2016 Postmortem
Related: About this forumClinton fury with Sanders grows
http://thehill.com/homenews/campaign/280622-clinton-fury-grows-with-sandersThe continued combat on the left is also complicating Clinton’s efforts to fully turn her attention to presumptive Republican nominee Donald Trump, who is reveling in the Democratic feuding.
“This is the worst-case scenario and the one people feared the most,” said one Clinton ally and former Clinton aide.
We welcome their hatred. Buckle up Clinton supporters this ain't over yet.
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Jester Messiah
(4,711 posts)And David Brock I guess.
onecaliberal
(32,864 posts)
Demsrule86
(68,593 posts)I blame Bernie the spoiler Sanders who is attempting either on purpose or because he is delusional and thinks he might get the nomination...to throw the election to Trump. Bernie has shown his true character.
okieinpain
(9,397 posts)
merrily
(45,251 posts)dishonest and untrustworthy with as much as 60% of the public. So, her campaign did a Rove thing on Bernie. His character is as good or better than anyone's, including her and her husband.
DU's nonsense seem to get thicker by the day. Don't add to it.
InAbLuEsTaTe
(24,122 posts)Bernie & Elizabeth 2016!!!
merrily
(45,251 posts)Some of them have been pushing the "spoiler" meme since he announced and I very much suspect they know better.
One of them called Kentucky a liberal state the other day. They're a hoot.
jeff47
(26,549 posts)The fact that Sanders is in the primary instead demonstrates he is deliberately not being a spoiler candidate.
seekthetruth
(504 posts)He's not giving up because he knows what is at stake..... continued neoliberalism.
But you probably have no idea what what means......
timmymoff
(1,947 posts)Blame the candidate you support for not being trustworthy or honest. Blame her for her corporate ties, her seeking gop money from mega donors. her Iraq war vote, her Syria, Libya and Honduras actions a s Secretary of state. I guess it would do you some good to now examine what we have always been saying. Oh lets not forget TPP, Nafta, private prison lobbies, keystone. wow my fingers hurt form all the things wrong with her.
InAbLuEsTaTe
(24,122 posts)Bernie & Elizabeth 2016!!!
Betty Karlson
(7,231 posts)pinebox
(5,761 posts)
panader0
(25,816 posts)
Yurovsky
(2,064 posts)She can't blame Bernie, the FBI, or even the GOP for this problem. It's all on her & Bill...
Rosa Luxemburg
(28,627 posts)
frylock
(34,825 posts)
Fawke Em
(11,366 posts)I wasn't going to vote for her before he even got in the race.
He has nothing to do with it. He's really just icing on the cake.
Mike__M
(1,052 posts)
RichVRichV
(885 posts)Because as a Bernie supporter I'm laughing at their insecurity. It sure isn't going to change my views any. she has almost literally been given every advantage this primary season and she's complaining it's still not enough!
So much for her being a battle hardened politician ready to take on anything. The election season is light weight stuff. Imagine once she gets to being a president and has to take on real pressures.
Silver_Witch
(1,820 posts)InAbLuEsTaTe
(24,122 posts)Bernie & Elizabeth 2016!!!
liberalnarb
(4,532 posts)HES RUNNING FOR THE DEMOCRATIC NOMINATION! Maybe if Hillary wasn't so damn weak on the important issues, this thing wouldn't be getting dragged out for so long.
Demsrule86
(68,593 posts)for anything ...he has lost. The delegate math is insurmountable.
liberalnarb
(4,532 posts)
Jackilope
(819 posts)... it appears She Who MUST Be Coronated is having her minions pull more dirty tricks in CA to hide just how weak and disliked she really is.
Our journalists, our voting integrity, and this primary is a pathetic theatric attempt to give illusion that we maybe had a choice. The curtain getting pulled back frequently provides anyone awake with what a sham this has become.
Silver_Witch
(1,820 posts)That is when the losing candidate should withdraw this cycle as well.
However, if you can explain why any candidate would withdraw until the final primary - please feel free to express it. Rather than the fantasy that Bernie is a spoiler. Unless of course you believed Hillary was the spoiler against Obama for not "withdrawing" prior to the final primary.
Hillary and her supporters have shown their true character.
Demsrule86
(68,593 posts)But he has said he will go to the convention which would be wrong and try to flip delegates.
HooptieWagon
(17,064 posts)It's her own actions...she has no one to blame but herself.
BlueStreak
(8,377 posts)Forget the policy differences, which as substantial. Looking strictly at the politics of it, the fact is that Bernie has been willing right about half the vote. Hillary's party connections ensure she will get the nomination. Only the biggest political fool on the planet would be picking fights with Bernie at this stage. Anybody with any brains whatsoever would be reaching out to Bernie and those who support him.
She is incompetent. She is a fool. She will probably lose to Trump because of it. This is really disgusting.
Yurovsky
(2,064 posts)and unnecessary. I can do the math. She has a lead, and will most likely maintain it until the convention. Even if it's not enough, the super delegates would go with her, unless Bernie had a lead in pledged delegates from the primaries and caucuses.
But the bullshit coming from the goons on her staff makes me want to tell Bernie to fight like hell, screw the implications. She wants to be a bully? Well, the only thing a bully understands is when the victim starts fighting back, refusing to be a victim any longer.
BlueStreak
(8,377 posts)She is going to get the nomination. She cannot win with the tens of millions of people who prefer Bernie.
This daily campaign to piss off Bernie supporters is about the stupidest thing I have seen in my 50-some years of paying attention to politics. It really makes me question her judgment. This is just not smart.
Yurovsky
(2,064 posts)and while she was never going to get them all, she could have gotten many of them. Now? Not so much... And yes, that is very stupid on the part of HRC and her "brain trust".
BlueStreak
(8,377 posts)What passes as "science" is actually just a big collection of "conventional wisdom" that mostly evolved from the pre-TV days of whistle=stop train campaigns, newspaper endirsements and the like. Today, anybody most Americans under 40 have never even been on a train, and most Americans under 30 have never subscribed to a newspaper.
In recent elections, it is staggering just how wrong the "conventional wisdom" has been. The same things that Lost Hillary the nomination in 2008 caused the Koch brothers to plw hundreds of millions of dollars with almost zero results in the past 2 election cycles.
Hillary's "brain trust" -- I love the irony of that phrase -- honestly believe that the campaign can be split into two distinct phases. The first phase uses every dirty tactic to grind the Sanders contingent into the pavement. And the second phase magically becomes one big happy family. Ask Mittens how well his "Etch-a-Sketch" strategy worked out.
The fundamental issue is that we don't take our direction from party bosses anymore. We don't care when the newspapers have to say and don't give a damn about any other endorsements. And for that matter, we mostly tune out the political ads on teevee now. This is a peer-to-peer world now. it is not just the "social media" (more accurately called anti-social media, I would think.) But if you are like me, you are receiving lost of emails from friends and associates who want to have a genuine conversation about this issue or that.
