even if delegates eventually "add up" for hillary, bernie must stay until the convention:here's why

[restorefreedom]

there is no doubt, and it's clearly obvious, that the powers that be are trying to force bernie out after super Tuesday. There are two reasons for this. One is because after Tuesday the states look more favorable to Bernie. The other reason is because of the convention. If Hillary ends up with any legal troubles, and it looks increasingly likely that she will, Bernie must be at the convention with his delegates to be there so that they can nominate him. Establishment is playing a giant game of "blink" right now. They think if they force bernie out before the convention, they will be free to nominate somebody else if and when Hillary has to step aside. Bernie is smart enough to know this and is not gonna give up all of his hard work for one of their establishment cronies. So until these words are uttered by Debbie Wasserman Schultz,

"the democratic party nominates hillary clinton for president of the united states"

bernie must stay at the convention and not concede, no matter what the delegate count is.

the estsblishment will not win this cycle. bernie or trump. their choice, because gods know, we are doing all we can to get the best person in.

#dontconcedebernie

[onecaliberal]

1. Agree! We are all in.

[tk2kewl]

8. #NotMeUs

[iAZZZo]

18. "#NotMeUs"

^ this ^

[tk2kewl]

48. e pluribus unum

[PowerToThePeople]

28. +2016

Inspired an avatar change in me.

[840high]

92. .+10

[LovingA2andMI]

80. IN Until The End!!!

[Plucketeer]

86. ALL the way

with donations to match!

[72DejaVu]

2. Plus, free buffets!

[restorefreedom]

3. the convention is in philly

but if it was in vegas, then yeah, buffets all around....

[72DejaVu]

9. Have you ever been to a political convention?

Buffets everywhere!

[restorefreedom]

14. i have not. but i don't doubt for a minute what you say :) nt

[krawhitham]

4. If she gets hit by legal troubles, Joe Biden walks out of the convention with the nomination

Unless Bernie can keep it close before the convention

[restorefreedom]

15. thats the point. it will be close, and no way they will get away with

gifting hillarys delegates to someone who didnt even run.

they will guarantee a loss and the destruction of the party.

[roody]

5. Of course Bernie will stay in.

He is Bernie!

[tk2kewl]

11. He's a fighter

[libdem4life]

47. Also, he's a long distance runner. That so aptly describes his being. Eye on the Prize.

In it to win it or until the end...hopefully both. Tortoise and the Hare. Bernie is not going anywhere.

[MaggieD]

6. Bernie will drop out when the math doesn't add up

Because donations will dry up. Just like every other primary cycle that ever was. It's just that simple.

[restorefreedom]

16. his campaign is people powered, not bought by special interests

he doesn't have to worry about "drying up" as long as the people are with him.

[MaggieD]

17. Then why did he spend $15mil more than he collected in Jan?

He did it to try to get momentum by winning IA and NV. Except it didn't work. I know his supporters hate to realize it, but it takes money to win elections.

Did you know that $17 million of the $75 million that has been donated to him came from people without a job? That's not sustainable. Sorry.

[restorefreedom]

22. just someone doesn't have a job, we can't assume they are broke

they may have other income or other sustenance. although if true, it speaks to the power of his message.

actually, you just made the case for publicly funded elections beautifully!

i don't know how you feel about publicly funded elections, but that was a great point!

[MaggieD]

26. I'd love to see publicly funded campaigns

Just like the vast majority of Dems would. But I'm not going to criticize Dem candidates for working under the system we have in place. We'll never get it changed if we don't win due to being outspent.

[restorefreedom]

31. ironically enough, trump wants to end special interest lobbying

another weird wild way this election is totally wacked.

glad we agree on publicly funded elections, though

and no, i am not advocating for trump. just pointing out the unconventional features of his candidacy

[MaggieD]

39. Absolutely

Hopefully we will all come together at the end of this given the fact that most of us DO agree on the vast majority of issues.

This primary is about pragmatism versus idealism. The candidates and the Dem voters agree on most issues. IMO.

[restorefreedom]

56. i think the problem we had,

and i am not trying to trash obama, but he campaigned as an idealist and governed as a pragmatic centrist. that disappointed a lot of people. and many of them are ready for some high reaching ideals instead of what they see as more compromise with the status quo.

will be interesting to see how it all shakes out

[MaggieD]

95. Okay, we agree again

I actually felt he was promising too much, and that he was doing it because he might not have really understood the challenges he would face once president. I didn't think he was bullshitting people - just a bit naïve. Which I understood since he didn't a ton of experience in politics on a federal level. (I was a Clinton supporter for that reason, but happy to get on board with him when he won the nom).

