Skinner, it's time to close down the Postmortem Forum

[CajunBlazer]

It has served its purpose (at least one would hope so), but like one of those strange fashion fads that has grown too long in the tooth, it is long past its prime and needs to be put out of its misery.

Oh, I readily admit that I did my share of re-fighting the primaries, but now the same old arguments about why Hilary should have won, how Bernie might or might not have done better, or whether it would be better or worse to nominate a more progressive in 2020 have been argued and then argued again in slightly different words hundreds of times and we are no closer to consensus than we were when we started. One can only hope that we that least gotten it out of systems.

If we haven't figured out by now that fighting like crazed animals during the primaries is destructive to our cause, we never will. If we haven't figured out by now that we have to support without reservation and with total dedication whoever is selected as our nominee, if we can't united solidly in 2020 against a common enemy, there is not hope for us or our progressive cause.

So please shut this forum down Skinner, we have clawed each other enough for at least another 4 year.

[TexasTowelie]

1. I don't know what else could be said that has not already been addressed within the past month since

the election. At this point most of the posts in the forum are clickbait and divisive. I noticed that I'm called for jury duty on an increasing basis, particularly for the "support Democrats" and "don't bash Democrats" reasons.

With the exception of learning additional facts regarding the involvement of the Russians in the general election I believe that we have exhausted the usefulness of the forum. Anything further regarding that investigation is suitable to discuss in the general discussion forum.

[hrmjustin]

2. I agree it is time to shut it down.

[scscholar]

55. The vote just happened this week, and...

the House hasn't certified the results yet. There's still a chance. Why not wait until the election is over?

[hrmjustin]

56. There is no chance.

It is over!

[Beartracks]

3. Here's the results of the Jury on the OP.

Just kidding! But really: would it have surprised you much?

=================

[CajunBlazer]

15. Actually, someone sent me an message that there was an alert on this post.

I guess I am just not emphatic, but I have no idea why. Perhaps you could fill me in.

[Beartracks]

38. OMG, really?

I was just joking...

There is a LOT of thin skin around here, plus itchy trigger fingers, bruised egos, etc. Many don't seem to want "unity" unless/until theyve first defeated their perceived rivals....

your post was fine in my opinion.



=================

[Justice]

4. Agree 1 million times

[WheelWalker]

5. Indeed.

[Ellipsis]

6. I pretty sure he's capable of coming to his own conclusions.

Not like he hasn't done this before.

I'm sure he has a timeline.



But Hey given your tenure...


Bottom line I agree.

[applegrove]

7. We are still in shock and denial. If you don't want to connect to the process

don't go there. Different people heal and examine events at different paces. Surely it is important that we do it right, not necessarily fast.

[YOHABLO]

8. I think our focus should be on obstructing Trump, and the Republican Congress.

We must do to them what they've been doing to us for the past 8 years. The Democratic Party and anyone who Independently would like to join us must stop squabbling and get down to business.

[TexasProgresive]

9. Click on 2016 Postmortem and trash the forum.

The forum is still serving a purpose to help some people cope. If you don't want to see it trash it. As to the fighting that's our party. We don't march in lock step. When we have the right leader we form a coalition that is unbeatable. That happened for a majority of Americans just not a majority of American states.

I am getting tired of all the Monday morning quarterbacking but I don't want it shut down because that will just suppress the talk and not the feelings.

[CajunBlazer]

16. Much of what I see now is not people trying to cope, ....

though that was the case earlier. What I see is most is people, and I was guilty of this earlier, trying to re-fight the primaries in some form or anther, and it isn't pretty.

Anything that needs to be discussed to improve our our party going forward can be productively discussed in the General Discussion forum.

[TexasProgresive]

18. Then stay in GD

[CajunBlazer]

20. I will go where I please

But thank you for your suggestion. I am tempted to make one of my own, but that wouldn't be nice.

[TexasProgresive]

24. Have you tried ATA forum

That's where your request should go.

[CajunBlazer]

35. I will post my requests where I please as well, thank you.

It is pretty obvious that your real problem is not with me, but that you are concerned that someone might take my request seriously. Based on the many replies thus far, you seem to be in the minority.

Are you afraid you will not be able to continue to push your arguments for a more progressive candidate next time around, or whatever the heck you are currently pushing. I think I have noticed something on this board that you obviously haven't - that no one is changing their minds, no one is being convinced to adopt the views of others. If anything, people are hardening their positions because of what they see is the lack of flexibility of others.

Enough of sticking pins and even knives into the favorite candidates of others. It's time to move on to something more constructive.

