2016 Postmortem
Related: About this forumState Dept. spokesman Wednesday: 'There was no prohibition on using personal email'
from Crooks and Liars:
Inspector General's Report On Clinton's Email Greatly Exaggerated By Media Outlets
... I can almost hear the calls of "criminal Hillary" from a certain party who shall go nameless. Note, though, as the report mentions, there were no administrative penalties in placeeither about the use of a private email server, or not following the established procedures for preserving emailsat the time Clinton served as Secretary of State. Moreover, there is indication that she wasn't even aware of the requirements.
report:
Although the Department is aware of the failure to print and file, the FAM contains no explicit penalties for lack of compliance, and the Department has never proposed discipline against an employee for failure to comply. OIG identified one email exchange occurring shortly before Secretary Clinton joined the Department that demonstrated a reluctance to communicate the requirement to incoming staff. In the exchange, records officials within the Bureau of Administration wondered whether there was an electronic method that could be used to capture the Secretarys emails because they were not comfortable advising the new administration to print and file email records.
State Department personnel were discouraged from using their private email, but not explicitly forbidden from doing so. As quoted in the CNN storythe one where Clinton was purportedly "slammed' by the OIGthe State Department spokesman concurred:
State Department spokesman Mark Toner briefed reporters Wednesday: "While not necessarily encouraged, there was no prohibition on using personal email. The only requirement is that -- and the regulations do state this, that these records need to be preserved."
To repeat what I wrote earlier, the OIG report was focused on the State Department's procedures in place for emails; it's not specifically focused on Clinton. It may be more titillating to say that the OIG is "slamming" Clinton, or that the OIG report was "sharply critical of Clinton"...but it's also inaccurate, and misleading.
read more: http://crooksandliars.com/2016/05/oig-report-states-email-handling-including
NWCorona
(8,541 posts)cali
(114,904 posts)Renew Deal
(81,869 posts)What did she do wrong? Failed to print some of her emails.
Thats nothing compared to stuff like Bridgegate.
NWCorona
(8,541 posts)For starters failed to ask for permission and Hillary did it would have been denied.
bkkyosemite
(5,792 posts)Jitter65
(3,089 posts)and recipients had copies and she produced 55,000 e-mails what accounts for "missing e-mails?"
ljm2002
(10,751 posts)...first of all, she produced 55,000 printed pages which represented about 30,000 emails. She also withheld about 30,000 emails which she claimed were personal in nature. Some of those have been retrieved, and it does not look like all of them were personal in nature.
It was not guaranteed anyone would see those other 30,000 emails, as she had the server wiped sometime before it was turned over to the FBI. But they were able to retrieve at least some of those emails. Hence the "missing e-mails".
Whether or not her staff and other recipients had copies is irrelevant. The State Department should not have to go running around asking anyone who might have received an email from her whether or not they did, and if so, to please turn it over. Obviously it is most efficient to go to the source and retrieve all of their emails from that person.
tex-wyo-dem
(3,190 posts)Simply using private email on a web based domain like gmail, yahoo, hotmail, etc for some communication (NOT confidential information...State has an entirely different highly secure system for that), and running your private email on a private domain on a private sever located in the basement of your house...huge difference. For one, all those web based domains mentioned above have security and encryption built in and constantly updated, run on servers that are maintained by a team of IT professionals. Hillary had one guy who wasn't even an IT expert install and maintain her server, and didn't even have basic security installed for the first couple of months she was SoS. This on top of the fact she received and sent confidential information via the private server.
Huge difference!
hellofromreddit
(1,182 posts)Hillary's running for a job that requires sound judgement in times where that are no explicit guidelines one way or another--just vague goals like "Protect jobs, avoid trade war." The fact is that this server issue does make it look like she has poor judgement. Claiming that it's not technically disallowed ain't gonna cut it.
Frankly, I don't know how Hillary can undo this damage--she has permanently lost yet another small slice of voters and handed Trump a big club to chip away at the others with.
bigtree
(86,005 posts)lagomorph777
(30,613 posts)which diverges significantly from the OIG position, and from reality.
bigtree
(86,005 posts)...blocked
floriduck
(2,262 posts)bigtree
(86,005 posts)floriduck
(2,262 posts)Surya Gayatri
(15,445 posts)wet their collective underpants with excitement.
Tarc
(10,476 posts)What remains to be seen is if they'll walk back their ridiculous rhetoric or double down.
democrattotheend
(11,605 posts)So I have to agree that it's probably being blown out of proportion.
That said, what upsets me about the whole e-mail scandal is the fact that she attempted to circumvent her responsibility to keep public records of her activities. It goes to the larger issue of her opaqueness and even paranoia, which is probably a result of all the lies that have been told about her over the years. Given everything that has been thrown at her I can understand why she is that way, but it is not a quality I want in a president. Nixon was paranoid and secretive for many of the same reasons, and it doesn't make it okay.
seabeyond
(110,159 posts)equipment, or if Clinton did something special.
ljm2002
(10,751 posts)...you don't honestly believe that State Department personnel routinely set up their own servers and conducted all of their official business using their own private email accounts on said servers?
