"Grim Tidings for Hillary -- They don't like her. They really don't like her."

[Attorney in Texas]

Anyone who thinks the moderate Republicans (i.e., the establishment, non-evangelicals and non-Tea Partiers) will not be motivated to turn out in record numbers to vote against Hillary has not been reading the news; excerpt:

Hillary Clinton’s loss to Bernie Sanders in the New Hampshire primary wasn't as bad as she'd feared. It was worse. Sanders's margin of victory — 60 percent to 39 percent — was the largest ever by a Democrat who wasn't a sitting president. It was a come-from-behind win: Eight months ago, Sanders was at 9 percent and Clinton held a 46-point advantage. And Sanders overperformed the polls. Only 1 of the last 15 polls had him above 60 percent; the Real Clear Politics average in New Hampshire had him at 54.5 percent going into the vote.... The exit polling for Clinton was brutal. Sanders won men by 35 points; he won women by 11. He won voters under the age of 30 by 67 points. People expect that of Sanders and his children's crusade. Clinton took home senior citizens, 54 percent to 45 percent. People expect that of Clinton's boomers. But in the big band of middle-aged Democrats, ages 45 to 64 (who made up 42 percent of the electorate), Sanders beat Clinton 54 percent to 45 percent. He beat her among Democrats with a high school diploma or less; he beat her among Democrats with postgraduate degrees. Among people who'd voted in a Democratic primary before, Sanders won by 16 points; among first-time voters, he won by 57. He won self-identified "moderate" voters by 20 points.... Sanders won voters who own guns by 40 points. But he won voters who don't own guns by 14. He even won voters who said that terrorism was their number one concern.

The biggest problem for Clinton, however, came in the candidate-perception categories. The second-most important quality voters said they wanted in a candidate was someone who "cares." Sanders won these voters by 65 points. The most important quality people said they wanted was "honesty." Sanders took those people home 92 to 6. Look at that again. When asked "Is Clinton honest and trustworthy?" 53 percent of all voters — not just Sanders voters, but everyone casting a Democratic ballot — said "no."

The final insult came from the raw vote totals. The hardest thing to do in politics is convert a new voter. The easiest thing is to retain an old one. A voter who has previously pulled the lever for a candidate is the easiest person to get back on your side. In 2008, Hillary Clinton got 112,404 votes in New Hampshire. If she had brought all of those voters with her, she still would have lost to Sanders this time around. But this year she got just 95,242. That's 17,000 voters — 1 out of every 7! — who refused to come back and vote for Clinton again.... Her campaign is offering eight years of trench warfare. Everything is about "fighting." ... But her entire pitch is like a recruiting poster for World War I: Vote for me and we'll take this country back one trench at a time, whatever the cost! ... Sanders, on the other hand, is offering a revolutionary vision: ... once The People are engaged, they'll impose their will on the handful of corporate oligarchs who have set up the current, corrupt system. In Sanders's view, outside of a tiny number of super-elites, we're all brothers and sisters. And no matter how conservative you might be, the truth is that Scandinavia is lovely. Who among us wouldn't want paid maternity leave, shorter work weeks, free state-college tuition, and locally sourced dairy products?

In the face of this, the Clinton campaign has pinned its hopes on two theories. The first is that Democrats will eventually settle for her. Literally: At an event in Hudson, New Hampshire, a guy on the stage behind Clinton wore a T-shirt saying "Settle for Hillary." ... The other theory of the Clinton campaign is salvation at the hands of black and Hispanic voters. ... But the numbers from Iowa and New Hampshire suggest Clinton has lost a great deal of support from 2008. Gone are her "moderate" supporters— the Jacksonian Democrats of Kentucky and Pennsylvania who powered her to victories in Appalachia. Splitting minority voters with Sanders won't be enough for Clinton; she'll have to win them decisively.

[Lucinda]

1. The Weekly Standard?

[Fawke Em]

5. Are the numbers wrong?

Cause, if they aren't (and they aren't), they still say what they say: Hillary's not well-liked by many, no matter who writes it.

[Lucinda]

11. Bernie had 143K+ votes to Hillary's 91K+ in a 2 person race

So he won by apx 50k+ votes, which is the amount of a moderate sized city in a state like FLA. So I'm not too worried about the NH numbers.

His number were excellent for NH - and I'm delighted he did well.
But 91K+ people voted for the "not well liked" candidate.

I think she did pretty well in a state with a gun industry, when she is very much on the record for new restrictions.

[litlbilly]

28. Bernie got over 151k, at least get that right, in 08 Hillary got over 120k in NH.

[HooptieWagon]

29. Clinton's vote numbers are much worse than author says.

She had fewer votes in a 2 candidate primary in 2016 than in a strong 3 candidate primary in 2008. In effect, she lost far more than 17,000 votes. More like 40,000 votes, if we assign Edwards votes 50/50 to Clinton and Obama.

