KING: Bernie Sanders’ entire net worth is half of what Hillary Clinton was paid for Goldman Sachs

[Uncle Joe]

speeches

On Monday, the Justice Department announced that Goldman Sachs had agreed to a $5 billion (that’s $5,000,000,000) settlement for their fraudulent practices between 2005 — 2007. How much wrong does a company had to have done to settle on an amount that large?

In the wake of the settlement, Bernie Sanders has rightfully doubled down on calling for Hillary Clinton to release the transcripts from the glowing speeches she made to Goldman Sachs in which she was compensated $675,000.

When I commented on this earlier Tuesday on Twitter, a Hillary supporter said, as if the two things were equal, that she’d release the transcripts when Bernie Sanders releases his tax returns. While I am sure the Clinton campaign would not make that deal, since they appear to be completely unwilling to release the transcripts, let’s entertain this notion for a moment.

Bernie’s entire net worth, accumulated over his 74 years of life, is less than half of what Hillary Clinton made just in her speeches to Goldman Sachs. In 2013, Bernie’s net worth was estimated to be $330,000 — making him among the least wealthy U.S. Senators in the country.

Combined, Bill and Hillary Clinton have made $153 million in speaking fees alone. In just 2013, Hillary received an astounding $9.68 million from her paid speeches.

In other words, Bernie Sanders would have to live 2,171 years to have the net worth of what Hillary made in 2013.

We’re not even talking about apples and oranges here — the disparity in their incomes warrants an altogether unique metaphor — like, for instance, a bank and a nickel, or a factory and a worker.

(snip)


http://www.nydailynews.com/news/national/king-clinton-paid-double-sanders-net-worth-speeches-article-1.2598017

This is an excellent article.

[GeorgiaPeanuts]

1. K&R, very informative!

[azmom]

2. Kick

[BernieforPres2016]

3. I've seen different estimates of Bernie's net worth, the most recent at roughly $700,000

But that doesn't change the point of the article. Hillary supporters yapping about Bernie's tax returns like there might be something in them after the Clintons have sucked up $153 million in speaking and "consulting" income over the last 15 years is pretty rich.

[madokie]

15. I'm not going to go looking

but the last thing I read about Bernie and Jane's worth it was in the neighborhood of a few big ones less than 400,000, including home, cars and retirements

[BernieforPres2016]

18. It has bounced around from year to year on their disclosure forms

The number I've seen most frequently recently is something over $700,000. As I said, for purposes of the point Shaun King is making, the difference between $330K and over $700K is not material.

[Buzz Clik]

4. Bernie should have gotten some decent investment advice.

[geek tragedy]

7. either that or they're hiding assets that we'd only know about from their taxes nt

[scscholar]

50. It does make you wonder where all that cash went.

[All in it together]

101. All what cash are you looking for?

He made zero paid speeches to Wall Street.

[basselope]

86. If they were "hiding" assets, they wouldn't appear on their taxes.

Derp

[noiretextatique]

120. A cursory look at their 2014 return

Even without the schedules should ease your mind.

[geek tragedy]

121. no it raises questions--how are their deductions so large

compared to the income?

[noiretextatique]

129. But you have no problem wirh Hillary's private speeches

To Wall Street at 3x his total income?

[imagine2015]

9. He doesn't have those Wall Street connections unlike Hillary the former Senator from Wall Street

[Fumesucker]

16. Maybe he's like Chelsea and can't bring himself to care about money?

I don't blame her for cashing in though after being dragged into sniper fire by her mother, that was a traumatic experience I'm sure.

[whopis01]

125. Absolutely. If you hang on to some investments too long, no one will buy them

Like your soul, dignity, and morality.

I am sure he could have made a killing if he sold those years ago.

[geek tragedy]

5. That net worth figure is almost certainly false.

He's been earning at least $100K and currently earns $175K by himself, not counting his wife's income. They've been earning that for 25-30 years.

Plus they own at least 3-4 different pieces of real estate.

And he's only managed to save 3% of his lifetime earnings?

Nope.

[Uncle Joe]

8. Bernie owns two homes and one of them is a rental, he made 26,000 dollars in royalties

from his book; "The Speech" and donated it all to charity.

Bernie grew up poor and has been poor for a large segment of his life, this has allowed him to relate on a personal level to so many average Americans.

[geek tragedy]

11. Since 1991 he has earned $3.8 million in salary since, pulls a pension from his time as Mayor,

and earns that rental income.

Plus his wife is a high earning professional who was president of a college.

Plus several pieces of real estate.

He is famous for not donating to charity and even criticizing the existence of charities.

