Democrats: Step back, squint your eyes, and consider this.

[grasswire]

Isn't it very peculiar indeed that the Democratic Party is divided nearly in half right now, one half supporting the most populist candidate since FDR and promoting the Democratic values and programs that won Roosevelt four terms in the White House and the unwavering love of the American people

--- the other half supporting a candidate serving the 1 percent, the corporations, the fossil fuel industry, the private prison industry, interventional wars of choice, and many more issues that do not comply with traditional Democratic values and/or do not bring the American people freedom from want, freedom from fear, and clear progress toward egalitarianism?


Isn't it very peculiar indeed that one half wants to restrict education by class; wants to ask young people to stifle their aspirations and sublimate visions for how things ought to be; wants them to live in the status quo, not the dreams of MLK and JFK and RFK?

--- while the other half says "If the people will stand together, there is nothing they cannot accomplish!" and recognizes that other first world countries are thriving because residents of those countries are able to say to the oligarchs "You can't have it all" and enact laws in support of workers and families and the earth and a common good?

Isn't it telling that one half of the Democratic Party actively seeks to disqualify and disenfranchise voters? The Democratic party! While the other half seeks to draw in millions of new voters and disaffected voters. One says HER; the other says US.

To me, those differences are irreconcilable while HRC and her posse campaign for Third Way, "New Democrat" supremacy. Whether there will be any cohesive Democratic Party after 2016 remains to be seen.

I just don't see progressives and traditional Democrats coming to unity with a candidate and constituency that is so diametrically opposite to long held values. It isn't purely a matter of personality. It's core values.

[oldandhappy]

1. Very Clear, smile.

You said it well. I don't know about the unity thing either.

[Ned_Devine]

2. Exactamundo!

[amborin]

3. K&R Real democrats cannot vote for someone who represents the opposite of real democratic values

[Kittycat]

76. Thank you!!! Perfectly stated.

[Rockyj]

123. well said!

Why Hillary Trolls would think for one minute that I would vote for a person who represents everything I am against? Are they for real?

[Armstead]

4. I keep resisting that thought but it is beginning to look that way

[TDale313]

5. These wounds aren't gonna heal easily.

And the Clintons are anything but uniters. In fact, I think they've been one of the most divisive forces in American Politics- particularly on the left- for decades.

[antigop]

6. +1000. Spot on. nt

[Agnosticsherbet]

7. In the primary, the vast majority of traditional democrats have voted for Clinton.

Your theory doesn't hold water.

[Trenzalore]

9. The dichotomy projected

One side is pure and noble and everything right with the world while the other is evil and ugly and everything wrong with the world. It must be nice to have that kind of certainty.

[Agnosticsherbet]

12. No side is pure and noble.

A fellow Whovian should know that.

The Demographic data I've seen show traditional Democratic party constituencies voted for Clinton (Women, minorities, 40 and older voters). Sanders pulls in a lot of the young, the progressive left, and independents. His reason for not doing well in closed primaries is that he did not have enormous appeal to "traditional democrats."

As a side note, I am bummed that there is no new series this year but look forward to the Christmas special and next year.

[Trenzalore]

13. Interesting choice for new companion

I like they've taken a break from the romantic entanglements with Peter. I'm getting my fix through Big Finish Audio plays while I work out. Going through a seventh doctor phase.

I started out the primary undecided between the two and than decided for Hillary after I listened to Sanders idea on how he would get things done. Didn't seem to acknowledge the difficulty the President has had the past 6 years. I will say Sanders supporters I know off the internet have driven me to be a little more militant on my choice but either is better than the alternative.

[bkkyosemite]

44. Vote machines are being flipped like they have done in previous elections.

[CoffeeCat]

55. Clinton has been stealing and voter-suppressing

her way across the country, from state to state.

It's so obvious.

From state to state, our elections have been nothing but chaos, cheating, suppression, vote flips, disenfranchisement and assorted shenanigans. From beginning to end, it's never, ever been like this.

She makes a mockery of every damn thing she touches because she's corrupt to
the core.

[Ed Suspicious]

57. This.

[dchill]

31. It is. Very nice.

It's a VERY clear dividing line, a very clear choice. For a Democrat, that is.

[OwlinAZ]

32. One side is the Kennedy Democrats

the other side is the Corporate Democrats.

