Is Hillary Clinton 'Honest'?

[eridani]

I personally don't think she's dishonest--she just flip-flops a lot.

http://readersupportednews.org/opinion2/277-75/36534-is-hillary-clinton-honest

In addition, Clinton appears to have learned nothing from her support for the catastrophic Iraq War and has argued against “conflating” her Iraq decision with her Libya decision. But that suggests that she is incapable of learning a lesson from one mistake and applying it to a similar situation, an almost disqualifying characteristic for someone who hopes to become President.

Being a successful President requires extracting painful lessons from one mistake and making sure you don’t make the same mistake again. But Clinton’s personal arrogance or defensiveness (it’s hard to figure out which is dominant) prevents her from that sort of self-criticism.

Indeed, her ritualistic (and politically timed) apology for her Iraq War vote in 2006 came across less as an honest recognition that she had done something horribly wrong than that she had to say something to appease a furious Democratic electorate as she mounted her first run for President against anti-Iraq War candidate Obama.

After losing to Obama and becoming his Secretary of State, she privately hedged her Iraq War apology by saying privately that she thought that President George W. Bush’s “surge” in Iraq was successful and admitting that she had only opposed it in 2007 for political reasons, according to former Defense Secretary Robert Gates in his memoir, Duty.

[apcalc]

1. I believe yes.

[CorporatistNation]

64. Watch THIS and Then Answer Again...

Very Enlightening video here...
Pay2Play

[MADem]

2. Yet another "Dem bashing" thread? You're starting to out yourself with this pattern.

It's not a good look. I'd also lose the "Reader Supported News" garbage--that Trump article was a piece of crap, too.

[eridani]

3. I really don't think that cluster bombs are a traditional Democratic value n/t

[MADem]

7. Well, you're dropping them, with these Yay Trump posts intermingled with Clinton sucks ones. nt

[eridani]

8. Trump discounting American exceptionalism is "boosting" On what planet?

The referenced article analyzes campaign rhetoric going back to Kennedy.

[MADem]

11. Your posts aren't a secret you know. Read what you post--that Trump article wasn't a critique.

It was a paean.

[eridani]

15. That's pure bullshit

If Trump quits acting like an asshole, we could be in real trouble.

[eridani]

18. Explan how the following paragraph is a paean to Trump

So if you look, for instance, at the speeches of John F. Kennedy, you won’t find them littered with exceptionals, indispensables, or their equivalents. In a pre-inaugural speech he gave in January 1961 on the kind of government he planned to bring to Washington, for instance, he did cite the birth of a “great republic,” the United States, and quoted Puritan John Winthrop on the desirability of creating a country that would be “a city upon a hill” to the rest of the world, with all of humanity’s eyes upon us. In his inaugural address (“Ask not what your country can do for you...”), he invoked a kind of unspoken greatness, saying, “We shall pay any price, bear any burden, meet any hardship, support any friend, oppose any foe to assure the survival and the success of liberty.” It was then common to speak of the U.S. with pride as a “free nation” (as opposed to the “enslaved” ones of the communist bloc) rather than an exceptional one. His only use of “great” was to invoke the U.S.-led and Soviet Union-led blocs as “two great and powerful groups of nations.”

[eridani]

20. Clinton was the one peddling Remington merchandise to Saudia Arabia. not me n/t

[Ferd Berfel]

48. Point, Point, and...Point!

[IdaBriggs]

4. Like any practicing attorney, her client is always right.

And she will fight for them diligently. This week. Of course, her other clients were also right which is why she has fought for things that are bad for us like fracking.

She has no commitment to the betterment of the people on the planet - just her bank account.

[Locrian]

19. ding ding

yes. 'her' is the *perfect* embodiment of the "the business of business is business" mantra. As in "anything goes as long as it's the status quo".

In effect - it's like the only thing that matters is winning. And the clients are the only thing that she wins for.
Truth and everything else is just means to an end. "Advertising" and doublespeak are the tools of trade.

And I truly think 'her' believes that is the right way to "get things done" - and everything else is trickle down. She's a free-market-true-believed-faith apostle.

