Welcome to DU! The truly grassroots left-of-center political community where regular people, not algorithms, drive the discussions and set the standards. Join the community: Create a free account Support DU (and get rid of ads!): Become a Star Member Latest Breaking News General Discussion The DU Lounge All Forums Issue Forums Culture Forums Alliance Forums Region Forums Support Forums Help & Search

Beacool

(30,249 posts)
Sun Apr 10, 2016, 03:14 PM Apr 2016

Vatican: Pope Didn't Invite Bernie Sanders

Controversy surrounds just who invited the Vermont senator to the Holy See, and whether he's doing it for political reasons.

ROME—Not since Pope Francis’s ill-advised meeting with gay marriage opponent Kim Davis has there been so much “he said, she said” controversy about the pope meddling in American politics.

On Friday, Democratic presidential hopeful Bernie Sanders announced that he was “very excited” about having just received an invitation to speak at a small, invitation-only scholarly conference at the Vatican’s Pontifical Academy of Social Sciences conference celebrating the 25th year anniversary of an encyclical “Centesimus Annus,” written by Pope John Paul II on the evils of capitalism.

-------

Margaret Archer, president of Pontifical Academy of Social Sciences, said that Sanders invited himself. “Sanders made the first move, for the obvious reasons,” Archer told Bloomberg. “He may be going for the Catholic vote but this is not the Catholic vote and he should remember that and act accordingly -- not that he will.”

Not long after, Monsignor Marcelo Sanchez Sorondo, chancellor of the Pontifical Academy of Social Sciences stepped in to dispute Archer’s statements. “"I deny that. It was not that way," Sorondo told Reuters “This is not true and she knows it. I invited him with her consensus.”

Sorondo later toned down his initial comments telling CNN the invitation should not be seen as an endorsement of the senator’s nomination. “It does not signify any support of the campaign," Sorondo said. "We want to establish a dialogue between North America and South America so we thought to invite a [U.S.] politician. The President of Bolivia will also be there. Perhaps the others (candidates) would have been interested but they did not request to come."

He also confirmed to CNN that Sanders had reached out to the Vatican first. “He has expressed an interest many times in the Pope's encyclical and it's clear that he has an interest in studying it,” Sorondo said. “It might have that effect, but we are not looking to support the campaign."

http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2016/04/10/vatican-pope-didn-t-invite-bernie-sanders.html

IMO, this whole controversy is much ado about nothing. I'm only posting this article to clarify that Sanders approached the Vatican first and then the invitation was proffered, it didn't come out of the blue. Either way, it's not that big of an issue.


