2016 Postmortem
Related: About this forumSanders Warns: Republicans Will Go After Hillary on Clinton Foundation
[link:
|Agschmid
(28,749 posts)CorporatistNation
(2,546 posts)At 2:37 Look for Hillary to admit that she understands "how" emails get on the government system... This proving "how" they ... DO NOT as well... Which is her major problem with the private server... Leading to possible even likely charges of... ESPIONAGE... per Washington, D.C. atty Joe Degenova last week.
Agschmid
(28,749 posts)dchill
(38,493 posts)That's some serious "what is is" action right there!
emulatorloo
(44,124 posts)They are extremely partisan Republicans who have a long history of lying about Democrats. They have never been correct about anything in their lives.
Here's a link:
http://www.sourcewatch.org/index.php?title=Victoria_Toensing
Republican partisan
"Toensing is, of course, not only a pricey DC defense lawyer. She's also a professional Republican, one tightly connected with the DC GOP power structure, and someone you could find at pretty much any point in the late nineties as an anti-Clinton 'legal expert' on every chat show under the sun," Joshua Micah Marshall wrote January 1, 2004, at Talking Points Memo.
"Joe DiGenova (as well as his wife and law partner Victoria Toensing) is a part of the DC Republican establishment who is routinely put forward when legal opinions are needed which exculpate Republicans or inculpate Democrats.
"There's no other way to put it. Look at their public statements in the various Clinton 'scandals', the Fitzgerald investigation and now this case. In their voluminous public pronouncements they are both, in the clearest sense of the word, advocates. And their 'client' is the Republican party establishment in Washington, DC. That's fine, as far as it goes. But they should be identified as such, albeit perhaps in gentler terms, when they provide quotes in papers like the [Washington] Times," Marshall wrote November 25, 2005, at Talking Points Memo.
---------------------------------------------------
Best way to approach DiGenova is to beleive the opposite of what he is saying. He isn't credible.
thesquanderer
(11,989 posts)artislife
(9,497 posts)Jitter65
(3,089 posts)Hoyt
(54,770 posts)pacalo
(24,721 posts)The "spreading of b.s" is on the media.
Well, I consider him to be helping Trump period. He did not have to say that.
Demsrule86
(68,576 posts)He did initiate it.
silvershadow
(10,336 posts)position she is in. Sanders is owed a debt of gratitude he apparently will not get from this party for giving her some shade while she sorts out her legal troubles.
Katashi_itto
(10,175 posts)Spacedog1973
(221 posts)Katashi_itto
(10,175 posts)Spacedog1973
(221 posts)And its weak. You know as well as everyone, that Barnie is a Democrat for expedience only. What does that make you? A Democrat for expedience only as well? You don't get to define what a Democrat is. You are an outlier. When Barnie retires from the race (and given his age he should retire, period), you have no political friends, no political home. You are an independent. Go find a party that meets your extremist naively political views or if there are enough of you, create your own party to form.
Ron Paul is waiting patiently. I'm sure your movement with shake up the status quo and be hugely successful.
v
Katashi_itto
(10,175 posts)Champions of the Status quo are not Democrats.
Considering how many of you low pro Hillary at any cost posters there suddenly are around now I can figure what you really are.
Please feel free to keep digging it deeper
Spacedog1973
(221 posts)Republicans = Conservatives - they conserve the status quo. Democrats are as liberal as America will stand. Its really that simple. As a consequence, they have to move incrementally toward their goal, rather than in some huge step that fails to bring people on board.
You know that a president represents not just those that voted for him/her?
You don't get points for being as liberal as you want and criticise anyone who takes a more inclusive and mature approach. That pushes people away and one of the main reasons why people of your ilk do so badly in convincing the populace of your cause.
1. You don't try to educate. Instead you repeat soundbites, or in Barnie's case, he repeats his stump speech. As if we didn't get it the first time. No, if it didn't work after the 10th time, you don't repeat it. This is common sense.
2. You guys don't know how to make an argument. Whenever you confront someone with a differing view, you accuse them of being 'Champions of the Status Quo' and arrogantly declare them not Democrats. How is that working out for you so far?
3. You guys don't understand the people with whom you live. You can't reach out to POC because you don't know them. You have no one in your lives that you have close that are POC and can't relate to them. You think reaching out, or speaking to their cause is 'pandering'. Your supporters have a huge contingent of racists, misogynists and bigots within the ranks and you as a group absorb them. You continually wonder why and how to get POC into your cause. It is a massive failure and an embarrassment to the democratic movement that for a while we allowed such people into it. I hope going forward you guys take some basic classes in politics and cultural studies in addition to some history - this is nothing to do with politics, I just think its a basic need that has been identified and will benefit not just you, but the POC who live around you.
I'm done digging. The Graveyard keeper will be around any time soon now. I suggest you shout loudly if you haven't dug yourself out by then.