So, where did all that money go?

His home equity alone should be way above $300K by now, if he was paying mortgages on two homes.

[reformist2]

12. No matter what his wealth, Bernie will never be anywhere near the Clintons, thewannabe billionaires!

[Uncle Joe]

13. Bernie donated all the royalties from his book to charity, his pension from being a Mayor is only

$5,000 dollars a year.

Sanders struggled with money for most of his life, which is likely why he relates so well with the “have-nots” and is a champion for the poor. When he was 23, he and his first wife, Deborah Sanders, lived in a property that was a “maple sugar shack” with a dirt floor, Politico reported.

(snip)

A meme began circulating in February, called the Bernie Sanders Loser Meme, that said he was a loser for having a low net worth and living off welfare for a time. But Snopes disputed the meme, pointing out that he worked hard even if he didn’t have an official “9-to-5” job. In fact, Sanders spent most of his free time campaigning, working for what he was most passionate about — helping the less fortunate, even to his own detriment.

(snip)

Most of Sanders’ income has, now and historically, come from his political jobs. When he was elected mayor in 1981, the salary of $33,800 was more than he had ever made, Politico reported. In 2014, his household took in more than $205,000, paying nearly $28,000 in taxes. Most of this is from his Senator salary of $174,000. He also receives a yearly pension of $5,000 from his time as Burlington mayor.

Some of his income comes from investment funds. Sanders also receives royalties from his book, “The Speech,” but he donates all of these to charity. In 2011 and 2012, he made $26,000 in royalties from his book and donated it all to charity.

http://heavy.com/news/2016/03/bernie-sanders-net-worth-money-raised-salary-income-debt-wife-welfare-president-meme-photos/

As I mentioned Bernie owns two homes, depending on when they were purchased, how they were financed and where they're located is what determines equity.

[geek tragedy]

17. Jane earned a cool $200K a year from 2004-2011 when she got fired.

So they earned $370K for 8 years (1%er territory). No savings?

After paying on a mortgage for decades, he should have substantial home equity.

Also, there's the retirement fund in her name that's worth around a half million bucks.

[Uncle Joe]

20. Jane resigned and if you truly want to understand Bernie's net worth and how it relates, here is a

nice link.

His condominium in Vermont is only valued at $100,000 Bernie's net worth along with other members of Congress took a major hit from the 2007-2008 financial crisis.

What is Bernie Sanders’ Net Worth?

Bernie Sanders net worth: $528,014 (August 2015 average)

Bernie Sanders net worth estimate from May 2015: $440,511bernie sanders net worth facts

Out of 100 U.S. Senators, Bernie Sanders’ net worth is #86.

Bernie Sanders minimum possible net worth 2015: $222,026
Bernie Sanders maximum possible net worth 2015: $769,002
Bernie Sanders net worth vs Jeb Bush net worth: 40 times smaller.
Bernie Sanders net worth vs Carly Fiorina net worth: 112 times smaller.
Bernie Sanders net worth vs Hillary Clinton net worth: 47 times smaller.
Bernie Sanders net worth vs Bill & Hillary Clinton net worth combined: 230 times smaller.
Bernie Sanders net worth vs Donald Trump net worth: 10,795 times smaller.
Bernie Sanders net worth vs median U.S. household net worth: 7.8 times larger.
Bernie Sanders net worth vs Bill Gates net worth: 151,515 times smaller.

(snip)

http://moneynation.com/bernie-sanders-net-worth/

I'm curious as to why the Clintons, Bill being a former Governor of Arkansas and President for two terms were "dead broke" after he left office and before the great recession hit?

It's a funny concept making millions in speeches "doesn't connect you" to the people giving you vast sums of money?

[geek tragedy]

23. the dead broke thing was a dumb thing to say.

People have paid me in the past to do stuff, I do it for them, I get the money, connection over.

They paid her that money not to peddle influence but rather because of her celebrity status--she cashed in on her fame by serving as a headline draw for their conference/meeting/whatever.

It's unseemly, and it was rather insulting to the Democratic base to do them in advance of an election.

But, is it evidence of corruption? Is there something lurking in those transcripts? No and no.

[imagine2015]

10. Provide some actual documented facts and details with credible links.

Can you do that?

[jillan]

14. You mean pulling things out of one's buttocks is not a credible link?

[frylock]

19. Why not ask for the sun and the moon?

[basselope]

94. This reminds me of an old Simpsons routine.

When the kids find Skinner's pay check showing he makes 50K per year and realize he has been a principal for 20 years and deduce he MUST be a millionaire.

