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wyldwolf

(43,867 posts)
Sun Feb 14, 2016, 10:20 AM Feb 2016

Atlanta mayor: Sanders 'disrespectful and dismissive' to Obama on race

Atlanta Mayor Kasim Reed, a Hillary Clinton supporter, is going after Democratic presidential candidate Bernie Sanders for saying that race relations would be better under his presidency.

"So his comments last night, which I happen to believe are incorrect, are consistent with his dismissive and disrespectful attitude towards President Obama," Reed said Friday in an interview on CNN.

He was referring to comments made by Sanders in Thursday night's debate, when the Vermont senator was asked whether race relations would be better with him in the White House than they are now.

“Absolutely," Sanders replied, "because what we will do is instead of give tax breaks to millionaires, we will create millions of jobs for low-income kids so they are not hanging out on street corners."
Clinton supporters are taking that as a sign of disrespect to the nation's first black president.
"I think it seemed a bit presumptuous to me to conclude that Bernie Sanders in the twilight of his career was going to be able to be the great healer in race relations," said Congressional Black Caucus whip Hakeem Jeffries (D-N.Y.) on Friday.

Reed also hit Sanders for his lack of a record on racial justice issues and questioned his allegiance to the Democratic Party.
"Show me in the Senate where he led some broad coalition to get something significant accomplished done," he said.

"He is running to be the standard-bearer of the Democratic Party, although he just became a Democrat within the last year."

http://thehill.com/blogs/ballot-box/269362-atlanta-mayor-sanders-disrespectful-and-dismissive-to-obama-over-race#.Vr9367_NqAE.facebook