[grasswire]

10. apparently not

those people voted for a candidate who will not exemplify traditional Democratic values.

[senz]

14. The movement in Demorats is to Bernie for his traditional Democratic values.

The Clintons are "new" Democrats, not the least bit traditional.

Many older Democrats get their information from the MSM, which has done a virtual blackout on Bernie. When liberals are informed about the two candidates, they increasingly chose Bernie.

[Cassiopeia]

27. Traditional Democrats alone

can not win the GE. It's foolish to not test our candidates by voters from all walks of political life. After all, that's what the winner will face in the GE.

[OwlinAZ]

36. "the Primary" is far from over

[passiveporcupine]

66. The vast majority of traditional democrats?

You mean establishment democrats.

It's no surprise you are trying to hang onto your positions of power, but the majority of the rest of us...well we kinda want to break that control you have and get the power back in the hands of the real people.

I'm sorry if you are on the wrong side of this line, but you have to make up your mind. Are you with us or against us, cause this time we mean business...and if we are ignored and supressed, this time it might end up with pitchforks. We've really kinda had enough of your bullshit. We are ready to fight.

[OnionPatch]

117. It's as if progressives and young people

Aren't "real" Democrats. And as if we don't need new blood in the party.

Unfortunately for the Establishment Dems the youth will lead the way. If not this election, the next. This old, lifelong Democrat will be cheering them on.

[Bluenorthwest]

96. Shitting on the Democrats in the many States Sanders has won is a bad idea.

You seem to define 'traditional Democrats' as being those from States with anti gay laws on the books. I reject your atavistic definition.

[antigop]

8. personally, I don't think the "New Democrat" supremacy care AT ALL about a progressive agenda.

They are hoping to get the Republicans who won't vote for Trump.

They don't want us.

[Metric System]

11. Hey, it's people over in the Bernie group talking about voting Trump.

[That Guy 888]

46. "They don't want us" I agree with you 100%

Which is why I find their anger about people saying they won't vote for her strange. According to the most obnoxious HRC supporters, the Democratic Party has "been carrying the Left for years".

And the weather vane spins between too small a number to matter and extreme Lefty purists cost the election.

[YouDig]

15. What are you talking about? We have two liberal candidates.

If the policies that Hillary is proposing are enacted into law, we'd all be dancing in the streets. Same goes for Bernie. All this sky is falling stuff is dumb. What, because she wants a national minimum wage of 12 instead of 15? With the GOP congress, we're not going to get either. The problem isn't Hillary vs Bernie, it's the GOP.

[grasswire]

17. you're not listening.

You're not hearing young people who the Clintons keep insulting.

You're not out and about on social media.

You're not even paying attention here on DU.

Apparently.

[YouDig]

26. I'm listening to the candidates and what they actually stand for.

[OwlinAZ]

34. As we all are.

[riderinthestorm]

24. You aren't talking to those desperate @ climate change then

Hillary's tepid "incrementalism" on the environmental issues and her outright support for fracking means the planet's inevitable slide into disaster is inevitable.

She's the same as climate change deniers in that way.

The planet can't wait. Its in its 11th hour. In 5 years as more severe weather and earth events occur, I'll be able to move forward with a clear conscience.

Those of you voting for Hillary will own our demise and Madame President will go down as the worst president in history for slow walking action on climate change to preserve the status quo for major polluters like the fracking industry.

[YouDig]

25. Now you're calling her the same as a climate change denier?

I have no idea where this is coming from.

[puffy socks]

28. I do, but I'm too polite to post it.

[riderinthestorm]

30. Her proposals will ensure the same result.

Too little, too late.

[YouDig]

33. That's not true. Look at her actual proposals.

Reductions in carbon emissions, investments in solar and other renewable energy sources.

[riderinthestorm]

39. Fracking, support for ground troops in Syria

(more toxic waste as the dendritus of war seeps into the ground water and air), support for TPP - a trade agreement custom designed by corporations willing to rape the land and pollute those communities with impunity. ..

Hell, even her support for carbon emissions is pathetically (disastrously) weak and only adopted within the past 6 months because of Bernie’s position. Do you think she'll adhere to that once in office?



Hillary’s said her top priority will be buddying back up with war criminal Netanyahu and servicing Israel's needs (war with Iran).

http://forward.com/opinion/national/324013/how-i-would-rebuild-ties-to-israel-and-benjamin-neta/

Bernie will make a bold, muscular international effort on climate change initiatives a major part of his 1st day.

