Now's the time for HRC to put this thing TOTALLY out of reach...

[Ken Burch]

...and say THESE words...

"If the TPP has not been ratified on January 20th, I will withdraw it from consideration. If it has been ratified, I will withdraw this country from the TPP, because it is not possible to make this corporate giveaway a deal that people with any progressive or democratic values can support".

If she does that, she pulls within ten points of Trump among working-class whites(as opposed to being thirty points down), does so without moving to the right on anything, and we score a historic landslide, retaking the Senate and probably the House as well.

Not "I am against 'trade deals'".

But "A vote for me ENDS the TPP".

Everything to gain...nothing to lose.

President Obama should be remembered as the hero who gave us the beginnings of universal health care and found the way to begin to get this country talking about race...not the guy who forever sold out working people, people of color, and the poor in the name of massive corporate profit at ALL cost and a pointless fixation on China's role in global trade.

Stopping TPP would exalt President Obama's legacy, and would not damage it or disrespect him in the slightest.

[bullimiami]

1. Sorry. TPP isn't big on my radar.

Not sure thats a statement that would "put it totally out of reach".

[stopbush]

2. Yep. It's a bugbear with the extreme left, but that's about it.

[Ken Burch]

4. It forever locks us into a right-wing trade regimen with much of the world.

It means that tribunals can throw out democratically-passed labor laws, environmental regulations, even force the reduction of education funding if corporations can persuade the tribunals that such things are tariffs or unfair trade practices. There is no appeal to these rulings.

This is a direct assault on every progressive measure in this country that protects people or the ecosystems around them.

It affects you directly, and you only benefit from what TPP does if you're a millionaire.

A good place to start is a Facebook page called "Fight for the Future":



https://www.facebook.com/fightfortheftr

And there's this:

http://www.seattleglobalist.com/2014/01/29/5-reasons-to-protest-the-trans-pacific-partnership-this-week/19818

[DURHAM D]

3. I doubt that 90% of the voters even know what

it is.

[Ken Burch]

6. There are large-scale campaigns going on against it.

There is little if anything that is good for workers, people of color and indigenous people, the environment or those who want to work for a more just world.

It will lock in right-wing anti-progressive policies on intellectual property, labor rights, and environmental safeguards.

It will give corporations the right to sue in undemocratically chosen tribunals to block governmental actions they dislike, and when they get those actions thrown out, there is no appeal(at least half the time in the tribunals in existing trade deals, the corporations win. It's even possible(to make this more specific to you)that a tribunal could throw out anti-discrimination laws involving LGBTQ people if a corporation from another country were to argue that these laws give American corporations an unfair trade advantage(don't assume there aren't corporate lawyers preparing briefs for such arguments as we speak). Also, the size of the victory we would win on an explicitly NO TPP pledge would almost certainly put enough Dems in the House and Senate to pass ENDA.

The labor movement across this land is organizing against it.

And the hint that it might be allowed to go through and then HRC might settle for "tweaking" it later(something NAFTA essentially proves that you can't do with an existing trade agreement)is one of the main reasons Trump holds the overwhelming lead among working-class whites that is the only reason he's even slightly competitive in this race.

A lot of LGBTQ organizations are part of the anti-TPP movement, too.

I don't have time right now, but I can send you links that explain this in detail.

But in short...

TPP is not benign or innocuous. It doesn't help anyone other than a few millionaires and billionaires...and we have the historic record so far that every trade deal the US has signed since the mid-1980's has led to large-scale exports of American jobs(a million jobs sent out of the country through NAFTA alone

[DURHAM D]

8. I don't need any additional info on the TPP.

I was just trying to let you know that no one knows what it is except for about 10% of the population. I am in that 10%

[Ken Burch]

10. That 10% represents a lot of votes we can add to our total

There are no significant numbers of current HRC voters insisting that the possibility of accepting the TPP be kept alive.

As awareness of the deal grows, opposition(which is already strong)will continue to grow.

(BTW, at one point, 10% or less of the population knew or cared about the LGBTQ struggle or supported it. I assume you're glad that has changed.)