112 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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Atlanta mayor: Sanders 'disrespectful and dismissive' to Obama on race (Original Post) wyldwolf Feb 2016 OP
Good grief, let's put this one to rest... TCJ70 Feb 2016 #1
Yes JustAnotherGen Feb 2016 #8
No We Can't! n/t thomservo Feb 2016 #11
we can't what? JustAnotherGen Feb 2016 #36
I totally agree with that Armstead Feb 2016 #16
Thank you JustAnotherGen Feb 2016 #44
This message was self-deleted by its author Hiraeth Feb 2016 #48
The racial climate in the U.S. can be improved and racism reduced if Bernie's plans take hold. Uncle Joe Feb 2016 #89
I don't think so JustAnotherGen Feb 2016 #92
Racism will be reduced if poverty is reduced and visa versa, there will be less Uncle Joe Feb 2016 #96
Maybe something aling the lines of "I will build on the President's work ..." Empowerer Feb 2016 #14
Message auto-removed Name removed Feb 2016 #17
No - he just said that the African American president isn't good enough on race relations Empowerer Feb 2016 #19
Message auto-removed Name removed Feb 2016 #20
Don't let yourself get baited by someone who just signed up today. n/t JTFrog Feb 2016 #46
of course he didn't. I don't think he has that in him. wyldwolf Feb 2016 #60
That's because it wasn't a discussion about gang criminals. oasis Feb 2016 #111
A key point is lost in the discussion. jonestonesusa Feb 2016 #24
You can parse all you want, but the fact remains that Sanders' claim that he'll do better Empowerer Feb 2016 #25
Predictably, you are moving back to identity politics rather than policy. jonestonesusa Feb 2016 #33
NO ... 1StrongBlackMan Feb 2016 #34
No he did not because that was not the question in the first place Obama wasn't mentioned azurnoir Feb 2016 #51
That doesn't change anything ... 1StrongBlackMan Feb 2016 #57
Haven't I already said that? a reminder for you azurnoir Feb 2016 #62
another question for you ever hear of a blogger named LaShawn Barber? azurnoir Feb 2016 #64
Bingo Empowerer Feb 2016 #69
That is what the fuck I saw bravenak Feb 2016 #88
Yes and his actions have consistently backed this up farleftlib Feb 2016 #39
You don't post much, Admiral Loinpresser Feb 2016 #43
Thanks! Primary season is upon us. jonestonesusa Feb 2016 #107
I agree completely yourpaljoey Feb 2016 #77
That does not fit the anti Obama narrative. boston bean Feb 2016 #40
That's false. Admiral Loinpresser Feb 2016 #45
Pure speculation. jonestonesusa Feb 2016 #106
Please family! JRLeft Feb 2016 #112
What does this mean? bravenak Feb 2016 #87
Message auto-removed Name removed Feb 2016 #90
It means... TCJ70 Feb 2016 #99
I can't afford to uponit7771 Feb 2016 #93
"do you still beat your wife? question...debate 001...not even 101 islandmkl Feb 2016 #2
K&R! stonecutter357 Feb 2016 #3
Just another establishment politician... thomservo Feb 2016 #4
Message auto-removed Name removed Feb 2016 #5
They are hitting this meme too hard and overplaying their hand. Bonobo Feb 2016 #6
Mayor Kasim Reed's constituents include: Wilms Feb 2016 #7
What a shocker. Not. cali Feb 2016 #9
K&R mcar Feb 2016 #10
"He is running to be the standard-bearer" Running as the conscience of the democratic party Donkees Feb 2016 #12
They can say what they want, but it doesn't change the facts casperthegm Feb 2016 #13
He was involved in the civil rights movement for a couple of years in the 1960s Empowerer Feb 2016 #15
He's always fought for the underdog casperthegm Feb 2016 #21
Support isn't fighting Empowerer Feb 2016 #26
Wrong. casperthegm Feb 2016 #30
Ever heard of Jesse Jackson? n/t Admiral Loinpresser Feb 2016 #47
What a fucking crock of steaming runny shit. cherokeeprogressive Feb 2016 #55
The Clinton campaign has adopted the republican meme that "liberals are the real racists" Doctor_J Feb 2016 #18
Bingo! sellitman Feb 2016 #22
Yes - a Liberal Polish Jew knows nothing about being discounted. SoLeftIAmRight Feb 2016 #23
Wow - playing the Polish Jew card now? Empowerer Feb 2016 #27
Get your two for - Vote Hillary and welcome Kissinger into the white house. SoLeftIAmRight Feb 2016 #29
Spot on! jonestonesusa Feb 2016 #31
I disagree with the Mayor. I heard exactly what Bernie said. ladjf Feb 2016 #28
So Sanders didn't say the stuff after the "Absolutely"? eom 1StrongBlackMan Feb 2016 #42
Yes, he said the remark about tax breaks for millionaires which is a criticism ladjf Feb 2016 #50
You left out the "So Black (Youth) won't be hanging out on street corners" part ... 1StrongBlackMan Feb 2016 #54
The quote: ladjf Feb 2016 #75
No ... that is not my disagreement. eom. 1StrongBlackMan Feb 2016 #80
LOL ... 1StrongBlackMan Feb 2016 #32
Definitely comment if you want. I will. jonestonesusa Feb 2016 #37
Why would Sanders answer a question about race relations by referring to getting kids jobs if he Empowerer Feb 2016 #63
Because if you just get jobs for the millions of black kids hanging out on corners-all will be well Empowerer Feb 2016 #38
Sandra Bland had a job ... 1StrongBlackMan Feb 2016 #49
So are you advocating for policies like bailing out wall St, CentralMass Feb 2016 #66
What does any of that have to do with race relations, i.e., relations between the races? Empowerer Feb 2016 #68
The topic of this thread is regarding a question asked CentralMass Feb 2016 #82
Your response exemplifies the problem we've been describing Empowerer Feb 2016 #100
Your responses make it clear that you don't really want CentralMass Feb 2016 #104
There's a truth teller in Atlanta who disagrees: Admiral Loinpresser Feb 2016 #35
A black man says something you don't like, so trout out another black man to tell us he's wrong Empowerer Feb 2016 #41
An uncorrupted man of the people, Admiral Loinpresser Feb 2016 #52
Thank you! Empowerer Feb 2016 #58
No, thank you! Admiral Loinpresser Feb 2016 #71
Great response. nt Cali_Democrat Feb 2016 #91
The have a great template o follow ... 1StrongBlackMan Feb 2016 #53
Really? Admiral Loinpresser Feb 2016 #73
I really don't care what you think. eom. 1StrongBlackMan Feb 2016 #79
I have the same feeling. bravenak Feb 2016 #86
Yes he does, Mike camparing Obama to a "master" is not only BS it's stupid racializaed flamebaite uponit7771 Feb 2016 #95
Jeffries puts the 'hack' in Hakeem. - nt KingCharlemagne Feb 2016 #56
As I've said for months now DefenseLawyer Feb 2016 #59
Lol, I see what you did there Arazi Feb 2016 #70
Thereby illustrating the total, utter bankruptcy of the Democratic Party establishment. While KingCharlemagne Feb 2016 #61
we're honored you at least considered us. Now you can move on. wyldwolf Feb 2016 #65
And then after graduating from college, he retired from the movement, moved to Vermont, and Empowerer Feb 2016 #72
He's not so squeaky clean allowing his brother to get away RiffRandell Feb 2016 #67
Here we go Empowerer Feb 2016 #74
Question BERNIE SANDERS all you want. RiffRandell Feb 2016 #105
My - what a great outreach strategy Empowerer Feb 2016 #108
Traction? RiffRandell Feb 2016 #110
The Swiftboating continues. Team Hillary dirty tricks. BillZBubb Feb 2016 #76
Great article in OP Gothmog Feb 2016 #78
Bernie said, better..not end. I would hope any candidate would work to make the issue better. Jefferson23 Feb 2016 #81
Ok, what's up with THIS?: bravenak Feb 2016 #83
Message auto-removed Name removed Feb 2016 #94
“Yeah, it’s rigged now because you don’t have a president that’s a change-maker.” Autumn Feb 2016 #84
Why should anyone pay attention to the mayor's statement? HooptieWagon Feb 2016 #85
Reed is a jerk mikehiggins Feb 2016 #97
He's in the same league as Claire McCaskill. Hillary's pit bulls. Cheese Sandwich Feb 2016 #98
Let me get this right.... workinclasszero Feb 2016 #101
Kasim Reed another of the many pillars of "saving black communities"... AOR Feb 2016 #102
I think a better answer would have been "I don't know" loyalsister Feb 2016 #103
Sanders has missed many opportunities and somehow keeps making things worse. At this late hour ... NurseJackie Feb 2016 #109

TCJ70

(4,387 posts)
1. Good grief, let's put this one to rest...
Sun Feb 14, 2016, 10:22 AM
Feb 2016

...how was he supposed to answer the question? "No. Race relations will not be better under my leadership."

