I guess I’m an Obama apologist...

[busterbrown]

Last edited Tue Jun 11, 2013, 02:31 AM - Edit history (1)

The truth is that I’m not scared shitless of tech. info. being collected from my cell phone because of the fact, that I have made 6 phone calls to Nigeria over the past week..

What does scares me shitless, is waking up the morning after the 2016 election and finding Pres. Elect Christi thanking his staff so much for their hard work as well the House, Senate and Supreme Court solidly in Republican/teabagger hands.. Now that would scare the fuck out of me...

Obamacare being repealed is a possibility and millions including me who are now beginning to experience relief from AHCA (Medicare Dollars) now have some hope of avoiding a medical financial disaster...That is a big deal...

I’m at war with these shits and as the Magistrate states, "I’m not giving them an inch”..

[BrotherIvan]

1. Move along, nothing to see here.

[busterbrown]

2. Thats all you got?

Back to U Tube.....

[Dragonfli]

5. When something scares the shit out of you, I suppose the only answer

is to genuflect and offer ones liberties and rights as a sacrifice to the God of fear in the hopes such humility and loss of rights will ensure the evil ones don't win an election.

What giving up liberty to fear has to do with winning an election I find hard to decipher, but if we must, just leave that one where I don't have to house and feed troops on a permanent basis, my apartment is too small. The other Amendments? Meh, the party requires a sacrifice to defeat the evil ones and I am a good and loyal partisan so I agree to wear the chains lightly.

[BrotherIvan]

7. But when our side looks so much like their side

Why do they care who wins?

[Spitfire of ATJ]

10. Actually, when something scares the shit out of you the best thing to do,..

...is look back to see just how full of shit you were.

[MannyGoldstein]

3. Indeed... we mustn't give Christy an inch

http://m.csmonitor.com/USA/DC-Decoder/2013/0528/Obama-Christie-bromance-Part-2-A-win-win-for-both

[busterbrown]

4. Yup!!

If you don’t think for a minute Teabaggers, Republicans, Moderate Republicans, Extremists, Libertarians, Racists, Fundamentalist, Corporations, Wall Street and Banks will not surround Christi and give him every ounce they collectively have to defeat the dem. nominee...then you’re living on another planet..

[MannyGoldstein]

6. Obama and Christy make such a cute couple.

Remind me of Laurel and Hardy.

[busterbrown]

8. That love affair will be used to show how Christi

is so willing to compromise even with his political enemies. The New Republican Leadership...
That will last for about 2 hrs. after he is sworn in..

[MannyGoldstein]

9. Good thing Obama's not helping Christy

We can all learn from this example.

[busterbrown]

11. Obama is Obama...

A Centrist who has been certainly less than expected...
But every time we smack him down. It gives our perspective nominee another step to overcome...

Elizabeth Warren (hopefully) shouldn’t have to back track to answer questions and defend his
administration.... We don’t need that....like we don’t need Hillary...

[Parable Arable]

12. Rather than having one Elizabeth Warren as president.

I'd rather have 100 men/women like her in the senate....

Though I agree, I'm averse to Hillary getting the nomination, and I'll gladly support Warren, unless Feingold or Grayson decides to run.

[busterbrown]

13. In my opinion Warren stands alone as Democrat who

calls bullshit...bullshit no matter who she is talking to.. She is clear, concise and doesn’t fumble and stumble when confronting a political enemy. She doesn’t mince words and emotions when grilling an opponent at Senate Hearings and is not fearful of the political attacks which might come at her at the end of the day...

Besides Bernie Sanders, Allan Grayson and Henry Waxman the dems have no heavyweights!!
I have been embarrassed by them for years, just waiting for one. just one Elizabeth Warren who will step up and lead our week herd.....

[Parable Arable]

14. Well, Sheldon Whiteouse has my respect.....

He's one of my favorites... Sherrod Brown as well. As does Raul Grijalva.