"Political 'Science' ", such as it is, cannot deal with peer-to-peer communications. The very bedrock of Political "Science" is a top-down hierarchy where campaigns can drive messages. That isn't how the world works today.
The upshot is that a month ago, I thought this would be an easy win for Hillary. Now I seriously doubt that she will win. She is running an LBJ-style campaign in a Twitter-Uber-LinkedIn-DemocraticUnderground world. Not very smart.
840high
(17,196 posts)Ferd Berfel
(3,687 posts)she should pull up her big girl pants and own the responsibility for this.
tex-wyo-dem
(3,190 posts)She's got sky high negatives, people don't trust her, she's got a serious issue with a federal investigation that will either sink her in the GE or while she is in office. If the presumptive GOP nominee weren't even worse with regards to negatives, she would be polling way behind. On top of that, she's running a disturbingly putrid and corrupt campaign against Bernie, with DWS and the DNC tilting the playing field and the snake Brock running whisper campaigns and narratives that Bernie is a racist, sexist, a mysogonist...everything that is the exact opposite of what the man stands for (perfectly Rovian to attack your opponent's strengths).
So sorry, Hillary, if you don't understand why Bernie supporters aren't tripping over themselves to join the Clinton parade...you did this to yourself.
onehandle
(51,122 posts)[img]
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Fritz Walter
(4,291 posts)Armstead
(47,803 posts)Fritz Walter
(4,291 posts)$300,000 from fossil fuel employees and lobbyists may seem like pocket change to Her Majesty,.. But not to me. Nor to Greenpeace, and many others.
http://www.politico.com/blogs/2016-dem-primary-live-updates-and-results/2016/03/hillary-clinton-bernie-sanders-campaign-lies-221434
still_one
(92,231 posts)gossip journalism, and focus on the general election.
Actually, there is very little to gain from the General Discussion : Primary group at this stage, since 95% of the threads are Hillary bashing threads, and rants of "why trump will win if Hillary is the nominee"
This group is just a trash bin now
dchill
(38,505 posts)Yet here you are!
Silver_Witch
(1,820 posts)Interesting. Must be very very important to you after all - or you like to root through the trash?
Hortensis
(58,785 posts)that I've switched DU to "personal GE" mode. Have fun tomorrow.
yuiyoshida
(41,832 posts)don't call my house, you will be wasting your dime.
frylock
(34,825 posts)
dchill
(38,505 posts)JRLeft
(7,010 posts)😂😂😂😂😂
pangaia
(24,324 posts)Easy for me to say, 'bring it on,' sitting in the safety of my home type, type, typing.
It is Bernie out there fighting....
Nevertheless,, "BRING IT ON."!!
Another $10 to Bernie.
JRLeft
(7,010 posts)tonyt53
(5,737 posts)frylock
(34,825 posts)
cwydro
(51,308 posts)I'm a Clinton supporter who would cheerfully vote for Sanders if he were the nominee.
I no longer like him as much as I once did, but I would vote for him without hesitation.
He won't be the nominee however.
Sad to hear someone say they "welcome hatred." I'm so glad I don't live my life that way.
JRLeft
(7,010 posts)pangaia
(24,324 posts)It is not a chosen position, but it is an extraordinarily noble position.
jeepers
(314 posts)jeff47
(26,549 posts)
grasswire
(50,130 posts)He was talking about Wall Street. He said "I welcome their hatred."
It is an historical reference.
cwydro
(51,308 posts)Nor do his supporters.
pdsimdars
(6,007 posts)RichVRichV
(885 posts)* The right to a useful and remunerative job in the industries or shops or farms or mines of the nation;
* The right to earn enough to provide adequate food and clothing and recreation;
* The right of every farmer to raise and sell his products at a return which will give him and his family a decent living;
* The right of every businessman, large and small, to trade in an atmosphere of freedom from unfair competition and domination by monopolies at home or abroad;
* The right of every family to a decent home;
* The right to adequate medical care and the opportunity to achieve and enjoy good health;
* The right to adequate protection from the economic fears of old age, sickness, accident, and unemployment;
* The right to a good education.
Now compare that to Bernie's platform. I'll hold my breath in baited anticipation of you finding no parallels.
vintx
(1,748 posts)senz
(11,945 posts)in many, many a decade.
Wait till he gets in office. You'll notice the resemblance then. 
passiveporcupine
(8,175 posts)OK, now I'm beginning to think you aren't being quite truthful when you say you don't hate anyone. To be so blind to who and what Bernie stands for, you have to have clouded judgement that is coming from a large case of too much emotion.
Ikonoklast
(23,973 posts)You do know that it was HRC who famously said that.
She was talking about Wall Street. She said "I welcome their money."
It is an historical reference.
Fairgo
(1,571 posts)four words say it all
Zorro
(15,740 posts)Thanks.
Fumesucker
(45,851 posts)Zorro
(15,740 posts)Hmmmm. Seems that a lot of people believe those are her actual words when they're not.
passiveporcupine
(8,175 posts)It's a pretty good analogy of where she stands on the money issue though.
arikara
(5,562 posts)and a good one at that.
Codeine
(25,586 posts)but Bernie Sanders isn't one of them. I'd have happily voted for him had my candidate lost -- I've spent my entire life backing primary losers! 
Voting for The Other Guy is the story of my life.
I'm unhappy with the attempts to delegitimize her win but a lot of this has to do with people new to politics and so invested in their choice that they're gutted to lose.
Personally I never invest anything in a candidate because it feels silly to me to have heroes in that realm, so I can't really relate to this kind of whackadoodle overreaction. Maybe that's part of the problem. 
It'll all be over soon and Sanders will be busy campaigning for Clinton. Maybe then we can put this nastiness behind us.
Surya Gayatri
(15,445 posts)
kerry-is-my-prez
(8,133 posts)stars in my eyes.
Surya Gayatri
(15,445 posts)Nixon, if you can believe it.
Fortunately, I was nowhere near old enough to vote! LOL!
A mere four years later, at 18, I became a Dem. convert during my first year at university.
Have never looked back. Still the only Dem among my RW-nut family, though.
kerry-is-my-prez
(8,133 posts)When I was in my 20s I became a Democrat.
bettyellen
(47,209 posts)House of Cards come to life for some people. It's 90% shared delusion at this point.
GeorgiaPeanuts
(2,353 posts)bettyellen
(47,209 posts)Not working out so well, is it?
GeorgiaPeanuts
(2,353 posts)
How about don't come for someone with the accusations of Orwellian/V for Vendetta (as you clearly were implying they are negative).
If you knew your herstory you wouldn't have made such a fool of yourself twice
bettyellen
(47,209 posts)spewing of Orwell quotes and non stop conspiracy theories pretty sophomoric. When you have to go back to WW2 to praise a Democrat, you're pretty desperate to canonize people who do not deserve it. Spare us your drama.
GeorgiaPeanuts
(2,353 posts)He was the most popular President ever... It is because of him that we now have term limits on the presidency.
bettyellen
(47,209 posts)matter to many here- that much is crystal clear. The best thing FDR did to advance opportunity for women was to send thousands of men to their brutal deaths. Ironic, that such a "war monger" would be lauded here.