[YouDig]

40. Her support for fracking is very mild, nothing compared to what the GOP wants.

Replacing coal with Natural Gas was an Obama administration goal, and it is a good one. But like Hillary has said, with the extent of regulation that she is in favor of, there would actually be very little fracking.

Comparing her in any way to global warming deniers is nuts.

[riderinthestorm]

43. Nope, as SOS she promoted fracking worldwide - a global disaster

And any support for fracking here means more earthquakes and contaminated aquifers.

When Oklahoma isn't a place to live anymore because its aquifer is too polluted, will you be able to live with "well it wasn't as bad as the GOP"?

You own that. I couldn't live with myself personally.

And noted you didn't address my other points.

[-none]

63. That aquifer under Oklahoma, goes clear up to North Dakota and even Canada

No way does it stop at the state line. Contaminate the aquifer under Oklahoma and you risk contaminating the ground water for millions of people.

http://water.usgs.gov/ogw/aquifer/map.html

[riderinthestorm]

64. .

[Admiral Loinpresser]

75. Fracking is eco-assault.

I live in Kansas. We didn't have earthquakes here before the massive fracking started in OK and southeast Kansas. Now we have hundreds of earthquakes per year. Last year we had a fairly big one felt in Wichita. It is getting worse here all the time. If you support fracking, you are an enemy of the earth. I will never support anyone one who supports fracking. NEVER!!!!!!!!!!!

[islandmkl]

95. my friends in my old hometown of Wellington are experiencing earthquakes several times a week..

and these are not little 'vibrations'...

of course, industry deniers claim 'there have always been earthquakes in the region'....except nobody remembers anything remotely like that happening until the past 6 or 8 years...

and Hillary's so-called stance on regulating fracking has so many caveats, along with a 'probably' and one of her good 'when it is determined' that, just as she will suddenly find that all of her concerns about TPP 'have been addressed', she will promote it just a fully as she has promoted it in the past....

i'll say one thing for Hillary...she can pander without shame...it's almost as if she is saying, "Yes, I am lying to you...but you'll vote for me anyway because you like my lies."

we get what we sow...and 2016's crop looks like it is about to be attacked by the Third Way locusts...

[Admiral Loinpresser]

111. I am told there was an earthquake near Wichita in the early '60s.

I was a little squirt then and don't remember it, but my best friend swears it happened. But now earthquakes in Oklahoma and Kansas are a common occurrence.

[bahrbearian]

41. What does she say the number one threat to the US is.

[Admiral Loinpresser]

112. Populism! n/t

[Dustlawyer]

62. Corporate Democrats know they have to throw us a few bones to try to keep us distracted.

Sure she will build a few solar power plants, but she won't press the energy companies and the state's to stop adding fees and other charges to residential and commercial businesses who install solar on their roof tops. Solar City, owned by Elon Musk, the largest installer of residential and commercial building solar power just had to pull out of one western state altogether because the Lobbiests got the state to make it not profitable to install.

It's the oldest trick in the book, give the appearance of doing something without really doing it, a false facade if you will. She will not drive and push for a complete shift to renewable energy, just enough to look like she supports it. That is her MO on practically everything we like, want and need. She does this because it works! Apparently, many Democrats are still falling for it.

[dreamnightwind]

70. Excellent post, thanks - eom

[bahrbearian]

38. "If the policies that Hillary is proposing are enacted into law." She has no intentions ...

implementing those policies.Those are empty promise's.

[eridani]

91. Because nothing says "feminism" like cluster bombs? n/t

[Baobab]

106. Willful blindness on the part of the Democratic Party

out of sight, out of mind.

But people are fed up with Miss Leading.

[Vincardog]

118. Are you being paid to believe that? I am not and I don't

[bvar22]

122. You mean the Hillary ...

[font size=3]NO. WE. CAN'T![/font] platform?

The two (Hillary & Bernie) could not be further apart.
Hillary has more in common with Republicans:

* Sanders has supported gay rights for over 40 years. Hillary and Republicans have not.

* Sanders wants to end the prohibition of marijuana. Hillary & The Republicans do not.

* Sanders wants to end the death penalty. Hillary and The Republicans do not.

* Sanders wants to raise the minimum wage to $15 an hour. Hillary and the Republicans do not.

