All Primaries Should Be Open Primaries Until or Unless...

[votesparks]

There is equal and fair ballot access for independents, and candidates from all political parties.

Why is this fundamental point of political equality fought against by the establishment with laws that require a major party candidate to collect 50 signatures to get onto the ballot, but my independent running mate must collect around 600 (this is the case in my state, but that number could be higher for indies if there is more population in their district)?

Who decided that candidates from our two-party system would have unfair advantages over others?

They did.

Go Democracy!

[DanTex]

1. LOL. If Bernie did better with Dem voters, then 100% of you would be in favor of closed primaries.

In the same way that y'all were outraged about superdelegates, but now that they're Bernie's only chance of winning by overriding the will of the electorate, you're totally on board with them.

[votesparks]

5. Negatory

I and many others in and outside of the parties have been against unfair ballot access their entire lives.

The practice is an insult to American veterans.

[votesparks]

21. question avoidance alert

Why should ballot access requirements be stricter for some than others?

[Hortensis]

27. I agree. Would that it was only about principle.

But then opinions would go both ways because there is more than one important principle involved and every choice violates some principles more than others.

[CorkySt.Clair]

39. +1

These OP's could not be more transparent.

[Renew Deal]

2. Wrong

Do you understand what happens in that situation? The larger group gets to pick all the candidates. So in a state like Oklahoma, a Democrat would never end up on the ballot. Just two republicans.

[bigtree]

4. that's why the Constitution gives primacy to states

...in allowing them to decide the manner in which they elect delegates.

[TMontoya]

3. I guess

This will be one of the many excuses we will be hearing on April 20th.

[Tarc]

6. If you're interested in the Democratic Party, then join the Democratic Party

This isn't Independent Underground we're on here.

[votesparks]

9. Read please

The question is about a fundamental aspect of fairness applied to all?

Why are you opposed to fairness? Answer the question.

I would gladly debate and run against any candidate, indie or not, and be happy that their requirements to get onto the ballot were not more prohibitive than mine. .

I'm running as a Democratic candidate, and spent COUNTLESS hours helping other D candidates. so I can only surmise that your "then join the Democratic Party" line is just refusal to researchh

[Tarc]

10. Having people who have a proven, vested interest in the party be the ones to vote IS fair

Closed primaries are also less susceptible to outside meddling.

I have no sympathy for people who can't read their state election law and register on-time.

[votesparks]

18. you didn't answer the question

[Tarc]

40. You didn't ask anything worth answering

[votesparks]

41. So say those

without answers.

[Tarc]

45. There is nothing undemocratic about a closed primary

People can either join or GTFO. Simple.

[votesparks]

48. You are switching the subject

the subject is unfair ballot access.

[Tarc]

49. Joing the @#$%ing party, then you have access to the @#$%ing ballot

Independents can pick a @#$%ing side; voting for a primary candidate while still maintaining an "independent" status is not a @#$%ing right.

Clear enough for you?

[votesparks]

54. You are switching the subject

the subject is unfair ballot access.

[Tarc]

55. How'd that work out for ya last night?

[votesparks]

56. Question is about

ballot access for candidates.

[Tarc]

57. How'd that work out for ya last night?

[Renew Deal]

13. Do your consider "One Party Rule" fair?

Because that's the outcome of what you're advocating.

[hrmjustin]

7. Independents in NY are warned they can not vote in primaries when they register to vote.

Sorry but i don't want people voting in our primary in NY that are not Democrats.

They chose not to affiliate with us then they should not vote in our primary.

[votesparks]

11. Then you should support fair ballot access for other parties and indies

because then all of the D primaries could be closed, but nobody would care or could say the process is unfair because others could do it they way they saw fit too, but on the same ballot access ground for all.

You don't seem to understand what I am saying.

They can't vote in another primary because the establishment has made it next to impossible for others to hold their own primaries through unfair ballot access laws.

It's the fairness thing that you can't seem to wrap your head around.

[hrmjustin]

14. We have many parties on our ballots.

Thry get on do I won't cry for them.

[votesparks]

20. you avoided the question

Why should the requirements for ballot access be more prohibitive for some than others?

[hrmjustin]

22. Because we have a system that you have to have support to get on the ballot.

Several third party get ballot access easily here in NY.

[votesparks]

26. why should

it be anything less than fair and equal for all. You avoided answering the question.

[hrmjustin]

29. Because the NY ballot is cluttered enough as it is.

We are not going to just put parties on the ballot that only a 100 people will vote for.

[votesparks]

32. Ahhhh....

We'll decide for them.

Thanks.

[hrmjustin]

33. Sorry but i don't care about third parties.

[votesparks]

35. You meant Democracy

because that's the subject.

