Hillary Clinton is Republicans' best hope to win in November

[wt1531]

Hillary will help Republicans eke out a win in November because:
She doesn't inspire people to go out of their way and vote--which will depress turn out and help the R candidate

She comes off as arrogant and entitled to most independents without whom wining swing states is impossible--another help to the R candidate

She will energize most R voters who hate her with passion to turn out in force

Most young voters will stay at home on election day because her status quo message and what she represents simply doesn't excite anyone

Most ardent Bernie supporters will be too depressed to go out and vote for a candidate who was collecting millions from big banks to give them speeches they like and has never forcefully spoken for the middle class or the poor until election time


Nominating Bernie will solve all the above mentioned problems for Democrats and nominating Hillary just because "it is her turn" or she has the Clinton last name, and ignoring her horrible record, will definitely give the Rs a fighting chance. The possibility of a Hillary nomination is what is giving Rs a little bit of hope for November as they know Bernie Sanders will present a night and day type contrast with them and will give Democrats a landslide win, if he were the nominee.

[onenote]

1. That's opinion. Here are facts.

The supposedly uninspiring Clinton has received a greater number of popular votes during the primaries than any other candidate, including Trump.

The way is clearing for R's to abandon Trump by the droves. When you have Gerson, Rubin, and Will all but begging for a third party run if Trump isn't stopped,it becomes easy for R's to stand down from supporting Trump.

The polls disagree with your opinion.

If most Bernie supporters are too depressed to get off their butts and cast a vote to prevent the election of the most racist, misogynist, and bigoted, and least well informed major party candidate of this or any other year, they are pathetic.

[pinebox]

23. Yes, Clinton's Gotten The Most Votes, But GOP Has More Overall

Oh oh http://www.npr.org/2016/03/19/471102628/yes-clintons-gotten-the-most-votes-but-gop-has-more-overall

[onenote]

30. turnout between the parties is not predictive of the outcome of general elections

as has been demonstrated on this site numerous times.

Again. Facts.

[pinebox]

31. Facts

[onenote]

35. Facts.

http://elections.huffingtonpost.com/pollster/donald-trump-favorable-rating

http://elections.huffingtonpost.com/pollster/ted-cruz-favorable-rating

That's ten points higher unfavorable for Trump
That's 9 points lower favorable for Cruz.

Game. Set. Match.

[pinebox]

39. Ok

[onenote]

46. You need to catch up on your reading

Rubio dropped out. Not running.

Cruz had a minuscule lead in polls taken over a month ago.
If Kasich gets the nomination after trailing, badly, Trump and Cruz, the Trump and Cruz supporters bail out on the repubs.

[pinebox]

47. You need to catch up in reality

Hillary loses to every single GOP candidate except Trump whom she barely beats.
Why is that so hard to understand? Hillary is weak and she is in trouble when it comes to a GE. Is it any wonder? All the lies, all the moving of the goal posts, all the distortions, all of the controversies, all of the flip flopping; people do NOT trust Hillary.

Should Hillary be the nominee, Dems lose.
Bookmark me now. She is ONLY popular among Democrats and that is it. That is a path to losing the White House.
http://www.counterpunch.org/2016/03/18/hillary-clinton-will-lose-to-donald-trump/

[onenote]

48. I'd bookmark you,

but I have a feeling you won't be around after the primary season ends.

[pinebox]

50. Why wouldn't I?

You think GDP is the only forum on here? lol?

[PATRICK]

40. Both parties and all outside movements

that actually have politicians and will and organizational support are too tepid and fat to have the guts to split or bloodfight at a Convention. The GOP is full of chickenhawks and people who only have that potential. The times will sicken us more and the drama will turn out very tawdry. The GOP has become too stupid and lazy to handle their clowns. Driving drunk, the entire party. Of course the Dems have no organizational capacity to deny Clinton at all or support the "outsider" who actually champions true politics on behalf of the people and planet with the least personal ambition of any candidate perhaps in American history. There is an embarrassing vacuum created there by the incredible decision to back one candidate, actually the most concretely controversial one running, the also ran last Open Primary! season, representing the dimming past glory of a former administration most of the electorate no longer even remembers- when allowed to. But there is no structure to hang the popular will and the truth on, no competence, no commitment, no way out, except to watch the idle exercise of power fail as it sets aside the populace, the planet, reality for its empty persistent survival, its pathetic rise to to the shared proconsulate of bi-partisan corporatist fantasy. Doom does not hinge on political success or failure in the fall. It an inexorable process militantly ignored, feebly acknowledged even as the sword falls.