[Svafa]

56. +1

[artislife]

62. +1

[Chasstev365]

5. Anyone who pander as much as Hillary does is not honest

[Ferd Berfel]

49. Changing your opinion due to data - and sticking with the change - is one thing

flip flopping and triangulation are something else again.

[PowerToThePeople]

6. No.

[MrMickeysMom]

9. Does a Polar Bear look for ice to poop, and find that no "front runner" gives a shit?

[baldguy]

10. Moreso than Sanders.

Considering that he's been lying to his own supporters for a year now - and continues to do so.

[grossproffit]

12. $27

[baldguy]

21. Exactly

[Armstead]

50. His supporters aren't stupid

We've always known it was a long shot....I may give some more soon, of he's planning to go through Calfornia.

It's my version of Western Union, sending a message.

[seabeyond]

13. Clinton is the most honest in the race.

[choie]

32. Oh my god you're delusional!

[seabeyond]

35. A fact. They all have been weighed and twice Clinton came up more honest.

Calling people names because you are uninformed is the best you know? Especially calling someone delusional. You believe the smears even when proven wrong. That would be defined as .... ?

[choie]

47. Clinton supporters know about smearing..

[seabeyond]

61. Not even close. Not even.... close.

[Joob]

14. I personally think she represents everything wrong in Democratic Party

but I see that's not the case. Just something wrong with me being in it.

[jfern]

16. Of course not

She told Bernie to apologize for Sandy Hook, and then just went to rural Pennsylvania to talk about how her father taught her to shoot and how great the 2nd amendment is.

[HereSince1628]

17. Let me be very clear... -technically- yes.

and that is precisely what we would expect.

[demwing]

54. Except for when she lies

shes honest when she's not lying

[Live and Learn]

22. Is the earth really flat? nt

[jfern]

23. That depends on the meaning of the word "is"

[djean111]

24. No, she is a Third Way warmongering corporatist, and would say anything in order to gain power.

She is a careless and habitual liar.

Not ever supporting that. If she is the new Democrat, then, quite simply, I must not be a Democrat.

[Katashi_itto]

25. No.

[JackInGreen]

26. I think she thinks she is

Has moments of lucidity, then remembers she has to get her old school pander on, and 'honesty and integrity' go out the window in favor of 'what have I been told to say?'

[elehhhhna]

57. Disagree. She smirks. A lot. And giggles at inappropriate times.

F.e. laughing about killing Quaddafi.

Creeps me out.

[Agnosticsherbet]

27. I think she is complex.

And that no single word will describe her.

[Nonhlanhla]

28. Hillary Clinton is the likely Democratic nominee for president

Moreover, she has been rated by Fact Checkers as the most honest candidate in the race.

Is there a reason why you choose to attack the person who will almost certainly be our presidential nominee, and on false grounds to boot?

[-none]

33. In that case, Fact Checkers should probably check their own facts.

Hillary is well known to say whatever she thinks is expedient at the moment.

Moreover, she has been rated by Fact Checkers as the most honest candidate in the race.

[Nonhlanhla]

36. Politicians all bend to circumstances

Hilary is no worse than the rest, and in fact somewhat better than most.

Your assumption that she "well known to say whatever she thinks is expedient at the moment" is the more result of campaigning against her, than of reality.

[-none]

39. So her reputation has nothing to do with it?

How'd she get it then?

[spooky3]

41. 25 years of Republican smears

[Nonhlanhla]

46. Her "reputation" is the result of 3 decades of GOP smears

starting when she refused to be the traditional type of First Lady.

To be sure, she made some mistakes along the way too, but for heaven's sake, why should she be absolutely 100% perfect if no one else in politics is (or can be)?!

I find it incredibly sad that so many of Bernie's supporters are buying into the GOP smear of Hillary.

I also find it sad that this thread is bashing our likely nominee. Why should we help the GOP win?

[pinebox]

29. No.

[democrattotheend]

30. I think she is somewhat opportunistic, but not dishonest for the most part

That said, I think she is full of shit when she says she did not ask anything of Obama in return for her support. I don't think he promised her Secretary of State at that point (I remember reading that he had to push her to accept when he asked her after the election), but I know that at a minimum, she wanted help paying off campaign debt and she wanted her name placed into nomination at the Democratic National Convention. I am not saying either of those demands were unreasonable, but to rewrite history and say she didn't ask for anything in return is BS.