Your calculations assume very few expenses.

Let's see.. there are 4 kids involved (3 from Jane's previous marriage and his son Levi). Did any of them go to college? If all 4 did, that's probably 500K of "net worth" gone right there.

They also now have grandkids. Wonder if they have put some money away for them?

I guess in your scenario no one in the family has ever had a major medical expense or needed help from the family.

Stop and think before you post next time!

[IamMab]

21. Paid $150+K for 20-odd years and that's his net worth? And he wants to run a country?

[Armstead]

25. Public Service pays a lot less than corruption and greed

[senz]

88. Yeh cause it's all about makin' money, innit?

Fer gawd's sakes, whut else is thar in life, huh?

[dsc]

22. Unless his two houses are worth pretty much nothing

that is total, complete, and utter bull shit. His net worth, exclusive of the value of his houses is around 300k. Half of 675k is 337.5k. His two houses, combined, would have to be worth under 100k. And note, what he owes on those houses is included in his net worth figure from Congressional disclosure but the value of the houses is excluded. So if he owes 500k on a 1 million dollar house, his net worth shows the 500k debit but not the 1 million dollar asset.

[Armstead]

24. Okay....Three Speeches then

[beam me up scottie]

45. LOL! Exactly, well played!

[Uncle Joe]

27. Their condominium in Vermont is worth $100,000 without taking into account a mortgage owed

against it.

Whether one wishes to take a low or high end in Bernie's net worth 200,000-700,000 it's no comparison to the money made by Clinton's "top secret" speeches to corrupt financial institutions along with others.

[840high]

79. .that^ X100

[BeyondGeography]

26. Maybe...if he and his wife have gambling problems

And the real estate is two vans down by the river.

[Uncle Joe]

29. They own two homes one of them is a rental, the condominium in Vermont is only worth $100,000

before taking a mortgage owed against it into account.

[BeyondGeography]

33. You know what else is weird...all the credit card debt

http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/elections/2016/2015/06/11/sanders-reports-credit-card-debt/71088390/

Two people with six-figure incomes and apparently low overhead shouldn't be running up CC bills.

Bernie is his own worst enemy in this conversation, btw. He should do the tax release dump and be done with it. But I don't think he will.

[Uncle Joe]

36. What's weird is a former Governor, two term President, having his wife claim they were "dead broke"

after leaving the White House, and so they were forced to give "top secret" speeches to corrupt institutions which trashed our economy for over a 100 million dollars.

[BeyondGeography]

59. Yeah, that was cringeworthy

So is the continued dog-ate-my-homework routine on Bernie's taxes.

[Uncle Joe]

63. As the OP stated and I concur the "top secret" transcripts to corrupt institutions which were

largely responsible for our trashing our economy is much more relevant than Bernie's taxes.

There is simply no comparison in regards to the potential impact on policies.

[840high]

80. .+1

[vintx]

123. How the hell does anyone believe this shit?! nt

[questionseverything]

117. the cc debt was from a daughter and niece getting married...it is paid off now

thanks for your concern

[MFM008]

28. so?

She has money. They have a foundation. He is a double elected X president. Everyone makes speechs, everyone takes money if you are a politician. Sanders takes your money, HRC takes my money. Everyone expects something for their money.
Tired of hearing about it.

[Uncle Joe]

32. The Clinton's do have a foundation, that's a major issue unto itself, "everybody" in government

doesn't make "top secret" speeches to corrupt institutions for mega bucks, Bernie hasn't.

[Jackie Wilson Said]

30. Bernie clearly could have made more money investing and he must not have

if the estimates of his wealth are accurate.

I dont know if he consciously didnt invest or if he used all of his income each year living in two places as that is expensive.

I hope once he does release his tax returns everybody here who has questioned his honesty about this will apologize.

You can be sure the right wing wont.

[anotherproletariat]

31. If that net worth figure is accurate, then we DO NOT want to trust Sanders with federal monies.

If a man who has been in congress since 1990, married to a spouse who was president of a private college, cannot save an adequate amount of money to provide for a comfortable retirement, then he cannot manage money.

[Uncle Joe]

34. 170 economists disagree, they trust Bernie's proposals as sound economics.

170 Economists Endorse Bernie Sanders’ Plan To Reform Wall St. And Rein In Greed

170 of the nation’s top economists have released a letter endorsing Democratic presidential candidate Bernie Sanders’s plan to reform Wall Street.