That Guy 888
(1,214 posts)So we should have continued to sell Japan war material to expand their Greater East Asia Co-Prosperity Sphere? Or after Japan attacked us at Pearl Harbor, in part because we embargoed war material, we should have sued for peace?
World War Two was one of our few wars that wasn't a war of choice. When it was over, we did a better job nation building than the gop, or the Clintons.
pinebox
(5,761 posts)You say "the best thing FDR did to advance opportunity for women was to send thousands of men to their brutal deaths: yet fail to realize that without us, Germany would have won and all POC wouldn't probably even be around right now. They would have been sent to Auschwitz, Dachau and other places like Treblinka.
That's some serious disconnect you have going on.
swag
(26,487 posts)bettyellen
(47,209 posts)I figure if you're going to sully this joint with old quotes, you might as well FUCK them up a bit.
Hortensis
(58,785 posts)grab for a well known hero FDR, who actually showed most of the Bernie types the door back then because he had every intention of protecting the "establishment" at all levels of society from anything like "revolution." He was the very definition of an old-money establishment figure with a bone-deep elitist conceit.
Btw, Bettyellen, his record on Jews is also absolutely terrible. Sure, Hitler's use of the Wehrmacht to help out the Holocaust was a real advantage to us militarily, and no doubt helped save many American servicemen's lives, but as is best known he never bombed a single railroad track to slow those trains down. Jewish groups begged and begged for years for any help at all. At one point he told one of their leaders they should be grateful to be allowed to live in the U.S. (American citizens!)
Ardent SBSers, the hero you need may be Henry Wallace, although there were other activists even farther left. He was FDR's VP 1940-44, but (fortunately, unfortunately?) FDR was not sympathetic enough to his stronger version of progressivism, which made FDR's look downright squishy and staid. In 1944, the large conservative wings of the party were strongly opposed to Wallace, and there were other Wallace issues, so FDR did not support him in his run against far more conservative Harry Truman. Truman of course won the VP slot on the ticket, Wallace ran for president as the Progressive Party candidate against FDR and lost, and then FDR died shortly after being sworn in (without meeting even once with Truman to try to prepare him).
I'm a Truman admirer, actually, but that Wallace never served as president at some point may well be an American tragedy. He was quite a guy, and also a civil rights activist long before white politicians would see any advantage to having their pictures taken with black leaders. He did break with progressives to support the Korean War though...
A liberal knows that the only certainty in this life is change but believes that the change can be directed toward a constructive end. -- Henry Wallace
Surya Gayatri
(15,445 posts)
bettyellen
(47,209 posts)blind rage about shit they gave every dude on the planet a pass for.... interesting to watch the mob try and rationalize their ugly behavior.
Surya Gayatri
(15,445 posts)bettyellen
(47,209 posts)Surya Gayatri
(15,445 posts)
7wo7rees
(5,128 posts)Bernie groups and in video/media.
To hear him speak so long ago about what is happening now is incredibly moving. Tks for sharing!
Hortensis
(58,785 posts)FDR said he welcomed the hate from the implacable opposition of both hard-core conservatives and also from those bitter, angry left-wing radicals who felt his reforms were a failure of duty for not going far enough. Believe me, their attitudes toward FDR then were just as nasty and hostile as those of the worst Bernie supporters toward Hillary today
Liberals and progressive conservatives were the groups that supported him and his New Deal.
I read history too, and not just to mine it for bits to support my preconceptions.
grasswire
(50,130 posts)You don't.
You are embarrassing yourself.
bettyellen
(47,209 posts)I get how some people only see the slivers of history that are about THEM. I don't have the luxury of these romantic illusions about that period in history.
jeff47
(26,549 posts)grasswire
(50,130 posts)And now you are trying to weasel out of that.
bettyellen
(47,209 posts)criticizing Hillary unfairly. The woman hurt his feelings so he had to lash out and say things he did not believe- that is sort of emblematic of this whole campaign. So many memes, so much childish behavior.
grasswire
(50,130 posts)AND THAT IS EMBLEMATIC OF HIS CAMPAIGN??
Oh my gawd.
Do you realize the campaign that Bernie could have chosen to run against her highness?
She's the one with the touchy fee fees.
bettyellen
(47,209 posts)be POTUS, his campaign has shown that much.
grasswire
(50,130 posts)there's just no hope for those who will not see
bettyellen
(47,209 posts)vintx
(1,748 posts)Well done, be proud
jonestonesusa
(880 posts)and there may have been some minor black writers who benefited from WPA programs under FDR, let's see... Zora Neale Hurston, Langston Hughes, pretty obscure...
I may have heard something about narratives of black men and women who survived slavery being recorded for future generations during the FDR era...but naaahh, Sanders made me white, so what do I know??
You probably get my point by now, that the either/or thinking about FDR and race in this campaign season is full of questionable generalities. Nobody is going to mistake FDR for Malcolm X. But there are some policy principles of the New Deal that would do some good in the 2010s for all populations, including the emphasis on infrastructure building, funding for the arts, some degree of support for collective bargaining, and a modicum of income security. None of them are cure-alls, but there is no cure-all for a 400-year legacy of racial injustice. Not Sanders, and definitely not Clinton.
kerry-is-my-prez
(8,133 posts)seekthetruth
(504 posts)Environmental damage, more war, and more support for the upper class?
Surya Gayatri
(15,445 posts) pdsimdars
(6,007 posts)This is why I don't believe you. Your empty rhetoric. What POLICIES of hers do you prefer over Bernie's?
The way I see it is this, you are making this "story line" up. If you really believe what you say, you would be able to explain WHICH issues of hers you agree with and how you prefer her position to Bernie's.
Because from our side we are sick and tired of all the lies, insincerity and nonsense. Not to mention all the smears, voting mischief and swift boating. That is not the way a strong candidate runs. Neither you nor Hillary can stand up for her positions.
Hortensis
(58,785 posts)passiveporcupine
(8,175 posts)You are a rare breed.
Many here hate Bernie with a white hot passion. And his supporters. They don't want us in their party, and there's a good reason for that. We don't represent what Hill camp wants in the party. We have two totally different ideologies of where we want this country to go.
Just found an excellent article (blog?)...and I'm going to post a lot of snippets...no complete paragraphs, and there is a LOT more at the link...to give everyone the gist of the article. It's a very good read and I suggest everyone go to the link and read it. Yeah...I know...TLDR. That is a shame when something as important as what is going on in this country right now takes more than a few words to really explain...but here goes:
Sanders and Clinton represent two very different ideologies.
between the 1930’s and the 1970’s, the United States drastically reduced economic inequality. It redistributed wealth from the top to the middle and the bottom, resulting in consistent wage increases and consequently consistent consumption increases.
in the 70’s there were two oil shocks, in which the price of oil went up very rapidly
the right co-opted the oil crisis to claim that the entire project of balancing investment with consumption was fundamentally mistaken, that the problem was that there was not enough investment and too much consumption.
in 1976 with Jimmy Carter, the Democratic Party was captured by this same ideology, which in academic circles is often referred to as neoliberalism. It is now largely forgotten that it was Carter, not Reagan, who began deregulating the market.