73 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
Highlight: NoneDon't highlight anything 5 newestHighlight 5 most recent replies
Vatican: Pope Didn't Invite Bernie Sanders (Original Post) Beacool Apr 2016 OP
He also confirmed to CNN that Sanders had reached out to the Vatican first. seabeyond Apr 2016 #1
Sanders will be speaking at the conference... He'll say hello, how are you, hello, excuse me, do... uponit7771 Apr 2016 #3
I really do not see him going head to head with scholars, anyway, that have had time to put together seabeyond Apr 2016 #8
Yep. So much for that nice little conference she had planned. ucrdem Apr 2016 #13
No, he's not a scholar Nonhlanhla Apr 2016 #66
Ty. Nt. seabeyond Apr 2016 #67
He'll probably get as far as buon giorno before it's time to say arrivaderci ucrdem Apr 2016 #10
+1, but they'll deny that he said anything untoward uponit7771 Apr 2016 #12
oh god. this is endless. no. he didn't. the vatican said no he didn't. roguevalley Apr 2016 #71
You have not caught up on the latest. Did you read the OP? What are you saying the Vatican confirmed seabeyond Apr 2016 #72
He did so! CentralCoaster Apr 2016 #2
a Vatican spokesman stated the invitation did not come from the Pope DrDan Apr 2016 #4
Here is the invitation FreakinDJ Apr 2016 #40
exactly - from Rev Sorondo, Prof Archer and the organizers - not the Pope DrDan Apr 2016 #44
Actually, Archer has made clear it was not from her, either. Nt seabeyond Apr 2016 #45
The issue as I see it is that Sanders and is supporters used this to upaloopa Apr 2016 #5
Agreed! While attacking Clinton and the Democratic party jcosgriff Apr 2016 #9
This just makes sense to me. I won't stop pointing out Sanders is a mere politician. This was a seabeyond Apr 2016 #11
To be fair, Turin_C3PO Apr 2016 #17
Sanders people arranged the invite then stated the Pope invited them. I do not expect Sanders seabeyond Apr 2016 #20
It wasn't a Vatican invite. Bernie twice on TV answered yes when asked if upaloopa Apr 2016 #21
Idk. Turin_C3PO Apr 2016 #32
Well, he might see the Pope WhiteTara Apr 2016 #46
I don't think anyone is concerned okasha Apr 2016 #58
I think that both sides need to cool it. Beacool Apr 2016 #27
I agree. He should go and have fun. Totally. And good for him. Sincerely. Nt. seabeyond Apr 2016 #29
Please link to those statements passiveporcupine Apr 2016 #57
Perhaps the others (candidates) would have been interested but they did not request to come." jcosgriff Apr 2016 #6
Not just pandering, X-treme Deathmatch Power-pandering ucrdem Apr 2016 #41
This......... Beacool Apr 2016 #56
Still obsessed with this nonsense? AgingAmerican Apr 2016 #7
Nope, this is the first time that I emitted an opinion on the subject. Beacool Apr 2016 #30
Ain't it a hoot, tho?!!!! yourpaljoey Apr 2016 #43
Yeah this is a non-issue. Turin_C3PO Apr 2016 #14
Thank you. Beacool Apr 2016 #54
It's an issue in that Sanders tried to represent this as something it wasn't. IamMab Apr 2016 #15
+1 oasis Apr 2016 #63
is Hillary's team hoping that if they create enough stink the Vatican will withdraw the invatation azurnoir Apr 2016 #16
I want Sanders to go. I am all for it. Getting at the truth should be good, too. seabeyond Apr 2016 #22
who's truth Bloomberg's ? azurnoir Apr 2016 #23
That the Pope did not schedule a meeting with Sanders. Ya think? Lol. seabeyond Apr 2016 #25
Let's see a direct link to what Monsignor Marcelo Sanchez Sorondo,said to CNN azurnoir Apr 2016 #31
Nah... believe what you like. I will just keep paying attention to this ever evolving story. seabeyond Apr 2016 #34
IOW you can't find one either, because I looked? also what appears to be a hyperlink to CNN isn't azurnoir Apr 2016 #38
To me it's a non-issue. Beacool Apr 2016 #33
yes this thread shows exactly how much of a non-issue it is for some LOL azurnoir Apr 2016 #35
Your wrong on two counts upaloopa Apr 2016 #47
Lies like my post? Really? ya go with that line of attack azurnoir Apr 2016 #48
Yep. Bernie actually invited himself. nt Cali_Democrat Apr 2016 #18
You've posted so many untrue things. Why on earth would anyone believe what you say now? DisgustipatedinCA Apr 2016 #36
I think you are the one who is wrong and not to be trusted upaloopa Apr 2016 #50
I do support Sanders, and I meant every word I said. DisgustipatedinCA Apr 2016 #53
... beam me up scottie Apr 2016 #19
Did the Pope invite Bernie Sanders to the Vatican? Cali_Democrat Apr 2016 #24
... beam me up scottie Apr 2016 #26
I will help here. No. The Pope did not invite Sanders for a meeting to ... chat. Lol. Nt. seabeyond Apr 2016 #28
Sarondo: I would've invited Hillary Clinton too if I thought she would come! lostnfound Apr 2016 #37
Sounds like Francis has already okasha Apr 2016 #59
This Daily Beast? MattSh Apr 2016 #39
This message was self-deleted by its author Vilis Veritas Apr 2016 #42
DU:P is one of Dante's circles in hell, isn't it? Vinca Apr 2016 #49
LMAO! Dante will have to create a new level just for Bernie! beam me up scottie Apr 2016 #51
I was thinking more of a level for idiotic shit that keeps being posted again and again and again. Vinca Apr 2016 #52
I got that but these over the top claims about Bernie are a little deranged too. beam me up scottie Apr 2016 #55
They've been calling him a saint and labeling us his acolytes since day one passiveporcupine Apr 2016 #62
Yep, they sound just like the Republicans who called Obama the "messiah" and labeled us a cult. beam me up scottie Apr 2016 #64
Thanks BMUS passiveporcupine Apr 2016 #73
.that^ X100 840high Apr 2016 #60
"IMO this whole controversy is much ado about nothing." Android3.14 Apr 2016 #61
There was no invite nothing but continuing lies upaloopa Apr 2016 #65
Try acquiring some class. Beacool Apr 2016 #69
"this whole controversy is much ado about nothing."...Quite a long post for as you say...nothing. EndElectoral Apr 2016 #68
K & R enthusiastically. Surya Gayatri Apr 2016 #70
 