Knowledge of it is stronger among Trump voters...some of them ONLY support Trump(not a majority but a significant bloc)because they believe he'll kill the deal(yes, I realize the Great Hairpiece is bullshitting about that). If we can make it loud and clear that TPP is dead if HRC wins, that will give us a large chunk of those votes and the potential to move a lot of those people into support for anti-oppression politics of all forms.

It's in our interest as Democrats to be strong and specific on this.

[bettyellen]

22. the 10% obsessed with the TPP do not believe that she is against it. they do not believe her,

never will, and so- are a complete waste of time.

[Tommy_Carcetti]

5. The whole TPP thing is like GMOs for me.

I can understand and agree with some of the concern about it, but honestly I think those opponents blow those concerns way out of proportion to hyperbole and to the point of self-parody.

[MBS]

11. my feelings too. n/t

[greatauntoftriplets]

32. Well said.

[TwilightZone]

7. The average voter doesn't care about the TPP

I doubt it's in the top 20 of issues for the average voter, if they even know what it is.

Secondly, she's not about to throw the current president under the bus for something that hasn't even passed yet.

[unitedwethrive]

9. I agree. The only reason it's even a campaign issue is because Bernie and Trump have

used it against her. It certainly is not in any political discussion I've had in the past year (and I've had MANY!).

[Ken Burch]

12. A lot of people care about it. It isn't trivial

and it doesn't do Obama any harm or disrespect to let this die. The deal is unworthy of him. He's better than that, and there is nothing in TPP that would ever have helped the people he used to organize on the South Side.

Why can't he be happy being remembered as the father of universal healthcare?

That was to the good of the people. TPP isn't.

[oberliner]

13. Zero chance of this happening

The issue is not even on the radar for most voters.

[Ken Burch]

16. I'm not sure why so many people(don't take this personally)who claim to be progressives

are invested in the argument that the TPP is harmless doesn't matter. If it is passed, it essentially makes it impossible for any country signing the agreement to pass meaningful measures to deal with the environmental crisis(did you know that the TPP never uses the words "climate change" at any point in the agreement?) or the exploitation of workers.

The tribunals set up under TPP(not sure if it's even possible to reform the tribunal process if the agreement is passed)make it possible for corporations to sue governments for passing legislation they don't like. If the legislation is thrown out, there's no process of appeal and no way to pass anything to replace what's been annulled.

There is nothing in this that agreement that benefits anyone who supports the values of the Democratic Party, or any of the voters who back us at the polls.

There simply isn't any case for it.

Let's throw it out and then negotiate a new pact, with labor, environmentalists, and people of color(especially indigenous people)having a say in the negotiations-not just corporations and the governments they approve of.

[oberliner]

29. I just don't think it's a big issue for most voters

And I think with Obama being a big proponent of TPP, it would not make sense for Hillary to make too much noise about it at this point.

[Demsrule86]

31. I do take offense at the notion (and I have heard it before) that those who don't agree

with you are somehow not progressive. And you knew we would didn't you?

[Codeine]

14. The average working-class white voter

is as concerned about the TTP as every other average voter, which is to say that they don't give two tugs of a dead dog's dick about it.

The intricacies of international trade deals are so far down the list of concerns so as to be essentially invisible.

And btw, she's doing just fine having ignored all of your well-intentioned advice up to this point.

[DanTex]

15. That would make no difference.

Particularly since she's already against TPP. But more important, most people don't care about TPP. And the ones who do are split on it. Trump voters aren't attracted to him because of TPP, they're attracted to him because they are racist. Trump could come out in favor of TPP and it wouldn't hurt him with his base, they don't care about trade policy.

[Ken Burch]

17. Most are racist, but some are just misguided victims of globalization.

The TPP is exactly the kind of deal that always betrayed working people(the FTA in the eighties, NAFTA in the 1990's, the others that have passed)and exported jobs.

If we take away, once and for all, the possibility of them getting shafted one more time, we can bust, I'd argue, at least 7 to 10 percent of the current Trump vote away(and in doing so, flip the Senate and the House, and begin the process of winning working-class whites to a position opposing grassroots and institutional bigotry. What's not to like?