[Fawke Em]

33. I was talking about these numbers:

The most important quality people said they wanted was "honesty." Sanders took those people home 92 to 6. Look at that again. When asked "Is Clinton honest and trustworthy?" 53 percent of all voters — not just Sanders voters, but everyone casting a Democratic ballot — said "no."

The point of the post is about likability and trustworthiness goes toward that. In other words, no, they don't really like her.

[earthside]

35. "What difference – at this point, what difference does it make?"

Whether the Weekly Standard or some other publication ... the analysis is valid.

The bottom line is this: Hillary Clinton was crushed in New Hampshire by Sen. Sanders. The exit polling show that this defeat was deep and broad based.

Hillary Clinton is a loser.

If Bernie can beat her in New Hampshire and all she can do is draw a tie in Iowa, the conclusion one can reasonably draw is that any Repuglican will be able to do the same come this November.

[Lucinda]

36. It matters, because it is giving traffic, therefore dollars, to right wing websites. n/t

[merrily]

53. Many LW websites simply don't report certain kinds of stories.

I don't frequent RW websites but the knee jerk source shaming and dismissing on DU as to factual info without any attempt to say the facts are wrong has reached ridiculous degrees, IMO. I've even seen WAPO and politico dismissed as RW sources if they post something negative to Hillary.

[mgmaggiemg]

2. you know who owns those papers right?

[Attorney in Texas]

6. How do adults have a discussion about whether moderate Republican voters will crossover if you can't

discuss the data?

[mgmaggiemg]

59. some do some don't

my bro lived in texas for 2 decades, a republican ....will be voting for HRC because of the ACA(2 kids in college and a mortgage) so he's a republican voting for a woman...And a democrat......then theres my mother.(retired)...and she likes trump because she's always had bad taste in men also a republican but Trump is a better choice than any other if you are going to vote republican, at least she's helping the democrats... and then there's me I like to vote green locally and I'm voting for HRC because I hate the GOP. so yes some republicans do cross over some to HRC because they like the ACA....libertarians, independent lefty/republican types might go for Bernie...mostly men...who don't want their guns taken away. they might be persuaded to vote for bernie in a primary...but in a general they will go back republican...in other words not super reliable.... like a boyfriend that ends up cheating on you.....does that help?

[msongs]

3. republicans and sanders supporters - two peas in the same pod on this issue nt

[AtomicKitten]

10. Numbers aren't partisan and don't lie.

And those trying to assign blame to the numbers are disingenuously spinning their wheels.

[frylock]

12. I suppose that thought will be of some comfort when she loses the nomination..

again.

[SheenaR]

18. Republicans and Sanders supporters.

Lol

So you are willfully admitting that nobody in this country likes her except the people supporting her campaign.

There's nobody left. And it is why she will lose in November. And you all will play the blame game. But it's the deeply flawed candidate that will be the reason.

[earthside]

37. You are correct ...

Repuglicans and Sanders supporters ARE two peas in the same pod on this issue: Hillary is a loser.

We don't want a loser, do we?

Sanders for President!

[OhZone]

4. The GOP really hate socialists too -

actually they hate any Democrat. Oh well.

[Attorney in Texas]

7. So if they hate Clinton and "socialists" why al the pretense about Sanders' electability?

[tk2kewl]

15. the difference is that other than a label Bernie hasn't given them any ammo

and the label is in fact an invitation to have him explain what his ideas are all about.

someone on huffpo called Bernie the Andy Dufresne of Washington because "he swam through a river of shit and came out clean."

can't quite say the same for Hillary

[OhZone]

22. Oh, yes, he has -

1 - Being socialist. Seriously, more people are accepting it, but that's still less than 50% of voters. The GOP will link him to Communists. Even though, he can try to explain the variations of socialism, too many Americans are willfully ignorant and won't wise up.
2 - Honeymooning in Moscow during the cold war (that's enough to destroy him in the general right there.)
3 - He has lived and worked with hard core communists. The GOP will make sure every voter knows that.
4 -Sanders was a conscientious objector during the Vietnam War. The GOP will equate that to “draft dodger” and question his ability to be commander in chief.
5 - Sanders is on record as saying “We will absolutely raise taxes” in the trillions of dollars. The GOP will play this up with “Tax and spend Socialist”. Sanders cannot refute it, and long explanations will not work. Remember Mondale?
6 - He is a white, older, New England liberal and as such will not easily connect with the minority voters necessary to win in the South and in the West.

I love Bernie, but he's ... gonna have a bad time.

And, since he's just beginning to get vetted so there's more to come.

The lies and distortions against Hillary have been vetted and the Clintons are prepared for them.