seabeyond

(110,159 posts)
1. He also confirmed to CNN that Sanders had reached out to the Vatican first.
Sun Apr 10, 2016, 03:17 PM
Apr 2016

Yes. That is what we have been saying. That is what Archer said, then Sorondo called her a liar.

Sachs, the foreign adviser to Sanders and speaker at the conference, asked Sorondo for an invite.

Truth will set you free. So Sanders can now go to his 30 people conference and listen to scholars discuss what the conference was created for. I am all for that. Kick ass Sanders.

uponit7771

(90,344 posts)
3. Sanders will be speaking at the conference... He'll say hello, how are you, hello, excuse me, do...
Sun Apr 10, 2016, 03:20 PM
Apr 2016

... I have to sit all the way back here etc, sorry bout stepping on your foot.

etc

 

seabeyond

(110,159 posts)
8. I really do not see him going head to head with scholars, anyway, that have had time to put together
Sun Apr 10, 2016, 03:29 PM
Apr 2016

what they are discussing, after years of research, lol. Maybe that is why Archer was pissed.

Nonhlanhla

(2,074 posts)
66. No, he's not a scholar
Sun Apr 10, 2016, 05:11 PM
Apr 2016

The conference is about a document that forms part of the body of Catholic Social Teaching. CST rests on particular principles with which non-scholars are not usually familiar. However, many of Bernie's ideas do overlap with the economic teachings of Catholicism (although it consists of a wide variety of documents, from the very capitalist but still very affirming of workers' rights Rerum Novarum, to the more socialist-sounding Labor Exercens, to the document discussed at this conference).

ucrdem

(15,512 posts)
10. He'll probably get as far as buon giorno before it's time to say arrivaderci
Sun Apr 10, 2016, 03:30 PM
Apr 2016

TBH I'm glad it's Bernie who put his foot in it this time and not Bill or Hill. But boy what a food fight.

 

seabeyond

(110,159 posts)
72. You have not caught up on the latest. Did you read the OP? What are you saying the Vatican confirmed
Sun Apr 10, 2016, 06:25 PM
Apr 2016
He also confirmed to CNN that Sanders had reached out to the Vatican first.


This is in the article. Sorondo finally confirmed that Sanders reached out to the Vatican. Sachs said he is the one doing the reaching out.

I do not get your post.

DrDan

(20,411 posts)
4. a Vatican spokesman stated the invitation did not come from the Pope
Sun Apr 10, 2016, 03:20 PM
Apr 2016

"In a telephone interview, the Rev. Federico Lombardi, the senior Vatican spokesman, said that the invitation to Sanders did not come from the pope and that he was unaware of whether the pontiff had been informed before the offer was extended. Rather, the invitation came via the hand of an influential Argentine cleric in Vatican City, Monsignor Marcelo Sánchez Sorondo, who heads the ancient Pontifical Academy of Sciences."

