HRC takes a position! Agrees with Jeb Bush!

[Divernan]

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2015/07/07/hillary-clinton-puerto-rico_n_7742468.html

Hillary Clinton Says Puerto Rico Should Have Access To U.S. Bankruptcy Laws

IOWA CITY, IOWA, July 7 (Reuters) - U.S. Democratic presidential candidate Hillary Clinton said Tuesday that Puerto Rico's public entities should be able to use U.S. bankruptcy laws to restructure some $72 billion in debt.

The White House said last week that there is "no one in the administration" that is "contemplating a federal bailout of Puerto Rico" but that the U.S. Congress should "take a look at" whether Puerto Rico's government-owned corporations should be able to access Chapter 9 bankruptcy protection.

Congressional Republicans largely oppose such a step but Republican presidential candidate Jeb Bush said in April that he thinks Puerto Rico's public agencies should have the ability to use U.S. bankruptcy laws.

Why her sudden concern for Puerto Rico, & changing the U.S. bankruptcy laws, you may ask. I mean if we're going to restructure the bankruptcy laws, the first place to start is to allow student loan debts to be included in bankruptcy proceedings. But Puerto Rico's govt. corporate debt-what's up with that? It's simple, campers! Convention delegates!

Voters in Puerto Rico and other U.S. territories are not permitted to vote in the presidential election under the provisions set forth in the Electoral College. But that doesn't mean they don't have a say in who gets to the White House.

That's because voters in Puerto Rico, the Virgin Islands, Guam and American Samoa are permitted to participate in the presidential primary and are granted delegates by the two major political parties.

In other words, Puerto Rico & other U.S. territories get to help nominate the presidential candidates. But voters there cannot actually participate in the election because of the Electoral College system.

The national Democratic Party's charter, enacted in 1974, states that Puerto Rico "shall be treated as a state containing the appropriate number of Congressional Districts." The Republican Party also allows voters in Puerto Rico and other U.S. territories to participate in the nomination process.

In the 2008 Democratic presidential primary, Puerto Rico had 55 delegates - more than Hawaii, Kentucky, Maine, Mississippi, Montana, Oregon, Rhode Island, South Dakota, Vermont, Washington, D.C., West Virginia, Wyoming and several other states with populations lesser than the U.S. territory's 4 million.

Four Democratic delegates went to Guam, 3 went to the Virgin Islands and American Samoa each.

In the Republican presidential primary of 2008, Puerto Rico had 20 delegates, and Guam, American Samoa and the Virgin Islands each had 6.

http://usgovinfo.about.com/od/thepresidentandcabinet/a/Puerto-Rico-And-The-Presidential-Election.htm

Participation in Puerto Rico's delegate selection process is open those who wish to participate as Democrats. Participants may not take part in any other party's Presidential Nominating process. Individuals who wish to participate in the Senate District Caucuses must register with the State Party by 5? June 2016.

Sunday 13 March 2016 (presumably): 51 of 58 delegates to the Democratic National Convention are pledged to presidential contenders based on the results of today's Senate District Caucuses. A mandatory 15 percent threshold is required in order for a presidential contender to be pledged National Convention delegates at either the senatorial district or islandwide level.

33 district delegates are proportionally pledged to presidential contenders by senatorial district (Puerto Rico has no congressional districts).
In addition, 11 at-large and 7 Pledged PLEOs delegates are pledged to presidential contenders based on the presidential preferences of the 33 district level delegates as pledged by the Senate District Caucuses. Hence, the National Convention District delegates are pledged from the preferences expressed at the Caucuses while the National Convention statewide delegates are pledged using the preferences of the National Convention District delegates.
11 at-large National Convention delegates
7 Pledged PLEOs

http://www.thegreenpapers.com/P16/PR-D

[Darb]

1. I happen to agree with that position too. What's your point, besides

a cheap shot via a deceptive post title?

[Divernan]

2. The thread title is absolutely true; I'm just reportin' the facts.

I think it's a very interesting campaign development. I didn't realize the U.S. Territories had voting power at the national conventions. And what's cheap about it? Don't HRC's supporters say she can work with a Republican congress?

[Human101948]

27. If it helps us get the White House, I'm for it!

Can you imagine if Republicans get the White House in 2016? All of America will become Wisconsin on steroids!

But right now, this is probably the only approach to the PR situation that will fly. We can't be suggesting that the debt be wiped off the books. Too many investors will be "take a haircut" in that scenario. And that includes pension funds and small investors who wanted the tax free income for retirement.

Better to reinstate all those corporate tax breaks for manufacturing in PR and have the corporations flocking to the sunny island to scoop up profits and provide some much needed jobs for the people there.

[Sheepshank]

33. Given her past voting recrods, she would have voted the same way regardless of her campaign. n/t

[NCTraveler]

3. Oh how easy this could have been done with out ever mentioning Jeb.

But you gotta build cred. I say good on Hillary. What part of her position here are you disagreeing with?