No, you cannot possibly believe that.
bigtree
(86,005 posts)...and criticizes Hillary for wanting to keep her private email inaccessible.
Maybe you're just not understanding what that secrecy applied to. ALL of her records, save maybe a half of dozen at worst, probably four, have been made available. It's clear that, if there was some pressing need to see them, well, here they are, available.
Not so with Nixon's, who was found to be engaged in criminal and highly unethical behavior, using his refusal to turn over records to cover up his criminality.
NOTHING about this rises to the level of calling Hillary, Nixon. I find your analogy ill-informed, at best.
democrattotheend
(11,605 posts)As this report indicates, she should have turned them all over and let the State Department decide which ones were not subject to FOIA disclosure. This could have been mostly done using natural language processing software without violating her privacy.
bigtree
(86,005 posts)...which makes all of the talk about wrongdoing ridiculous.
Even more absurd is hang Sec. Clinton on decisions made on technology available, following what previous secretaries had done, not for some criminal or unethical enterprise, but for the conduct of business at State. The hyperbole suggests some wrongdoing or criminality behind it all or encompassing it all, and that's not supported by the facts in this report.
BootinUp
(47,179 posts)thought about that enough?
ljm2002
(10,751 posts)...was use a work email for work and a personal email for personal things. Then she could have turned over all of her work emails and voila! No privacy issues at all.
Of course, there would still be the issue of using her own badly set up server and her own email account for ALL of her official State business.
LAS14
(13,783 posts)... of preserving copies using modern backup procedures.
lagomorph777
(30,613 posts)seabeyond
(110,159 posts)because their candidate lost and this was their only hope. Rollin' eyes. What ever.
AgingAmerican
(12,958 posts)riversedge
(70,282 posts)nadinbrzezinski
(154,021 posts)go read it
thesquanderer
(11,990 posts)Problem 1 is the rest of the sentence, "The only requirement is that -- and the regulations do state this, that these records need to be preserved." She didn't do that.
Problem 2 is that, in the same press conference, it was brought out that there is also an obligation to use department systems in most circumstances. Which mean that, while using personal email is not prohibited, using it for ALL your correspondence IS prohibited.
vintx
(1,748 posts)KeepItReal
(7,769 posts)Tierra_y_Libertad
(50,414 posts)bigtree
(86,005 posts)...exactly.
Is that progressiveness?
berni_mccoy
(23,018 posts)And what Hillary did. If you don't get that you are either never going to or supporting a lie from camp Hillary.
CrowCityDem
(2,348 posts)frylock
(34,825 posts)CrowCityDem
(2,348 posts)frylock
(34,825 posts)They have people and utilities monitoring their network around the clock, as well as multiple layers of safeguards against intrusion. Hillary's IT guy unplugged the server from the network when he suspected they were being attacked. While Yahoo, Google, and other providers have been compromised, comparing their security protocol to Hillary's home brewed set up is positively ludicrous.
kcr
(15,318 posts)I hate to break it to you, but personal email accounts on services like g-mail aren't ironclad secure. They are hacked all the time. Email gate is such a non-issue and I hate seeing fellow progressives get roped in on this ridiculous right wing smear.
KeepItReal
(7,769 posts)Sending emails from a weakly secured (turn it off when a hack is suspected?!?) personal exchange sever in her house on a run of the mill commercial ISP? With no end-to-end encryption to recipients at State or wherever she chose to email work stuff?
That's pathetic and attempts to defend that are pretty weak.
kcr
(15,318 posts)I'm not arguing that her personal set up was the equivalent of Fort Knox. I'm saying that personal email via gmail isn't either. As if following the rules would have meant security and therefore we could all sleep well in our beds! It's all manufactured outrage.
kcr
(15,318 posts)If this is the reason people don't want to vote for her? Than Bernie's run was all a waste of time. This is a meaningless right wing smear campaign and nothing more.
FourScore
(9,704 posts)Personal emails are NOT the problem. The problem is state dept work on an unsecured SERVER (and, truth be told, phone), including classified documents that should have never been removed from the secure locations available for viewing such info within the state dept.
Such a breach may have thwarted military operations, outed agents and exposed our country in other vulnerable ways.
Anyone else who did this would already be rotting in jail.
The FBI has granted immunity to her IT guy. They have extradited a man known to have hacked into Blumenthal's email acct (and possibly Hillary's server). Not only is it unprecedented to extradite a hacker from a foreign country, they also offered him a plea bargain. Why would they do that?
Wake up! If you still want to support her despite all of this, okay; but at least be honest about what is going on here.
(And this isn't even touching on the Clinton Foundation stuff!)
nc4bo
(17,651 posts)bigtree
(86,005 posts)timmymoff
(1,947 posts)You look like the damn fool you are. Kind of like if getting pulled over for speeding and you say, " why me, everyone else was speeding too?" Pretty weak ass defense.