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/sanders-ties-his-advocacy-for-a-moral-economy-to-the-work-of-pope-francis/2016/04/09/1082454e-fe58-11e5-80e4-c381214de1a3_story.html?postshare=5551460219544263&tid=ss_tw

DrDan

(20,411 posts)
44. exactly - from Rev Sorondo, Prof Archer and the organizers - not the Pope
Sun Apr 10, 2016, 03:56 PM
Apr 2016

a Vatican spokesman made clear today - the invitation was not from the Pope.

upaloopa

(11,417 posts)
5. The issue as I see it is that Sanders and is supporters used this to
Sun Apr 10, 2016, 03:23 PM
Apr 2016

score points making it a political statement that the Pope endorsed Bernie's campaign. They put it out there out of context like every thing they say to let people think that.

They are always dishonest yet act like they occupy the moral high ground.


We have an obligation to voters to point out the truth as this piece does.

 

seabeyond

(110,159 posts)
11. This just makes sense to me. I won't stop pointing out Sanders is a mere politician. This was a
Sun Apr 10, 2016, 03:31 PM
Apr 2016

political ploy that back fired. Quit making it worse and move on. Not that hard. But, seems such a challenge with the Sanders campaign.

Turin_C3PO

(13,998 posts)
17. To be fair,
Sun Apr 10, 2016, 03:35 PM
Apr 2016

don't you think any campaign would use a Vatican invite to score points? That's the name of the game, imo.

 

seabeyond

(110,159 posts)
20. Sanders people arranged the invite then stated the Pope invited them. I do not expect Sanders
Sun Apr 10, 2016, 03:37 PM
Apr 2016

to be anything but a politician and that is cool. But, that kind of lie simply is going to be called out by the opponent.

upaloopa

(11,417 posts)
21. It wasn't a Vatican invite. Bernie twice on TV answered yes when asked if
Sun Apr 10, 2016, 03:39 PM
Apr 2016

he was going to see the Pope.

He lied

okasha

(11,573 posts)
58. I don't think anyone is concerned
Sun Apr 10, 2016, 04:15 PM
Apr 2016

with Sanders going to the conference. It's an odd time for him to be away from his campaign, but that's his decision. I hope he has an enjoyable visit.

What has drawn mockery--not anger--from Hillary supporters is Sanders' and his partisans' attempts to embellish the occasion, ranging from an alleged personal invitation from the Pope to the dispatch of a Vatican aircraft to transport him.

Sanders and his fans have managed to put their feet into a situation that could have been a very nice little perk for him. All they would have had to do is tell the truth.

Beacool

(30,249 posts)
27. I think that both sides need to cool it.
Sun Apr 10, 2016, 03:43 PM
Apr 2016

The invitation was made to Sanders after he expressed interest in attending. He should go and have fun. I agree that Sanders going to a conference held at the Vatican does not mean that the Pope is endorsing him. Ditto if it had been Hillary who attended instead of Sanders. Popes try not to be seen as supporting foreign political candidates.

I would love to meet Pope Francis, he's the best Pope of my lifetime. I would be thrilled to meet him. I don't blame Sanders for wanting to meet him. Although, according to the article, he's not attending the conference. He may stop by and greet the attendees. Who knows?

passiveporcupine

(8,175 posts)
57. Please link to those statements
Sun Apr 10, 2016, 04:14 PM
Apr 2016

I have yet to see anyone say that the Pope endorses Bernie for President.