Bill Clinton took the party even further to the right. In 1992 he ran on the promise to “end welfare as we know it”, a total repudiation of the FDR/LBJ legacy. With the help of republicans, Clinton was eventually successful in drastically cutting the welfare program. Clinton also signed important deregulatory bills into law, like the Commodities Futures Modernization Act and the Gramm-Leach-Bliley Act.
Wealth inequality, which decreased under FDR, Truman, JFK, and LBJ, increased under Carter, Clinton, and Obama:
On economic policy, contemporary establishment democrats have more in common with contemporary republicans than they do with the FDR/LBJ democrats.
Instead of eliminating inequality and poverty to fuel the capitalist system and produce strong economic growth, establishment democrats now largely agree with establishment republicans that the problem is a lack of support for business investment.
(Bernie) is running to take the Democratic Party back from an establishment that ignores the fundamental systemic economic problems that lead to wage stagnation and economic crisis.
In the years since 2008, many Americans, in particular young people, are willing to consider the possibility that neoliberalism–the economic ideology espoused by both the post-Reagan republicans and the post-Carter Clinton-era democrats–is fundamentally flawed and must be revised or potentially replaced entirely.
This is not a contest to see who will lead the democrats, it’s a contest to see what kind of party the democrats are going to be in the coming decades, what ideology and what interests, causes, and issues the Democratic Party will prioritize.
This is about whether the Democratic Party is going to care about inequality for the next decade. We are making a historical decision between two distinct ideological paradigms
https://benjaminstudebaker.com/2016/02/05/why-bernie-vs-hillary-matters-more-than-people-think/
Please go to the link and read it all, and maybe it will explain why the divide in this party is becoming so heated. Hill camp doesn't think there is much difference between her and Bernie, but they could not be more wrong.
notadmblnd
(23,720 posts)
BillZBubb
(10,650 posts)Nah!
pdsimdars
(6,007 posts)JRLeft
(7,010 posts)In that case the onus is on herself.
It's like, "Go fuck yourself and help me out here."
JRLeft
(7,010 posts)😂😂😂😂😂
He won't do it though, he's going to make sure he has a big influence on the party platform and force her to add at least 3 of his positions.
pdsimdars
(6,007 posts)
redstateblues
(10,565 posts)Start getting used to it
JRLeft
(7,010 posts)jeff47
(26,549 posts)Remember how you keep talking about the massive number of endorsements Clinton has? If endorsements carried the weight you think they do, every Sanders supporter would have already switched.
Sanders supporters are not backing Sanders. They are backing his policies. An endorsement does not change that. Only policies will.
socialist_n_TN
(11,481 posts)they are backing his policies. That's something that a lot of Team "D" people don't get. It's not about Team "D", it's about what the nominee believes in and supports.
vintx
(1,748 posts)pangaia
(24,324 posts)
BillZBubb
(10,650 posts)Bernie's not a Democrat when she's trying to win a primary. Bernie is a Democrat when she needs him to convince Democrats to vote for her in the GE.
Whatever benefits Hillary the most is the truth at that moment. Always has been, always will be.
JRLeft
(7,010 posts)lumberjack_jeff
(33,224 posts)bvf
(6,604 posts)that Clinton can't walk and chew gum at the same time, politically speaking.
Yes, this ain't over yet.
frylock
(34,825 posts)yourpaljoey
(2,166 posts)redstateblues
(10,565 posts)And he's having a hard time dealing with it
pangaia
(24,324 posts)He knew what he was up against and what would come..
Clinton has NOT won, and is having a horrendous time dealing with THAT.
brush
(53,792 posts)pangaia
(24,324 posts) brush
(53,792 posts)redstateblues
(10,565 posts)And it still won't be true. Bernie is creating false hope to keep the money rolling in. What is Tad's %? 5%? Bernie has made him and Weaver 1% ers. Getting rich railing at the wealthy. Nice work if you can get it.
pangaia
(24,324 posts)I feel you greatly misjudge the man.
I keep contributing as I can and I know absolutely why I do it.
pdsimdars
(6,007 posts)
.
Response to GeorgiaPeanuts (Original post)
NowSam This message was self-deleted by its author.
pangaia
(24,324 posts)And also why he won't quit.
CountAllVotes
(20,876 posts)n/t
GreenPartyVoter
(72,378 posts)
redstateblues
(10,565 posts)I know you're having a hard time dealing with it. I would be frustrated too
jeff47
(26,549 posts)I know you're having a hard time remembering that the primary is not the end of the 2016 election. I would to, looking at every poll showing a rabid yam like Trump is doing well against your chosen candidate.
redstateblues
(10,565 posts)On the middle class and his numbers would be in the teens. The last democrat to run on raising taxes on the middle class was Walter Mondale. He won one state
jeff47
(26,549 posts)As well as the upcoming October Surprises about the Clinton foundation.
And how has the "we agree with the Republicans and will cut taxes on everyone" worked for us? Lost both houses, an enormous number of governorships, and an even larger swath of state legislatures.
Perhaps you should stop shuddering in fear of Mondale and actually pay attention to what has happened more recently.
redstateblues
(10,565 posts)jeff47
(26,549 posts)Oh wait! There is.
Man, it sure would suck for me to pay $4k more a year in taxes, and $12k per year less in insurance premiums and deductibles. It would be awful for that money to go to the evil terrible government instead of the benevolent gods at Blue Cross.
redstateblues
(10,565 posts)Bernie would be a sitting duck in the GE
jeff47
(26,549 posts)following your advice to run on Reagan's talking points?
Divernan
(15,480 posts)In the words of Alice Roosevelt Longworth, sit right down next to me and share!
Is the Clinton Foundation being dragged in to the FBI investigation of Hill's emails? Or maybe the surprise relates to this connection? http://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2015/feb/10/hillary-clinton-foundation-donors-hsbc-swiss-bank?CMP=edit_2221
A new report found that the Clinton Foundation has received more than $81 million from clients of HSBC – the controversial British bank recently accused of helping “hide millions of dollars for drug traffickers, arms dealers and celebrities as it assisted wealthy people around the world dodge taxes.”
One individual mentioned in the HSBC files was Canadian mining magnate Frank Giustra, who has given upwards of $50 million (!) to the Clinton Foundation. Giustra will be speaking at today’s Clinton Global Initiative (CGI) meeting and was important enough to have his photo placed next to Chelsea and Bill Clinton’s on CGI’s website. Another Clinton foundation donor who had a HSBC account in the tax haven is Jeffrey Epstein, the billionaire hedge fund manager and convicted sex offender who once flew the former president on his private jet for charity events in Africa.
The identities of Clinton supporters who banked with HSBC in Geneva are contained in internal bank data leaked by a HSBC computer expert turned whistleblower, Hervé Falciani.