A letter signed by 170 economists including former Labor Secretary Robert Reich, University of Texas Professor James K. Galbraith, Dean Baker, co-director of the Center for Economic and Policy Research in Washington, DC., Brad Miller, former U.S. Congressman from North Carolina, and William K. Black, University of Missouri-Kansas City endorsed the Sanders plan to reform Wall Street.

In our view, Sanders’ plan for comprehensive financial reform is critical for avoiding another ‘too-big-to-fail’ financial crisis. The Senator is correct that the biggest banks must be broken up and that a new 21st Century Glass-Steagall Act, separating investment from commercial banking, must be enacted.

Wall Street’s largest banks are now far bigger than they were before the crisis, and they still have every incentive to take excessive risks. No major Wall Street executive has been indicted for the fraudulent behavior that led up to the 2008 crash, and fines imposed on the banks have been only a fraction of the banks’ potential gains. In addition, the banks and their lobbyists have succeeded in watering down the Dodd-Frank reform legislation, and the financial institutions that pose the greatest risk to our economy have still not devised sufficient “living wills” for winding down their operations in the event of another crisis.

Secretary Hillary Clinton’s more modest proposals do not go far enough. They call for a bit more oversight and a few new charges on shadow banking activity, but they leave intact the titanic financial conglomerates that practice most shadow banking. As a result, her plan does not adequately reduce the serious risks our financial system poses to the American economy and to individual Americans. Given the size and political power of Wall Street, her proposals would only invite more dilution and finagle.

The only way to contain Wall Street’s excesses is with reforms sufficiently bold and public they can’t be watered down. That’s why we support Senator Sanders’s plans for busting up the biggest banks and resurrecting a modernized version of Glass-Steagall.

(snip)

If the American people want to protect themselves from another economic collapse, it will take real reforms like those that are being proposed by Sen. Sanders.

170 economists agree that Bernie Sanders is the candidate who will hold Wall Street accountable.

http://www.politicususa.com/2016/01/14/170-economists-bernie-sanders-plan-reform-wall-st-rein-greed.html

[senz]

90. ...

I love the way you're handling all the noise here, Uncle Joe.

[vintx]

124. Really puzzling how her supporters manage to stifle what must be

an agonizing case of cognitive dissonance.

[beam me up scottie]

35. "cannot save an adequate amount of money to provide for a comfortable retirement"?

[anotherproletariat]

40. Any financial advisor would tell you that two people will need at least $1M in retirement savings if

they plan to live for another 20 years. And that is being conservative.

[beam me up scottie]

43. Doesn't change the fact that you used a strawman to deflect.

Neither Bernie nor the op said he didn't have enough saved for a comfortable retirement.

He can't compete with the Clintons and their multi-million dollar fortune but he and Jane will be fine.

[anotherproletariat]

44. It said his net worth...that includes savings. nt

[beam me up scottie]

47. There have been numerous threads about his investments, your post was a strawman.

Nice effort but totally transparent.

[anotherproletariat]

55. I don't have time to read numerous posts...I just know that any 74 year old who has a net worth of

less than 340K does not manage money well. Period. I have no idea what you mean about the Strawman thing (is it a Wizard of Oz reference?), but it seems to make you feel better, so go for it.

[beam me up scottie]

57. A strawman is a form of logical fallacy, I posted the definition.

And enough with the 'can't manage money well' talking point, all you have is speculation and it's starting to sound more and more like a dog whistle.

[eridani]

97. Real peoplw can't afford financial asvisors

Most Americans have less than $1,000 in savings

http://www.marketwatch.com/story/most-americans-have-less-than-1000-in-savings-2015-10-06

Approximately 62% of Americans have less than $1,000 in their savings accounts and 21% don’t even have a savings account, according to a new survey of more than 5,000 adults conducted this month by Google Consumer Survey for personal finance website GOBankingRates.com. “It’s worrisome that such a large percentage of Americans have so little set aside in a savings account,” says Cameron Huddleston, a personal finance analyst for the site. “They likely don’t have cash reserves to cover an emergency and will have to rely on credit, friends and family, or even their retirement accounts to cover unexpected expenses.”

This is supported by a similar survey of 1,000 adults carried out earlier this year by personal finance site Bankrate.com, which also found that 62% of Americans have no emergency savings for things such as a $1,000 emergency room visit or a $500 car repair. Faced with an emergency, they say they would raise the money by reducing spending elsewhere (26%), borrowing from family and/or friends (16%) or using credit cards (12%). And among those who had savings prior to 2008, 57% said they’d used some or all of their savings in the Great Recession, according to a U.S. Federal Reserve survey of over 4,000 adults released last year. Of course, paltry savings-account rates don’t encourage people to save either.