JustAnotherGen

(31,828 posts)
8. Yes
Sun Feb 14, 2016, 10:32 AM
Feb 2016

Because it would be a realistic answer. I turned 43 yesterday.

I have zero belief that bigots will change in my lifetime or that the racial climate in America will get better.

It is what it is.

There were people hateful to me when I was five - there will be people hateful to me when I'm 85. That's not going to change.

Sanders and Clinton both need to start pushing back - every time bigotry towards blacks gets brought up. . . Better than if we have a Republican in the White House.

Hammer those pigs on the Right - not each other. They both need to prepare for a GE where they can have old sound bites pointing out what vile racists Republicants are.

JustAnotherGen

(31,828 posts)
36. we can't what?
Sun Feb 14, 2016, 11:48 AM
Feb 2016

Point out they have been foaming at the mouth racists since 1976?

I can only think you are white. From where I sit? As a black woman?America is a racist piece of shit and won't change until we become majority brown and tan.


I'm sorry -but we suck.

 

Armstead

(47,803 posts)
16. I totally agree with that
Sun Feb 14, 2016, 10:38 AM
Feb 2016

as a white male.

There are deep seated issues that neither candidate will eradicate.

But there are right now threats like stripping of voting rights, the criminal injustice system, etc. Both Bernie and Clinton are light years ahead of the GOP on those things. We should at least have a concensus onn that instead of arguing about which is more "enlightened"

JustAnotherGen

(31,828 posts)
44. Thank you
Sun Feb 14, 2016, 11:53 AM
Feb 2016

Exactly. One group of candidates wants to strip black people of voting rights - two on our side have pledged to defend.

It's pretty clear who the racists are.

Response to Armstead (Reply #16)

JustAnotherGen

(31,828 posts)
92. I don't think so
Sun Feb 14, 2016, 02:19 PM
Feb 2016

Once everyone has their financial needs met - everyone goes back to their personal islands.

Uncle Joe

(58,365 posts)
96. Racism will be reduced if poverty is reduced and visa versa, there will be less
Sun Feb 14, 2016, 02:25 PM
Feb 2016

overall bitterness, less resentment, less bigotry, less desperation, less crime, less stereotyping, more education, more enlightenment, hatred and racism are fed by fear and ignorance.

No one is claiming that racism will be entirely eliminated although at some point in the future I believe that's possible.

Empowerer

(3,900 posts)
14. Maybe something aling the lines of "I will build on the President's work ..."
Sun Feb 14, 2016, 10:35 AM
Feb 2016

But instead, he suggested the President is doing an inadequate job and that he, Bernie Sanders, will "absolutely" do it better.

Response to Empowerer (Reply #14)

Empowerer

(3,900 posts)
19. No - he just said that the African American president isn't good enough on race relations
Sun Feb 14, 2016, 10:46 AM
Feb 2016

and that he, Bernie Sanders, will do it better.

Because he's had so much experience with it, I guess ...

Response to Empowerer (Reply #19)

jonestonesusa

(880 posts)
24. A key point is lost in the discussion.
Sun Feb 14, 2016, 11:01 AM
Feb 2016

The term race relations refers to relationships among groups and policies pursued by institutions to expand opportunity and equity.

Sanders tends to focus on policies (college access, health care, public infrastructure initiative, decriminalization, etc.) more than relationships, and his policy proposals are ambitious with a high upside.

Critics of Sanders seem to focus more on relationships with black communities, and by comparison, Clinton has more established relationships with black officeholders in particular.

The point that is lost: the impact of policies. They are not discussed enough. I admire Obama, went to the 2008 inauguration, met him twice, continue to find him to be a transformational politician. But his policies need to be challenged, and his record needs to be examined. Why is it an insult for a candidate to say he can do better? Yes, it's hubris, compared to Clinton wrapping herself in Obama's legacy. For my money though, I'll take better policy anytime over friendly promises. And the Clinton camp seems to prefer to discuss identity politics more than policy.

Empowerer

(3,900 posts)
25. You can parse all you want, but the fact remains that Sanders' claim that he'll do better
Sun Feb 14, 2016, 11:08 AM
Feb 2016

on race relations than Barack Obama was arrogant, insulting, and likely false - and was surely not lost on a constituency he desperately needs.

jonestonesusa

(880 posts)
33. Predictably, you are moving back to identity politics rather than policy.
Sun Feb 14, 2016, 11:39 AM
Feb 2016

And at the end of the day, this campaign isn't about Obama, who isn't even running. It's about making more progress toward a functioning democracy for all, or less progress, and we have two viable DEM candidates claiming they can help. If we lose focus and make it all about perception,, it's to everyone's detriment. So we had best take a hard look at policies and be substantive in how we evaluate the candidates.

 

1StrongBlackMan

(31,849 posts)
34. NO ...
Sun Feb 14, 2016, 11:42 AM
Feb 2016

You can parse all you want, but the fact remains that Sanders' claim that he'll do better on race relations than Barack Obama BY GIVING BLACK (YOUTH) JOBS SO THEY WON'T BE HANGING OUT ON CORNERS was arrogant, insulting, and likely false - and was surely not lost on a constituency he desperately needs.

azurnoir

(45,850 posts)
51. No he did not because that was not the question in the first place Obama wasn't mentioned
Sun Feb 14, 2016, 12:01 PM
Feb 2016

here is the question with Bernie's reply in full

Asked by PBS debate moderator Judy Woodruff if "race relations would be better under a Sanders presidency than they've been," the Vermont senator replied, "Absolutely."

