If you send people to war based on lies put forth by a Bush, you are UNQUALIFIED to be Pres

[Skwmom]

Last edited Thu Apr 7, 2016, 04:51 PM - Edit history (1)

Lies that were easily exposed if you bother to read what they were pushing.


And by the way, it was much more than the WP article regarding the Bernie is unqualified meme.

[KansDem]

1. Bush sat and did nothing when told we were under attack

That alone should have been grounds for impeachment.

[Art_from_Ark]

43. If Gore had been President and continued to sit in a 2nd grade classroom

listening to kids reading a children's book after hearing of a second attack, there would have been endless video clips of it on the news, and he would have been dragged in front of dozens of Congressional committees before getting impeached.

[MADem]

2. Really?

http://www.counterpunch.org/2016/02/16/blood-traces-bernies-iraq-war-hypocrisy/

...Sanders supported Bill Clinton’s war on Serbia, voted for the 2001 Authorization Unilateral Military Force Against Terrorists (AUMF), which pretty much allowed Bush to wage war wherever he wanted, backed Obama’s Libyan debacle and supports an expanded US role in the Syrian Civil War.

More problematic for the Senator in Birkenstocks is the little-known fact that Bernie Sanders himself voted twice in support of regime change in Iraq. In 1998 Sanders voted in favor of the Iraq Liberation Act of 1998, which said: “It should be the policy of the United States to support efforts to remove the regime headed by Saddam Hussein from power in Iraq and to promote the emergence of a democratic government to replace that regime.”

Later that same year, Sanders also backed a resolution that stated: “Congress reaffirms that it should be the policy of the United States to support efforts to remove the regime headed by Saddam Hussein from power in Iraq and to promote the emergence of a democratic government to replace that regime.” These measures gave congressional backing for the CIA’s covert plan to overthrow the Hussein regime in Baghdad, as well as the tightening of an economic sanctions regime that may have killed as many as 500,000 Iraqi children. The resolution also gave the green light to Operation Desert Fox, a four-day long bombing campaign striking 100 targets throughout Iraq. The operation featured more than 300 bombing sorties and 350 ground-launched Tomahawk cruise missiles, several targeting Saddam Hussein himself.

Even Hillary belatedly admitted that her Iraq war vote was a mistake. Bernie, however, has never apologized for his two votes endorsing the overthrow of Saddam. On the rare occasions when Sanders has been confronted about these votes, he has casually dismissed them as being “almost unanimous.” I went back and checked the record. In fact, many members of the progressive caucus in the House, as well as a few libertarian anti-war Members of Congress, vote against the Iraq regime change measures. Here’s a list of the “no” votes on the Iraq Liberation Act of 1998:

Abercrombie
Bartlett
Brown (CA)
Carson
Chenoweth
Clay
Conyers
Davis (IL)
Doggett
Everett
Ewing
Ford
Furse
Hastings (FL)
Hilliard
Hostettler
Jackson (IL)
Jefferson
LaHood
Lee
Lewis (GA)
McKinney
Miller (CA)
Mink
Paul
Payne
Pombo
Rivers
Rush
Sabo
Serrano
Skaggs
Skelton
Stark
Towns
Vento
Walsh
Waters

[Deuce]

3. Thanks for the info...

[George II]

28. Oooops. As Al Gore would say, "an inconvenient truth"!

[Hortensis]

49. Bernie has spent 1 year denying

his involvement in all the Democrats' stupid and evil corporatist capitalistic swinish deeds and 25 years voting as part of the Democratic congressional caucus, what, 94%, 96% of the time?

Qualifications? This word re-entered the nation's political vocabulary when Bernie revealed that he has no well-thought-out plans for implementing his promises and is amazingly ignorant of how the tools at hand might be put to use.

[George II]

50. He's been in Congress for 25 years yet he doesn't understand the job of the three branches...

...of government.

And HE is talking about "qualification"?

[WhiteTara]

4. Where were you in 2004 with that argument?

Kerry was running for president and never did I once see that as a "dis qualifier." Seems a bit selective to me. Biden voted yes too...did that disqualify him for the vice presidency? BTW, I don't think Bernie is unqualified.

[Dem2]

5. It's called a "trump card"

It's played every time Bernie gets into some trouble politically, and then periodically just because Hillary needs to know she'll never be shit to a large majority on DU. And I was vehemently against the vote at the time and screamed at my TV and anybody who would listen "CAN'T YOU SEE THEY'RE FUCKING LYING??!!!??" Doesn't mean I disqualify every person for life who made that vote, Bush was going to do it with or without consent anyway. I blame Bush for Bush's war.

