2016 Postmortem
Related: About this forumHillary reached out to Bernie in a very important way
Did the Bernie Sanders supporters notice?
Van Jones made this point on CNN.
If you watched her speech, she was respectful of Bernie and praised him and his supporters.
Agschmid
(28,749 posts)virtualobserver
(8,760 posts)seabeyond
(110,159 posts)Armstead
(47,803 posts)seabeyond
(110,159 posts)frylock
(34,825 posts)Nailed it.
Response to Armstead (Reply #34)
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passiveporcupine
(8,175 posts)I want to see just how faxt she can backpeddal.
Demsrule86
(68,586 posts)And since he votes for the gun lobby...some of his were conservative leaning.
bkkyosemite
(5,792 posts)highprincipleswork
(3,111 posts)Punkingal
(9,522 posts)MrMickeysMom
(20,453 posts)Probably the Brock morph effect.
yuiyoshida
(41,831 posts)She doesn't need us, at all...
fine, whatever.
passiveporcupine
(8,175 posts)SusanCalvin
(6,592 posts)And a dumb response on her part.
I dislike her intensely. But that's nothing next to how intensely Republicans scare me. So I want her to be smart in both word and deed.
apcalc
(4,465 posts)They both were.
She insults Bernie and his supporters and now wants to play nice. Nice try.
CentralCoaster
(1,163 posts)But I don't call it reaching out in a special way, except that it was uncharacteristically respectful, better than usual.
pangaia
(24,324 posts)The woman is insufferable.
The most horrible democratic candidate I can remember in my voting lifetime, which goes back to JFK.
msongs
(67,413 posts)think
(11,641 posts)Her scorched earth campaign...
TM99
(8,352 posts)Why do you think we don't trust her.
Last night she was the arrogant queen refusing to do a damned thing for Sanders or his supporters.
Today after winning a net 81 delegates she says she feels differently?
Horseshit. She knows she needs us to win. And she should have thought of that the entire primary season. Oh well, sucks to get to the GE and then lose because you can't get the votes needed to win.
snagglepuss
(12,704 posts)Amimnoch
(4,558 posts)I get this is how primaries go, but it's been a really disheartening season when 2 sides who, when all the partisan shit and rhetoric is put aside likely agree on 90% or more of the issues that mean so much to us.
I'm hoping more follow her lead, and the sooner the better.
Chan790
(20,176 posts)A story. Very early on in my undergraduate career, 2nd day of Intro to American Government, Professor W made a provocative statement.
"Democrats and Republicans agree on more than 85% of issues."
We called bullshit. He challenged us. Giving us a list of issues (30 of them), the only issues we were allowed to discuss...we were asked to speak to each other for 20 minutes and accurately predict the political affiliations of our peers and the TAs. Anybody that got more than 23/25 correct got an A for the semester and never had to come to class again.
Nobody got better than 16/25. Why? Because his provocative statement is true...and those vast majority of issues go undebated, undisputed and unchallenged because nobody disagrees on them. Even Republicans generally believe that fire departments should be funded by taxpayer dollars and that subsidized school lunch programs are a good thing; even Democrats generally believe that we need a military for national defense; nobody believes that the US should not engage in foreign diplomacy to project our interests abroad. In 30 years of teaching, about 2800 undergrads, Professor W has never had to give out that A.
When all the partisan shit and rhetoric is put aside we all agree on 90% or more of issues with Rick Santorum and Paul Ryan too.
I should be concerned if we agreed with each other less than we agree with the GOP.
passiveporcupine
(8,175 posts)I don't believe this.
and those vast majority of issues go undebated, undisputed and unchallenged because nobody disagrees on them.
It wasn't because we agreed on most issues...it was because we didn't have answers about how to deal with many issues. It takes planning and working together to try new things and because of the party divide that kind of cooperation is slim to none.
for example, you say even Democrats generally believe that we need a military for national defense; nobody believes that the US should not engage in foreign diplomacy to project our interests abroad.
That is true, but 'how' we engage is a very divisive issue. Not everyone thinks we have the right to rule over other sovereign countries and force regime change, just for our commercial benefit.
I don't believe in this age we agree to that level ...I think those are very old stats.
Armstead
(47,803 posts)Clinton will not fight for single payer coverage...or even a public option
She's perfectly happy with monopolies. She's perfectly happy with allowing a handful of immense banking empires to suck up the entire economy.
She'll negotiate with the GOP over Social Security and Medicare
Naw. I'm not gonna agree with her just because she's the nominee.
TheKentuckian
(25,026 posts)Past that it is pretty clear all bets are off.
All we have is policy you folks want no part of.
Chan790
(20,176 posts)We want her to listen to what we're actually saying about why she's unfit...and evolve into a candidate worth supporting.
pangaia
(24,324 posts)She is who she is and always has been.