[Kentonio]

10. If people are still disagreeing

They'll do it elsewhere if this forum is closed down. Makes much more sense letting it play out here, and maybe just maybe letting people find some closure.

[CajunBlazer]

40. They will be disagreeing four years from now and they will still be convincing no one

There are discussions to reach consensus - that constructive. (I haven't seen any consensus building on this forum in quite a while.) Then there is arguing for the sake of arguing when it is clear that there is no hope of convincing the other person - that's just people who like to argue doing their thing.

Frankly, if people just want to argue for the sake of arguing they can take their argument elsewhere for all I care - heck; they can exchange emails if that suits them - that way they don't even have to obey forum rules.

[kentuck]

11. I think it should be replaced with Post Election 2016...

and it should be used specifically for Democratic strategizing and should be open to "star" members only.

Just a thought.

[SidDithers]

12. +1...

Good idea.

Sid

[Drumron]

13. Dead horse

Agreed we've beaten this dead horse long enough...... .... it's time for a new forum....

[Coventina]

14. If you don't like it, don't enter the forum. Easy Peasy.

[CajunBlazer]

17. That's sounds like a good arguement for starting up 4 or 5 new forums...

....where we can find new reasons to fight with one another.

[Coventina]

19. Well, if history is any guide, this forum will simply be renamed GD: Politics.

And the discussions will remain pretty much what they are now.

[mtnsnake]

21. FYI it isn't up to you to decide.

Just sayin'

[CajunBlazer]

22. I think that it is obvious that if it were up to me to decide...

....it would already be gone. It is equally as obvious that you just felt the need to comment. Just sayin'.

[NCTraveler]

26. A suggestion is different than a decision.

Just sayin'

[mtnsnake]

28. that's funny

I don't remember posting to you but thanks for your brilliant insight.

[NCTraveler]

29. It's common sense. Not brilliance.

You are posting on a discussion board, of which I am a member.

[Paladin]

23. Yes, please. The 2016 Postmortem forum has overstayed its usefulness.

All it's doing is perpetuating grudges and divisions which we can no longer afford to advertise. We've done our enemies enough favors.

[NCTraveler]

25. +1 nt.

[Skinner]

27. 2016 Postmortem Forum

[zipplewrath]

30. The purpose it serves

It is primarily a way to concentrate these discussions here. Otherwise, they will just continue on in other forums. Most likely by the way in general discussion. It does occur to me that the forum that needs to be identified is the "where do we go from here" forum.

[mtnsnake]

31. +1 n/t

[coco22]

32. kicked&recommended..

[liquid diamond]

33. I agree

Shut this forum down. It's time to unite against Trump.

[DrDan]

34. you speaking for everyone?

There are still those posting here daily - and many reading here daily.

Why do you want to deny them that? You can easily either hide or ignore.

[CajunBlazer]

36. I seen many of the more contentious posts here as not only counter productive, but....

... actually destructive of our ability to unite against a common foe. If you felt that strongly as I do, wouldn't you react in the same manner?

[LanternWaste]

42. Specifically how do posts directly render us less capable of uniting against a common foe

Specifically how do posts directly render us less capable of uniting against a common foe, and on what objective measure is the alleged weakness based on other than simply dialog on a message board?

[CajunBlazer]

50. I would think the answer to your question is obvious

If you and I ultimately need to unite to achieve a common purpose, it isn't useful to continue to argue about those items were we disagree if neither or us are going to be moved by the other's arguments.

Go back and look at the many contentious posts and see how many you can find where those involved in those arguments ultimately achieved consensus. Then ask yourself - were those arguments useful or counter productive.

[DrDan]

47. no I wouldn't - the site has safeguards against destructive posts - I side in favor allowing

freedom of speech and access. I do not see my rights extending to be able to limit the rights of others.

But to each his own. I guess you feel differently.

[tavernier]

37. You beat me to it.

Lately it's the SOS over and over. We'd be better off with a Christmas cookie 🍪 exchange thread.

[realmirage]

39. Looks like Skinner gave you your answer above. Stay away if you don't like it

[CajunBlazer]

43. I would say the scene from War Games is open to interpertation

I would say this particular set of confrontation isn't going to end, and if it does, it won't end well.

[realmirage]

44. The forum is still up isn't it?

No interpretation needed.

[CajunBlazer]

45. Surely you didn't expect him to take it down or change its reason for being immeditely...

just because I asked, did you?

I'm guessing Skinner is planning on doing something with it the day Don the Con is inaugurated. However, it doesn't hurt to start the thought process, or the process of peopling deserting this forum so all that will be left are those who like to argue with themselves.