The leaked files have now been obtained through an international collaboration of news outlets, including the Guardian, the French daily Le Monde, CBS’s 60 Minutes and the Washington-based International Consortium of Investigative Journalists.
Asked to comment on the questionable funding sources, “A spokesperson for Hillary Clinton declined to comment about her family foundation’s receipt of money from donors with accounts in Geneva.”
jeff47
(26,549 posts)This is the Republicans we are talking about. They'll be able to find plenty that looks really bad, whether or not it is true. And the media will happily amplify the attacks.
And we only need to look at Clinton's response to the emails to see just how poorly she will handle it - she literally interrupted the firestorm over the Republican letter to Iran in order to remind everyone about her emails.
bvf
(6,604 posts)tex-wyo-dem
(3,190 posts)Expanded to the CF dealings while Hillary was SoS. One wonders what was in those 30k emails that Hillary tried to delete, only to be found later by investigators on the cloud. Perhaps a lot of information regarding the CF opening more doors of investigation.
Divernan
(15,480 posts)http://www.wsj.com/articles/clinton-charity-aided-clinton-friends-1463086383
Clinton Charity Aided Clinton Friends
A $2 million commitment arranged by the nonprofit Clinton Global Initiative in 2010 went to a for-profit company part-owned by friends of the Clintons
By James V. Grimaldi
May 12, 2016 4:53 p.m. ET
HASTINGS, Neb.—The Clinton Global Initiative, which arranges donations to help solve the world’s problems, set up a financial commitment that benefited a for-profit company part-owned by people with ties to the Clintons, including a close friend of former president, Bill Clinton.
At Bill Clinton's behest, a $2 million commitment for Energy Pioneer Solutions was placed on the agenda during a September 2010 conference of the Clinton Global Initiative. As it turns out, the commitment is a bit of an issue...
At the heart of the issue is the foundation sent funding to a company that had significant ties to the Clinton family according to the WSJ. The IRS website states that any 501(c)(3) should not be operated for the benefit of private interests.
(The WSJ explains the connections)
Energy Pioneer Solutions was founded in 2009 by Scott Kleeb, a Democrat who twice ran for Congress from Nebraska. An internal document from that year showed it as owned 29% by Mr. Kleeb; 29% by Jane Eckert, the owner of an art gallery in Pine Plains, N.Y.; and 29% by Julie Tauber McMahon of Chappaqua, N.Y., a close friend of Mr. Clinton, who also lives in Chappaqua.
pangaia
(24,324 posts)He has ripped the curtain back, and more and more people are seeing what a hodisgusting sham American politics is.
THIS is what has Hillary Clinton and all the rest of TPTB frightened and really, really pissed off. They are vicious, vicious people who will fight to the political death to avoid giving up what they have.
reformist2
(9,841 posts)
Waiting For Everyman
(9,385 posts)Truth is, she figured she could do it all by force. Cheat her way through and then force us to accept and like it. Bernie too.
I'd say that was a major miscalculation on her part.
Zorra
(27,670 posts)Larkspur
(12,804 posts)of not voting for HRC in the GE.
I'm a Democrat and active in my local Dem committee. The arrogance and sense of entitlement of the HRC camp disgusts me.
I was going to hold my nose in the GE and vote for HRC as that she is nothing more to me than the lesser of 2 evils but after the NV Dem convention when HRC surrogates lied and fanned the flames of protest against them, I am leaning towards not voting for HRC for Prez.
redstateblues
(10,565 posts)I lived through Nixon's era. Calling Hillary Nixon is way over the top. There is no comparison. The lies told against Hillary are repeated every day here. Bernie is just as much of a politician as anyone else who has been in Washington for 25 years
panader0
(25,816 posts)Entitled to what? Health care, a decent job, education, ending the needless wars?
Please explain what the sense of entitlement is you are referring to.
Larkspur
(12,804 posts)How many snipers were actually shooting at her when she was First Lady?
jeff47
(26,549 posts)for Clinton to win over the voters she needs in the general.
It's too bad nobody mentioned this before....oh wait! Lots of people did.
okieinpain
(9,397 posts) "national party. Other Sanders complaints are specious: You don’t have to like closed primaries, but they were established long before Sanders came along, and acting like they “disenfranchise” his independent or non-aligned voters is an insult to the mostly African-American and poor people who are truly disenfranchised in this country. Still, several states, including New York, make it ridiculously hard to change your registration and become a Democrat. There’s plenty of room for reform to make the party more inclusive."
[link:http://www.thenation.com/article/bernie-sanders-is-hurting-himself-by-playing-the-victim/|]
DookDook
(166 posts)Instead of hiring people to troll other people online, they could have hired people to get her message out. They could have hired people and given them a list of responses to posts that they may run across online. Instead they wanted to paint Bernie as a loon and his followers as a bunch of sexist young men that only were pulling for him because free stuff and a hatred of females. They wanted the people who supported Bernie Sanders to give up hope and just resign themselves to 'moving up the Hill' or something.
Merryland
(1,134 posts)she has no message. It is "I'm with Her" if it's anything. She is a national joke & disgrace.
DookDook
(166 posts)Well I guess now the message would be, "I'm not Trump!"
I'm in total agreement with you, I think she would govern the same way that President Bill Clinton made important policy decisions, popular poll, because that is the third-way. I remember when President Clinton was sworn in and he very quickly went back on three of his major campaign promises because they would have cost him too much political capital at the time. I am sure that it will be the same with Secretary Clinton if she wins the GE, well, if she had made any promises, I don't think she will and if she does promise anything I'm sure it'll be worded in such a way that she'll be able to go either left or right of the issue, again the thirdway.
We need someone to lead us, not someone who is going to ask where we want to go. My wife pointed out to me years ago that with all the wars that this country fights it's amazing that we civilians are never asked to sacrifice anything. When America fought wars in the past the citizenry used to be on rations and they'd have tin drives, food drives, victory gardens, all that stuff. Even Hollywood got involved and had the actors pitch in and do those bits about buying war bonds...But you don't see any of that anymore. After 9/11 we were told to 'go shopping.' Why weren't we told to conserve gas and learn to knit so that we wouldn't be so dependent on Mideast oil? Or do anything different so that we could be more energy independent? But change is hard so we'll just march right off this cliff.
Bernie at least is telling us what we'll have to sacrifice (some of our money) so that we can get a stronger safety net, affordable college, a future to believe in...
WolverineDG
(22,298 posts)& telling them they'll go to a special place in hell for not voting for a woman. 
Vattel
(9,289 posts)CrowCityDem
(2,348 posts)How is Hillary supposed to unite the party when this is over, if there is a sizeable portion of Bernie's supporters who believe that the nomination was stolen from him? Bernie does nothing to discourage that line of thinking, so can they ever accept Hillary when Bernie turns around and tells them that they need to vote for her in November?
That's where the anger comes from. It's not that Bernie is still running, it's that the last month has become a wholesale assault on the very legitimacy of the primary process. Using Bernie's own words, he's made the argument that Hillary wouldn't be a legitimate nominee. That can't be walked back easily.
grasswire
(50,130 posts)How can there be change if there is kumbaya at the end of the fight for it?