Katashi_itto
(10,175 posts)you copy/paste from.
I suggest for history you guys study the French Aristocracy. Thats the modern day equivalent you tossed your lot in with.
Spacedog1973
(221 posts)The first time someone told me I must have copied and pasted something. Is that because you are reluctantly impressed?
The French aristocracy as opposed to the foundation on which the US was founded? Are you serious? The US was slavery based for a while, that was the basis of its economy. The 'current' Democratic party was the basis of the movement that contributed in stopping it.
An Aristocracy usually (but not exclusively) a by-product of a Royalty based system of which there is none in the US. However, the closest would be the political class, of which Barnie has been in for a number of decades. A trait of the Aristocracy was privilege and uselessness. Completely fitting Barnie to a T.
How many black people do you know who spent time writing fantasy fiction rape in their 30s to then go on to be decade long politicians and later run for president? Another old white guy for president?
I have no database, I just rely on you guys for material and inspiration. Its like arguing with a flat earther. I get no pleasure from it.
Here, to dilute any smugness you might have sensed from this post, have a round of applause for the quality of your post.
v
Katashi_itto
(10,175 posts)But I suppose you must need to make a quota.
Spacedog1973
(221 posts)You don't or cannot argue, then fein offense.
I've never met such a delicate bunch of wilting flowers. Your feelings are hurt at every comment you disagree with. Its 'condescending and smug'. You've mentioned condescending twice now. There must be other words available or maybe you feel that so strongly its worth mentioning again.
Or in respect of a quota you mention, its you that hasn't met it?
Do you need to mention condescending again? Feel free.
v
procon
(15,805 posts)He was a Socialist before he was a Democratic Socialist for convenience.
Demsrule86
(68,576 posts)who need Republicans. He is almost campaigning for the GOP at this point.
Sparkly
(24,149 posts)they simply could not come up with any oppo on Sanders?
If they were worried about him, they'd have used it by now.
grasswire
(50,130 posts)The guy is a square. An old square who has no interest in acquiring money and who genuinely desires that people's needs are met.
silvershadow
(10,336 posts)Sparkly
(24,149 posts)They make sh*t up.
pinebox
(5,761 posts)yourpaljoey
(2,166 posts)musicblind
(4,484 posts)Obama is truly the greatest president of my lifetime. They couldn't come up with anything so they just made crap up. Birthers, truthers, that he was a Muslim, that he was the anti-Christ.
Never underestimate the spitefulness.
If they can't find something on Sanders they will gladly make it up.
Qutzupalotl
(14,311 posts)despite it being pushed hard and constantly. I see no reason to assume made-up stuff will bring Bernie down. If anything, the right's hype has made young voters numb to the idea that socialism and social programs are scary.
Also, Bernie is less constrained about fighting back than the first black president, who had to be at all times on his best behavior and above the fray. But Bernie can mix it up with the best of them.
Skink
(10,122 posts)It's there. We know it.
pinebox
(5,761 posts)Samantha
(9,314 posts)and that is how he is regarded by the voters in Vermont (some of whom are Republicans). They say "He always tells us the truth." Hillary has low numbers in the trustworthy category. So by constantly accusing Bernie of being a liar, they are just trying to negate the advantage he currently holds over Hillary for honesty.
Sam
grasswire
(50,130 posts)It doesn't work with those who already support him. It just makes us donate more money.
silvershadow
(10,336 posts)leverage with him, and no oppo either.
Demsrule86
(68,576 posts)In prior years, the losing primary candidate stopped with the smears and ended his/her candidacy for the good of the party and the country. Sanders, apparently, is cut from different cloth. I can't decide if it is spite ( he hates Clinton because she beat him) or he really thinks by attacking her, he can turn the supers (he won't).
madokie
(51,076 posts)by electing Hillary. Is that what you're implying here?
Sheepshank
(12,504 posts).....and in other breaking news.....
Waiting For Everyman
(9,385 posts)Clinton Foundation, email server, Panama Papers trade agreement, and more. Bernie chose not to. He could have, and he probably would be way ahead now but that isn't who he is.
Trump will go for the jugular, until the Independents run from her in droves. Anyone who thinks he won't is kidding themselves.
grasswire
(50,130 posts)All of it.
A hot mess of money laundering through the Foundation. A rogue foreign policy run out of sight of Obama. Pay to play for arms sales to countries with massive human rights violations.
That will be Trump's breakfast.
creeksneakers2
(7,473 posts)Samantha
(9,314 posts)840high
(17,196 posts)All this was brought on by Hillary herself and Bill. They started crap as early as in Arkansas and kept going.
grasswire
(50,130 posts)They saw how being seen as victims could work for them as a shield, and they have played it extremely well. Whenever their actions catch up with them, they holler VRWC! And their fans take up the hue and cry.