But you have to admit, he wasn't promising near as much as Bernie. 2008 was my son's first election, and he was brought up in a very politically informed family so he was psyched to finally be allowed to be part of the electoral process.

And then he was hugely disappointed when the reality of governing set in for Obama. He didn't understand why Obama couldn't just make it all happen. Kids are like that. Idealistic. And dog bless them for that. Some of us never grow out of it, and we need them too.

[restorefreedom]

104. hey we are now two for two!

"I actually felt he was promising too much, and that he was doing it because he might not have really understood the challenges he would face once president. I didn't think he was bullshitting people - just a bit naïve."

i can totally see that. i mean, he was a community organizer for cripe sake, he wanted to help people and was clearly not into this for personal gain, at least in the corporate sense. but somewhere along the way, something happened. the biggest disappoint for me is his rabid support for tpp, which even trump and cruz are against. when top r and d candidates agree on something, i gotta wonder how bad this thing really is.....

but yes, your original analysis of obama makes a lot of sense. i think it gets us back to the tough issue of campaign finance reform. when we get the lobbyists and special interests out of the sphere of influence, we can really get to work

[Kentonio]

23. How do you know whether its sustainable?

We're talking about people throwing in $5 or $10 when they can spare it. It's a sacrifice all the same, but because there's so many people doing it there is no expiry date as long as people want him to continue.

[libdem4life]

61. Wow...an expert on statistics and school marm to Bernie supporters...money? Really? Sorry,

he has an unlimited supply of $27 donations. And people without work? Well, they have spouses, unemployment et al who can spare an extra $27 here and there. They are the ones who need him the most. Bernie asks for donations for free...on debate stages, and millions flow in. It's HRC that is having to make the frequent trips to the Gold Vault.

A lot of people like me put our small contributions on auto-withdraw...in our budgets...and every month I look at that withdrawal with pride.

I think it may be just the opposite, as HRC continues to drop as she does not have upward momentum, but is relying on the establishment, large donors may experience the all-too-reminiscent Clinton Fatigue.

[roody]

91. Thanks for reminding me to make mine monthly.

[99th_Monkey]

62. Bernie's nay-sayers are usually wrong, and have been from day one. nt

[PonyUp]

7. He should stay in in case something happens as per Hillary

[DAMANgoldberg]

85. After watching the Special Comment from Keith...

Some of the same issues he raised in 2008 are still around her neck today. He was right then, and if he was allowed to speak on this, would be right again in 2016.

TPTB & DWS secretly want Joe Biden to be in the race, and if Bernie leaves, they may get their wish. That would amount to President Donald Trump and Vice President Ted Cruz.

I like VP Joe Biden and would have supported him over Hilary, but he made the decision not to run, so it wouldn't be fair to "just show up" after the campaign season. I would also say that if Sen Elizabeth Warren, who I would adore, did the same thing.

[PonyUp]

102. Maybe it's in the works for an indictment and then put Biden in. Who knows. n/t

[MisterP]

108. and who has time to run a campaign when you're zipping in and out of DC for discovery?

[onecaliberal]

10. We are going to pull off California. Keep your eye on the ball.

[MaggieD]

19. What does "pull off" mean?

Even if he won it would only be by a small margin. That won't make up for the Clinton blow outs that are coming in delegate rich states like Texas, Florida, and New York.

[Kentonio]

27. I wouldn't get to comfortable with the idea of Hillary winning big in New York.

He was only 20 behind a month ago and the polls have moved in his favor since then.

[MaggieD]

42. He won't be seen as viable by then

People like to vote for a winner. That's what momentum is all about.

[Kentonio]

43. In your dreams maybe.

She'll be leading but not by anything like the numbers you folks in the Clinton camp have managed to convince yourselves of.

[MaggieD]

49. Okay, well don't stop believing

I can understand that.

[Herman4747]

94. That may be true, but people also don't like voting...

for someone as UTTERLY DISHONEST AND INSINCERE as your candidate. So we have to see which tendency wins out.

[MaggieD]

96. Most Dem primary voters don't see her that way

As I think you are going to find out over the next few weeks.