CrowCityDem
(2,348 posts)grasswire
(50,130 posts)HE is the one who can stop Trump.
The longer people are exposed to her, the more they dislike and distrust her.
And it's not because Bernie has been mildly critical of her judgment.
She has always done it to herself.
AgerolanAmerican
(1,000 posts)She has doomed us to lose the general election with her actions.
If she wanted to unite the party, her opportunity came and went when voting irregularities that inured to her favor happened with no expression of concern on her part. The lack of any statement to the effect that the integrity of elections is vital to the democratic process was poison in the well.
When the time came for Clinton to stand up and back our right to have a voice in our own governance, she kept her butt firmly planted in her seat.
The consequence of that lack of support for the most basic principles of democracy is that her victory - should she actually consummate it - will not be seen as legitimate.
Contrast this to the GOP where none of the defeated candidates had any gripes whatsoever about the integrity of the process.
JPnoodleman
(454 posts)There is at this point a massive trust gap between the Clinton name and the Left. The Clinton's have played punch the left for a long time now and have done a LOT of things to engender animosity with the Left.
Plus her image as a cold calculating political robot who says and does anything to gain power is strongly cemented. Hillary has made terrible policy decisions and has terrible friends and allies whom we all believe will be whispering in her ear.
Her biggest challenge is her credibility on Progressive Issues and the Class issues brought up by the Sanders run. She has sworn herself to not doing shit about Health Care, and likely nothing about Student Debt, the two quickest measures for rallying the youth vote right now. But even if she said she would get "Student Debt forgiveness," or fight for it, the main issue would be "Can we honestly believe a word she says?"
Hillary has to fix her credibility problem.
lumberjack_jeff
(33,224 posts)That win wasn't legitimate. It's not incumbent on Sanders to "walk back" the truth.
When they lose California (like every other west coast state), they should do so graciously and do a strong outreach here to understand what it is that we want in the general. To the extent that this is possible, (trust isn't something she's gonna get) she needs to promise those things at the convention.
Unlike the old south (despite their value to the primary), she will need strong support in these blue states to win a general election.
Waiting For Everyman
(9,385 posts)to make her look good. Not that we would believe it and fall in line.
It's not only against his character to lie like that, he knows it wouldn't do any good.
Image and memes won't cut it with Bernie people. Reality does. We saw that for ourselves.
That Guy 888
(1,214 posts)It isn't about Sanders, it's about the DNC and Clinton.
440 of 700+ super delegates supported Clinton before a vote was cast.
Debbie Wasserman Schultz far from being an impartial DNC head, has sided with Clinton on every decision she could.
Those tremendous advantages weren't enough for Clinton. During the primary her campaign(not somebody on DU or twitter) insulted Sanders supporters at every turn. Racist, sexist, "girls following boys to Sanders", niave, childish, violent chair throwers(when not one chair was thrown),etc. etc. etc.
arikara
(5,562 posts)According to her she has no intention to unite the party, she already said she doesn't need to make concessions to the left if she "wins". She's evidently more interested in courting moderate Republicans now and thinks she doesn't need Bernie supporters.
CrowCityDem
(2,348 posts)
mmonk
(52,589 posts)AgerolanAmerican
(1,000 posts)arikara
(5,562 posts)If she had ran her campaign with grace and dignity instead of with smears, lies, dirty tricks and entitlement, this could have a different story. If she truly planned to represent the citizens instead of the 1% it would have been a different story. She short sheeted her own bed, now she has no choice but to lie in it.
ThePhilosopher04
(1,732 posts)if she can't handle playing through final horn she needs to go play intramurals. She's not tough enough to be President.
grasswire
(50,130 posts)Her default position.
Wahh!
ThePhilosopher04
(1,732 posts)trudyco
(1,258 posts)She was the front runner. Had the Superdelegates lined up. The head of the DNC used to be her co-chair. Had a sweet deal with DNC and Hillary Victory Fund. Had the name recognition. Strangely had vote counts turn out better than exit polls in almost every state with electronic voting machines. Big donors.
She's real tough when it's brown skinned people on the other side of the world she's letting get killed.
Where's that toughness now?
Maybe somebody is mad at themselves? Over stupid emails maybe? Taking it out on the guy who has treated her with the utmost respect and kid gloves - much more than she showed him?d
Women can get ahead without playing the victim card. This Damsel in Distress stuff is old. Be a leader.
MisterP
(23,730 posts)BillZBubb
(10,650 posts)Her Majesty is furious!!! What a laugh.
You want to know why this is happening Ms. Golden Sacks? Look in the mirror.
BernieforPres2016
(3,017 posts)Nothing Bernie says could further alienate me from Hillary. I've detested her since her Stand by Your Man appearance on 60 Minutes 25 years ago.
TheProgressive
(1,656 posts)Are the 'little people' getting in her majesty's way?
Clinton would be disgusting and dangerous as President.
CharlotteVale
(2,717 posts)bettyellen
(47,209 posts)No one can take your bullshit rants lifted from B movies and Orwell novels seriously.
GeorgiaPeanuts
(2,353 posts)He is only the greatest Democrat to ever walk this earth. So take your forked tongue and slither it elsewhere.
bettyellen
(47,209 posts)but that's okay I guess. All of that was so awesome for my Dad who served, and for my future.
grasswire
(50,130 posts)bettyellen
(47,209 posts)grasswire
(50,130 posts)
Raster
(20,998 posts)Rex
(65,616 posts)Are you going there now, just because of some silly HRC vs BS argument?
bettyellen
(47,209 posts)Rex
(65,616 posts)frylock
(34,825 posts)grasswire
(50,130 posts)Goddam. The Democratic Party needs to arrange history lessons for our third wayers.
frylock
(34,825 posts)Where did that come from? I don't recall Goldstein welcoming their hate. Was there a Kevin Costner reboot that I missed?
JPnoodleman
(454 posts)Look, the Clinton consensus of "They have nowhere else to go!" Had to crack at some point, what more fitting time than when one of the Clintons is running.
beachbumbob
(9,263 posts)Sanders is demonstrating a lack of class...At this point in 2008...Hillary did show class...sanders is showing angry old socialist..Almost as if he is being paid off by trump and the Koch brothers..
Fumesucker
(45,851 posts)Buzz cook
(2,472 posts)Don't you folks get tired of dragging out that lie. Oh and kissing tweety's ass at the same time, I'm sure you'll make it a trifecta before too long.
In 2008 the demands that Clinton leave the race were louder and more insistent than anything Sanders is hearing. They were coming from Obama supporters and the main stream media.
And at that time Clinton was much closer to Obama than Sanders will ever be to Clinton.
In 1968 no one was asking Gene McCarty to drop out. No one was asking Bobbie Kennedy to drop out and not one of the minor candidates were asked to drop out either. The campaign ran until June and would have ended at the convention even if Kennedy had not been killed.
The point of Clinton's statement is plainly that the 68 contest went till June with no demands that anyone drop out.