DebDoo
(319 posts)Each time getting more corrupt. And every time Clinton supporters just write it off. I suppose this is actually her best case for incrementalism does work. Pretty soon she could go to Time Square and...
The behavior is more and more risky.
Why must we put up with this? Why? The corruption just stinks.
Demsrule86
(68,576 posts)has done much good in the world...bring it on.
KingFlorez
(12,689 posts)Sanders' past writings (particularly the rape essay) would be the perfect way for Trump to deflect his own comments about women. Sanders is naive if he thinks Republicans wouldn't lay a hand on him.
northernsouthern
(1,511 posts)...they will go after Hillary for laughing about letting a rapist off, and all of the things with her husband. Let them go after Bernie for a 40 year old essay that mentions rape as a way to talk about a sexually dysfunctional society with issues of male power.
KingFlorez
(12,689 posts)My point is that Sanders isn't going to be handled with kid gloves. Republicans can attack any Democrat running and be very effective.
If a Republican wrote an essay like that, Democrats would be all over it and show no mercy. Let's be consistent.
morningfog
(18,115 posts)No one cares what any candidate wrote 40 years ago. Not in the least.
northernsouthern
(1,511 posts)...just the people that fixate over a 40 year old paper...but the much more recent stuff with Hillary and Bill or her case with the rapist she got off. I did a quick search and of the two stories Hillary's case was mentioned in some sites this month, Bernie's was mentioned last year...by NPR...so think what you like, but she is about to get her issues flooded on her. I am pretty sure we will have an add about her being a "Feminist" that frees child r@pists, and an ad that loops her saying "we didn't lose one person in Lybia".
Seeinghope
(786 posts)Whatever Bernie Sanders may have is nothing compared to what Hillary Clinton has starting with the FBI, The Clinton Foundation, The speeches, Her dismal record as Secretary of State.........
KingFlorez
(12,689 posts)Clinton is battled tested enough to handle him.
Seeinghope
(786 posts)morningfog
(18,115 posts)KingFlorez
(12,689 posts)Call a spade a spade.
Kentonio
(4,377 posts)Then suddenly you become incredible shy about saying what's in front of your eyes.
Samantha
(9,314 posts)they are desperate. I can't believe anyone would use something like that written 39 years ago and think it would be harmful today.
Sam
Zambero
(8,964 posts)The Donald has a bigger glass house than even he realizes.
dchill
(38,493 posts)He'd have to commit murder on live TV to lose.
Zambero
(8,964 posts)Holding firm at 9% to 11% favorable in various polls. Mittens managed 27% of this demographic and managed to lose the election handily. But somehow Trump dons magic Teflon and walks away with it? OK then. I'm quite familiar with the folly of Voodoo Economics, but now we are witnessing Voodoo Electoral Logic?
Renew Deal
(81,859 posts)Aspects of his bio.
LiberalFighter
(50,928 posts)underthematrix
(5,811 posts)Be patient he'll get there
grossproffit
(5,591 posts)underthematrix
(5,811 posts)madokie
(51,076 posts)for my first and I mean 'first' morning laugh.
Ferd Berfel
(3,687 posts)the problem is that Clinton has a completely new picnic basket of crap to rummage through
that hasn't hardly been touched.
grasswire
(50,130 posts)Her minions have fallen for this "framing". We see it here every day.
The worst of the matter has happened since 2008. And even worse is planned.
Demsrule86
(68,576 posts)He must know he has lost...how he can he say stuff like that. Honestly, Sanders is a big disappointment to me.
wyldwolf
(43,867 posts)beachbumbob
(9,263 posts)Demsrule86
(68,576 posts)Honestly, there are no words...well Bernie is on ignore for the rest of the primary. He has nothing to say that I want to hear...Just call Trump and compare notes: Bernie-figure out which attacks will work and all.
grossproffit
(5,591 posts)Demsrule86
(68,576 posts)I turn the TV off when he is on. I don't like Jane either. I forced myself to watch the video...and then I was so angry.
what is he thinking?
BootinUp
(47,151 posts)Negative slurs against a humanitarian organization. You suck Bernie.
grasswire
(50,130 posts)...for humanitarian purposes!
A "humanitarian organization" that accepts billions of dollars from foreign leaders with human rights violations galore and ..........miraculously...........Hillary then approves arms sales to those people.
Sick.
Twisted.
Psychopathic.
BootinUp
(47,151 posts)spreading the lie.
grasswire
(50,130 posts)BootinUp
(47,151 posts)NurseJackie
(42,862 posts)Demsrule86
(68,576 posts)Love it...laughed out loud!
Response to Bernie93 (Original post)
Jitter65 This message was self-deleted by its author.
Vote2016
(1,198 posts)skeletons like no nominee we have ever considered.