[Herman4747]

100. Of course, though, even if only say 10% do & decide to stay home

... on election day in November, rather than vote for someone who can shamelessly lie, then we could wind up with President Trump.

[DCBob]

12. I am sure he will hang on until the convention.

I am a Hillary supporter but we need him and his message and his supporters.

[thesquanderer]

13. I think a candidate's delegates show up and are bound through the first tally...

...even if the candidate himself has "suspended" his campaign.

[MaggieD]

20. You can't have a floor fight with two candidates

Not possible. Sorry. That only works with three or more at convention time.

[thesquanderer]

76. That's (basically) true. But also a non-sequitor.

My point was, Sanders does not have to "stay in the race" in order to have his delegates "show up" on his behalf at the convention. They will show up and vote for him no matter what.

The OP is putting forth a premise that Hillary might step aside at some point due to legal problems; and seems to be worrying that if Bernie steps out before that point, he will lose his delegate representation at the convention, but AFAIK, those delegates would show up and vote for him regardless.

That said, the more delegates he has amassed (in this unlikely scenario), the better.

For example, let's say that Hillary suspends her campaign before she has amassed enough pledged delegates to capture the nomination, and Biden steps in. If Sanders had already stopped campaigning and essentially conceded that many more delegates to Clinton, he will be in a weaker position than if he had continued to amass delegates of his own.

So here's the reason I put the word "basically" in the subject line. In this case, you could end up with a floor fight with only two "active" candidates (Sanders, Biden)... because there is a third candidate (Clinton) who may hold a significant number of delegates, even if she is no longer campaigning and not prepared to accept the nomination. (And no, I don't think this will happen.)

[MaggieD]

88. Okay, I see your point

I don't think there is any chance Clinton will step aside for "legal problems" but I apologize for misreading your previous comment. You are correct about his delegates.

[wyldwolf]

21. When Bernie is mathematically eliminated, he'll concede and endorse Hillary

[restorefreedom]

24. nope. explained in op. nt

[wyldwolf]

25. So Bernie wrote the OP?

[restorefreedom]

29. didn't have to. he told chuck todd two weeks ago

he in till the convention.

[wyldwolf]

32. Yeah, I'm sure he'll be there. He may even get a speaking spot. Maybe.

Bookmarking this for later - may two weeks or so from now.

[restorefreedom]

35. hope your bookmark doesn't have an expiration date :) nt

[wyldwolf]

41. quote:

Not only are we going to New Hampshire ... we're going to South Carolina and Oklahoma and Arizona and North Dakota and New Mexico, and we're going to California and Texas and New York. And we're going to South Dakota and Oregon and Washington and Michigan. And then we're going to Washington, D.C. To take back the White House. Yeah! - Howard Dean

Three weeks later, he dropped out of his race. Several weeks later, he endorsed John Kerry.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A23587-2004Mar25_2.html

[restorefreedom]

52. and howard dean is now shilling for big pharma

clearly, he is NOT like bernie, thank gods...

[wyldwolf]

54. So? He's but one example of a politician that vowed to stay in the race ... then left.

[restorefreedom]

60. he also used to fight for health care reform and now works for the enemy

his word, unlike bernies, can not be trusted.

[MaggieD]

44. He'll look bad if he stays in after mathematical elimination

Lots of candidates say they are in until the convention. Then sanity prevails, and wanting to maintain their image.

Sanders will want leverage with the party, and won't piss it away by staying in if winning becomes mathematically impossible.

However, unlike some of my fellow Clinton supporters I don't think that tipping point is going to be reached in the next two weeks. We'll see.

[restorefreedom]

65. i think you are right about the timeline

the whole theory about whether he stays or not might be moot, because i believe after tuesday it will become a long and close race, probably right up until the convention.

[think]

30. ABC News 5 days ago: Bernie Sanders Vows to Stay in the Race Right Up to the Convention

http://abcnews.go.com/WNT/video/bernie-sanders-vows-stay-race-convention-37123213

[restorefreedom]

36. + a million nt

[wyldwolf]

38. Candidates say that every election cycle.

Not only are we going to New Hampshire ... we're going to South Carolina and Oklahoma and Arizona and North Dakota and New Mexico, and we're going to California and Texas and New York. And we're going to South Dakota and Oregon and Washington and Michigan. And then we're going to Washington, D.C. To take back the White House. Yeah! - Howard Dean

Three weeks later, he dropped out of his race. Several weeks later, he endorsed John Kerry.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A23587-2004Mar25_2.html

[MaggieD]

46. Edwards famously said that a week before dropping out

It's what candidates do.