* Sanders wants to break up the biggest banks. Hillary and The Republicans do not.

* Sanders voted against the Wall Street bailout. Hillary and the Republicans (and too many "Democrats) did not.

* Sanders introduced legislation to overturn Citizens United. Hillary and The Republicans did not.

* Sanders refuses to accept money from super PACs. Hillary and the Republicans do not.

* Sanders supports a single-payer healthcare system. Hillary and The Republicans do not.

* Sanders refrains from waging personal attacks for political gains. Hillary and The Republicans do not.

* Sanders considers climate change our nation's biggest threat. Hillary and The Republicans do not.

* Sanders opposed the Keystone XL Pipeline since day one. Hillary and the Republicans do not.

* Sanders voted against the Patriot Act. Hillary and the Republicans did not.

* Sanders voted against the war in Iraq. Hillary and The Republicans did not.

* Sanders wants to Raise (or eliminate) the CAP on FICA deductions. Hillary and the Republicans do not.

* Sanders opposes unrestricted "Free Trade". Hillary and the Republican do not.

*Sanders wants to protect Social Security by Raising-the-Cap. Hillary and the Republicans do not because the top 1% will have to pay their fair share.

*Sanders wants to diffuse the Middle Est by NOT sending more weapons, Hillary and the Republicans do not.

(These are just a few of the differences. Please add more if you wish)

Hillary sure seems to agree with Republicans a lot.
I don't,
that is why I am a Democrat, and voting for a Democrat....Bernie!

[LWolf]

16. K & R

[insightdeluxe]

18. dnc truthers

preach. the dnc has progressives in a rear naked choke.

[grasswire]

19. don't want to know what a rear naked choke is. nt

[Zynx]

20. Are you familiar with what FDR campaigned on in 1932?

[ridgenvalley]

21. K&R.

Well said.

[grasswire]

22. thank you :-) nt

[asuhornets]

23. ...

[silvershadow]

29. She needs to bow out. I'm actually convinced she isn't even the clear front-runner.

Evidence all over DU and in the news about the massive irregularities throughout. I will not respond to anyone who disputes this post, only those who support it.

[ReRe]

92. She may very well want to quit today...

... since Roiters reported this a.m. that Charles Koch has endorsed her.

[ChiciB1]

35. I've Been Trying For Weeks AND Weeks Now To...

UNDERSTAND what so many of us JFK, FDR Democrats see so CLEARLY that other Democrats CAN'T or WON'T look at. For far too many years we've watched our Party pull away from what I always believed THE DEMOCRATIC Party of We The People stood for and watching it being replaced IMO a Party that looks so much like The Republican Party BEFORE they went totally SUPER RIGHT WING and seems to think GOD is on their side.

I recall so many times during my younger days saying "Jesus was as Liberal!"

I think what Bernie has been able to show THIS NATION is a way to HEAL, not "Make Them Heel" as it seems so very, very many of our CONGRESS CRITTERS have been doing to us for so very long!

I DO NOT CARE if anyone here believes that this Primary Season has been shown to have "voting irregularities" almost everywhere! Something has been gumming up the works now more than ever. IT DOES NOT MAKE sense that a man who has thousands and thousands of people turn out to hear him speak, rally after rally and is not winning. Sure Closed Primaries can be blamed somewhat, but for me it doesn't add up! It's happened TOO MANY TIMES!

Even BEFORE Bernie became a household name he was ignored, laughed at and thrown to the side like a dirty rag! Super Delegates pledged long before he really had a chance and now because of "promises made to them" that they would receive money to help get them elected, and the money THEY DIDN'T really get, they can't break THE PROMISE! Not to long ago there was a long article written about how this was done, I recall one of the names mentioned was Senator Testor but can't remember who wrote it.

A PLAN was hatched a long time ago and I honestly think that many here really know this, even Hillary supporters who won't ever admit to it, that SHE was going to win no matter what!

I have now accepted that, but so much has changed for them along the way and THIS DEMOCRATIC PARTY is now permanently fractured! I do believe this because of how I FEEL! Let her be QUEEN, have at it... but there will be so many who will not bow down nor will we even be part of HER DEMOCRATIC PARTY anymore!