As for myself, I'll just wait for the Democratic field to play itself out. I don't expect any single liberal to come along and fix this party, but having a figure like Warren vaulted to center stage would be a startt, even if she doesn't win the nomination.

[busterbrown]

17. Yea, Sheldon is o.k. and I also like Steve Lynch..

Sherrod is good, ideas are great but he fumbles frequently..... Fucking assholes Hatch, Simpson, Graham, and several other Repubs. are all examples of 200 yrd rushers... They are relentless..
Just my opinion...

[Parable Arable]

18. The biggest assholes in congress, if you ask me....

Are guys like Cruz, Gohmert, Rubio and McConnell... They actively spread misinformation, undermine development, and degrade the level of discourse to the point that everything becomes a pissing contest.

I may abhore Republican ideals, but I'd rather that debates are conducted in a civil manner rather than having them be a manner of who screams louder.

[busterbrown]

21. yea but the guys I mentioned aren’t like the Rethugs you mentioned.

your mentions are just bat shit ...Graham, Hatch and Simpson are all examples of respected thugs
who don’t just rant and lie continuously . They slip in some truths (Gish Gallop) and lie the rest of the time...Thats why I like Warren so much, she remains civil all day long..

[MADem]

32. She will disappoint everyone who praises her because they think they know her.

They like her stance on ONE issue, Wall Street, and they think they know her.

She used to be a Republican. She's not Kucinich in female form.

She's my Senator, and I think she's just fine, but I know that people here who are praising her to the skies would be beating the shit out of her should she ever hit the White House--though I don't see that as a near-term option (and she, like us all, isn't getting any younger).

[Rowdyboy]

55. People tend to project views on certain politicians. Todays funniest for me is the outrage over

Senator Franken's condemnation of Edward Snowden. How DARE that damn DINO express an opinion that goes against the current sentiment on DU?

I truly wish I had a senator as good as Warren (I live in Mississippi ) but she isn't the reincarnation of Ted Kennedy that many here believe her to be.
It's similar in many ways to the adulation people here expressed for Obama in 2008. If you paid attention, it was obvious that he was a moderate with a lot of conservative leanings but here he was the savior of progressivism. I like the president and I'm not disappointed in him because I knew what to expect.

[MADem]

56. It's pure craziness. The Snowden fans aren't getting that his cheering squad is NOT

falling along party lines. It's not "All the super liberals, the 'true' progressives, think Snowden is grand." In fact, he has a huge fan base over at Faux Snooze (no wonder Murdoch's Hong Kong paper got the latest scoop) and at the CATO Institute (where Glenn Greenwald took a paycheck for a year or so). Hardly super liberal or true progressives, those guys!

Warren voted for Reagan--I can "get over" that, people do evolve. But she's of an age and stage and collection of experiences that she is likely never to be as liberal as Ted--she never had the freedom from worrying about how the bills were going to get paid that Ted had, and that kind of experience does shape one's views. People who are very rich and very poor are often the most compassionate; it's that muddy middle, where taxpayers get squeezed, that sometimes hardens people about some (often unrelated) issues.


Your point about POTUS was spot on. I was on the HRC team during the primaries, but hey, I'm not stupid--I jumped on the Obama bandwagon because Palin a heartbeat from the Presidency was as scary as John "Never met a war I didn't like" McCain with his tired old finger on the button.


I've been lucky in that I come from a state where Democrats hold sway (except we sometimes pick GOP governors just to play like we're into bipartisanship, or to make sure the Dem-dominated legislature doesn't get TOO secure in themselves--it helps that the MA governor is a very WEAK executive, they can't do anything without the legislative branch); I realize some people aren't so lucky (like you, poor YOU!) and I do feel for them. Of course, we did go through that Nightmare That Was Scott Brown, and now we're fighting to send Markey to the Senate and not a phony non-war-hero (spent his career defending Saint Kitts) on the GOP side (special election for Kerry's seat).