[think]

79. OK. Guess we shall see what transpires.

[peace13]

33. There's something about a comment like this.

You may be right. Is it possible or probable. It's any woman's guess.

[tazkcmo]

34. Marathon

Not sprint.

[restorefreedom]

37. and the hare wants it to be a sprint

cuz the tortoise will catch up in the later states..

[dinkytron]

40. The powers that be can fck off.

[OhZone]

45. What if the "powers that be" are the majority of Democrats voting for Hillary? n/t

[MaggieD]

53. That's the thing - we are

The "we, the people" stuff irritates me a bit because the polls show we, the people are pretty much behind Clinton. But to some Bernie fans we apparently aren't people.

[davidthegnome]

68. They do?

Which polls would those be? There are polls that have shown Sanders leading among democrats, Nation-wide. There are polls that have shown him handily defeating all of the republican candidates. To some Clinton fans, we apparently aren't people.

[mythology]

99. The poll you're referring to has been widely discredited

Also general election polls during the primaries are pretty much useless.

[Eric J in MN]

50. I hope that Bernie Sanders is our nominee and next president

...but even if Hillary Clinton wins every remaining primary-and-caucus in a landslide, I'm confident that Sanders will stay in to speak out about the policies which would help the American people.

[Thinkingabout]

51. In a brokered convention those pledged delegates could go to another candidate

such as O'Malley, if Hillary is out of the race does not mean he will get all of the delegates.

[w4rma]

57. Why do you think that some unknown replacement would get every one of them? (nt)

[Thinkingabout]

58. She could give them to another.

[w4rma]

69. You must really want to lose the general election. (nt)

[Thinkingabout]

103. No, the last poll I saw says Hillary will beat Trump, Rubio and Cruz. It must

mean I want the most qualified candidate running for president to be our next president.

[w4rma]

109. LATEST POLL: Bernie Sanders is MUCH more electable than Hillary Clinton

FEBRUARY 18, 2016: The latest Quinnipiac Poll of national voters shows that Bernie Sanders performs MUCH better than Hillary Clinton against potential GOP opponents.
http://www.dailykos.com/story/2016/2/20/1488200/-LATEST-POLL-Bernie-Sanders-is-MUCH-more-electable-than-Hillary-Clinton

But, I was talking about your support of authoritarianism by simply replacing Clinton with a candidate who didn't run and isn't supported by the primary voters.

The neoliberals are afraid of another FDR.

[Thinkingabout]

110. Likewise those same voters did not support Sanders.

[w4rma]

111. I thought you'd say that. Authoritarian. And, like I said, you are trying to lose the general.

You need to understand that if you are too heavy handed with the anti-authoritarian wing of the Democratic Party, we'll revolt. Even if it means mutually assured political destruction.

[Thinkingabout]

112. Your accusations does not prove a point with me, in fact it does not bother

Me in the least. Why do you think Sanders should get the nomination without the required number of delegates?

[w4rma]

113. Why do you think that some unknown replacement would get every one of those delegates?

It's clear that this race is going until the convention. And it's clear that it's going to be fairly close, in the end. There won't be a whole lot of delegates separating Sanders and Clinton in the end.

Sanders would only need a small number of them to have the required majority number if Clinton squeaks out a win, which I don't think that she will.

[Thinkingabout]

114. read up on the convention rules.

[w4rma]

115. I'm read up on them. You read them. (nt)

[Thinkingabout]

116. goodbye

[99th_Monkey]

55. Great post! Thank you for the timely reminder. Time to double-down on Bernie!! nt

[restorefreedom]

77. +++++ a zillion go bernie!! nt

[brentspeak]

59. Bernie can outlast Hillary for several reasons

1) Hillary will run of money; Bernie won't
2) The email scandal won't go away
3) The #whichhillary protests may have appeared too late to hurt HRC in South Carolina, but it will dent her approval among minorities in the months to come, count on it.
4) Bernie is quite used to long distance contests. If he chose to stay in the race, he would remain competitive up to the very end.

[SoLeftIAmRight]

62. DWS has still not...

made a commitment to give Sanders a prime time slot.

WTF

[Mister Ed]

64. Agreed. And perhaps more important:

Sanders is working hard to bend the USA away from the oligarchy it has become, and back toward democracy. I, personally, believe that goal is what has been driving him all this time.