[hrmjustin]

37. Third parties do fine here.

[brooklynite]

8. Why should people who don't like political parties get to decide who the party runs as a candidate?

[votesparks]

15. Why are you opposed to people who don't like THE BIG 2 political parties forming their own thing

with the same ballot access requirements as everyone else?

Why are you opposed to fairness?

IMO, we Ds can hold whatever form of open or closed primary that we want. And others should be able to do so, with no more or less requirements than us.

Why are you opposed to fairness across the spectrum of democracy?

[brooklynite]

23. I'm totally in favor of people who don't like the big two parties forming their own parties...

...rather than coming in to mine.

[votesparks]

28. then you are in favor of

equal and fair ballot access for their candidates?

Or do you believe one candidate should be allowed to collect 50 signatures to get onto the ballot, while another is required to get hundreds, or sometimes thousands for the same office?

[brooklynite]

31. I'm absolutely in favor of fair ballot access...

...and recommend you take that up with the State Governments which determine such things, not create a workaround by requiring Independent Parties to open their process to non-members.

[votesparks]

34. We are in agreement

I have no problem with closed primaries, as long as the candidates of other parties and entities do not have more restrictive access to getting onto the ballot. As long as the process of ballot access for candidates is fair and equal, a party could declare that it's only going to allow people who love eating Big Macs to vote in their primary for all I care. It's the fair and equal part I want to get to.

That's where we have a long way to go.

I am going to take it up with my State Government. I am running for State Representative in Ohio's 43rd (D).

[Gothmog]

12. Democrats should get to decide who the the Democratic nominee is

[votesparks]

16. you didn't answer the question

it's about equal ballot access for others, not whether Ds should get to decide who the D nominee.

[CalvinballPro]

44. Your "equal access" doesn't trump our Freedom of Association.

This is already settled, so no additional whining will make a difference.

[Gothmog]

46. The party gets to set its own rules

Republicans and other voters have no inherent right to vote in the Democratic primary

[Proud Public Servant]

17. Parties aren't public or government entities

They are private organizations, and their primaries are votes of their membership. Woyld you advocate union elections be open to all employees, regardless of union membership (and thus open to management)? Would you want everyone in your neighborhood to elect the head of your school's PTA, regardless of whether they even have kids in your school? I wouldn't.

Bernie supporters -- and I am one -- who feel disenfranchised in closed primary states can simply join the Party. If Bernie can so it, surely they can. But this incessant whining about the Party primaries being open only to Party members -- which is the whole point of primaries -- is really tedious.

[votesparks]

19. you didn't answer the question

it's about unfair ballot access requirements.

[brooklynite]

24. You complain nobody's answering the question, so I'll answer it...

...ballot access is a decision of the STATE GOVERNMENT. Why should independent political parties be penalized for a decision that's not theirs to control?

[votesparks]

30. Because the big 2 control

the state governments.

Do you support fair and equal ballot access for all political parties and independents? Yes or no will actually suffice.

[malokvale77]

53. Reading through this thread...

tells me that most here don't understand your question.

Yes, the requirements to get on the ballot should be the same for anyone wanting to run for office. Democrats and Republicans shouldn't get special status.

[EmperorHasNoClothes]

25. Not to mention

all the shenanigans we have seen this year with people having their party affiliation changed without their consent.

If we had a true multi-party system, closed primaries might make more sense. Since the two parties have such a choke hold on the process, however, it's important to give a voice to everyone who doesn't strictly align with one of the two parties.

I'm happy to live in a state with open primaries and I wouldn't have it any other way.

[seabeyond]

36. For sure, we did not see this need to totally change our process in the middle of a primary in '08.

Sanders certainly feels rules should not apply to him. having been in competitive sports for decades, this is no more than a poor loser.

[One of the 99]

42. No way.

Open primaries can lead to disruption by the opposition. Like or not political parties are private groups and if you want to vote in their primary, you should be a registered member of that party.

[CalvinballPro]

43. Parties make their own rules. SCOTUS verified in CA Dems v Jones

Google it maybe. Then you won't look so naive on this subject.

Want to run a party? Start your own!

[artyteacher]

51. this eom

[mythology]

47. Because the two major parties have a proven history of support

Much like third party candidates don't get added to debates without meeting a level of support, it makes sense to require slightly extra of those who don't have that history.

[votesparks]

52. That's an oligarchy

self-fulfilling prophecy.

Less known ideas are not able to be showcased to a national audience, making it harder for said ideas to to break into the mainstream. It's part of the rigged system.

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

50. I would like to see one, nationwide, open primary.

If a candidate wishes to declare a party, fine. If not, fine.

Parties are labels and little else.