"Because what we will do is say, instead of giving tax breaks to millionaires, we are going to create millions of jobs for low-income kids so they're not hanging out on street corners," he said. "We're going to make sure that those kids stay in school or are able get a college education. So I think that when you give low-income kids, African-American, white, Latino kids, the opportunities to get their lives together, they are not going to end up in jail. They're going to end up in the productive economy, which is where we want them."


http://www.cnn.com/2016/02/11/politics/bernie-sanders-race-relations-democratic-debate/]

photogate fell on it's face so now we have this
 

1StrongBlackMan

(31,849 posts)
57. That doesn't change anything ...
Sun Feb 14, 2016, 12:16 PM
Feb 2016

and displays stunning lack of awareness to say ... and even more to defend.

You do realize that well educated, highly compensated Black people, young and old, that have never been to jail, experience race related problems in America. Right?

azurnoir

(45,850 posts)
62. Haven't I already said that? a reminder for you
Sun Feb 14, 2016, 12:23 PM
Feb 2016

Star Member azurnoir (42,516 posts)
28. well first off COGIC is Church of G-d in Christ

https://www.facebook.com/ChurchOfGodInChrist/

and it is that church going Black demographic I think Ben Carson was supposed to be tapping into, it didn't work

as to excusing Hillary's comment I'm going to go off into admittedly dangerous ground here because I'm white however to my observation it is because for my some of that Church going Black demographic she wasn't about their sons she was talking about the others the ghetto folk the gang bangers ect, there are divisions within the Black community that rarely if ever get addressed on a message board such as DU

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1187&pid=39168

so yes I do realize that and have seen it firsthand, albeit I did live in what could be called the ghetto

azurnoir

(45,850 posts)
64. another question for you ever hear of a blogger named LaShawn Barber?
Sun Feb 14, 2016, 12:27 PM
Feb 2016

my first before DU political debates online were on her site, occasionaly here I have moments that could almost be called Deja Vu

 

farleftlib

(2,125 posts)
39. Yes and his actions have consistently backed this up
Sun Feb 14, 2016, 11:50 AM
Feb 2016

Great post from someone who's been on the receiving end.

Admiral Loinpresser

(3,859 posts)
43. You don't post much,
Sun Feb 14, 2016, 11:53 AM
Feb 2016

but when you do, I consistently gain insight. Really appreciate your thoughts. Please keep it up.

jonestonesusa

(880 posts)
107. Thanks! Primary season is upon us.
Sun Feb 14, 2016, 05:11 PM
Feb 2016

I enjoy commenting and reading commens then. See you around the forums and thanks for the encouragement.

boston bean

(36,221 posts)
40. That does not fit the anti Obama narrative.
Sun Feb 14, 2016, 11:52 AM
Feb 2016

See, Bernie likes to look like he is above the fray. But when you scratch just the surface, he knows his supporters don't like Obama. So, he aint gonna do anything to alienate them.

Admiral Loinpresser

(3,859 posts)
45. That's false.
Sun Feb 14, 2016, 11:55 AM
Feb 2016

There are all kinds of Obama supporters in the Bernie coalition. He wouldn't have more elected delegates than HRC right now if your premise were true. It's laughable, really.

 

bravenak

(34,648 posts)
87. What does this mean?
Sun Feb 14, 2016, 01:56 PM
Feb 2016
He was referring to comments made by Sanders in Thursday night's debate, when the Vermont senator was asked whether race relations would be better with him in the White House than they are now.

“Absolutely," Sanders replied, "because what we will do is instead of give tax breaks to millionaires, we will create millions of jobs for low-income kids so they are not hanging out on street corners."


I am offended.

Response to bravenak (Reply #87)

TCJ70

(4,387 posts)
99. It means...
Sun Feb 14, 2016, 02:44 PM
Feb 2016

...he wants to address the systemic economic inequality that disproportionately affects minorities. Sound good?

Response to wyldwolf (Original post)

Bonobo

(29,257 posts)
6. They are hitting this meme too hard and overplaying their hand.
Sun Feb 14, 2016, 10:30 AM
Feb 2016

I predict a backlash soon.

It is becoming too obvious.

Swiftboating properly requires a bit more subtlety.

 

Wilms

(26,795 posts)
7. Mayor Kasim Reed's constituents include:
Sun Feb 14, 2016, 10:31 AM
Feb 2016

snip

The most recent round of fundraising show 240 separate donations from a who's-who of Atlanta business and politics. Frank Blake, chief executive of Home Depot, gave $1,000. Carol Tomé, the company's chief financial officer, gave the same amount, with the company's political action committee chipping in $2,500.