But like any tribal group Sanders supporters want it to be about the assassination, because that helps make Clinton the "other" not a real human. Keep up the good work.
Fumesucker
(45,851 posts)Part of that inherent superiority of Clinton supporters no doubt...
If that was the point Clinton wanted to make by raising the specter of the BK assassination perhaps she should have actually made it rather than leaving her point up to the imagination of the audience.
I like the wistful way she said it too, like she could only be so lucky as for Obama to be taken out of the race.
Buzz cook
(2,472 posts)nt
Shadowflash
(1,536 posts)
grasswire
(50,130 posts)Maedhros
(10,007 posts)seekthetruth
(504 posts)Just an understanding of why we don't support Hillary. And if they just listen and understand, I'm pretty sure a fair amount of them would come over to our side.
hollowdweller
(4,229 posts)grasswire
(50,130 posts)heat -- kitchen
(to use a cliche)
frylock
(34,825 posts)
7wo7rees
(5,128 posts)
MuseRider
(34,111 posts)"combat on the left" to combat FROM the left. Only one lefty here as far as I can tell.
LibDemAlways
(15,139 posts)Hillary Clinton. She accomplished that entirely on her own.
I have a FB friend who is an ardent Hillary fan. Today in response to an article posted by Robert Reich he wrote that Reich and other well known Bernie supporters need to focus on getting Bernie supporters to "enthusiastically" support Hillary. How clueless is he? I can see some Bernie voters holding their noses and voting for her as the lesser of two evils or because they hate Trump, but "enthusiastically" support someone whose campaign has treated their candidate like shit and who is a fierce fighter for the status quo? Will never happen.
If Clinton loses to Trump, it will be because Clinton is a weak candidate. If she fails to earn enough votes to win, that's on her. Not on Bernie.
NewImproved Deal
(534 posts)[link:
|
HughLefty1
(231 posts)Of course that is apparently the Clinton modus operandi. The same playbook they have used on Bill's female victims over the years. They don't unify. They have a history of stealing, silencing, and strong arming others into submission.
SheilaT
(23,156 posts)fucking bad.
She, her surrogates, and her supporters have been quite dismissive of the Bernie people, making in quite clear they don't need us.
Good luck in November.
pdsimdars
(6,007 posts)
islandmkl
(5,275 posts)the lack of historical knowledge gets replaced by a perspective that is poorly informed, even though one might claim to know all about FDR and the years he was President...
i would say when one can only pick a couple of points of perspective (negative, of course) surmising that FDR was some kind of failure...well, you'll have that...
uninformed seems to be the 'new' D's (not recent D's, but Third Way/DLC types) historical perspective...both about the Democratic Party and America itself...
0rganism
(23,957 posts)worst case is if the DNC somehow pisses off SBS enough that he runs 3rd party, handing the presidency to Trump and losing any chance of retaking the Senate.
THAT is the "worst-case scenario".
it still hasn't happened. it still could.
Third Doctor
(1,574 posts)She did that on her own. Especially her dismissive and crass attitude towards people that dare question her. Would I vote for her? Probably but it will be painful and against my core beliefs.
KPN
(15,646 posts)But being a Bernie supporter, I'm not sure that Bernie's statements are making matters worse. He's just continuing to say the things he believes are truthful and has been saying throughout his campaign in the same manner he always has. He's straightforward and concise.
Yeah, he's probably too blunt for those who have a different view or support the other candidate. I guess he can be criticized for that. But it strikes me that blame should be placed instead on a system that has failed to look out for and protect the interests of the common person. Is anyone really surprised that so many feel disenfranchised and screwed today? It's not just Bernie, it's the masses who feel angry with a system that has essentially screwed them and their future -- or their kids future over.
How is it that you are so surprised that these people don't trust the Party's primary process? Are you really surprised that these people are speaking up and making a stand that might even seem like worst case to the "establishment"? Isn't that in fact the point?
If you are surprised, I can only surmise that it's because you are detached from the real world of so very many, or maybe you are just naive. Instead of demonizing Berners, you and the Party would do well to heed their collective voice and perhaps welcome them into the fold.
Bernie can't control these people for you despite what you may think. They've flocked to him because he provides a conduit for their voices. They have a sense of urgency which worked to Bernie's favor, but it also works against the Parties' interest on its own -- with or without Bernie. I think that's what the establishment just doesn't get. Call them Berners, but the disenfranchised masses have a sense of urgency about them that just won't stand by and watch their moribund world expire.
This isn't about this election. It's about much more than that. The Democratic Party will either come to grips with this and genuinely, as well as boldly, welcome Berners into the fold, or it will be left to grapple with the worst case scenario that now confronts them. It seems there really isn't much room between those two options.
nest
(23 posts)They want Bernie to drop out because they want him to shut up. But he won't shut up. He promised us he would go all the way to the convention and Bernie, unlike Hillary, doesn't break his promises. So my promise to Bernie is that I will stick with him 100% of the way.
Buzz cook
(2,472 posts)They love the controversy. Some of the talking heads think Sanders should leave, but that ain't the mainstream media.
felix_numinous
(5,198 posts)spend millions of their precious corporate money, we have but to out last them. Another name for 'The Progressive Movement' is simply Americans who refuse to go along with their criminal enterprises any longer, our numbers are much more vast than they are willing to count legally--because they don't want to face their lack of support.
bkkyosemite
(5,792 posts)and your laundry if you know what I mean...and your confidence since day one that you would win...had it in the bag from day one huh Hillary
Aerows
(39,961 posts)to have ire directed at her campaign and the DNC leadership that has conducted this primary in disgrace.
Clinton supporters are nil in comparison to the machinations that have taken place behind the scenes and the dirty voter suppression, electoral fraud and conniving blind eyes that have turned our Democratic primary into a mockery.
You think lifelong Democrats haven't noticed?
AtomicKitten
(46,585 posts)cherokeeprogressive
(24,853 posts)
KoKo
(84,711 posts)The Key Snips from "The Hill":
“I will be the nominee for my party, Chris,” the former first lady told CNN's Chris Cuomo. “That is already done in effect. There is no way I won't be.”
--------------
“In the past three weeks voters in Indiana, West Virginia and Oregon respectfully disagreed with Secretary Clinton," campaign spokesman Michael Briggs said in a statement. "We expect voters in the remaining eight contests also will disagree."
-------------
"With almost every national and state poll showing Sen. Sanders doing much, much better than Secretary Clinton against Donald Trump, it is clear that millions of Americans have growing doubts about the Clinton campaign," Briggs said in Thursday's statement.
-------------
Democrats continue to point out that the party survived a bitter 2008 primary between Clinton and then-Sen. Barack Obama.
-----------
nruthie
(466 posts)I am just sick of it all at this point. We are squabbling our way right into a Trump victory. If we can't even unite against such a monster then we are pretty much toast aren't we? The
other side is starting to unite against us and here we are spinning our wheels and attacking each other.
DookDook
(166 posts)I've always been amazed at how Republicans will all march in lockstep and engage in purity tests, with their cries of RINO! to anyone who dares disagree with the party line. That was always where the danger lies with them, they are subject to group think, it doesn't matter what the facts are or what the circumstances are they just toe the party line.
