[Liberal_Stalwart71]

56. You admitted upthread that he stated his opinion. Either it's an opinion or a mistake.

Make up your mind.

[bvar22]

34. Please have a little compassion for the Old Dog.

He is desperately trying to hang on to his undisputed title of The Best Republican President EVER!
His comments about extending Tax Breaks for the Wealthy should give him a little boost in this area.
Its not much fun being 2nd Best.
Nobody Thrill F**ks 2nd Place.



You will know them by their WORKS,
not by their excuses.
[font size=5 color=green]Solidarity99![/font][font size=2 color=green]
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[greymattermom]

43. old dog????

Bill Clinton born Aug 19, 1946.
Mitt Romney born March 12, 1947.


Six month age difference.

[Liberal_Stalwart71]

45. Thank you! You are absolutely on point! And at least you're consistent...

You call out Barack Obama when he's wrong and acting like a Republican. And you're doing the same when it comes to Bill Clinton. Kudos to you!!

[center rising]

39. If Clinton wanted to sabotage Obama

He would have done so in 2008!!! What a joke!!!!

[Liberal_Stalwart71]

46. He tried...and failed! You didn't have a problem with him going on Faux News,

appearing with Rush Limbaugh? That's not an issue for you? Hanging out with the Bushes as their "other son?" That doesn't bother you. But I bet you that if this were Barack Obama, you'd lose your freakin' minds!

[Beacool]

64. He didn't try to sabotage Obama.

His wife was running against Obama and he thought that she was a far better choice for president than a rookie senator with barely 2 years of service under his belt. Then again, so did millions of people.

[Liberal_Stalwart71]

68. Hi Beacool!

Your response is expected.

[Beacool]

69. And so are yours, my friend.

[Liberal_Stalwart71]

70. We argue and don't agree but we're still on the same team.

[Douglas Carpenter]

40. NO, he actually believes that tax cuts should be extended temprarily even for the wealthiest. That

would be consistent with his general philosophy.

[Liberal_Stalwart71]

47. And inconsistent with Barack Obama. And if they can't get on the same page, him being

Obama's surrogate, then I think Bill should no long be an Obama surrogate. This is a key plank in the Democratic Party platform. A KEY PLANK! If Bill Clinton isn't onboard with a KEY PLANK, then he shouldn't be a Democrat anymore. Maybe we should just accept that he really wants to hold hands with Paul Ryan because it appears that he agrees with him, hence the Republican Party!

[leftynyc]

50. What other KEY PLANK items

are you willing to throw Democrats (who, according to you, have no right to call themselves Democrats) over for. Is the fact I don't hate guns on that list?

[Liberal_Stalwart71]

52. Wait just one minute: If the Democratic Party has a fundamental philosophy that tax cuts for

the wealthy DO NOT improve the economy, but Bill Clinton believes that we SHOULD extend ALL tax cuts, even for the wealthy, then there's a disconnect here. Bill Clinton's philosophy is therefore NOT aligned with the Democratic Party; it is aligned with the Republican Party.

Can you not see that?

[leftynyc]

53. He has stated that he thinks

the issue is not worth spending months fighting about. I agree with him on that. You're talking about keeping "pure" and he's talking about what it takes to govern - two entirely different arguments.

[Liberal_Stalwart71]

55. I'm not talking about "keeping pure" at all. I'm talking about a central Democratic Party

philosophy about taxes. Yes, he stated what he thought, and that's fine. But that opinion doesn't align with basic Democratic Party principles, no?

[leftynyc]

58. I'm not even sure what the Democrats

think about taxes anymore. Is there something in the platform about it? Other than a few fringe people that think a flat tax is fair (liars), I think everyone is one the same page about progressive taxation. And I'm good with that as long as they get rid of the loopholes -that's what's killing the tax code. That someone like Romney can pay an effective tax rate that is 1/2 of what I pay is absurd.

[Liberal_Stalwart71]

62. You're being willfully ignorant. You know exactly what I'm talking about, lefty.

You know what? Forget it. I give up.

We'll agree to disagree on this one and leave it at that.

Have a nice day.

[leftynyc]

65. I really don't

I don't think I've ever read the platform but if you wish to call me a liar or ignorant, that's your choice.

[yellowcanine]

48. No.

[Beacool]

60. Clinton can say whatever the hell he wants to say.

Besides, if Obama didn't think that he needed his help he wouldn't have asked him to campaign for him. Bill and Hillary are the most popular politicians in the country, any Democrat would be happy to have them campaign for them.

Too much manufactured drama.

[MjolnirTime]

67. Bill knows better than anyone that everything he says can and will be misinterpreted.

He knows this, yet he stills runs off at the mouth.

He's either stupid, which I don't buy, or an extremely loose cannon.

Popularity doesn't equal quality, does it?

[AtomicKitten]

61. Call it what you will, he's undermining the Obama campaign message.

"We should embrace the Keystone Pipeline"

"I have no problem with extending the Bush tax cuts temporarily"

"Gov. Rmoney has a sterling business career ... doing good work at Bain"

[JTFrog]

63. +1 n/t

[DCKit]

66. Bill Clinton is DLC, 1%er all the way.

He'll make (and keep) his money no matter which party controls the WH and Congress.

Our problem is not (R)s vs. (D)s, it's the fact that there's really no difference.