John Brock, chairman and CEO of soft drinks bottler Coca-Cola Enterprises, gave $2,500. Keisha Lance Bottoms, a member of Atlanta's City Council, gave $1,000.

snip

http://www.ajc.com/news/news/local/atlanta-mayor-kasim-reeds-campaign-raises-280000-h/nQQmg/


Here's the list.

http://media.ethics.ga.gov/search/Campaign/Campaign_ByContributions_RFR.aspx?NameID=4982&FilerID=C2008000654&CDRID=53241&Name=Reed,%20Mohammed%20Kasim&Year=2011&Report=December%2031st%20-%20Non-Election%20Year

Poor guys hands are tied.

casperthegm

(643 posts)
13. They can say what they want, but it doesn't change the facts
Sun Feb 14, 2016, 10:34 AM
Feb 2016

It's unfortunate that these comments are getting any press, but everyone has the right to free speech, as uninformed as that speech may be. And when I say uninformed, it's not to be petty, but it's well established(after a round of misinformation) that Bernie has been involved in the civil rights movement from as far back as his college days. It's up to us though to keep (respectfully) pushing back on those who minimize the work that Sanders has done.

casperthegm

(643 posts)
21. He's always fought for the underdog
Sun Feb 14, 2016, 10:48 AM
Feb 2016

And under-represented people. He said as much when Anderson Cooper asked him about the time he was arrested for his opposition to the U of Chicago's housing policies. And let's not forget that Hillary was a republican working for Goldwater back in the 60's, so there's plenty of room for some back and forth if we want to go down that road. I suppose it comes down to who we feel is the more authentic candidate when it comes to this issue and others. The choice is clear for me.

Empowerer

(3,900 posts)
26. Support isn't fighting
Sun Feb 14, 2016, 11:10 AM
Feb 2016

And the "but but but HILLARY" gambit is worn out. We're not talking about Hillary, we're talkng about Bernie.

casperthegm

(643 posts)
30. Wrong.
Sun Feb 14, 2016, 11:18 AM
Feb 2016

There are two candidates and therefore there should be every expectation to do a fair side by side comparison. And that's where Clinton fans go off the rails. If you want to go head to head on the issues Clinton loses on both results and authenticity.

Her position on Keystone (or lack of one). She waited until the same week that Obama made his decision before announcing where she stood. That's not standing up for the environment. That's politics.

Wall Street money. Whether it's impression or reality, it's there and it can't help but make me wonder. Generally speaking, it's hard to imagine the banks and Wall Street throwing all of that money at her and saying "here you go, we don't expect anything in return." Bernie said as much in the last debate.

Her opposition to Glass Stegall. Though I do recall her telling the banks to "cut it out." Thanks Hillary. Bernie has been in support of it all along.

Her Iraq vote. You may be sick of hearing about it but it's a big deal. It was poor judgement and lack of foresight. Sanders saw that it would destabilize the region. And it did. Now we not have the legacy of the Iraq war, we have the current ISIS situation.

Speaking of that, there is the no-fly zone proposal. Another poor foreign policy decision. What happens when Russian jets cross that line? You have to be prepared for that and I don't see it. Bernie opposes the no-fly zone.

The email and server investigation by the FBI. Sorry, it's real. It very well could end up being nothing in the end, but what if it's not? What if it drags on until the general election and then she gets indicted? Then you end up with a republican in the White House.

Gay marriage. You can see how she has flip flopped over the years, as confirmed via politifact. Another change based on the political winds.

All of this and more have led me to distrust her judgement and her authenticity. I look forward to hearing what your thoughts are regarding the actual issues listed here.

 

Doctor_J

(36,392 posts)
18. The Clinton campaign has adopted the republican meme that "liberals are the real racists"
Sun Feb 14, 2016, 10:43 AM
Feb 2016

I don't see any of the lies and mudslinging doing much damage to Bernie. They are just trying to keep turnout down. Which will also fail BTW

sellitman

(11,607 posts)
22. Bingo!
Sun Feb 14, 2016, 10:51 AM
Feb 2016

I've noticed this online and this is the first time I've seen it expressed.

The Clinton Campaign needs to stop this ASAP!

 

SoLeftIAmRight

(4,883 posts)
23. Yes - a Liberal Polish Jew knows nothing about being discounted.
Sun Feb 14, 2016, 10:59 AM
Feb 2016

I am going to support the Blonde haired - Blue eyed - Goldwater Girl - she understands what what real struggle means.

 

SoLeftIAmRight

(4,883 posts)
29. Get your two for - Vote Hillary and welcome Kissinger into the white house.
Sun Feb 14, 2016, 11:16 AM
Feb 2016

I think you will enjoy the results.

ladjf

(17,320 posts)
28. I disagree with the Mayor. I heard exactly what Bernie said.
Sun Feb 14, 2016, 11:14 AM
Feb 2016

When asked would race relationships improve under his (Bernie's) administration, he simply answered "yes".

That is not disrespectful of dismissive.

ladjf

(17,320 posts)
50. Yes, he said the remark about tax breaks for millionaires which is a criticism
Sun Feb 14, 2016, 12:00 PM
Feb 2016

of an Obama policy but, in my opinion , short of being disrespectful IMO.



 

1StrongBlackMan

(31,849 posts)
54. You left out the "So Black (Youth) won't be hanging out on street corners" part ...
Sun Feb 14, 2016, 12:09 PM
Feb 2016

That was/is the disrespectful, dismissive ... and just plain wrong part.

ladjf

(17,320 posts)
75. The quote:
Sun Feb 14, 2016, 01:14 PM
Feb 2016

Absolutelyy," Sanders replied, "because what we will do is instead of give tax breaks to millionaires, we will create millions of jobs for low-income kids so they are not hanging out on street corners."

