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Uncle Joe

(58,366 posts)
Sun Apr 24, 2016, 07:23 PM Apr 2016

If you're voting Tuesday for Hillary but not firmly committed, vote Bernie, you have nothing to lose

If it's an internal argument between your ideals/pragmatism and as the polls currently have Hillary favored in the closed primary states voting on Tuesday, she may win anyway. So from a pragmatic standpoint you still win.

If Bernie wins and can go on to the Midwest and West in a stronger position the continued debate will energize or invigorate the Democratic Party, your highest ideals will have a chance to win out in this marathon.

During Bernie's darkest political hour after losing New York, the New York Times; a publication which had earlier endorsed Hillary said as much when their Editorial Board argued that Bernie should stay in the race.



(snip)

Mr. Sanders has always stood more for a vision than for reality, especially with a Republican-led Congress. As he and Mrs. Clinton tore into each other in last week’s debate in Brooklyn, some Democrats worried that the nasty fracas would hurt the party. Others want Mr. Sanders to get out and let Mrs. Clinton focus on the Trump threat.

Mr. Sanders’s presence has made this an immeasurably more substantive race, in which both candidates’ policies have been better vetted, and as a result, better delineated. That’s the best preparation for the general election. Yes, Mrs. Clinton’s lead is nearly insurmountable, but it should be voters who erase the “nearly.”

Mr. Sanders has voiced the concerns and energized millions of young people, many of them voting for the first time. His candidacy has forced the party to go deeper on addressing issues like wealth inequality, college tuition costs and the toll of globalization — important points of distinction with Republicans. What’s more, Mr. Sanders’s commitment to small individual contributions has put the lie to Democrats’ excuses that they, too, must play the big money game to win. This is a message too seldom heard in the party that first championed campaign finance reform. That it’s back is long overdue, good for Democrats and good for campaigning. Mrs. Clinton “is clearly irritated by the fact that she has to deal with this guy,” the Democratic strategist David Axelrod said in an interview. “But he’s pushed her on a lot of issues in a positive way, and I think that his young supporters will be bitterly resentful if anyone tries to shove him out of the race.”

Voters are keeping these also-ran candidates going. When Mr. Sanders loses in a state, he raises more money, not less. Voters consistently choose Mr. Kasich as the Republican most likely to beat Mrs. Clinton. This refusal to anoint a front-runner in either party appears in poll after poll, as dispirited voters declare that they simply don’t like Mr. Trump, Mr. Cruz or Mrs. Clinton. This should be a wake-up call to leaders of both parties. They are missing something big about their own members’ priorities, and their mood. A spirited nominating season might teach them what voters actually want from their president. So far, voters are saying they aren’t willing to settle for a party favorite, and don’t want to be cheated out of a choice.


http://www.nytimes.com/2016/04/20/opinion/sanders-and-kasich-should-ignore-any-pressure-to-quit.html?_r=0



Of course Independents are a required constituency in the general election, in too many closed Democratic Primaries they haven't had a voice.

With Bernie being the nominee, his appeal and message is stronger with Independents, Bernie polls much better against Republicans than Hillary because of this, so your pragmatism still wins out.

Bernie beating Republicans by much greater margins than Hillary has a been a long term consistent trend and as we inevitably march closer to the general election, those polls validity continually increases.

The duel dynamics of simultaneously energizing the Democratic Party with heart while drawing in the majority of Independents with head creates a much greater opportunity to change the Congress for the better.

From either an idealistic or pragmatic standpoint a vote for Bernie on Tuesday is a win/win situation.
15 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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If you're voting Tuesday for Hillary but not firmly committed, vote Bernie, you have nothing to lose (Original Post) Uncle Joe Apr 2016 OP
LOL JoePhilly Apr 2016 #1
You crack me up. Squinch Apr 2016 #2
Understandable ... JoePhilly Apr 2016 #3
On the wings of angels! Squinch Apr 2016 #6
Thanks to both of you for the kick. Uncle Joe Apr 2016 #4
Too funny not to kick. JoePhilly Apr 2016 #5
So you have no argument against any of my points? Uncle Joe Apr 2016 #8
Yea ... you think Hillary supporters are stupid enough to short her ... JoePhilly Apr 2016 #9
I stated in the title Hillary voters that weren't "firmly committed." n/t Uncle Joe Apr 2016 #10
De nada! Squinch Apr 2016 #7
I am voting Tuesday and am proudly voting for Bernie. Just hope they don't switch my vote. EndElectoral Apr 2016 #11
Thanks, EndElectoral. Uncle Joe Apr 2016 #12
...and of course you have no evidence at all of vote switching, right? brooklynite Apr 2016 #13
Voters listen to you, Uncle Joe. Octafish May 2016 #14
... Uncle Joe May 2016 #15

JoePhilly

(27,787 posts)
3. Understandable ...
Sun Apr 24, 2016, 07:36 PM
Apr 2016

... I crack ME up too.

I love this OP.

"Hey Hillary supporters ... here's an idea, get drunk, and vote for Bernie and your ideals will be propelled forward!!!!!!"

JoePhilly

(27,787 posts)
9. Yea ... you think Hillary supporters are stupid enough to short her ...
Sun Apr 24, 2016, 07:41 PM
Apr 2016

... delegates in PA ... so that their "ideals" can be carried forward even though Bernie is going to lose.

Dude, glass is less transparent.

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