Akicita
(1,196 posts)Would have passed years ago. And there wouldn't have been a tea party uprising.
seabeyond
(110,159 posts)Remains presidential.
TheSarcastinator
(854 posts)Lying, deceitful, and nowhere near as smart as she thinks she is.
seabeyond
(110,159 posts)tex-wyo-dem
(3,190 posts)TheSarcastinator
(854 posts)It's her turn!!! Why can't Bernie just get out of the race and let Her Majesty ascend to her rightful throne???
AZ Progressive
(3,411 posts)barrow-wight
(744 posts)That Sanders is so desperate to keep this going even though he knows he's lost is despicable. He'd clearly rather scorch the earth for the Democratic party and see Trump win if it means he can't be president. Yet we're also seeing his supporters in the media and even his superdelegates criticizing him left and right. If that's how his most notable supporters feel, I can only imagine what the party stalwarts have in store for him once he's back to the Senate. My sense is he'll be persona non grata and I don't doubt for a second that they will find a leftist Democrat to run against him in Vermont.
Trajan
(19,089 posts)He is representing tens of millions of American citizens ...
This post is a display of the same cavalier attitude towards Bernie supporters as the campaign shows: Bernie's supporters mean nothing ...
Millions of Democratic Party voters mean nothing to Hillary supporters, as long as they shut up and stand aside ...
Yeah ... A plea for unity there - 'shut the fuck up and get in line!'
Screw that ... Bernie is fighting for the middle class against the greedy billionaires ... Who is Hillary fighting for again?
I stand with Bernie and the rest of those decent, loving, caring Bernie supporters, hoping (REALLY hoping) for a better future for their children and grandchildren ...
No matter HOW HARD IT IS!
barrow-wight
(744 posts)I can't say I share it.
Warren DeMontague
(80,708 posts)Maybe they can find a real ultra-liberal, like one who thinks the minimum wage should be 8 bucks, or someone who thinks pot smokers should only get 2 years in prison instead of 10.
You will cower in fear before the flaming liberal challengers we will throw your way, mister sanders!
barrow-wight
(744 posts)Warren DeMontague
(80,708 posts)barrow-wight
(744 posts)The cold shoulder he'll be getting will be worth the price of admission.
Warren DeMontague
(80,708 posts)He gives us the majority again.
barrow-wight
(744 posts)Yeah, that'll keep him reelected.
Who else is he going to caucus with? He has far more in common with the policy positions of the Democratic Party.
Warren DeMontague
(80,708 posts)Voters again.
I would imagine our senate leadership is smart enough to not give him a giant, peevish "fuck youuuu" because he had the nerve - the nerve!- to challenge Hillary Clinton.
barrow-wight
(744 posts)Warren DeMontague
(80,708 posts)Maybe DWS will, too.
barrow-wight
(744 posts)
KauaiK
(544 posts)Every time they tell him to drop out; every time HRC says I WILL be the nominee, the more I know I with WRITE Bernie's name in.
snowy owl
(2,145 posts)nadinbrzezinski
(154,021 posts)this is not an intra left party conflict, It is a conflict between a center right establishment pol, and a moderately center left politician
southerncrone
(5,506 posts)
snowy owl
(2,145 posts)akbacchus_BC
(5,704 posts)her running until the end. She does not even remember the crap she pulled in 2008. I am glad Bernie is still running until the convention. Trump will win over Hilary if she is the nominee! Most Americans find her unfavourable after being in politics for 30 years and when you see her on TV, you see how fake she is. She is a Wall Street girl, she will never change unless Bernie stays as opposed to Kerry, and hold her feet to the fire to become more left.
ucrdem
(15,512 posts)Betty Karlson
(7,231 posts)
polly7
(20,582 posts)Full video:
"In a Wednesday afternoon statement, Sanders campaign manager Jeff Weaver said the Vermont senator has accepted an invitation from Fox News to debate "with the understanding that we can reach mutual agreement on the debate moderators, the format and other details.”
Weaver said both campaigns in January agreed to hold a debate in May in California, adding that the Clinton campaign has “balked at keeping that pledge.”
“More than half way through the month of May, we hope Secretary Clinton will soon make good on her campaign’s commitment and agree to a time and pace for a debate,” Weaver said in the statement.
“There are issues of enormous importance facing the people of California and our nation and the people of our largest state deserve to hear the Democratic candidates [sic] opinions."
http://thehill.com/blogs/ballot-box/presidential-races/280405-sanders-pushes-clinton-for-debate-in-california
(bbm)
PatrickforO
(14,578 posts)She lost her temper with Obama too. That, you'll recall, is when he said he knew he would win the nomination.
The party is split and until this split is acknowledged and the merits of New Deal type policies are discussed, debated and added to the party platform, and the platforms of candidates, then we're gonna keep having this problem.
I'm like millions of Americans. I like Bernie because of his policies because they would genuinely make my life and the lives of my family better. I don't give a fuck whether you call me a unicorn, or a dreamer or someone clinging to fantasy, these are the things I want my tax money that I pay to my government to be offer. I do NOT believe domestic spying is patriotic, nor is the Patriot Act. The forever war does not help, nor do drone attacks and kill lists. I WANT MY GOVERNMENT THAT I PAY FOR AND THAT SUPPOSEDLY REPRESENTS ME AND THE REST OF THE AMERICAN PEOPLE TO DO STUFF THAT ACTUALLY HELPS US.
Clinton hasn't done very well as the person who will say no, and 'get things done.' Like what? More war? More tax cuts, deregulation, cuts to Social Security?
Nope.
Aerows
(39,961 posts)The major gripe is that the DNC is foisting her off on us with all of her corrupt splendor.
There aren't enough cleaning products in the world to sanitize her campaign.
pdsimdars
(6,007 posts)And she'll have something to be mad about too.
Response to GeorgiaPeanuts (Original post)
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DesertRat
(27,995 posts)And I'm not sure what you mean about her look. What was it that scared you? 
Response to DesertRat (Reply #279)
Name removed Message auto-removed
Response to Name removed (Reply #280)
DesertRat This message was self-deleted by its author.
democrattotheend
(11,605 posts)In 2008, Hillary stayed in the race until 4 days after the last vote had been cast, and spent the time between the last primary and her concession speech feeling out superdelegates to see if she still had a chance despite being behind in pledged delegates at the end of the voting. It was only after she realized the superdelegates weren't stupid enough to take the nomination away from the first black candidate to win a majority of the pledged delegates that she conceded.
Even after her concession speech, it was only a month or two later that it felt like she was fully behind Obama. I don't fault her for that - it was a crushing blow and I think it would take anyone some time to get over it and get behind the person who beat them. But her contention that she got behind Obama right away and asked nothing in return is simply false. It is undisputed that she asked for at least two things in return: help paying down her debt and being formally put up for nomination at the convention. I am not saying either request was unreasonable, but I am irked by her attempts to rewrite history.