I think Franken's got some fine credentials, and the fact that he is coming down against Snowden suggests to me that first, he understands the issues surrounding the material that was released, and second, he took the doggone intelligence briefs that were provided to members of Congress--what a guy! He did his j-o-b!

[Bluenorthwest]

38. Wyden, Merkley....

They both make Waxman look like a startled model from an 1890's tonsorial examples book. Henry's fine, but this routine of claiming others don't exist gets boring as a tactic. Boring

[cali]

48. oh please. Pat Leahy, Barbara Boxer, Sheldon Whitehouse

and they aren't the only ones.

[calimary]

16. Welcome to DU, Parable Arable!

Glad you're here! I love Elizabeth Warren! She's made me proud!

[VanillaRhapsody]

51. Lest you forget...Joe Biden gets first crack at it...

While I think the chances of that happening is pretty low....people always seem to dismiss him as even a contender when he has automatic "poll position" that alone is nothing to sneeze at.

[Doctor_J]

49. You're blaming the messenger

The problem is not people complaining about Obama being friendlier with Repukes than with Dems. The problems is Obama being friendlier with Repukes than with Dems. the 2016 nominee is going to have to overcome complete failure at dealing with right-wingers.

[1StrongBlackMan]

44. Yeah …

President Obama should strive to be just as intractable as the gop has demonstrated … that’ll surely attract that cohort of independent voters and republicans that value governance over rigid ideology, needed to flip the House. Right?

[Whisp]

54. That's pretty low, to use the misery of the hurricane to puff up your Obama hate. n/t

[calimary]

15. That concerns me as well. One thing that's struck me in this whole affair is

that people on CNN and elsewhere sure are going apeshit over the Guardian.

WHERE THE FUCK WERE THEY IN 2002 and 2003???? The Guardian was all over the lies about the run-up to the Iraq War. They had it all. That paper was pretty much the only mainstream news outlet throughout that published the truth about what bush/cheney was up to. THEY had the voices and sources and quotes and interviews with people who brought up the OTHER side than what we were getting here in the US, being force-fed that drum-beat for war, with the "9-11," "9-11," "9-11" and "WMD!" "WMD!" WMD!" mantras being jammed up our asses every damn day. They actually covered the opposing view, thoroughly and richly, and gave it many a column inch. Continuing after 2003, too. The Guardian kept up the coverage throughout. It was the ONE place where you could reliably go to get to the bottom of what was going on, because the Guardian was talking to the people who were muzzled, ignored, frozen out, or demonized, and giving them full attention, exposure, and the legitimacy their views deserved.

There was almost none of that anywhere here - except for the low-profile and much-ignored McClatchy papers, the alternative press, and of course on sites like this one. None of the majors. Shit, people got fired for trying to report on coffins coming home from the Iraq War, or even take photos. It was years before one shot of multiple flag-draped coffins loaded inside some transport plane actually made it to print on a mass public scale. It was like the details of actual warfare were taboo and not to be spoken. Here and there you'd hear about some reporter getting sidelined or even fired for trying to cover the opposition to the war. Highest-profile case, I think - Phil Donahue was fired by MSNBC no less, because he was a lone voice against our invading Iraq, and oh gracious me, we certainly couldn't have that on the air now, could we?! Typical panels discussing Iraq on cable news would consist of a republi-CON representative or senator, a conservative columnist, a reporter or critic with a known conservative slant, and Donna Brazile: one of the most infuriating milquetoasts I'd ever screeched at when she was making yet another anemic "defense" of Democrats or conceding how wrong the Democratic/liberal/progressive take on things was. NO ONE paid any attention to what the Guardian was reporting, day after day, as it proved there was VERY much indeed another side to consider besides the non-stop war-cheerleading from every media .