I left out "So Black (Youth)" because it wasn't in the quote.

Apparently our main disagreement is that you feel that a criticism of any of Obama's actions or statements is disrespectful and dismissive. I do not think that one criticism was either disrespectful or dismissive.


 

1StrongBlackMan

(31,849 posts)
32. LOL ...
Sun Feb 14, 2016, 11:33 AM
Feb 2016
“Absolutely," Sanders replied, "because what we will do is instead of give tax breaks to millionaires, we will create millions of jobs for low-income kids so they are not hanging out on street corners."


I don't know if I can, or better, should comment on that.

jonestonesusa

(880 posts)
37. Definitely comment if you want. I will.
Sun Feb 14, 2016, 11:48 AM
Feb 2016

It's a cringe worthy line.

It's part of the internalized racism that is embedded in US culture.

It doesn't specifically mention an ethnic group, but in US politics we fill it in as black.

I think the line deserves criticism.

I still support the value of an infrastructure-based public works program, which Sanders offers in his platform. Clinton doesn't.

I'm glad that Sanders shows up at forums such as the recent one in North Minneapolis to engage directly with black citizens, take his criticism, learn, and move forward.

Empowerer

(3,900 posts)
63. Why would Sanders answer a question about race relations by referring to getting kids jobs if he
Sun Feb 14, 2016, 12:24 PM
Feb 2016

wasn't referring to black kids? If he was talking about kids of all races, what would that have to do with race relations?

No one filled in a blank for Bernie - he'd already filled it in quite nicely and made himself crystal clear.

Empowerer

(3,900 posts)
38. Because if you just get jobs for the millions of black kids hanging out on corners-all will be well
Sun Feb 14, 2016, 11:50 AM
Feb 2016

Tone-deaf...

But we're not and we can HEAR you, you know ...

CentralMass

(15,265 posts)
66. So are you advocating for policies like bailing out wall St,
Sun Feb 14, 2016, 12:35 PM
Feb 2016

After their greed and corruption took the country to its kneestill? Or extending the Bush tax cuts ( that would have sunsetted automatically in 2010 if the President had not lobbied his lame duck Congress to extend them ?

How about cuts to things like the LIHEAP program while millions of American americans were losing their jobs.

http://thehill.com/policy/energy-environment/201287-as-winter-approaches-congress-cuts-funds-for-home-heating-assistance
"While the omnibus spending bill cuts funding for LIHEAP by 25 percent, President Obama floated even bigger cuts to the program in his fiscal year 2012 budget proposal, proposing to fund the program at $2.5 billion.

Congress greatly increased LIHEAP funding to about $5.1 billion in 2008, when energy prices were high. Obama, in February, said it was time to reduce the program to a “more sustainable level.”

There are many more examples. If criticising those and other harmful policy decisions is wrong, count me in on being wrong. We have something like 46 million people living in poverty and an overwhelming disproportionate share of African American children living in poverty and we have had no obvious focus on addressing this issue from this President .

Empowerer

(3,900 posts)
68. What does any of that have to do with race relations, i.e., relations between the races?
Sun Feb 14, 2016, 01:00 PM
Feb 2016

You seem to have the same problem Sanders does ...

CentralMass

(15,265 posts)
82. The topic of this thread is regarding a question asked
Sun Feb 14, 2016, 01:47 PM
Feb 2016

To Bernie Sanders about if race relations would improve under his administration and he answered it with an Affirmative with his proposed economic policies as the means. Yet his words were twisted by a self serving politician as an affront to the President

Many of us like the President personally but that doesn't mean we have to lie his policies. Which have catered to corporate interests. Wall St. , and the weathy. IMO because the Democratic party has made that the new :center". Many of us do not agree.

It his clearly Bernie Sanders belief and the.belief of many of us who support him That levelling the economic playing field and addressing income inequality is good for all Americans., particularly those who are the most deeply affected by it. While it won't solve all the isdues, it it is step one in addressing them.

We are losing ground. The democratic losses at the stste evel over the last 8 years are stagering.. the number of people in the middle class hsd slipped under 50%. Incomes are stagnant, poverty is at its highest since the civil rights era.

The national debt went from ~$7.5 trillion to over $18 trillion. That debt is significant in that unless we elect different leader's , the cost of that debt is going to be taken out if our hides This 8 years was the fulfilment of "Starve thr Beast" . We went from a gross debt to GDP ratio of 72% to we'll over 100%.

If you look at the budget trajectory there is a storm looming with Social Security and Medicare hitting critically mass and if we don't ditch this Republican lite leadership we are going to be scrwed.


Empowerer

(3,900 posts)
100. Your response exemplifies the problem we've been describing
Sun Feb 14, 2016, 02:52 PM
Feb 2016

The topic is race relations, but you, like Sanders, keeps pivoting to economic policy.

We have repeatedly pointed out that this approach is not resonating - and the reason his message is not resonating with blacks is that most of us don't see race relations, racial justice and discrimination as a mere subset of economic inequality, but you won't llisten. Instead, you just keep repeating the same tone-deaf message as if you think if you say it often and loudly enough, we'll come to our collective senses and see the light.