In the latest survey, 29% said they have savings above $1,000 and, of those who do have money in their savings account, the most common balance is $10,000 or more (14%), followed by 5% of adults surveyed who have saved between $5,000 and just shy of $10,000; 10% say they have saved $1,000 to just shy of $5,000. Just 9% of people say they keep only enough money in their savings accounts to meet the minimum balance requirements and avoid fees. But minimum balance requirements can vary widely and be hard to meet for some consumers. They can vary anywhere between $300 a month and $1,500 a month at some major banks.

[anotherproletariat]

119. Totally agree...but someone making a congressional salary for 20+ years should save more

I'm not comparing him to the average person, since the Sanders are certainly more well off than most.

[kiva]

126. So by your logic,

the richest presidential candidate should automatically win. No need to bother with political parties or elections, just give the office to the richest person who wants it

[KelleyD]

37. I've seen posts that say he didn't earn anything until he was elected Mayor at 40 yrs old.

Maybe that is why he has such a low earning portfolio. The Clinton's worked and saved money after graduation from college working to earn their income. Could be that is the difference.

[BreakfastClub]

42. I've read that too. He only has a bachelor's degree, which makes him undereducated for the

job of president, and which also contributes to his lack of money.

[B Calm]

64. Makes him more in common with the average citizen, therefore unlike Hillary he knows

the issues that effect us.

[ecstatic]

93. Um, I don't want an average Joe to be president. I thought only

Trump supporters were into that average Joe stuff. I only have a bachelor's, but at some point in the near future, I hope to get a master's, at least. Meanwhile, Bernie had the means to go back to school but wasn't interested in learning more. That's telling. Maybe if he had gone to law school, his ideas would actually be legal and make more sense.

[B Calm]

98. Since when does the POTUS must be a lawer in order to be qualified? The smartest man I

ever known was my father. He spoke five languages fluently and during WW2 the highly educated officers were always turning to my dad. My father went to school for 7 years.

[senz]

56. Hillary went from "dead broke" in 2000 to a multi-multi-millionaire.

From the OP:

Combined, Bill and Hillary Clinton have made $153 million in speaking fees alone.

[seabeyond]

38. I want a candidate who gets the money and doesnt let money dictate her behavior. Clinton is going up

against repugs that have lots of money. Fool us to want someone who can't get a big war chest.

[Uncle Joe]

46. Bernie has raised more money in Jan, Feb and March from the American People than Hillary,

I see no reason that trend won't continue should he face the Republicans in the general election.

Bernie would be most competitive in the G.E. his astonishing fund raising prowess especially for someone coming from such a small state against a strong entrenched political machine, serves him well not only from a fund raising point of view but as inoculation against Republican "anti-establishment" attacks whether it comes from Trump or Cruz.

[seabeyond]

48. I do not know where his money is coming from. FEC has called him out three times. 85% comes

from DC. But... Good to know, just in case. I still do not have an issue with Clinton raising money.

[Uncle Joe]

51. That's incorrect the majority of Bernie's fundraising has come from the more progressive

Northwest, Oregon, Washington and California.

As I mentioned above Bernie's small donations from the people inoculates him against Republican anti-establishment attacks and this why he polls better against them than Hillary.

[seabeyond]

60. Not from what I have seen. And he hasn't been vetted. I am still open to questions.

[Uncle Joe]

65. Perhaps you have D.C. and Washington State confused?

Washington voters giving more to Bernie Sanders than all others combined

Washington state isn’t just feeling the Bern. We’re on fire with it. The total number of donations reflects how many people in our state were inspired enough by a candidate to send any amount of money.

http://www.seattletimes.com/seattle-news/politics/states-donors-hot-for-the-bern/

Where Did Bernie Sanders' Two Million Donations Come From?

Sanders' lack of concern with the golden state's rich and famous hasn't put much of a dent in his support statewide. California residents have contributed 23% of his campaign contributions, more than any other state (and significant, given that California comprises 12% of the U.S. population). Los Angeles area donors are his top contributors, followed by those in New York, Boston and San Francisco. The leading zip code for Sanders contributors is his hometown of Burlington, Vt., followed by Los Angeles and San Francisco.


http://www.thestreet.com/story/13403166/1/where-did-bernie-sanders-two-million-donations-come-from.html

[seabeyond]

66. I am pretty good with geography.

[Uncle Joe]

68. From you post# 48

I do not know where his money is coming from. FEC has called him out three times. 85% comes

from DC. But... Good to know, just in case. I still do not have an issue with Clinton raising money.