[George II]

31. What's the point of this? Will it change anything for Sanders or might you turn some away...

...from Clinton toward Trump?

Admit it, Clinton WILL be our nominee. Continuing to tear her down here now only helps the republicans.

Is that what you want?

[mcar]

34. Yes

[Faux pas]

37. Yes!

that is all.

[BernieforPres2016]

38. Is Hillary Clinton honest? LOL, absolutely not. "I remember being under sniper fire."

[BernieforPres2016]

42. She even lied about the lie

She claimed that she told the lie because she had been sleep deprived (that was also a lie, she had been home the night before with no public events) and had never mentioned it before, but it had been part of her stump speech according to this article.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/1582795/Hillary-Clintons-Bosnia-sniper-story-exposed.html

<She insisted it was the "first time in 12 years" she had spoken inaccurately about the trip.

But her Bosnia anecdote has been a regular feature of her stump speeches.>

So what did the Clinton campaign do in 2008 after being caught in that blatant lie? Naturally, attack her opponent.

<The Clinton campaign initially tried to shut down debate about the Bosnia remarks, refusing to answer a reporter's question on a conference call saying that they would supply a transcript of the communications director's remarks from Monday.

But Clinton advisers later changed tack, issuing a press release entitle "Just Embellished Words: Senator Obama's Record of Exaggerations & Misstatements" listing occasions on which Mr Obama had apparently misspoken.>

Here is my favorite quote from the article, such a perfect Hillary quote. After getting caught in a blatant lie, she plays the victim while at the same time reminding everybody that she is above the rest of us:

"Occasionally, I am a human being like everybody else."

[demwing]

40. She's a liar

how can liars be honest?

[Punkingal]

43. No.

Win at all costs people are not honest. An honest person would not work with David Brock.

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

44. No. But, she makes up for it in ruthlessness.

[Orsino]

45. Too isolated by money and comfortable with it to be very honest.

It would be hard for her to repudiate the oligarchy when it's spent twenty years getting her to this point.

Not that many other people could possibly remain progressive inside such a richly-appointed bubble.

[HERVEPA]

51. Is the Pope Italian?

[JDPriestly]

52. No. Her opposition to gay marriage was dishonest.

She is fundamentally dishonest about what is going on in the world. It isn't a matter of being dishonest about this or that. She just is not a person I feel I can trust. It's intuitive in part.

And Bill Clinton was the same. Hillary couldn't even trust him. And now that I look back at his presidency, I see all the bills he signed and policies he fostered that have had horrible effects in the world and in our country.

He was not honest with the American people. Not at all. And she can't be honest either. It isn't in her.

I do not trust her. It isn't just a matter of changing her views. It is her constant seeking advantage for herself, her constant egotism.

In contrast, Bernie is a listener by nature. A very compassionate man.

[vintx]

59. Have you seen this?

[Hoyt]

53. Sanders can lie about cutting health care expenditures from $3 Trillion to $1.37 Trillion. That's OK

to his supporters. And Clinton is a liar because Republican Robert Gates says so.

[MFM008]

55. Yes

accusing her of being "untrustworthy" is a ploy used by republicans, Clinton haters or disgruntled supporters of other candidates.

[vintx]

58. "We never called it a coup"

"The Clean Power Plan is something that Sen. Sanders has said he would delay implementing."

The gun industry is "the only business in America that is wholly protected from any kind of liability."

"I remember landing under sniper fire."

"I actually started criticizing the war in Iraq before (Obama) did."


There are so many more examples.

So yeah... no. She's really not.

[pdsimdars]

60. How do people even ask this quesion?

Here's what America thinks. . . . she's the top rated.

[seabeyond]

63. The most honest of any of the candidates, per the people paying attention. Might ask why?

[sadoldgirl]

65. Was she not asked that question by the media

and weaseled out of it?

No, she is not, but very good at obfuscation, and
she is weighing every answer as if she were in court;
that means totally calculating and cautious.