If someone has, I'd be one of the first to correct them.

jcosgriff

(2 posts)
6. Perhaps the others (candidates) would have been interested but they did not request to come."
Sun Apr 10, 2016, 03:25 PM
Apr 2016

So glad this article was published. I like Sanders and I do believe he is a good person and humanitarian, but I am so tired of the 'holier than thou" focus of his campaign. Sander is trailing to clinton in the catholic vote like 60 (Clinton) to Sanders( in the 30s) but noone ever brings up about Sanders pandering. What about his pandering to the African American community - chasing after an endorsement from Garner, having Spike Lee create a video - speaking in Harlem calling people "brother". Gag

Nothing worse than constantly putting himself on a pedestal. He and Clinton voted 93% the same on most issues - yet he is superior. And his followers are worse than Republicans about the Clinton hate - threatening to destroy the party. Some f his followers have created a hit list for Superdelegates - so they can collectively harass them - Sanders needs to speak out on that.

ucrdem

(15,512 posts)
41. Not just pandering, X-treme Deathmatch Power-pandering
Sun Apr 10, 2016, 03:48 PM
Apr 2016

But at the end of the day he picked a funny time to take a Roman holiday. And that will be how this episode will be remembered if he's lucky.

p.s. Welcome to DU!

Turin_C3PO

(13,998 posts)
14. Yeah this is a non-issue.
Sun Apr 10, 2016, 03:34 PM
Apr 2016

It's just like Hillary's emails, another "much ado about nothing". I say this as a Sanders supporter.

 

IamMab

(1,359 posts)
15. It's an issue in that Sanders tried to represent this as something it wasn't.
Sun Apr 10, 2016, 03:35 PM
Apr 2016

He wasn't invited by the Pope. He wasn't invited to speak to the Pope. He wasn't invited to even visit the Vatican.

He was invited, by a long-time friend of his who was involved in this event, to speak at an off-site symposium on a document released 25 years ago. Someone with a biased interest in promoting the Sanders campaign has used a Vatican-sponsored event to imply that Bernie Sanders somehow has the Pope's endorsement.

Sanders is trying to use Catholicism as a prop ahead of the NY election, and I'm glad to see it blowing up in his face.

azurnoir

(45,850 posts)
16. is Hillary's team hoping that if they create enough stink the Vatican will withdraw the invatation
Sun Apr 10, 2016, 03:35 PM
Apr 2016

or are they just repeating Bloomberg's lies to delegitimize the visit?

azurnoir

(45,850 posts)
31. Let's see a direct link to what Monsignor Marcelo Sanchez Sorondo,said to CNN
Sun Apr 10, 2016, 03:45 PM
Apr 2016

ya know like from CNN not Chelsea's Beast

 

seabeyond

(110,159 posts)
34. Nah... believe what you like. I will just keep paying attention to this ever evolving story.
Sun Apr 10, 2016, 03:46 PM
Apr 2016

If you want to believe... Then it is yours to do. I am good with that.

azurnoir

(45,850 posts)
38. IOW you can't find one either, because I looked? also what appears to be a hyperlink to CNN isn't
Sun Apr 10, 2016, 03:47 PM
Apr 2016

it's a link to Bloomberg's lies

upaloopa

(11,417 posts)
47. Your wrong on two counts
Sun Apr 10, 2016, 04:02 PM
Apr 2016

There is no Vatican invite and Bloomberg is not lying

The campaign you support is built on lies like your post

 

DisgustipatedinCA

(12,530 posts)
36. You've posted so many untrue things. Why on earth would anyone believe what you say now?
Sun Apr 10, 2016, 03:47 PM
Apr 2016

You've completely destroyed any reputation you may have once had by posting the most vicious and inaccurate of smears, NEVER ONCE backing down from the lies.

And now you think you get to make statements and you expect to be taken seriously? No, that won't be happening. Your words carry no value at all, and you are the person solely responsible for that.

 

DisgustipatedinCA

(12,530 posts)
53. I do support Sanders, and I meant every word I said.
Sun Apr 10, 2016, 04:07 PM
Apr 2016

You're more than welcome to borrow a third grader's tried-and-true "I know you are but what am I?" retort, but it's not your finest moment.

lostnfound

(16,179 posts)
37. Sarondo: I would've invited Hillary Clinton too if I thought she would come!
Sun Apr 10, 2016, 03:47 PM
Apr 2016

John Allen of Crux just said on CNN that they had asked Bishop Sarondo if they were taking sides or why they invited Bernie and not Hillary. Sarondo told them, "I would've invited Hillary Clinton too, if I thought she would come !"

okasha

(11,573 posts)
59. Sounds like Francis has already
Sun Apr 10, 2016, 04:27 PM
Apr 2016

handed Sarondo his ass.