[Seeinghope]

74. Yeah getting $350,000 from Alice Walton is something to be really proud of

Sitting on the board of director for a company that pays their employee's such low wages that many of them receive some type of aid. Hillary Clinton sat on the board of directors for Walmart fro 1986 to 1992 while Walmart was fight against unions.

Hillary Clinton get's money from the very people the suppress the middle class and the poor. How does Hillary Clinton represent those people and claim not to side with the people that giving money to her hand over fist? There is a direct conflict that is not logical. Nobody "owns" Bernie Sanders. He won't have favours to pay. If Hillary Clinton is so "pro middle class, the poor...even upper middle class why not just show us the transcripts from her speeches to those 20 contributors?" Why as Secretary of State did the Clinton Foundation receive all of these foreign countries that added up for hundreds of millions of dollars while those same countries received contracts for arms from the U.S. Getting money from unethical activity doesn't make for great leadership qualities. Who exactly is she serving? Her personal wealth or the people. It is very obvious who Bernie Sanders is working for.

For people of faith, the person who died on the cross did not spend his time on earth accumulating personal wealth while living in the palaces, eating with the wealthy and travel with the Kings. That person spent his time on earth helping and teaching, living in poverty. According to Hillary Clinton supporters this person would not be a person qualified to really believe in or follow.

It is a difference of values and ethics.

[seabeyond]

99. Young and only woman on the board, she fought for women's wage, position and ecology.

[Seeinghope]

100. Yeah, she made quite a difference didn't she?

[Seeinghope]

102. Hillary Clinton was the ONLY woman on the board of Directors of Walmart

She sat on the sidelines when it came to fighting for higher wages, unions and women's rights. She focused on ecology.

http://www.nytimes.com/2007/05/20/us/politics/20walmart.html?_r=0

[Marr]

115. I believe that's essentially Trump's argument, too.

It's almost too absurd to address.

[seabeyond]

116. Of course it isnt absurd, but simply pragmatic to be able financially compete with Repug opponent.

Last edited Wed Apr 13, 2016, 02:20 PM - Edit history (1)

[DesertFlower]

39. what difference does a person's wealth or lack thereof

have to do with anything? take the kennedy's for instance -- they were wealthy and almost all of them devoted their lives to public service.

[Uncle Joe]

52. Wealth in and of itself doesn't mean a candidate or President can't serve the nation well and no one

is arguing that point here.

How that money is raised and to what degree it affects policy proposals and the historical record are most assuredly relevant.

[DesertFlower]

58. let me go back to the kennedy's. they

were not crooks, but their dad was. remember he made some kind of deal with sinatra to get "mob" (?) votes.

i should have known you're a bernie supporter.

[Uncle Joe]

61. So what's your point?

I am a Bernie supporter, is that bad?

[DesertFlower]

62. no. i just don't want to hear

anymore hillary bashing.

[Uncle Joe]

67. No candidate can expect to run for the Presidency and not face criticism?

If anything Bernie has pulled his punches in regards to Hillary, whereas a Republican opponent will not.

[DesertFlower]

69. let's face it. hillary has had more than

her share of criticism. it started in the early '90s when bill ran. the repubs bashed her and are still bashing her and i think some of the bernie supporters have joined them.

she's not perfect -- but enough is enough.

[Uncle Joe]

70. I would agree that the Republicans have attacked the Clintons regardless of the merits but in both

cases; Bill and Hillary much if not most of their political ailments have come from self-inflicted wounds.

In politics there is no "enough" in regards to criticism whether it comes in a primary, general election or if successful after being elected.

Political criticism is eternal but don't make the mistake of assuming sincere Bernie supporters are doing it with the same ideals or motivations as Republicans.

I sincerely believe Bernie could be one of our greatest Presidents; a truly transformation-al political leader, something that is long overdue since the days of Reagan.

[840high]

81. How much of that bashing has

she brought on herself by her behavior? That includes Bill, too.

[senz]

78. +1 True and well-said, Uncle Joe.

[treestar]

106. Why? If it is not illegal

then what difference does it make?

[Uncle Joe]

108. Why have a code of ethics for any industry, profession or occupation if it's not illegal?

That sounds like what you are promoting.

[BreakfastClub]

41. FDR. Need I say more? nt

[Uncle Joe]

53. See my post #52 just above yours. n/t

[JTFrog]

105. Do you know how the Roosevelt and Delano families made their money?

Do you know where FDR's first job was? Do you know about his connections to Wall Street? Do you realize that in his day he recieved all kinds of criticism calling him a "corporate socialist" and a war hawk?