Oh well.

[tk2kewl]

25. in case you didn't know...

1- already gave you my opinion on that and it ain't such a dirty word anymore

2- his Russia trip was through a sister-cities program he started in Burlington. it was a way to bridge divides and allow people of both countries to experience each other's humanity. he had a similar relationship with a Nicaraguan city. Believe me, he is prepared for when they come for him on this, and the only ones that are going to take the bait are the ones that can't be reached anyway.

3- gladly reply to evidence

4- at this point much of the electorate will see this as a plus. he didn't get deferments or safe plumb assignments or go awol like recent presidents

5- you must be living in a different country than me, because I see a shit ton of people that want the tax code to be appropriately progressive and don't mind paying a little more to get a lot more

6- totally disagree with the statement. Hillary's record on racial justice and dog whistle politics has been well document here on DU. And his GE competition is having minorities beaten and dragged out of their rallies. how the hell is he at a disadvantage here vs GOP.

lies and distortions about the Clintons aside... how about the Clintons on lies, and constantly shifting positions?

[OhZone]

30. Apparently I do live in a different country -

My country has a ton of homophobes, racists, teabaggers, idiots, Christian fundamentalists (and terrorists), and just plain low information voters. Also some greedy bastards. And a "YUUUGE" propaganda machine.

That potion of the country, very often represents about 50% of the vote, over and over and over. And over and over and over.

Where do you live? I live in a blue state, but in a fairly conservative city. My job is full of a wide range of political beliefs and a lot of people there are talking about which Republican will win. This is in a blue state.

You think there's a revolution, but it's really a small vocal minority.

IMHO.

Oh well.

[tk2kewl]

34. too bad you acquiesce so easily

if you actually got out in the street with us once in a while you might see it diffidently. a lot of us aren't willing to take it sitting down

[OhZone]

44. I'm planning to get out in the street again, on my next vacation -

And hold signs for Hillary.

[tk2kewl]

45. good luck

[OhZone]

46. Thank you, hun. :) nt

[Bjornsdotter]

31. Point for point

1. I am a socialist of the Scandinavian variety. It comes from living both there and here. I am thrilled to have someone who calls himself a Democratic Socialist.

2. I've been to East Germany during the cold war.

3. I've known Communists, a relative worked in an embassy in Moscow.

4. I've known many conscientious objectors during Vietnam. Many came to Sweden.

5. Raise taxes to have a better life for all....good. I'm all for it.

6. He will have to reach out to connect with minority voters.

Everyone is different, what you may see as a stumbling block others may see as a plus.

[SheenaR]

20. Hence why

There are widespread reports of Sanders' crossover appeal. Both in the media and anecdotally here at DU.

Despite her moderate/centrist (guilty as charged)/ slightly left of Reagan beliefs, she will not get republicans or independents. At all.

[jeff47]

51. Yes...They call any Democrat a socialist. Even Clinton.

If we're going to take the down-side hit of being called a socialist, might as well take the up-side of good policies.

[JRLeft]

8. "Settle for Hillary."

That is the theme of her campaign.

[farleftlib]

9. Yes. Clinton's biggest problem is Clinton

She's a lousy campaigner and a compromised candidate with an overblown sense of entitlement. She wants to run on experience but her accomplishments are a mixed bag at best. And then there's the trustworthiness problem, a very self-inflicted wound there.

Thanks for posting.

[Carolina]

27. What accomplishments? What has she done?

She is part of Bill Clinton's legacy (the two for one, the 8 years of 'experience'): NAFTA, Telecommunications Bill of 1996, Welfare Reform (not), Three Strikes, overturning Glass-Steagall, etc. She and Bill kept Alan Greenspan at the Fed, placed the then Mr. Goldman Sucks himself Robert Reuben as head of Treasury and hired as financial advisor that abominable Wall Streeter Larry Summers (who lost a $billion from Harvard's endowment!). Those three and their 'bright ideas' crashed the economy:



And we, the people (the little people, lots of women and children), reaped the whirlwind of that 1999 Act which ended Glass-Steagall and for which every repuke in the Senate voted AYE while every Dem -- save one -- voted NAY. Bill signed it into law anyway, paying no heed to the canary-in-the-mine Dems who said that this dastardly new law would lead to disaster 10 years hence. Sure enough it did, harming women and families throughout the land. And Wall Street, Hillary's BFF, continues to be such a benefactor for women!

In the Senate, what did she DO? What legislation or amendments to legislation illustrate her initiative or activism on behalf of women and children. The aye votes for IWR, the Patriot Act and Bush's Bankruptcy bill sure were a big help to us all!