But man, on this story, the Guardian is being referenced or quoted seemingly every minute on the minute. Almost as though somebody woke up somewhere in some back news office a couple of weeks ago and realized there was this news outlet in the UK called the Guardian that was reporting all kinds of stuff worth noticing.

[busterbrown]

19. Thanks for that..

You sure know how to hit on points effectively.. I certainly can’t do it as well as you can...
But my one question to you is...Why are so many on DU are trying to build on and support this story.

I swear to Christ most of them sound like Libertarians... All govt. is evil and not to be trusted..
All I know is that I don’t have the slightest doubt that Republicans if end up controlling the three branches of govt., will take this way the fuck up to the next level..

[calimary]

41. Unfortunate but true. There are WAY too many problems that come with a GOP presidency.

Last edited Wed Jun 12, 2013, 12:18 AM - Edit history (2)

WAY too many!
- How 'bout the Supreme Court nominations that will come, and who will retire to create those openings in the first place, one of ours or one of theirs?
- How 'bout the appointees and nominees that will come, and the mindset that would take over? Surely you don't want to see the PNAC having The Big Access again, do you? They were all over the romney campaign in the foreign policy department. These same wannabe warriors are in mid-life or later, and never served when they were younger and had a chance to go to Vietnam or maybe Desert Storm, so they have no concept about the real costs of war. They want to lead the way in a great crusade, from the safety of their well-appointed offices, of course. When a Dem is in the White House, their access becomes more difficult, because the Democratic world view is a lot less welcoming to these wild and totally failing notions of the imposition of an American Empire upon the world. It's the republi-CONS who are into that juvenile, unrealistic, self-absorbed shit. Dems not so much, and when they're in power, the PNAC is not exactly in with that in-crowd.
- How 'bout the "advisors" who'd come in with a republi-CON president? Consider: who are their campaign chieftains, their head fund-raisers, their debate coaches and sparring partners, their activist business pals, their big-ass donors who all see this as an investment. ALL THOSE PEOPLE would come flooding in with their pal, the GOP president.
- How 'bout energy policy? We'd have NO hope whatsoever of combatting Keystone XL, protecting the ecosystem, developing and promoting sustainable energy sources, or cracking down on polluters, dumpers, manufacturers of toxins and toxic byproducts, and more. All the polluters would be given free passes to the Fast-Track lane because their pal who also hates regulations just grabbed the ultimate brass ring.
- How 'bout civil liberties. Okay there is shit going on, on Obama's watch. But it started and came to full flower under bush/cheney, and they never bothered getting warrants.
- How 'bout other civil liberties? Do you think for one minute any kind of worker protections, women's rights, voting rights, marriage equality, reproductive freedom, consumer protections, universal health care coverage, immigration issues, gun safety issues, issues involving the poor and homeless and elderly, the addressing of climate change, or any number of other issues that we care about - would figure anywhere in a republi-CON adminstration's agenda? Anywhere at all? How 'bout all those Congressional panels discussing women's reproductive rights or violence against women, and all the panelists are male? At least when the Dems get in, those things do go onto the "to do" list. Those are issues Dems talk about and are far more likely to try to accomplish things. Back it up from Election Night and consider the dramatically differing manifestos and mission statements of the party platforms of the Dems and the GOP. Look at all the planks in those platforms. THAT is the mindset that would come in with the winning ticket, and which would govern all decisions and policy directives. Which do YOU prefer?
- How 'bout the kinds of visitors they have, the kinds of events they attend and who they hang with? In other words, just who is getting regular and friendly access to the Oval Office & Co.? Who is it who's whispering in the ear of the (GOP) president? reagan's so-called "Kitchen Cabinet" exerted tremendous under-the-radar influence over his presidency. The members included a number of industrialists and California business tycoons. They were neither formally appointed as advisors nor nominated for Senate approval, so there was no accountability whatsoever. They operated in the shadows, out of public view and indifferent to public opinion. Is it gonna be another "Millionaires on Parade" as reagan's years were nicknamed? Exclusively the 1%, invitation-only, thank you? Just the have's and the have-more's?
- And you know there's more.