CentralMass

(15,265 posts)
104. Your responses make it clear that you don't really want
Sun Feb 14, 2016, 03:17 PM
Feb 2016

to entertain any opinions other than your own.

Lets cut this to it's essence. Bernie sanders comments being twisted by a politician as being an attack on the President.

Please explan where this occurred?

Admiral Loinpresser

(3,859 posts)
35. There's a truth teller in Atlanta who disagrees:
Sun Feb 14, 2016, 11:46 AM
Feb 2016

Killer Mike. He doesn't spew out bullshit, he just puts out the truth about Bernie's positions.

Empowerer

(3,900 posts)
41. A black man says something you don't like, so trout out another black man to tell us he's wrong
Sun Feb 14, 2016, 11:52 AM
Feb 2016

I see what you did there.

Empowerer

(3,900 posts)
58. Thank you!
Sun Feb 14, 2016, 12:17 PM
Feb 2016

We love it when white folks decide for us which black people are more worthy of our consideration. We really appreciate it when you pick our leaders, role models, and influencers for us because it's so much easier than thinking for ourselves, which is really a burden since we're so naive and don't have the intelligence, savvy or information to figure it out for ourselves.

 

1StrongBlackMan

(31,849 posts)
53. The have a great template o follow ...
Sun Feb 14, 2016, 12:05 PM
Feb 2016

the right have been doing it for ... like ... forever (See: Willie Lynch through Thomas Sowell)

Admiral Loinpresser

(3,859 posts)
73. Really?
Sun Feb 14, 2016, 01:13 PM
Feb 2016

I think that is some weak-ass tea, but go ahead and take the last snark, because I have better things to do.

uponit7771

(90,347 posts)
95. Yes he does, Mike camparing Obama to a "master" is not only BS it's stupid racializaed flamebaite
Sun Feb 14, 2016, 02:24 PM
Feb 2016

... Bigga is another overt Obama Basher ... no credibility

 

DefenseLawyer

(11,101 posts)
59. As I've said for months now
Sun Feb 14, 2016, 12:18 PM
Feb 2016

This election is going to come down to who has the endorsement of the mayor of Atlanta.

 

KingCharlemagne

(7,908 posts)
61. Thereby illustrating the total, utter bankruptcy of the Democratic Party establishment. While
Sun Feb 14, 2016, 12:23 PM
Feb 2016

Sanders was being arrested with CORE while leading protests against racially segregated housing, Hillary was a fucking Goldwater Girl.

FFS

Empowerer

(3,900 posts)
72. And then after graduating from college, he retired from the movement, moved to Vermont, and
Sun Feb 14, 2016, 01:12 PM
Feb 2016

over the next half century often spoke out and voted for civil rights for African Americans and even, on a few occasions, did a little bit more than that.

RiffRandell

(5,909 posts)
67. He's not so squeaky clean allowing his brother to get away
Sun Feb 14, 2016, 12:52 PM
Feb 2016

with illegal behavior so I don't take the guy seriously. He is a jackass, and those statements prove it imo.

ATLANTA (CBS46) -
A CBS Atlanta exclusive investigation has revealed that the brother of Atlanta Mayor Kasim Reed has been illegally driving city vehicles for several years.

Our undercover investigation caught Tracy Reed leaving Atlanta City Hall and driving off in a government vehicle in October.

Driving a city vehicle shouldn't be a problem for Tracy Reed, because he works for the city. He's worked in the office of Contract Compliance fore 12 years.

But Tracy Reed shouldn't be driving a city vehicle or any other vehicle. That's because according to the Georgia Bureau of Investigation, his driver's license expired in September of 2006.

CBS Atlanta's Tony McNary caught up with Tracy Reed outside his office and asked him the Tough Questions about why he was driving without a valid driver's license.

"You have to take everything up with our communication department," said Reed.


Read more: http://www.cbs46.com/story/15930892/mayors-brother-driving-city-vehicles-illegally#ixzz40A5z1AeG

Empowerer

(3,900 posts)
74. Here we go
Sun Feb 14, 2016, 01:14 PM
Feb 2016

The popularly elected and popular mayor of a predominantly black city is now an unreliable "jackass" because he criticized He Who Shall Never Be Questioned.

And y'all wonder why black folks aren't Feeling the Bern in record numbers?

Empowerer

(3,900 posts)
108. My - what a great outreach strategy
Sun Feb 14, 2016, 05:14 PM
Feb 2016

Tell people whose support he needs and who are much closer to the issue than he is the same thing over and over again and when they tell him that it doesn't make sense, you respond with, "that's just too bad."

And you wonder why he's not getting any traction?

RiffRandell

(5,909 posts)
110. Traction?
Sun Feb 14, 2016, 08:20 PM
Feb 2016

Last I saw he had a lot of 'traction' in NH.

Maybe he'll get even more if people interrupt him on stage and start screaming.

Maybe OSW supporters should do that to Hillary to get some 'traction'.



BillZBubb

(10,650 posts)
76. The Swiftboating continues. Team Hillary dirty tricks.
Sun Feb 14, 2016, 01:16 PM
Feb 2016

How right wing of her. But desperate times right?

