With the Choice of the Last Two Speakers,

[On the Road]

it looks like Clinton may be trying to seize the conservative populist mantle from Trump. Local congressman devoted almost his whole talk to POW-MIA and current speaker talking about American dream.

Had not expected this, but it may be good political strategy.

[Tal Vez]

1. To anyone who can see straight, Clinton will never be seen as a conservative anything.

She has been hated by conservatives for decades. I'm not sure that some of the younger folk realize this, but it's true. She will always be viewed as a progressive/radical.

[abetterkid]

2. Certainly not to...

The younger generations. And compared to tRump he ain't your father's Republican or conservative for that matter.

[RonniePudding]

7. That's because Trump is a true fascist

Who is a minion of a more powerful fascist.

[elleng]

3. It's really a matter of perspective,

you MUST know. from THEN, 'progressive,' and from NOW, 'conservative, middle-of the road,' anything but radical.

[Tal Vez]

4. I am only talking about the perspective of Americans.

I don't know what she looks like from North Korea, but she is to the left of where most Americans find themselves now.

[elleng]

10. So am I.

[Tal Vez]

16. I suspect that you're not too happy with what is happening in this election.

I suspect you're going to feel that way for a long, long time. Progress takes time.

After taking a few tumbles, people figure it out. Be patient.

[elleng]

26. I'm not,

and have not been 'happy' with Dem party for some time.

It MAY be that, depending on how bad the election turns out, real Dems, the people, will finally gain the 'power' we need, to return to where we should be.

[Tal Vez]

34. It will make sense for you to assume that the people do have the power and

that, unfortunately, they don't all agree with you. And, you'll find that many of the folks that you believe do agree with you just don't take the time to vote. It's disappointing most of the time. That's why it takes work. Progress is hard. Take any progress you can get and build on that.

[elleng]

38. It's pretty clear, from the recent Dem debacle,

the PEOPLE do NOT have the power. I know damn well many of them don't agree with me, and many don't vote. Dem Party must be reorganized into a truly democratic institution, so the people's interests can be heard and respected.

[Tal Vez]

41. Well, nobody in the Democratic Party (or any party) is going to listen to the advice

of anyone who isn't demonstrating a commitment to the party. A political party is like anything else. From the outside, it looks intransigent. But, people who get involved find out that real participants are so few in number that they get power dumped into their laps very quickly. If you're involved, you know this already. If you're not involved, get involved. You can change things because you will be one of the very few who care enough to show up.

[elleng]

42. You may (or may not) be interested in my role here:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=forum&id=1281

[Tal Vez]

43. Well, I'm never afraid to admit my own ignorance. I honestly don't know what that

link tells me other than that you are/were probably active in the Martin O'Malley campaign. If so, good on ya!

Stay involved. You'll never regret it.

[elleng]

44. Was a co-host.

[Tal Vez]

45. Good for you. I liked and like your candidate a lot. He's a very decent guy, maybe too decent

for a national media which only has the hots for something crazy, crude or scandalous.

Good luck!

[On the Road]

5. Clinton Has a Socially Conservative Streak

at least when it comes to political strategy.

She was a young Goldwater supporter. And Bill and she hired Dick Morris, James Carville and others.

Clinton might just ride address the Bernie Sanders element, but I think that would be a mistake.

[Tal Vez]

6. She is very clearly to the left of most Americans.

[JudyM]

8. Not if you look at research on what most Americans want/believe. You can check it out online via

numerous polls.

[Tal Vez]

12. Having been active in the politics of this country for more than fifty years,

I have no need to learn about what most Americans want/believe by reading research projects. You really have to be kidding.

Get out in the world and find out first hand what people think. You won't find many Americans referring to Clinton as a conservative. It really amazes me that someone could conclude that Clinton's political problem is that she is viewed as too conservative for America.

And Rush Limbaugh is just too liberal?

[JI7]

19. exactly

[JudyM]

22. Sorry, dear, but we are talking about the majority, not the conservatives. And your sample

regardless of the years on your tires, is not as statistically accurate as scientifically validated polls.

[Tal Vez]

28. Well, you just keep reading your research projects and you just keep wondering why the elections

aren't coming out like your research projects predict. Then have a talk with the persons who produced those research projects and ask them why they're not helpful.

Progress takes time and a hell of a lot of work. And, you're going to have a whole lot of defeats. Take whatever improvement you can get and build on that.

[JudyM]

33. The research is chronicling real world events, not positing theories.

[pnwmom]

39. That imaginary research you just are too busy to provide a link to, even though you have the time

to make so many posts claiming that it exists.

[JI7]

14. we have actual election results .

[JudyM]

17. That is way off base. Most of the electorate are independents, and they were shut out of much

of the voting.

[JI7]

21. they are not shut out in general elections

Plus they could easily register in a party to vote in a primary.

[JudyM]

23. Ok, so...?

[JI7]

25. so what you claimed was not true

As there are actual numbers.

[pnwmom]

20. Please show at least one of these "numerous polls" showing that most Democrats are left of Hillary.

You can't. They don't exist.

[JudyM]

27. Google is your friend, we are so far apart philosophically that I know better than to engage on this

[pnwmom]

29. Google can't find a poll that does NOT exist. You're the one that claims to have seen

such a poll, not me.

So please provide a link to support your claim.

[pnwmom]

24. It's impossible to find polls that don't exist. If you think they do exist, you should be able

to prove that.

Where's the link to prove your claim?

[JudyM]

31. As I suggested above... I've read the polls and if you're actually interested in the data you can

find them easily enough. Wish I actually had time to do research for you.

[pnwmom]

32. They don't exist, so there is nothing to find. I can't find unicorns or flying elephants either,

except pretend ones.

Apparently you're talking about imaginary polls.

[JudyM]

35. As usual, a revelatory exchange.

[pnwmom]

36. Yes, you have revealed you have nothing to back up your claim. All you would have had to do to

prove me wrong is provide a link to a single real poll, but you couldn't.

[JudyM]

37. Give it up, I'm not engaging any more with you on this site.

This is not third grade.

[pnwmom]

40. That is fine. But I will keep responding to your posts, whenever I feel it's called for. n/t

[pnwmom]

18. She was a 16 year old Goldwater girl with two GOP parents. Once she got to college

and was exposed to more ideas, she quickly became a progressive. She wrote her senior thesis on Saul Alinsky. It's ridiculous to say that she has a "socially conservative streak."

[John Poet]

9. How is POW-MIA 'conservative populist'?

If it wasn't for conservative/hawkish foreign policies, there wouldn't be any MIAs to worry about...

[MrScorpio]

11. Wrong...

Many of our POW-MIAs were people of color, poor and working class service people.

That's our natural constituency.

We're the true patriots, not the wingers who didn't mention our POW-MIAs ONCE during their convention.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

13. Being a liberal, caring about POWs/MIAs, and believing in the American Dream aren't mutually ...

Being a liberal, caring about POWs/MIAs, and believing in the American Dream aren't mutually exclusive.

[JI7]

15. how are these things supposed to be conservative ?

[Squinch]

30. POW-MIA and the American Dream are not subjects liberals are allowed to talk about? WTF?