You're actually electing a mindset. How they lean, what they believe, where they stand, and all their like-minded friends, benefactors, associates, and advisors.

I'm gonna stay with the Democrats for awhile. There really isn't another option - any genuinely realistic one, that is.

[LeftInTX]

45. I agree with you!!

[SoapBox]

20. I agree 100%

[tofuandbeer]

22. DU is starting to sound like CommonDreams.org

[busterbrown]

23. Thank God..

I thought I was the only one who felt this way...It’s almost as tough they are very clever trolls..
Now I know that ain’t true, but God the way they have been so supportive of this story has given me great concern...Why the fuck are they giving republicans a leg up on the elections..
Even Chris Hayes stated that it would be a great tactic ( even though its bullshit) to use in the campaigns.. I was pissed at Hayes for simply reinforcing the fact that it would be a good tactic!!

[ReRe]

27. That's a good thing ;-) n/t

[boilerbabe]

47. hallelujah! you make it sound like that is a bad thing.

which would you prefer, The New Republic(an)?

[JDPriestly]

24. I think a lot of DUers are simply going through the stages of

grief.

The first is denial, then anger, then bargaining, then depression, then acceptance.

A lot of DUers are expressing anger at people who are already at the acceptance stage. Face it. We don't know all the facts yet. But this scandal is going to skip.

In fact, we who support Obama should not be so upset. I think he will handle this well. All he has to do is to narrow the program so that it affects only those who are reasonably likely to be involved in terrorism and it will be legal, and he will be viewed as a wise leader, a hero.

[Bluenorthwest]

40. I agree with you, I think there is no reason to think this debate will harm Obama.

In fact, I think this is the sort of thing that usually makes him look good, he's one of the few political figures capable of discussing complicated issues well. Obviously if we face threats our responses have to be constantly inspected and revised, measured for results, discarded when ineffective. It has to be seen as our responsibility as a society, not something we hire a service to do while we pretend nothing is going on.

[JoeyT]

25. Everything isn't about Obama.

I realize some people need to make him the center of the universe, but he's really not.

This is way bigger than him. Every concession on rights is followed immediately by a demand for another concession.

[busterbrown]

26. I’ll ask you as well..

Since Friday afternoon this site has been filled with fanatical Threads pinning the blame of this old story squarely on the Obama Administration...I mean they have been relentless in their accusations and seem to be enjoying this piling on shit..

I thought my thread tonight was gonna light a huge posse roundup resulting in another Ox-bow like
attack on me.. Where are they... In bed??

I hope this thread lasts until the a.m. I wanna drink coffee and fight all day..

[Amonester]

30. All things must pass.

And this newest outrage fest will pass too, like all the others before.

There is not a tiny chance of these programs ever go away.

Better face reality.

Imagine this obstructionist CONgRe$$: "This Democrat President is Weak.On.Terra" if he would manage to srap them...

All things must pass.

[JoeyT]

36. They're blaming Obama for using it.

Blame for making it lies solely on the asshats that wrote the laws and Bush for setting the precedent. Some of the blame for using it falls to them too. Blame for being willing to accept programs like this fall on all of us.

[ReRe]

28. "Every concession on rights is followed immediately....

.... by a demand for another concession." Every. Single. Time.

[Prospectum_Quaero]

29. Sorry to hear about your high medical expenses, but you have considered that Socialized medicine...

Socialized medicine is not the best system.

Particularly as it will be approached in the U.S, since it will be effectively the case that the government is not creating a Universal Healthcare System administered by the Government, but is simply providing subsidies and allowing the handful of Insurance Companies to offer healthcare benefits in whatever manner they see fit.

Look, if you're going to offer healthcare to everyone, either have completely Government run healthcare, or, allow for real competition in the medical insurance field by removing all the regulations and red tape that entrepeneurial insurance companies could provide, rather than the mafia effectively created by the handful of companies currently available.