We are not allowed to try to survive. Excite me about something else?

[leftofcool]

2. Trump Humping I see.

[FarPoint]

4. I believe you are on target there....

I'm feeling flaimbait Tump fatigue.

[Dynamite Dave]

3. More reason to nominate Bernie

and deny Clinton the inevitability again. I don't know ANYONE who craves power more than one Hillary Diane Rodham Clinton, since she became the First Lady of Arkansas.

[FarPoint]

6. Bernie who? Never heard of any Bernie..

Hillary Clinton... Absolutely the best candidate the Democratic Party can nominate for President.

[iAZZZo]

14. very rarely can i respond to any post but yours is a hoot

[br /][br /]

"Hillary Clinton... Absolutely the best candidate the Democratic Party can nominate for President."

[font size="14" face="Times"]i'll prefer to listen to president obama's words in 2008:[/font]

[FarPoint]

15. Campaigning fodder trash talk ...

We all know they kissed and made up the next day....Obama and the Clinton's are essentially family. A real, mutual admiration for one another....

So, what other SPAM do you have on file?

[iAZZZo]

16. "Campaigning fodder trash talk ..."

denigrating our president's words with your vile "Campaigning fodder trash talk ..." statement?

yes... now i'm beginning to understand

thank you

[NanceGreggs]

21. Apparently you're not ...

... beginning to understand anything.

The poster was not "denigrating the president's words". They were pointing out that when politicians are competing for the same nomination or office, they say things that point out their opponent's weaknesses, flaws, bad voting record, etc.

Once they are no longer in a competition with each other, they quit-the-bitchin' and get on with their lives.

Obama and HRC have an incredible relationship. Pulling up the he said/she said rhetoric from the 2008 primaries is simply beyond irrelevance.

No one cares. No one is going to not vote for Hillary because of what Obama said about her, or what she said about Obama, eight years ago.

People have seen them work together, laugh together, praise each other. Trying to sell anyone on the but look what they said then schtick is straw-grasping at its finest.

[brush]

24. Hmmm . . . infiltrator?

[840high]

29. .+1

[rjsquirrel]

5. Keep on/ believin'

Hold on to that dreaaaaaaaaaam!


Wishful thinking, counterfactual assertion, just a nip and a tuck and reality will be just what I want it to be!

In another thread someone bashing Clinton seriously told me "the polls are hacked." Lol, seriously?

The power of fantasy is strong.

[wt1531]

8. I want to see a lot of Trump or whoever teh Rs put up supporters

In tears on election day with whoever the Democrats put up being announced President-elect.

I am afraid Hillary is a terrible candidate and might just manage to lose to one of the horribles the other side puts up.

Ofcourse this is my honest opinion and we will see who will be proven right. Btw, writing off Bernie with half the country yet to vote seems like a psycho op operation by Hillary supporters to depress future Bernie voters...let the primary process play out and then try to get the winner with a D after his/her name in the White House.

[rjsquirrel]

13. Psycho op?

Half the country will not vote much differently than the first half. Bernie's math is impossible.

Or you think NY and California are gonna for Bernie? Not a single poll suggests that. Last I saw she is winning NY by 35%.

Your "half the country" line implies a possibility of Clinton's support collapsing completely and overnight. She just has to break even from here on out. And the polls have her doing a lot better than that.

Believe all you want but concede the facts as they are.

[brush]

26. From reading the responses, most here don't think you're a Sanders supporter. I don't either.

Do you get paid?

[wt1531]

52. This is not a high school popularity contest

I am a Sanders supporter and don't have to prove it to anyone. Whether you think I am or not doesn't mean a thing to me.