[realmirage]

46. You answered your own question. The answer was no

Sounds like you sure did expect him to take it down right away. You got the answer, so like all adults if you don't like something don't take part in it and don't tell others what they should and shouldn't be doing. Last reply

[CajunBlazer]

51. No, I didn't expect him to take it down right away

But I did want him and everyone else to start thinking about taking it down or at least changing its purpose.

[Persondem]

41. 2018 should be the concern. Dems have a tough map to defend. 2016 was a

crazy ass CF. Let it go folks. Time to move on.

[hamsterjill]

48. I don't give a shit what the name of the forum is.

But I'm still grieving, and I expect to continue to grieve this stolen election for the next minimum four years.

It makes no difference to me where I need to post, but I will be damned if I'm going to forget what happened here and just move on.

This forum has not been about "re-fighting the primaries" for me. It's been about the post election horror of Trump set to be inaugurated in a month.

[Uggwearingdad]

49. I'm new and am treading lightly.. but this quote is why this should stay open...

" If we haven't figured out by now that we have to support without reservation and with total dedication whoever is selected as our nominee,.."...that idea will lead to repetitive losses...just saying.
The morons on the right did just that....now look at what we have

[CajunBlazer]

52. I'm sorry but you lost me with that one...

How will everyone getting on board and supporting the Democratic nominee "without reservation and with total dedication" going to lead to "repetitive losses" for the Democratic Party.

Call me simple, but I don't understand.

[Uggwearingdad]

53. Simple...are we lock step little goobers?

Or are we thoughtful people that see "without reservation and with total dedication" is quite close to what happened this go round...wasn't the voters that failed...2.8 mill pop vote lead is proof...but that vote in a state/s we KNEW we had won doesn't help in Pa. or Wi., or Mi., or Fl....that's a leadership mistake.

Going down that road isn't wise...blind following will Never be a winning strategy for us....Jeb was the predicted R candidate early, Christie, not far behind... not totally batshit nuts guys......but there were reservations and NO total dedication...and now...we have a jello head....I say because our side was intractable.

[CajunBlazer]

54. BS!

That was not what happened this time around. What happened, among a slew of other things, is that many the followers of on of the potential nominees were pissed big time that their guy lost, claiming (like Trump) that it was a rigged election.

Many of the followers of this other guy held their nose and voted for the Democratic nominee in the general election. While they gave generously of the money to their guy in the primaries and worked their fingers to the bone for him, they "weren't excited" about the Democratic nominee. So that was all they did was vote. So except for voting, some of our most "enthusiastic" Democrats and left of center independents essentially sat out the general election. Now they like me, are stuck with Trump, and they really shouldn't be too proud of themselves about now.

Was this the reason we lost, no, it as one of the reasons we lost.

[Uggwearingdad]

57. What else were we supposed to do.." So that was all they did was vote."

What else could we do...besides vote?

"...some of our most "enthusiastic" Democrats and left of center independents essentially sat out the general election." they must not have been too enthusiastic....if they sat out the GE.

You and I may be on the same side but maybe talking past each other.....or not.

[CajunBlazer]

58. I see you really don't get it

You mean you really don't see what's wrong with this picture?

In the primaries, when Sanders' opponent was a Democrat and a progressive (though not as progressive as Sanders who is a Socialist), Sanders supporters here on DU were sending their candidate money on a regular basis and volunteering to work as many hours as possible to work in his campaign. Heck we had people on DU who spent their time doing their best to manipulate internet polls so they could say Sanders won.

However, in the general election, the Hillary's opponent was egotistical narcissist who lied every time he opened his mouth and courted Putin to hack Hillary's emails. Did the Sanders' supporters enthusiastically support Hillary. Did they give money to Hillary's campaign, did they volunteer to work for her campaign? No, most did not.

Can you possibly understand how irrational that totally inconsistent that behavior was? When the opponent is another progressive they were all in, and then some. But when the opponent was someone many Americans wouldn't want anywhere close to the nuclear button, the best they could do was hold their nose and vote for Hillary. And some of them didn't even do that.

That's simply sad.

[True Dough]

59. I sometimes bump into Postmortem threads

when I review latest threads. I usually back out of them fairly quickly because they almost always wind up going in circles. It gets frustrating and depressing really quickly.

I recall Skinner posting a message for all of us when we logged back into the site after the sabotage that the Postmortem forum was temporary, not permanent. I trust the mods/admins will exercise sound judgment on when to pull the plug. From what I've read in this thread, it's not done serving its purpose for everybody but I've sure had my fill!