[Divernan]

4. My link didn't disagree at all; just presented lots of facts.

Oh, but I did point out that if she's interested in reforming the bankruptcy laws, and restructuring debts, the place to start would be with student loan debt. But WAIT! Her Wall Street/Big Bank donors would HATE that! They make a shitload of money over those obscenely high rates of interest on student loan debts. Oh well. ssssshhh! We just won't talk about that, right?

[NCTraveler]

7. Interesting that you want to divert away from your own topic.

What part of her position here do you disagree with? Not simply I want more. Of her stated position here, what point do you stand in opposition to?

[Deny and Shred]

19. Totally agree with the Jeb linkage

The article is trying to score a cheap jab with that comparison. It could just as easily say HRC disagrees with all but one of the GOP field.

That said, the article goes on to the more salient point IMO. If bankruptcy laws are to be examined and changed, why did HRC exclude student loan debt and only mention Puerto Rico? That does sound like an attempt at political points with voters in PR, that is unless she is fine with the current state of student loan debt.

Quite a bit has been made about the scant attention to some topics in the speeches by Bernie. Ought not the same microscope be used on exclusions by Hillary Clinton?

[NCTraveler]

21. Yes.

"Quite a bit has been made about the scant attention to some topics in the speeches by Bernie. Ought not the same microscope be used on exclusions by Hillary Clinton? " It should be. No positive conversation will come from a dishonest op like this. We should be having this conversation. The op doesn't want to. Please look and see I directly asked the op questions about Hillarys position. They did not want to answer. It is worthy of a conversation. The op is worthy of scorn.

The op truly stated that they report, you decide. They said this after they entered their shady opinion into the op itself. Seriously. They report, you decide.

[FSogol]

5. You don't think PR should be allowed to restructure their debt?

Your concern for the island as opposed to trying to score cheap political points is touching.

[Divernan]

6. Please don't lie about my OP. I never said any such thing, as you well know.

[NCTraveler]

8. Perfect reply. Couldn't have locked it in anymore.

You agree with Jeb.

[Divernan]

10. I don't have a position; just reported an interesting development.

Now HRC, on the other hand, does - according to this article - agree with Jeb. If you have a problem with that, please elucidate.

[FSogol]

11. HRC (and Jeb, I guess) want to allow PR to restructure their loans. Why are you against that?

[Divernan]

15. Nope. Never said I was against it, as you well know.

[NCTraveler]

12. Divernan reports, you decide.

"I don't have a position; just reported an interesting development."

Truly identical meaning in phrases.

It's also not very hard to take a position here. I understand that under the fair and balanced mantra you aren't able to come op with an opinion, just reporting. lol. One of the best laughs I have had this week. Thanks.

[Divernan]

16. Reuters reported this story, as per my link

[NCTraveler]

17. "I don't have a position; just reported an interesting development."

By way of meaning, that is exactly "we report, you decide." Even after adding your own spiffy commentary and acting like you didn't. Transparent.

[FSogol]

18. Did they add exclamation points after Hillary and Jeb like you did?

[hrmjustin]

14. If you were just reporting a development you would have used the title of the article.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

20. Jeb would probably say we shouldn't relieve ourselves in public.

Would you disagree with him?

[BainsBane]

9. My number one take away from the primary season

Is how little issues matter compared to advancing one's candidate. This is a prime example.

[hrmjustin]

13. Your dig at Hillary is transparent.

You coukd have used the title of the article but you wanted to dig.

[JaneyVee]

22. Bernie takes a position! Agrees with NRA!

http://www.politicususa.com/2015/07/07/surprise-hillary-clinton-left-senator-bernie-sanders.html

[hrmjustin]

24. Well done!

[FSogol]

29. Kudos on the exclamation points! Well done!

[ismnotwasm]

30. Heh.

That's pretty funny.

[Fred Sanders]

23. I will give the OP some credit: at least someone is attempting to throw a veil over the open distortions.

But the veil - see headline- is gossamer-thin as to intent, nevertheless.

Even the things every liberal agrees on can be turned around with an ad hominem fallacy.

Or is it a false equivalence fallacy?


"False equivalence is a logical fallacy which describes a situation where there is a logical and apparent equivalence, but when in fact there is none. This fallacy is categorized as a fallacy of inconsistency. It would be the antonym of the mathematical concept of material equivalence."

[FSogol]

32. Bernie Sanders and Jeb Bush matriculated! With Coeds!

[NCTraveler]

25. Supporters of no candidate here will fall for this attack from the right.

Proof is in the comments. Good job du supporters of all candidates.

Guilt by association even though I like what she says. I find this so amusing. You have halved wits with yourself.

I report, you decide. That's something I thought I would never hear someone spout on du.

[PoliticAverse]

26. So if they go bankrupt do the "public entities" get turned over to the bondholders and privatized?

[Kingofalldems]

28. Looks like a big fail from here.

Most people agree with Hillary on this one. Try again.

[NCTraveler]

31. Kick for exposure. nt.

[RandySF]

34. Isn't PR a U.S. Territory?

[RandySF]

35. I believe the sun rises in the East

Look! I agreed with Jeb!