I do believe that Bernie came along when this country needed him to show us a WAY BACK, I think he's ALREADY done that and I've begun to realize that it could be THE BEST thing if he isn't elected. My reasoning is that IF he is elected EVERYTHING that seems ripe to blow open will be blamed on him! I wonder if it isn't BEST to have it blow up in the faces of those who led us down this path. So many newcomers have joined Bernie's side that it will open up the NEW doors that will shine new light in.

THIS Democratic Party isn't the one I joined so many years ago. We are already an Oligarchy, it's being repeated more and more all the time by not only people in THIS country, but in other countries too!

My thoughts may not be the thoughts of others, but I needed to say it. Will I see something different if she wins, I REALLY, REALLY don't think so... but if I do then I will come back. But, SHE has A LOT to prove and if I had to bet right now... it's more of NO WE CAN'T!

Who knows this really might be the right time for a New Party. I can't see the future, but I CAN see what I'm seeing now and it's left such a bitter ugly taste in my mouth. And I'm also AFRAID! Very AFRAID! Haven't been posting a lot lately, but do read threads. Not leaving, just posting less because THIS time is NOT the same as when Obama ran! I have a feeling that we all won't come home for Hillary. I think about it ALL the time and really don't know IF I CAN DO IT. Maybe, maybe, maybe... I WISH I could feel it!

[grasswire]

47. we will follow Bernie's cue

You trust him, so do I. He will tell us the truth about what needs to be done. I don't believe they can muzzle him into capitulation, because he really has nothing to lose at this point and everything to gain by pressing forward and building a movement.

Follow the birdie, friend. Have peace and follow the birdie. I was in the arena when that birdie landed in front of him and sat there, at peace with him.

Keep your eyes on the prize.

[ChiciB1]

108. Thank You Very Much! I Belong Ton A Group & My Family Also

feels the same. WE WILL follow The Birdie!

[haikugal]

67. I loved reading your post, it's the best thing I've read today. Most excellent and I totally agree!

Wonderful!! Scary and wonderful!!

[ChiciB1]

109. Thanks So Much For Standing With Bernie So We

may keep his voice & movement going! I'm older, my kids & grandkids have FINALLY opened their eyes & no longer say, "it's politics, what can ya do?"

His message has made people take a NEW LOOK!

FORWARD!

[dreamnightwind]

71. Great job, always like your voice here - eom

[ChiciB1]

110. Many Thanks To You Also... I READ Your Posts With Happiness Too! n/t

[CrispyQ]

107. List of the 33 states here:

APRIL 1, 2016
How Hillary Clinton Bought the Loyalty of 33 State Democratic Parties
by MARGOT KIDDER

http://www.counterpunch.org/2016/04/01/how-hillary-clinton-bought-the-loyalty-of-33-state-democratic-parties/

Beneficiaries

Recipient Party Type** Office Sought Total
Clinton, Hillary D C Pres $4,440,000
DNC Services Corp D P $2,263,436
Democratic Party of Wisconsin D P $207,278
Democratic Party of Oklahoma D P $140,000
Democratic Party of New Hampshire D P $74,700
Democratic Party of Pennsylvania D P $70,500
Democratic Party of Texas D P $69,100
Democratic Executive Cmte of Florida D P $66,200
Democratic Party of Nevada D P $66,200
Democratic Party of Colorado D P $66,000
Democratic Party of Ohio D P $66,000
Democratic Cmte of Utah D P $64,100
Democratic Party of Alaska D P $64,100
Democratic Party of Mississippi D P $64,100
Democratic Party of Montana D P $64,100
Democratic Party of Oregon D P $64,100
Democratic Party of South Carolina D P $64,100
Democratic Party of Tennessee D P $64,100
Democratic State Cmte of Massachusetts D P $64,100
Georgia Federal Elections Cmte D P $64,100
Idaho State Democratic Party D P $64,100
Michigan Democratic State Central Cmte D P $64,100
Minnesota Democratic Farmer Labor Party D P $64,100
Missouri Democratic State Cmte D P $64,100
Rhode Island Democratic State Cmte D P $64,100
West Virginia State Democratic Exec Cmte D P $64,100
Wyoming State Democratic Central Cmte D P $64,100
Democratic Party of North Carolina D P $64,000
Democratic State Central Cmte/Louisiana D P $64,000
Indiana Democratic Congressional Victory Cmte D P $64,000
Democratic Party of Arkansas D P $63,000
Maine Democratic State Cmte D P $59,800
Democratic Party of Virginia D P $43,500

Source: FEC

The first of the article also describes exactly what they did.