The greed, the arrogance, the self-love is ingrained and will never come out. It is too late.
You'd probably never believe her anyway.
Chan790
(20,176 posts)If she said she was going to clean up Wall St. I'd be rightfully skeptical. If she declared her intention to appoint a bulldog prosecutor (by name!) that has gone after white collar crime as AG...I'd believe her then.
If she declared her intention to overturn the crime bill that Bill signed that functionally criminalized an entire generation of my inner-city peers...I wouldn't believe her. If she returned the donations she'd received from private prison companies...I might believe her.
If she could simply answer "No" to the fracking question or the FTA question instead of dithering and dancing around having to say an explicit "No" she won't allow fracking and an explicit "No" that TPP is dead and will not be reconsidered; that her intentions are to withdraw fully from the negotiations...that would lend confidence to my belief in her.
It's Hillary's fault, not ours, that we don't believe her. She's never met a question she won't give a slant answer to avoid having to take a position that she will commit to and not reconsider or reverse course. She even gives slant answers on whether she's consider working with the GOP to ban a woman's right to choose. We all know it's not on the table...even the GOP knows that...and she still couldn't say "Nope. It's a dead issue and I won't negotiate it with them." when she was asked by Chuck Todd in October.
She's not a person that inspires confidence in her honesty and until she becomes one, she's not someone to be believed.
nolawarlock
(1,729 posts)She's winning now and she'll win in November.
Chan790
(20,176 posts)nolawarlock
(1,729 posts)NurseJackie
(42,862 posts)I can't imagine Bernie being so gracious.
seekthetruth
(504 posts).....because if either Hillary or Trump get in, Wall Street is going to push the middle class even more downwards.
But, who cares? In less than a hundred years our coastal towns and cities will be half under water since this generation did nothing to begin the necessary changes to how we utilize our resources.
It'll be a sad day for this country when Hillary or Trump take office. Hell, they might as well get on the same ticket.
mcar
(42,334 posts)oldandhappy
(6,719 posts)There have been so many trolls here I have backed off listening. The attacks on social media have shown a lot of disrespect to Bernie. Call off the social media attacks if you want me to listen. Thank you.
grntuscarora
(1,249 posts)Is there any reason to trust her even if she did?
She is going to have to EARN my vote in November, and make no mistake, she has an uphill battle.
oberliner
(58,724 posts)Which are quite significant.
grntuscarora
(1,249 posts)and the other just talks.
Armstead
(47,803 posts)Typical.
I think last night was how she really sees it.
jimlup
(7,968 posts)what and how we Bernie supporters decide what we are going to do next.
Just say'n. I'm glad to see that she is at least thinking about reconciliation but don't forget that there are still some very hard feelings. At best it will take some time.
oberliner
(58,724 posts)It seems like she took a step in that direction with her speech tonight. Or at least attempted to do so.
Response to oberliner (Reply #28)
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Maru Kitteh
(28,340 posts)It's not going to settle out overnight. Feelings and pride are bruised. Passions have been genuine and intense. But in the end it's going to be okay.
djean111
(14,255 posts)In any event - she is still a Third Way warmonger who reports to Wall Street, right? Nothing she says, at this point, can override that. No fucking sale.
Generic Brad
(14,275 posts)So why should she make an effort?
When my daughter was young and demanded things I would say to her "What do you get when you have the gimmes? Nothing." If you take a stance where there is no negotiating, forgiveness or concessions then you get what you deserve which is nothing.
djean111
(14,255 posts)I have been up front about that from the first.
She cannot get my vote. She is a Third Way warmonger.
The calls for "party unity" are ridiculous. And she agrees with me on that - she said, basically, fuck you Bernie supporters, I don't need you and I won't change a thing.
She has no intention of negotiating, and no one would believe her if she did. She says take it or leave it, and I will leave it. Simple as that. We are not children. We are afraid for our children.
Generic Brad
(14,275 posts)You have a lot of anger that will remain unresolved. I feel for you.
djean111
(14,255 posts)And it is not anger. Disgust is more like it. 'bye.
Persondem
(1,936 posts)Jitter65
(3,089 posts)Come together.
DCBob
(24,689 posts)She is reaching out. Let's see what Bernie does.
lumberjack_jeff
(33,224 posts)riderinthestorm
(23,272 posts)Typical.
More lies.
djean111
(14,255 posts)Newsflash to those pimping the "Hillary reached out" bullshit - no one believes a damned word she says. Not one word. And she is still a proud Third Way warmonger.
oberliner
(58,724 posts)Isn't this exactly what she needs to do?
SusanCalvin
(6,592 posts)That's the right thing to do, politically. Glad to see she made a smart choice.