[Onlooker]

7. Actually, Hillary has gotten way more votes than Bernie ...

... and if Sander supporters think they can blackmail Democrats into supporting Sanders, they are being very naive. Neither side will sell out on principle, and both sides will do the right thing come November. Anyone who doesn't vote for the Democratic nominee and let's Trump win is an ass. There won't be many asses.

[Fawke Em]

20. If the Democrats nominate someone who doesn't act like a Democrat, I don't blame people

for not voting for the nominee.

[NanceGreggs]

25. Apparently millions of primary voters ...

... think Hillary "acts like a Democrat" just fine.

[KingFlorez]

9. Clinton has been turning out voters

Last edited Mon Mar 21, 2016, 01:01 AM - Edit history (1)

The numbers speak for themselves. Clinton brings up the sort of broad coalition of voters that is necessary for a Democrat to win a general election. Sanders hasn't done that in the primary and that suggest that he can't do it in the general.

[kcjohn1]

28. The base of Clinton support

Is 65+ age group. This group will come out no matter what to vote. Strangely Dems will lose this group by large margin in the general.

Sanders is winning the under 45 group. This is where dems win general. The question is how many will turn out?

[cantbeserious]

10. Agreed - IMHO - A Vote For HRC In The Primary Is A Vote For Trump In The General

eom

[LexVegas]

11. ...

[DemocratSinceBirth]

12. "Ok. n/t."

[redstateblues]

17. Once the Rs unpack Bernie's baggage

he would get crushed. The last Democrat that ran on raising taxes on the middle class was Walter Mondale. He won ONE state- his home state MN. Bernie has never faced an opponent that has gone after his many weaknesses. The Republicans fear Hillary- that's why they never say anything about Bernie-he's so far behind that he's not being taken seriously.

[Cosmocat]

58. That is the thing

Who knows what Bernie would like once the Rs pound the $hit out of him ...

[Dynamite Dave]

63. What baggage?

I'm waiting for your thoughts about Bernie's baggage. I'm ready to see what your idea of Bernie's baggage is. (Socialism? Widely accepted and has no fear factor. You can thank the Republicans for beating that word to death in terms of fear)

You do know Clinton's baggage is about 15 trainloads worth, and it's not even close to finished.

[longship]

18. Nope. It's the independents.

Hillary Clinton does not get them on her side. Her policies are not sufficiently different from the GOP's to make a difference for them to switch from their usual GOP allegiance.

This is something that Clinton supporters do not understand.

It's Political Science 101. When one aligns ones political positions to that of the opposition in order to win, one cannot win. One has already ceded the argument to the opposition.

In case nobody in the Clinton campaign hasn't noticed, here are two facts:

1. Independents are the largest political faction in the country. No party can win nationally without them.

2. Hillary Clinton consistently polls horribly with independents. Bernie Sanders consistently polls much better. Look it up.

That is why I was happy to be part of Bernie's surprise victory in MI. It is also why I am very sad by the abject hubris and outright sense of entitlement expressed by my Hillary Clinton supporting friends.

I will support Hillary Clinton in November if she gets the nod. But she is by far the worst Democratic presidential candidate of my lifetime, and I was born in the 1940's.

The political reality is that no candidate can win nationally without independents. If the polls are right, Hillary does not have them in her corner -- they despise her. Meanwhile, they like Bernie rather a lot. That is what the polls say.

Here, from earlier this month:

[redstateblues]

53. Ridiculous smear

You said "Her policies are not sufficiently different from the GOP's" Do you not realize how absurd that statement is? Hillary was one of the most liberal Senators in Congress. You sound like Ralph "not a dimes worth of difference" Nader. Hillary and Bernie are very close in their positions. She might not be as hard left as you would prefer but you are just making shit up.

[longship]

64. One still has to explain the polls.

Why does Bernie poll better against the GOP?

That isn't making shit up. That is what the polls have been saying. Now I have no problem with voting for Hillary Clinton in November. I just don't think she can win.