Do any of these things sound familiar to you?

[Uncle Joe]

114. I know that FDR developed Polio and this radically changed his perception in regards

to the most vulnerable.

I know he took on the vested powers and wealthy interests of the day, successfully multiple times.

[AzDar]

49. The Clintons are not, nor have they ever been ... the solution. They are part of the problem.

They need to exit... stage right (of course).

[Uncle Joe]

54. I and Michelle Alexander would agree with you.

Peace to you, AzDar.

[mythology]

71. Yet more tripe from Shaun King

Isn't his 15 minutes of fame over with? How many different times does the money he raises in the name of this or that cause have to not seemed to make it to the intended purposes before people stop taking him seriously?

He's a scam artist who insists on calling pretty much everybody who disagrees with him a white supremacist.

[Uncle Joe]

72. So you have no rebuttal to the actual points he makes in the article?

[Segami]

73. Kick

[senz]

75. How Bernie's net worth compares to the Senate average over time ...

?resize=593%2C395

Bernie Sanders’ net worth is shown by the blue bars at the bottom.
The yellow line represents the average net worth of the U.S. senate.
Image source: Center for Responsive Politics

http://moneynation.com/bernie-sanders-net-worth/

And lest any rightwing-flavored Bernie critic attacks him for not getting rich on his income, most senators are now millionaires.

https://ballotpedia.org/Net_worth_of_United_States_Senators_and_Representatives

[Uncle Joe]

83. Thanks for the addition, senz.

[senz]

85. It's an interesting topic, Uncle Joe.

Some of the responses remind me that these days the Democratic Party (or maybe just DU) contains outlooks and value sets one didn't used to associate with Democrats -- or at least liberals and progressives.

The last link in my comment contains lists of richest and poorest legislators a few years ago. I found myself liking and admiring the poorer ones especially.

It's nice to have you back and making OPs again.

[Uncle Joe]

91. Your post reminds me of the late Senator Paul Wellstone; a political leader of modest means.

WASHINGTON, Oct. 25— Paul Wellstone often seemed out of step. He called himself a liberal when many used that word as a slur. He voted against the Persian Gulf war in his first year in the Senate, and this month opposed using force against Iraq.

Senator Wellstone, 58, who died in a plane crash today while campaigning for re-election, fought for bills favored by unions and advocates of family farmers and the poor, and against those favored by banks, agribusiness and large corporations.

This year he was the principal opponent of legislation supported by large majorities of Democrats and Republicans that would make it more difficult for people to declare bankruptcy. He argued that the measure would enrich creditors at the expense of people ''in brutal economic circumstances.'' He advocated causes like national health insurance that even many of his fellow liberals abandoned as futile.

Mr. Wellstone was a rumpled, unfailingly modest man who, unlike many of his colleagues, lived on his Senate salary. He was married to the former Sheila Ison for 39 years, having married at 19 when he was in college. His wife and their 33-year-old daughter, Marcia, also died today in the crash.

(snip)

He was more interested in leading his students in protests than he was in publishing in academic journals, and he was often at odds with his colleagues and Carleton administrators. He fought the college's investments in companies doing business in South Africa, battled local banks that foreclosed on farms, picketed with strikers at a meat-packing plant and taught classes off campus rather than cross a picket line when Carleton's custodians were on strike.

In 1974, the college told him his contract would not be renewed. But with strong support from students, the student newspaper and local activists, he appealed the dismissal, and it was reversed.

(snip)

Mr. Boschwitz spent $7 million on his campaign, seven times Mr. Wellstone's budget. To counteract the Boschwitz attacks, Mr. Wellstone ran witty, even endearing television commercials produced without charge by a group led by a former student. In one ad, the video and audio were speeded up, and Mr. Wellstone said he had to talk fast because ''I don't have $6 million to spend.''

Mr. Wellstone toured the state in a battered green school bus, and in the end, he won 50.4 percent of the vote and was the only challenger in 1990 to defeat an incumbent senator.

(snip)

http://www.nytimes.com/2002/10/26/us/a-death-in-the-senate-the-senator-paul-wellstone-58-icon-of-liberalism-in-senate.html?pagewanted=all

Thanks for the kind words, senz, peace to you.

[uponit7771]

76. ... and she's still underpaid

[Uncle Joe]

84. You may be correct, the return on investment for the mega-banks, Goldman Sachs, the

fossil fuel industry and so forth may have actually warranted giving Hillary a million or more per speech versus the pittance of 250,000.

Goldman Sachs just shelled out five billion dollars without breaking a sweat for fraudulent practices, of course no one in their upper food chain will spend any time in prison for it, that's reserved for the common folk.