HRC is as corrupt as the Bushes. Both parties are in crisis as they both serve the 1%. Sure the dems throw the proles a few more crumbs, but it's only to dupe us into voting for the lesser of two evils. Again. I've been doing that for 30 years now & HRC is what we've come to. Holy fucking shit. The D brand is so tarnished I hardly recognize it.

[ChiciB1]

114. THIS TIME I'll KEEP This List! It's So Very Informative & DOES Expose

what's been done by OUR DEMOCRATS! In my family I think they've decided my middle name is "politics activist" but I depend on so many like you for staying on top of ALL this critical information!

I've read so many books over the years and my head is crammed full of years of data! But every day NEW information comes to light and I feel the time has come FOR REAL CHANGE!

And HILLARY is only status quo or worse... so WE MOVE ON!

Thank you again for posting this again!

[CrispyQ]

115. If you lose the link,

just Google "Margo Kidder Hillary Clinton" & it's at the top of the list.

The more I read about HRC & Bill & their frickin' foundation the less I think I'll be able to vote for her. And every time I see his face I have almost the same reaction I had when looking at W's face.

Both parties are in crisis. I'm convinced all the voting irregularities - which are increasing with every election - are just the 1% taking down the scenery.

[ChiciB1]

119. Thank YOU Again... Just Wrote Myself ANOTHER Post It Note!

They're really piling up so need to type them ALL up and print them out. I Bookmark too many things and get on here and don't ever seem to find the time to re-check my posts to find them because I always seem to post instead.

I DO know how "the feeling" about Slick Willy too. Every time I here him speak these days his voice grates on me AND here's sends me to my remote to "mute" the sound. Someone must have been giving her lessons that SHE has decided to listen to since I've noticed that she's toned down her shrillness lately. But, habits are habits and it slips through now and again.

With ANY LUCK should she find herself crowned, her enemies might feel free enough to spill some beans. I don't know how you feel about the enemies they've amassed over the years either by money, arm twisting or information they have threatened others with, but it's no secret that they HAVE used their power over the years to claw themselves to this position of POWER.

As I stated earlier, I haven't been posting as much as before so only glimpsed at some information about a suit they filed against FB, Reddit and others because THEY don't like all the nasty comments being made about them. I think that's what I heard on an RT program... need to check that out myself since I don't know the exact details. IF the info is true it almost seems like they want to control what people SAY about them and that SHOULD send a message to millions of people that THIS is what they do!

Doing away with FREEDOM OF SPEECH??? As I said in my first comments, it's so hard to trust her and filing a law suit makes wonder even MORE about how SHE wants to govern. Shades of "House of Cards????" But, I'll have to research the snippet I heard first... still I had found that some of my TEFLON pans really have had food stick to them!!! LOL!

[Scuba]

37. ...

"If the Democratic Party would fight as hard for the Working Class as the Republican Party fights for the Ruling Class, the Republicans would be a powerless minority party within a few election cycles.

The Democratic Party knows this, the Republican Party knows this, the Ruling Class knows this- and they've been astonishingly successful at making sure the Working Class never learns this.

The status quo was rolling along just fine, until Bernie Sanders came along and mucked it up with his crazy ideas about democracy, equality and justice." ~ Anonymous

[mythology]

42. Clearly an unbiased and even consideration of the candidates

You are effectively asking Clinton supporters a variation of "when did you stop beating your wife?" The question as you lay it out presupposes that for all intents and purposes, nothing Clinton does is good.

[grasswire]

48. perhaps the flaws just are greater than the attributes.

We won't know for sure for a month or so.

[bkkyosemite]

45. I have seen voting irregularities in election after election. It is proven they can be flipped in

60 seconds. The votes are being flipped for whoever corporate America wants. So much evidence and people keep thinking our elections are fair and square.

[Califonz]

49. It's the "where else are they going to go?" third way triangulation game

It fools some of the people some of the time... Until a true progressive party is formed and the Democratic Party goes the way of the Whigs.

[appalachiablue]

121. Yeah, that expression says it all, "where else are they going to go" from Tommy

Frank I first heard about it, sorry to say. In other words, take it or leave it.