[Avalux]

8. I don't disqualify every person who voted YEA either.

Let's put some context around Hillary's vote, shall we?

She said she trusted Bush would do the right thing, said it was the toughest decision she's ever made, then proceeded to list off every single neocon talking point.

We could see they were fucking lying, but she couldn't?

There isn't anything you can say that can justify her rationale for her vote.

[Dem2]

9. Hate her for life

it's your decision, I'm a different person and remember the heat of that moment like it was yesterday, dispassionately dismissing what it was like less than a year after 9/11 shows that you're not being fair to the majority of Democrats in the Senate who voted for the resolution. But it doesn't matter, it's been said and done and you'll dismiss everything I say even though you probably supported Kerry and Biden and other Democratss who made the same vote.

[Lizzie Poppet]

10. It's not so much hate her as distrust her judgement.

And it's not as if that's the only data point justifying that distrust...

[Dem2]

11. Yes, heard it a million times

I like and trust both candidates. I live and learn and know that both of our candidates are decent human beings who do the same. To imply that she's some sort of heartless monster who can never be trusted says more about the person who makes the claim than it does about Hillary. She does not deserve this treatment. It's wrong.

[Lizzie Poppet]

16. I don't buy into the more hyperbolic claims, either.

But that doesn't stop me from considering Hillary Clinton to be a person of dubious character and priorities. No monster, obviously, but not someone I believe possesses the character I insist upon in a president.

[Dem2]

18. That's fair

If everybody would use this language, I think we'd probably have a lot more productive dialog here.

Nah, that's boring! lol I kid.

[Avalux]

13. This is the here and now and I'm a different person too.

Hillary Clinton is asking me to put her in the White House and to trust that she will NOT carelessly start wars to line the pockets of her rich friends. Why should I believe her?

[Dem2]

14. Don't.

I do. I also trust that Bernie is better than his worst instinct or his worst day (which may indeed be today.)

[Avalux]

17. I would really like to know why you trust Hillary.

Please give me a compelling reason. I am not wanting to argue about it, just want to know why you feel the way you do.

[Dem2]

19. Same reason I knew Bush was lying.

I understand why she is the way she is. She's not a natural politician like Bill or Obama; she's admitted so recently. She thinks too much and wants to have the exact right answer at the time it's asked. Yes, it comes across as political and she seems to shift her positions over time, but that's what most of us would do if we had to run for office. Her strength, as even she's admitted, is getting the job done once she's been hired for it. As she's said, she's not good at the interview; she's not naturally charismatic. I'm OK with that. She has foibles just like the rest of us. I think a lot of the mistrust is misplaced, her heart is undoubtedly in the right place, at least that's my opinion having studied her for most of my adult lifetime.

[Avalux]

22. Thank you.

I tend to think politician's actions should line up with their words; to me, that's an indication of what's in their hearts since we don't know them personally, don't know what goes on in their heads. When there's incongruity between the two I doubt if they're being honest when they speak.

[Dem2]

24. It's a fair criticism

I think I know enough about her, but I could be wrong. But that also applies to any politician running for office. I have my issues with Bernie too, they are different as compared to Hillary, but I also feel like I can live with his imperfections. That's about as philosophical as I want to get at this time, this place isn't exactly friendly territory for this sort of discussion.

[Avalux]

26. I know.

I have enjoyed our conversation nonetheless. Cheers!

[Dem2]

27. Yes, thank you.

I know most here are good at heart, I try to remind myself of that before posting something snarky. I fail a lot.

[anotherproletariat]

23. As a new New Yorker (came here for college), most people here seem to understand her vote.

I was having this discussion with a guy down the hall, and he said that New Yorkers felt a bit of PTSD at the time, and most supported any action that would possibly decrease the risk of terrorism, whether of not it was aimed at the same group that attacked NY on 9/11. He thinks that Hillary was trying to give voice to her constituents views at the time. Of course, in retrospect we know that the sell-job for the war was based on lies, but at the time this was only speculation.