If HRC were to say "TPP dies if I get elected", rather than just use weasel words like "I'm against bad trade deals&quot which imply that TPP could somehow be "tweaked" and made progressive after it is approved-something we all know is impossible), that would take all the voters(not a majority, but a significant bloc)who have been persuaded that Trump is somehow a tribune of the dispossessed away from him, leaving him with nothing but the better-off haters.

It was deference enough to the president to leave the no-TPP language out of the platform.

Without TPP, the president will be remembered as a progressive hero-speaking truth to power about race, engaging with OWS and embracing some of their ideas, and building the foundations of universal healthcare. It's a much better legacy than permanently selling out workers and the environment to unregulated corporate arrogance.

So what if we piss off a few CEO's? It just gives us the chance to start over and do global trade on humane, progressive, small-d democratic terms. That is exactly the kind of thing we are here to do.

[DanTex]

19. I think you're mixing up policy and politics.

I doubt that even 1% of Trump's current voters would switch to Hillary just because she more forcefully re-iterates her current position on TPP. The scant polling I've seen shows that opinion is basically even on TPP, if anything slightly more in favor than against.

The people for whom anti-TPP is a big issue are the left. Working-class Republicans don't care, they're against it because it's "Obamatrade" and they hate Obama. If Trump proposed the exact same policy, they'd be in favor of it.

So maybe she could pick up a few potential Green party voters by being more forceful against TPP. But there aren't many of them to begin with, and a lot of them are just anti-Hillary and aren't going to believe her no matter what she says, so the upside is pretty small. And there's also a downside with middle-class centrists and economic conservatives who favor TPP and free trade in general (it's not just "a few CEO's&quot . Remember, Libertarians, who are reflexively pro-trade, are polling at 10%, whereas Greens, who are reflexively anti-trade are polling at 3%.

But I don't think it will make much difference either way. Probably the best thing for her is just not talk about it, because she's kind of in a tricky position, with the current (and quite popular) Democratic president being in favor, and with her having said positive things about it (or about earlier drafts) in the past, and now being against.

[Ken Burch]

21. opposition to TPP does not make a person "anti-trade".

There is no conflict between trade with other countries and preserving national sovereignty AND strong social, envirnmental and labor policies.

[DanTex]

24. That's true, but for the most part the pros and cons come from the usual

pro-trade and anti-trade contingents. I don't see many pro-trade people or groups coming out against TPP.

[independentpiney]

18. The white working class Trump voters I know would think TPP is a motor oil additive

you're giving them way to much credit for having interest in or knowledge of politics, economics or global affairs.

[synergie]

20. Sorry, she doesn't need you to feed her lines.

[KingCharlemagne]

23. White working-class voters support Trump first and foremost because they are racists, not

because Trump opposes an obscure trade deal.

Come on, get real.

[NurseJackie]

25. She's much smarter than you're giving her credit for.

And smart enough to avoid playing to the extremes.

[Demsrule86]

26. She has already come out against the TPP

"

"

You keep posting stuff like this...rather misleading. As Hillary Clinton disavowed the TPP in her economic speech. Also, she voted against CAFTA...so much concern over a settled issued. The only way TPP gets passed would be in a lame duck session,and it could happen because Obama whom I voted for twice has always been for trade. I knew that when I voted for him. Instead of writing concerned posts about something that has already been settled by Sec. Clinton, perhaps you could help by contacting Congress and telling them not to pass it. Your concern is duly noted...although why did you even write this? The information that Sec. Clinton opposes the TPP is easily attainable using Google or any search engine.

[Demsrule86]

27. One last thing... Virginia an important state depends on trade.

So perhaps it is not as black and white as you imply. Also, I can tell you that trade is important in steel as well... as hubs lost his job when China had trouble last just before Christmas last year. He found another one quickly, but Trade is no longer the simple issue it once was. And I live in Ohio.

[Ken Burch]

28. We can still have trade without the TPP.

It's not as though we're going to turn into Albania.

[Demsrule86]

30. As I pointed out

Hillary has said she won't pass the TPP...but Obama in a lame duck probably will. And that is the truth. I knew when he ran he supported trade. He was still the best choice...but Virginia wants the TPP you know. I don't. She should not insult Pres. Obama who is still president ...by making a big deal about this...she has already said what needed to be said. Much of your 'advice' would cost her votes...and not just in this instance.