So the corporate, establishment Dems. assist in dismantling the New Deal when they once proudly supported the Big Tent, Labor and the Middle Class, and also adopted free market, voodoo Reaganomics, neoliberalism and globalization.

As a result, it's on New Dealers and Progressives is to put up, shut hope, hope they "will move left' and change, or
go through the effort of establishing an entirely new political party-- finding or building a new home.
That's huge, but if it's what it takes.
Like the media and education which have been altered, corporatized and diluted, two other major democratic institutions.

Like people in your house, and others who came over, got along but now are hogging almost the entire house and don't want to change. Maybe live some where else, a new place, or move in with the Other House down the road...

[Old Codger]

50. After the primaries

I will probably register as an indy, I am ashamed of what that half of the dem party has become and refuse to be affiliated with raw greed,cronyism and selfishness I see in that half.

[Trajan]

51. I love you ....

Yes ... I do .... and so do my kids, and their kids, and ....

The Third Way Conservatives MUST GO ! ... There is no point in having two right wing parties ....

[grasswire]

65. nice

We're in this together. Paul Wellstone: "Stand up! Keep fighting!"

[vintx]

74. Aw, Paul Wellstone.

I miss his voice. Imagine if we had been able to have a Sanders / Wellstone ticket.

[CrowCityDem]

53. Isn't it peculiar...

that one half of the party insults the very people who make up it's base.

that one half of the party writes off entire regions of the country as unimportant when they can't compete there.

that one half of the party smears everyone who is slightly less liberal as being not good enough.

that one half of the party is actively talking about stealing the nomination from the will of the people.

Yup. Those 'progressives' sure are great people.

[Ed Suspicious]

59. You think compassionate conservatives are the base?

Out of touch.

[Lil Missy]

73. it's called "sore losers"

[Trajan]

54. And .. Oh yeah ...

I got a sweet little letter from Hillary today .... She says "Trajan, We've got a fight on our hands!"

I said " HELL YEAH HILL .... WE DO ! "

After which - Letter > round file ....

I didn't wonder how she targeted me ... I figured it was either because I've been a DEMOCRAT ALL MY EVER LOVIN LIFE ! ...

Or ... she stole it ....

I vote for the latter ...

[sweetloukillbot]

77. So does that mean the reason I've gotten e-mails from Bernie are because he stole it?

[jamese777]

56. I Try To Be Pragmatic

I will support whoever is the nominee. If that's Senator Sanders, great. If that's Secretary Clinton, great. To me, defeating Trump or Cruz or whoever is the greater good.
Senator Clinton got more votes in the New York Primary, in Trump's home state, than Trump, Kasich and Cruz COMBINED: more than a million for Clinton and about 850,000 for the three Republicans. That's impressive.
I do not apologize for not wanting a Republican in the White House.

[rock]

58. My favorite quote comes to mind

[Bluenorthwest]

97. An even bigger and more stinking pile:

Of course Hillary supporters cheered for that sermon full of stank because they are Reagan Democrats, conservatives.

[840high]

60. K/R

[passiveporcupine]

61. I'm having a hard time with this too

I just don't see progressives and traditional Democrats coming to unity with a candidate and constituency that is so diametrically opposite to long held values. It isn't purely a matter of personality. It's core values.

This is the first time we've actually been put in control of our own vote and our own power.

But it won't matter because it's being taken away from us.

How many of us will let it be taken away?

Maybe I'm just too old to care. They can put me in jail if they want, I'm not buying the old rules any more. I'm not paying the middle man any more. I want what we are supposed to get. Representation for our vote.

[Time for change]

68. Yes

And the way the Democratic Party leaders are acting now, I think it deserves to break up, with half of it forming a new liberal party. Then we'll have one liberal party and two conservative parties to split the vote between them.

And I think that Bernie should be the one to lead that effort, given what he has done to create a more clear awareness of the real issues in this country.

[haikugal]

69. Thank you grasswire I totally agree.

[CharlotteVale]

72. Great post.

[ncovington89]

78. Peculiar?

Yes it's "very peculiar." Clinton had her shot in 2008 and got tanked by a then-little known senator. That should have proved to the Democratic Party that she is no good. So why do they keep putting her to the forefront?

If the DNC embraced Sanders and wooed his supporters, the democrats could be the first party “funded by the people and for the people” by Bernie supporters with small donations. With bipartisan and independent disdain for money in politics, that would give democrats a decisive advantage for years to come.