Then there was her abysmal management and nasty conduct during the 2008 primary campaign. She had the money, she had the name, she was entitled, she was "in it to win it" and so arrogant that she claimed it would be over by Super Tuesday. But when it wasn't and she was losing, she resorted to the gutter. She praised McCain and derided Obama as someone who only gave pretty speeches. And when the Party urged her to bow out gracefully, she said that she was going to stay in the race through the CA primary because "you never know... remember Bobby Kennedy..." Her insinuation (a veiled wish?) that Obama might be assassinated like RFK was beyond classless and tasteless. It was evil (google Keith Olbermann on that atrocity). And when she finally, gracelessly bowed out, she did so on condition that the Obama organization and DNC pay off her campaign debt. Some management skills, just like her Wall Street benefactors who f--- things up, then expect others to pay for the disaster created.

As SOS, she was also terrible. Honduras, Libya and Syria are a mess. But HRC, the consummate pro-MIC corporatist, never saw a war she didn't like. And last I checked, war is not good for women, children or men!

Now in 2016, HRC is back in kitchen sink mode. The surrogates have been unleashed. They have insulted young women for “going where the boys are” and damned all women who don’t support the anointed one. They are impugning the opponent’s integrity and record on Civil Rights and there is more and worse to come. This is 2008 redux with added shock and awe.

This is HRC's history. So, please tell me what she has DONE that is positive or constructive? What are her accomplishments? What is this record she always harkens back to in her me, me, me, mine, mine, mine debate responses and that her supporters parrot? She's in it for herself, she plays sexist gender politics, she LIES about her alleged record, she changes her mind with the political winds, she panders, she pads her pockets, and she is the worst sort of Democrat... a founder of the DLC and a triangulator to her core.

[farleftlib]

32. Whoa, I'm on Bernie's side all the way

Maybe the sarcasm didn't come through but believe me, I'm well aware of how much damage she and Bill did to this country.

I'm very glad you're on our side! I'm kinda glad I pissed you off because that is one hell of a post. THank you.

[Carolina]

40. So sorry. I got your sarcasm

I really meant to come across as saying yeah, I know... what damn accomplishments.

But truly, we hear ad nauseum about her accomplishments, decades long record and experience... blah, blah, blah. But what has she DONE? For the life of me, I don't understand why she's never challenged on this BS.

Anyway, I didn't mean to be snarky to you and sincerely apologize. After all your screen name and avatar say it all

[farleftlib]

42. No apology necessary

It's all good. It was a bad choice of words on my part. I should have put they eyeroll emoji in there after the word 'accomplishments.' Like I said, I'm so happy you're on Team Bernie. WTG.

[frylock]

13. Is there a picture of that 'Settle for Hillary' shirt on stage at a Clinton event?

Because that is so rad!

[DiehardLiberal]

16. Here you go...

?itok=AubfMQ-C

Don't know how to capture it but I bet you do!

[frylock]

17. Thanks!

I just spit IPA all over my phone!

[DiehardLiberal]

19. It's beautiful, isn't it?

[frylock]

23. That guy is a troll GOD!

[JRLeft]

24. There are people who really believe this is a great way to get people to support her.

[dchill]

52. Maybe he's just a moran!

As Freud said, "Sometimes a Moran is just a Moran."

[frylock]

57. He did say that. Yep.

[dchill]

58. Well, yes. Yes he did!

I just forgot the attribution.

[Live and Learn]

41. OMG, that is too funny!!

[Live and Learn]

43. Such enthusiasm. nt

[840high]

47. Oh my goodness..........

[tk2kewl]

14. not only have they "not been reading the news..."

they must've been born yesterday for crying out loud. the right has been arming themselves for a fight against Hillary for 20 years and she's been giving them a good chunk of the ammo

[Ferd Berfel]

21. This is one of the basic facts of life. Republicans WILL turn out

just to vote against Hillary.

On the other hand (the left hand that is) there are some republicans that will cross over and vote for Bernie. As has occurred in often in Bernies elections.

Hillary is the long-shot here, Bernie is the one with a much better chance.

[musiclawyer]

50. X million

That is the truth

[thereismore]

26. That's a good summary. Ergo, kitchen sink. nt

[Live and Learn]

38. I ain't settling! Feel the Bern!!

[speaktruthtopower]

39. I think..

we're seeing voter rebellion against the establishment in both parties.

[840high]

48. Yes we are.

[asuhornets]

49. n/t

[leveymg]

54. I really don't like her, and I'm a life-long Democrat. I'm against her as she will lose.

There can't possible be a better reason to oppose her.

[cascadiance]

55. Grimm tidings indeed. Right wingers probably think she's leading "Black Claw".

[FreakinDJ]

56. Who said Hillary's negatives don't matter

Apparently they do

[kath]

60. Kick. The numbers in the exit polls are VERY bad news for HRC.