To accomplish that goal, he and his supporters must press the Democratic Party to return to its populist roots. That pressure must continue all the way to the convention, and far beyond.

[libdem4life]

72. I so agree...when a Time Has Come...kind of like new technology...it does not go away. nt

[silvershadow]

66. He has said he would. We just have to keep him in it. nt

[erlewyne]

67. It is going to be a proud day for me in November

when I walk down the Railroad tracks to the polls.

I will vote for Bernie. I could take the sidewalk but the
tracks are more fun. We vote at the fire station across
from the rural water pumps.

Thanks so much Bernie!!!

[alcibiades_mystery]

70. vivid imagination!

[saidsimplesimon]

71. I'm donating again on Act Blue.

Senator Sanders speaks for me. He will need funding to keep up the fight.

[Jezza]

90. +27

me too

[grasswire]

73. don't blink Bernie

Do what Al Gore was not man enough to do.

Fight to the end. Make them tear it from your hands if it is to be so.

Make a mark for history, as Gore should have done.

[Trust Buster]

74. As Hillary's nomination becomes more apparent,

She will peel of Bernie supporters by the bunches. If past is prologue, voters start jumping onto the ship of the winning candidate. It will accelerate exponentially.

[Andy823]

75. I will leave that to Bernie to decide

He will know when to drop out, or stay till the end, it's all his choice. Bernie has done wonders for this race, and no matter what happens, no matter who wins the nomination, he has helped to put some great ideas on the table. His revolution does not end as long as those who "really" support his ideas and want to see things change, continue to get out and make sure more candidates at local, and state levels get put into office who will keep on making the right changes in order to get real change in this country.

[gwheezie]

78. What if either of them get whooped bad?

Say maybe win 1/2 as many delegates as the other?

[restorefreedom]

82. it probably going to be much closer

but if she has to step down, bernie will still have way more delegstes than biden or anyone else, who didn't run and will have zero delegates. bernie will have to the the nom.

[left-of-center2012]

81. She'll swing to right of center again

Abandoning liberals and progressives in favor of the military, industrials, and Wall Street.

[dcbuckeye]

83. How is it becoming "increasingly likely" that Hillary will face legal troubles?

You said it looks "increasingly likely" that Hillary will face legal troubles. Do you have some inside knowledge that the rest of us don't have?

[restorefreedom]

84. i have been reading the increasingly serious issues of her emails

no insider anything. just keeping up with the latest

[azurnoir]

87. No if it goes that way Bernie should concede ASAP that way the focus can be on Hillary

hopefully it won't be like an ant under a magnifying glass

[andrewv1]

89. I am amazed the MSM has made it like it's "do or die" in SC when I can't remember the last time it..

went Democratic in the GE.

[Ccarmona]

97. NO surprise

The MSM is so in the bag for HRC, they're trying all they can to diminish Bernie's candidacy. They only can handle one horse race, and they want it to be on the Repub side. And, it's what their corporate masters want. That said, Bernie needs to stay in the race so he forces sellout DWS to give home a prominent speaking spot at the Convention and help shape the Party's platform.

[andrewv1]

93. If Bernie doesn't lock up the Democratic Nomination by late March?...Go Independent!

In terms of how he has been screwed by the Democratic Establishment, I wouldn't wait around...

If it's not him, then another Progressive can step up for the Progressive base & independents & they would have a good chance to win; Especially with the probability of another right-wing conservative getting in the race splitting up the vote.

They would have until May to get on the ballot in every state, & who want's to bet on Hillary with a possible indictment & unfavorable rating & whatever negative baggage she "acquires" by that time?

Hillary will have a tough time winning the General Election unless she "rigs it" or the Rethug Candidate completely explodes.

[rock]

98. I agree with your conclusion but would use another reason

Best illustrated by a joke:

Bob stopped by Pete's the other day and Pete greeted him at the door dressed in nothing but a top hat. Bob, though surprised, came on in.
"Why aren't you wearing anything?"
"Nobody ever calls, except you."
"Why are you wearing a top hat?"
"Somebody might!"

[restorefreedom]

105. lol. well done. nt

[CentralMass]

101. Agreed.

[Autumn]

106. Bernie is in it till the convention. They can want him to concede all they want.

[restorefreedom]

107. exactly. if they want to spit in the ocean, they can have at it. nt

[azmom]

117. Kick