If only they would take the chance.

[grasswire]

80. won't happen with HRC

Why do they keep putting her to the forefront?

Let's ask Bernie. He says "It's a rigged system." Graft, payola, money laundering, pay to play.....it's all there. And she is the queen of it.

Another candidate...say Mark O'Malley....would never allow the kind of theft that the Clintons allow.

[Joob]

79. I will always Stand with Democracy, not DeMOCKracy

[grasswire]

81. :-) nt

[Firebrand Gary]

82. Isn't it very peculiar that you're using the term one half of the democratic party...

If that were the case, Hillary would not be leading by 2.7 million votes.

[grasswire]

83. your calculation does not include caucus voters. nt

[Firebrand Gary]

87. Caucuses are the least democratic process we have.

Not to mention there also held in most minimally populist states. Nice try however.

[grasswire]

88. doesn't matter

the votes from caucuses are votes.

[Firebrand Gary]

89. Yes, they are and they do! Unfortunately for you

if we added the caucuses up all together, your count would increase by what 100K? So about that other 2.6 million then???

[Uncle Joe]

84. Outstanding OP!

Thanks for the thread, grasswire.

[grasswire]

85. Thanks, Uncle Joe!

But what are you doing up so late?

[Uncle Joe]

86. I couldn't sleep but will probably be crashing shortly.

It's easy for me to get my sleeping hours screwed up.

[Surya Gayatri]

90. Here are a bunch of words and phrases that I basically started saying as a joke, and now can't stop.

I CAN'T (stop repeating myself)

And, just in case you missed it, I'll say it again:

I just don't see progressives and traditional Democrats coming to unity with a candidate and constituency that is so diametrically opposite to long held values. It isn't purely a matter of personality. It's core values!!!11!!!!!1!!

[WhaTHellsgoingonhere]

93. That's not even the complete story. The status quo half,

the half that's had control of the Party for a generation now, is hemorrhaging individuals with FDR Democratic values, turning others off to the political process, and inspiring others to register Independent. This is a big deal in that, in practice, it works like voter suppression. As opposition outside the Party continues to grow, so too does the relative strength of the establishment. It's winning by losing. Following NY, Joan Walsh was so proud of herself, and lauded by her colleagues, after writing what this generation of New Democrats does best: shame people for not showing up. She wrote, Bernie supporters love to rally but they don't like to vote. She, and the rest of the media that's been fueling this meme for years, totally missed the real story. Bernie's engaged people the Democratic establishment has happily ignored for years. Unfortunately, they've rejected the Democratic Party and registered Independent. Joan will get to pat herself on the back again come California's closed election, as 300,000 Californians, likely mistakenly, registered with the Independence Party. People don't understand the machine, especially people who vote in states where their vote never matters.

[grasswire]

101. good post, thanks

I just learned about that Independence Party problem in California.

[cui bono]

94. Yes, it's clear that the DLC/Third Way Dems are not real Dems in that they have tossed aside

the traditional core values of the Party's platform in favor of getting money from corporatations. They were wrong to do that and Bernie has made that perfectly clear.

This primary has made what you described perfectly clear and shows that we did not need to make a deal with the devil to get campaign contributions. So why did Bill Clinton bring us the DLC? He and his wife have certainly made a lot of money for themselves because of it.

This stark difference, the things that the Third Way candidate has supported and fights for, is why I will not vote for Hillary. I will not sell out my principles and values. If she loses it will be because the Party moved too far right and it will be the Party establishment/Third Way's leadership's fault and everyone who votes for Hillary in the primary's fault. They will blame Bernie and his supporters, but history will prove them wrong. They are on the wrong side of history and that will become evident in 1-10 years. The people have had enough of this bullshit oligarchy. We want our democracy back.

.

[grasswire]

102. the wrong side of history, yes

I want my Democratic Party back. The party of Roosevelt and RFK and Paul Wellstone.

[dinkytron]

99. grasswire, you are on fire.

[grasswire]

100. Feelin' the Bern!! :-) nt

[dinkytron]

103. Me too.

It is all about core values.

[Vinca]

104. Great post.

[grasswire]

105. thanks, friend :-) nt

[rbrnmw]

113. ...

[JEB]

116. K&R for core values.

[TheDormouse]

120. The two groups have to unify, else hand the keys over to the Republicans