[snagglepuss]

44. A leader is supposed to lead not follow which is why Hillary is not fit to be president

Bernie is fit because he has not only foresight but also the strength of character necessary to withstand the pressure to fall in, and go along. YOu write how Hillary is absolved because she just followed the crowd and Bush, blindly following the path of least resistance. THat doesn't absolve her, that very thing condemns her as a unfit leader. She might be the nicest person in the world but she has shown she lacks the foresight and the strength of character necessary in a leader.

[MADem]

32. John Edwards voted the same way--and yet, Susan Sarandon didn't have a problem with HIS vote.

Isn't that a bit curious, that it's a dealbreaker for SS with HER, and her vote, but not a dealbreaker with HIM, and his vote?

I found that odd, I did. Situational, perhaps?

http://blogs.reuters.com/talesfromthetrail/2008/01/07/actors-robbins-sarandon-hit-the-road-for-john-edwards/

[Avalux]

35. I don't really care about what Susan Sarandon has done or said.

Why are you bringing her up? John Edwards was a fraud, I knew it the first time I heard him speak.

[MADem]

36. She has horrible judgment in choosing candidates to support, I'd say. nt

[WhiteTara]

20. Yeah, I did too and flew to DC to protest in person

of course it didn't make it to the media here, but I called and ranted and protested along with millions of others.

[Octafish]

6. That's what a lot of DUers said in 2004.

Funny how so many of them are still around to say the opposite now.

[WhiteTara]

51. Are you saying that DU said Kerry was not

qualified for his Iraq vote? I was here and NEVER saw that claim. There was a lot of defense against the swift boaters though.

[Octafish]

52. Who mentioned John Kerry?

I agreed with the OP:

If you send people to war based on lies put forth by a Bush, you are UNQUALIFIED to be Pres

BTW: I did all I could to advance Kerry's campaign for president.

[WhiteTara]

53. John Kerry voted for the Iraq War

which is why I brought up John Kerry. So why did he get a pass?

[Octafish]

54. John Kerry had worked to shine light on the criminality of Bush and Cheney.

Talking Bush senior, especially, via BCCI. For that, Cheney and others in the BFEE have called him a "conspiracy theorist" over the years.

Coincidentally, that's the same BCCI fronted for by Clark Clifford and connected into American finance by Jackson Stephens of Little Rock, Arkansas, represented by counsel Hillary Clinton.

[tk2kewl]

7. a neoconservative parrot

https://m.

[shanti]

45. Sickening n/t

[SixString]

12. Frig-a-dig-it

and a kick.

[Tarc]

15. What about someone who voted to fund the war?

[Sky Masterson]

21. Exactly!

.

[pdsimdars]

25. Precisely. . . . . .

[amborin]

29. or repeat reckless regime change in Libya:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/12511362141

[George II]

30. It is so funny how so many people can talk about Clinton saying that Sanders is "unqualified", but..

...no one can actually bring forth what she actually said.

Amazing, huh?

[Sheepshank]

31. Bernie's vote for financing the conflict doesn't absolve him of anything/except in the mind of BSers

[seabeyond]

33. If you refuse to learn any issues but core issues, then lack knowledge on that, well....

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

34. But...but...she thought all the troops in Kuwait were just there to improve their tans. K&R

[synergie]

37. He did vote for the first AUMF, giving Bush authority, so Bernie is out.

If you want purity, the ONLY person who did not vote for that is Rep. Barbara Lee.

Yes, Bernie has been putting his foot in his mouth and enjoying the taste, his meme is hurting his even more than his failed surrogates, campaign staff and roving band of online marauders who've been doxxing superdelegates and exposing the misogyny inherent in his campaign.

She didn't say what he claims she did, HE did, and it's backfiring madly.

[closeupready]

38. Agreed.

K&R

[MisterP]

39. I'm from the 9-11 state and WE know you can't WAIT for mere FACTS

[Duppers]

40. +10

[Live and Learn]

41. K&R nt

[amborin]

42. KNR

[Scuba]

46. I knew Bush would go to war, and that the war was based on lies. Millions of us knew.

Why didn't Hillary get it? So stupid she believed Bush? Complicit in his war crimes?



Doesn't matter; she's disqualified.

[VulgarPoet]

47. What's funny about all this is she was offered intel and optics on the situation prior to the vote

...and she didn't take it. She didn't take it. I'm not going to accept a Commander in Chief who can't be fucking bothered to read a fucking intel report.

[tabasco]

48. Your statement is correct.

Most Democrats in Congress had the good sense to know they were being lied to and voted against the war.