I like this Pope, but I think he has very little patience with people who embarrass him.

MattSh

(3,714 posts)
39. This Daily Beast?
Sun Apr 10, 2016, 03:48 PM
Apr 2016

The one owned by IAC, a company that has Chelsea Clinton on it's Board of Directors?

Response to Beacool (Original post)

beam me up scottie

(57,349 posts)
55. I got that but these over the top claims about Bernie are a little deranged too.
Sun Apr 10, 2016, 04:10 PM
Apr 2016

They don't post such nasty things about Trump, it's like Bernie is the anti-Christ for wanting to go to the Vatican.


passiveporcupine

(8,175 posts)
62. They've been calling him a saint and labeling us his acolytes since day one
Sun Apr 10, 2016, 04:59 PM
Apr 2016

And this was too good to pass up. To them it's proof he thinks he's holy or god or something. Jeezus!

Pathetic desperation to the extreme.

Who wouldn't be excited to be invited to Rome to participate in a conference like this? How many would assume this was in invitation from the Vatican (not the Pope himself...he's got people for that) because of the connection between the Academy and the Vatican? How many would hope for a few minutes with the Pope.

Did he make a mistake by not clarifying right away who actually invited him, and how it came about, and that he most likely would not get an audience with the Pope? Considering the political climate in this election, yeah, he should have done that. And maybe it was political on his part, or maybe it was just too much excitement. I don't put it past him to use this as a photo op kinda thing. Hillary does lots of photo ops and that's OK with her base...but this is really Bernie's first and he's being grilled over the flames for it.

It's OK. He's coated with teflon. He's used to this kind of treatment. But the glee from the Hill camp is pretty sad.

BTW, if Hillary had a political advisor who was a designated speaker at this conference, don't you think they would have tried to get her an invite too? You bet your bippy they would. It would not make her evil, but it would, correctly, be called a political ploy, and I have no problem with that being said of Bernie. It's the nasty stuff accompanying it, directed at Bernie and his supporters, that pisses me off.

I really believe that Bernie is excited because it connects beautifully with his message, and he'd be just as excited if he were not in a campaign right now. Who wouldn't be?

beam me up scottie

(57,349 posts)
64. Yep, they sound just like the Republicans who called Obama the "messiah" and labeled us a cult.
Sun Apr 10, 2016, 05:03 PM
Apr 2016

At this point I can't tell some of them apart from Trump supporters, their hatred is that unhinged.

And well said, you should make that an op in the Bernie group!


passiveporcupine

(8,175 posts)
73. Thanks BMUS
Sun Apr 10, 2016, 07:40 PM
Apr 2016

But, I really am not comfortable posting threads in private groups. I don't think it's fair or good for the forum to have protected conversations with people, while others who cannot participate in that group, can read things we say that may upset them.

I don't participate much at protected forums like that either, except here...where we are pretty much protected from Republican blow back. I guess I have my limits on what I'm willing to expose myself to.

But here on DU, we are supposed to be a family...all of us...working toward the same goal, even if we differ somewhat in much of it, and range from very liberal to conservative. I feel it is too divisive to allow private groups to lock people out because they don't hold the same beliefs or support the same candidate or issues.

It's just me. I think I'll stick with the more open places.

 

Android3.14

(5,402 posts)
61. "IMO this whole controversy is much ado about nothing."
Sun Apr 10, 2016, 04:49 PM
Apr 2016

Well it certainly has a lot of panties wadded for "nothing". Clinton must have just about shat her Dr. Evil suit when she heard the announcement, based on the sheer number of attempts to discredit the invite and the bizarre effort to push back.

Latest Discussions»Retired Forums»2016 Postmortem»Vatican: Pope Didn't Invi...