Ok. I will admit it. I'm a Libertarian, but I'm also a Humanist. I also think Democracy has value. So too does Communism.

Sorry my friends. No easy labels here.

Ultimately, as I said earlier, I'm glad that you will find some relief in your medical expenses now.
That's great.
We still have to have our eye on the prize of a genuinely sustainable system.
I think pure capitalism is that system, but, hey I'm thinking it out.
That's being human.

[bowens43]

31. Yes, you are an apologist. This 'our guy isn't as bad as their guy' bullshit doesn't fly anymore.

what scares me shitless is posts like yours.

[Liberal_Stalwart71]

35. How do you feel about FDR?

[Hippo_Tron]

53. I feel that if I had been around in the 30's and 40's

It would have been wise and prudent for me to criticize his court packing, his internment of the Japanese, and his inaction on civil rights. It would've also been wise and prudent to praise his economic policies and general handling of World War II.

[busterbrown]

39. Well compare and you tell me...

Last edited Tue Jun 11, 2013, 09:26 PM - Edit history (1)

Romney, Paul Ryan.....Obama, Joe Biden....You tell me it doesn’t fly...

One Party wants to take control of a Woman’s Anatomy?.......Bullshit?
One Party wants to destroy Medicare and Social Security.......Bullshit?
One Party is absolutely filled with Racists and xenophobic s and homophobic.....BullShit?
One Party wants absolutely no path to citizenship for Children of immigrants.....Bullshit?
One Party denies the existence of Climate Change.................Bullshit?
One Party is for privatization of every asset owned by the people....Bullshit?
One Party wants to completely destroy Unions and basically has......Bullshit?

And your posting, This “our guy isn’t as bad as their guy bullshit doesn’t fly anymore?”

Now thats just crap!!

How many Libertarians are rolling around in D.U. anyway?

[calimary]

42. Totally. Boils it down perfectly.

It's what I felt when I saw those photos of Medea Benjamin and friends posting with handmade valentines for rand paul.

rand frickin' paul??????? Are they frickin' NUTS??????

Do they seriously believe that they'd have a seat at rand paul's table if he, God forbid, ever gets into the White House? Would they ever even get to see the table, much less be invited to sit as equal members? If they're even half-serious, then they're as sadly deluded as the Pox Noise audience.

[66 dmhlt]

33. You get an "AMEN!" from me

[DFW]

34. I think you'll find that the extremist right has no monopoly on "my way or the highway."

Supporters of the far right cheered when their side tried to steamroll over us, no matter the collateral damage.

Some on our side will never cheer until we do the same to them, no matter the collateral damage.

[savalez]

37. Uh oh, be careful you don't FRIGHTEN a DUer with this.

You know how sensitive some are. I mean this could possibly be deemed the MOST FRIGHTENING post on DU today.

[1StrongBlackMan]

43. While not scaring me …

I will be highly disappointed come January 2014, when watching the House remain firmly in control of the modern gop because some democrats/progressives/liberals couldn’t see the net advantage of fighting for the principle of freedom, while working to hold what we have and preventing the further erosions we a bound to see with the House status quo.

I know … I know … the Democrats are just like the modern gop!

[LeftInTX]

46. If we lose at elections, we will lose everything we fought for

Let's say they repeal the Patriot Act, when a Republican comes along they will just re-create it again. Especially if they control both the house and senate.

Reagan began quickly dismantling the New Deal. Now very little of the New Deal is remaining. Trying to get it back is next to impossible.

[craigmatic]

50. At a certain point it's time to put party interests to the side and stand on principle.

Spying on US citizens is wrong regardless of which party does it.

[hamster]

52. you don't have to apologize for anything about President Obama.

As i've said before, Best. PRESIDENT. (Obama) Ever. Obama's got this. the republicans drove the car into the ditch and now they want the car back.