As for the American People; we will never know whether Hillary was underpaid or overpaid because those are "top secret" speeches affecting major industries which dominate the government.

[senz]

96. Wow. Maybe you could start a religion.

[Jitter65]

77. Seems to me that's Bernie's problem...not Hillary's nt

[senz]

87. Seems to me the pursuit of truth and justice is a far finer thing than the pursuit of money.

[Uncle Joe]

92. I agree on counts senz.

[ecstatic]

89. So what? Is this supposed to help Bernie somehow?

"making him among the least wealthy U.S. Senators in the country"

Until recently, he's never been particularly ambitious. Is that a good thing? ymmv

[Uncle Joe]

95. Just to highlight a difference, with politicians "personal ambition" is paramount, with

political leaders working for a more fair, just society and changing the world for the better is their guiding star.

[Bluenorthwest]

111. Several Senators have net worths under 100K, even under 50K.

In the House, a couple of dozen members have negative net worth, more debts than assets. Sen. Martin Heinrich of NM is about 3/4 of a million underwater....


http://media.cq.com/50Richest/

[Uncle Joe]

113. Thanks for the addition, Bluenorthwest.

Peace to you.

[Octafish]

103. Ms. Clinton is paid BILLIONAIRE wages.

To wit:



Warren Buffett: He made $12.7 billion this year or ~$37 million per day; ~$1.54 million per hour; or ~$25,694 per minute.

Bill Gates: He earned $11.5 billion this year which works out to be ~$33.3 million per day; $1.38 million per hour; or ~$23,148 per minute.

Sheldon Adelson: The casino mogul earned $11.4 billion this year which means he made ~$33 million per day; ~$1.38 million per hour; or $22,946 per minute.

Jeff Bezos: He made $11.3 billion this year or ~$32.7 million per day; $1.36 million per hour; or ~$22,745 per minute.

Mark Zuckerberg: The Facebook founder made $10.5 billion this year or ~$30.4 million per day; ~$1.27 million per hour; or ~$21,135 per minute.

Masayoshi Son: He made $10.3 billion this year or ~$29.86 billion per day; ~$1.24 million per hour; or $20,732 per minute.

Sergey Brin: He made $9.3 billion this year which works out to be ~$26.9 million per day, $1.12 million per hour; or $18,719 per minute.

Larry Page: He made $9.3 billion this year which works out to be ~$26.9 million per day, $1.12 million per hour; or $18,719 per minute.

Lu Chee Woo: He brought in $8.3 billion this year or ~$24 million per day; ~$1 million per hour; or ~$16,706 per minute.

Carl Icahn: The billionaire investor made $7.2 billion this year, which works out to be ~$20.87 million/day; ~$869,565/hour; or ~$14,492/minute.

SOURCE: http://www.businessinsider.com/what-warren-buffett-makes-per-hour-2013-12

So, a billionaire makes about as much as the average schmuck working three part-time, minimum wage jobs for a year, per minute. Then, they move it offshore.

[Uncle Joe]

104. The ratios are logically ridiculous only creating massive imbalance in our society, leading

to a dysfunctional world too enmeshed in rigor mortis to the point of preventing us from adapting or evolving to a rapidly changing environment.

[treestar]

107. Maybe I should run, since the poorer a person is, the better

[Uncle Joe]

109. No one is arguing that point, but nice try.

[treestar]

110. that's precisely your point

Are you not attempting to paint Bernie as a better candidate and more of the people because he has not earned as much money as Hillary has? And trying to imply Hillary's earnings mean she is automatically corrupt?

I mean geez, Bernie can't seem to win on his policy positions, so the have to try these other things?

[Uncle Joe]

112. No I am painting Bernie as the better candidate because of his stance on the critical issues

which affect the vast majority of Americans specifically and the world in general.

As for Hillary "you can't serve two masters," the system which has so greatly skewed our society to the point of being highly dysfunctional and unjust has laden her with lucre for "top secret" speeches.

The problem isn't the Clinton's wealth it's how they obtained it and to what degree this has affected their stance on the issues and policy positions.

From all observable evidence and history, Hillary is compromised.

[SocialLibFiscalCon]

118. That's what you took from the article?

Get help

[vintx]

122. Love this

A factory and a worker indeed.

[redstateblues]

127. Envy is an ugly emotion

[Uncle Joe]

128. Yes it is, be sure to let us know when you actually find it. n/t

[Lil Missy]

130. Net worth has nothing to do with qualifications. I don't care if he's a billionaire. n/t