[randome]

61. She voted with Sanders 93% of the time.

And polls of Independents are unreliable until we have actual nominees. Are you saying that Sanders, as an Independent, is more likely to vote for Trump? And what will you say when Sanders endorses Clinton?
[hr][font color="blue"][center]Treat your body like a machine. Your mind like a castle.[/center][/font][hr]

[MFM008]

19. oh please

she beats Trump and Cruz I dont care if its by 10 votes.

[Fawke Em]

22. The polling doesn't suggest that.

And, if the FBI finds a bunch of crap, it's over.

[Beacool]

27. Hillary beats Trump and that's all that matters.

These attempts to try to demoralize her supporters are futile.

[elleng]

32. Right.

[jfern]

33. Meanwhile with Bernie, the Republicans might not even win in Utah

http://www.democraticunderground.com/12511540589

[NanceGreggs]

34. The woman who "doesn't inspire anyone to vote" ...

... has inspired more people to come out and vote for her than Bernie has.

"She will energize most R voters who hate her with passion to turn out in force", as opposed to the R voters who would stay home, rather than vote against a self-proclaimed socialist.

"Most young voters will stay at home on election day ..." Have any stats to back that up?

"Most ardent Bernie supporters will be too depressed to go out and vote ..." - stats? Polls? Surveys? Anything other than your own fabrcations?

"Nominating Bernie will solve all the above mentioned problems ..."

Yeah, that's a winning strategy - let's go with the guy who couldn't get enough votes to win the nomination, because that will "solve all of the above mentioned problems".

[Thinkingabout]

36. Bookmarking for future reference

[Z_California]

37. Even if she wins the Presidency they win

at least on some of their issues: the next war, TPP, fracking, Wall Street appeasement.

I thought for sure that's what the title of the OP was referring to.

[ThePhilosopher04]

38. If Hillary or a Republican win, America loses. We are doomed to hell.

[PATRICK]

42. Less passionately

I observe more properly we are not organized nor allowed much to think about even trying. We will eat the seed corn and many other atrocities led by the same old crowd for faded institutions and degraded elites before anything takes shape resembling an intelligent life form or just an animal with good instincts. Doom sounds too easy.

[Cosmocat]

59. That is a consensus on the right for sure ...

That is what every single one of my republican friends/neighbors say about Hillary, too ...

[snowy owl]

41. She's not my candidate but I believe she will win

I just can't see this country - with all the pr that shows Trump as a monster - that he'll get the most votes. I don't believe it. I don't think he's a monster. I think media has turned him into a monster.

Nevertheless, Hillary will win. The majority of Americans are thoroughly afraid of Trump. I don't even see it as close. I don't want Trump to win but Americans are sheep and with all the bashing from all main stream media, he'll lose. Take it to the bank.

[PATRICK]

43. How did Perot lose?

It is key to think about that and other lesser examples of "mavericks" who tired out or scared away the middle. Undercutting him was easier than Trump. Why?

[snowy owl]

45. He was third party.

[Sky Masterson]

44. In other news : It hurts when you slam your hand in a car door

Also, Water is wet.

[redstateblues]

54. I thought Republicans hated Hillary

You can't have it both ways

[Cosmocat]

60. On what fricken planet

is there any republican who does not hate Hillary?

This is why it is like trying to talk to conservatives here, the complete conflict between their hysterics.

One one hand, Bernistas say how much Republicans hate Hillary and will turn out in droves to vote against her while on the other hand saying how happy they would be with her in the white house.

[peacebird]

51. Yes, nominate Hillary and republicans win.

[Tarc]

55. Donald Trump is mobilizing every person of color in the country

to vote against him.

At this point, Sanders is an afterthought, as he has no realistic shot at the nomination. It is time to turn our attention to real matters.

[EndElectoral]

56. She's got the Kissinger and Kagan endorsement

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2016/2/12/1484183/-Not-Only-Kissinger-Hillary-gets-advice-from-PNAC-co-founder-Robert-Kagan

[seabeyond]

57. Nu uh.

[jcgoldie]

62. You forgot #6

Sour grapes Sanders supporters mis-characterizing her record and attempting to tear down the Democratic nominee.