Jefferson23

(30,099 posts)
81. Bernie said, better..not end. I would hope any candidate would work to make the issue better.
Sun Feb 14, 2016, 01:38 PM
Feb 2016

Are we all behind Obama's TPP now too? Is that what we're doing?

Disrespectful and dismissive? What an amazingly cynical call to authority
to persuade SC voters. May work for some, but I doubt enough will
fall for it.

 

bravenak

(34,648 posts)
83. Ok, what's up with THIS?:
Sun Feb 14, 2016, 01:53 PM
Feb 2016
He was referring to comments made by Sanders in Thursday night's debate, when the Vermont senator was asked whether race relations would be better with him in the White House than they are now.

“Absolutely," Sanders replied, "because what we will do is instead of give tax breaks to millionaires, we will create millions of jobs for low-income kids so they are not hanging out on street corners."


Umm? Heal race relations by making sure THEY are not hanging out on street corners, who is THEY? I hope he is not blaming racism on black kids hanging on street corners without a job. I hope that's not what that meant.

Somebody explain to me how black kids 'hanging on street corners' is not offensive? And the idea that blacks not having jobs for 'low income kids' is in any way the source of the race problem?

I think that I am gonna keep this in mind, what he said right here and think long and hard about what the hell thats supposed to mean.

Response to bravenak (Reply #83)

Autumn

(45,106 posts)
84. “Yeah, it’s rigged now because you don’t have a president that’s a change-maker.”
Sun Feb 14, 2016, 01:54 PM
Feb 2016

Bill Clinton Friday, campaigning for Hillary Clinton

http://nypost.com/2016/02/14/bill-clinton-downplays-obama-were-all-mixed-race-people/
Clinton credited Obama for doing “a better job than he has gotten credit for,” but chided the current president for doing little to end Washington gridlock.

“A lot of people say you don’t understand — it’s rigged now,” he said. “Yeah, it’s rigged now because you don’t have a president that’s a change-maker.”

He praised Hillary Clinton for being “the best change-maker I’ve ever known.”


I wonder if he or you think that those comments are consistent with a dismissive and disrespectful attitude towards President Obama?

Let Bills words sink in "you don’t have a president that’s a change-maker.”
 

HooptieWagon

(17,064 posts)
85. Why should anyone pay attention to the mayor's statement?
Sun Feb 14, 2016, 01:55 PM
Feb 2016

He has already come out in endorsement of Clinton, so anything he says is heavily biased in that direction.
Secondly, Sanders answer to the question is correct. If Sanders accomplishes anything to address AA issues, it will be more than Obama who has done nothing.

 

Cheese Sandwich

(9,086 posts)
98. He's in the same league as Claire McCaskill. Hillary's pit bulls.
Sun Feb 14, 2016, 02:34 PM
Feb 2016

Pit bull is a metaphor. This is not literally calling them animals. They are like pit bulls because of the way they attack, which seems to be pretty viciously.

 

workinclasszero

(28,270 posts)
101. Let me get this right....
Sun Feb 14, 2016, 03:00 PM
Feb 2016

Bernie thinks low income kids are thugs, criminals, scum etc and he is dismissive and disrespectful towards President Obama whom the called to be primaried.

Damn...


That's not gonna play well outside of New Hampshire Bernie.

 

AOR

(692 posts)
102. Kasim Reed another of the many pillars of "saving black communities"...
Sun Feb 14, 2016, 03:02 PM
Feb 2016

just a little sampling of the laughable hypocrisy and corruption of the Black bourgeois political class hacks like Kasim Reed and Hakeem Jeffries.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

http://blackagendareport.com/content/occupy-atlanta-vs-kasim-reed-black-misleadership-class-and-one-percent

Occupy Atlanta VS Kasim Reed, the Black Misleadership Class and the One Percent

-- Bruce A. Dixon

(Snips)

"Nobody should doubt that Atlanta mayor Kasim Reed is firmly in the pocket of the one percent. It's old news. It's a choice he and leaders of the local black misleadership class made more than a generation ago. The clique of black political leaders who came to power with Atlanta mayor Maynard Jackson in 1973, and who still hold sway today have never been friends or advocates of black or white working people. Though they owed, and still owe their offices, careers and personal fortunes to the political victories won by the Freedom Movement, Atlanta's black misleadership class has rarely if ever lined up with black and working people when it came to economic justice."


"Shirley Franklin came in after Campbell with a campaign of sweeping privatizations of parks, city services, parking and more. But with Atlanta's newly privatized water works pumping rust colored mud through the taps of tens of thousands of Atlanta residents (including wealthy white ones) the drive to privatize everything in sight had to be slowed. Still, Shirley Franklin completed the demolition of nearly all Atlanta's public housing, driving tens of thousands of poor black Atlantans from the city. Like Andy Young, Franklin also cashed in after leaving City Hall, as a consultant for the telecom industry, and pushing the privatization of schools and services of all kinds."

"By 2002, after a generation of “Black Mecca” and black political leadership, the city's poverty rate was in the top five of metro areas nationwide. One in three black Atlanta children is in poverty, even after the expulsion of tens of thousands of poor Atlantans when their neighborhoods were demolished."

"The current mayor is firmly within the tradition of his predecessors. Kasim Reed is a corporate lawyer for the rich and racist. He is a man who has never fought for or believed in justice for ordinary people.As a state senator in 2006 he introduced vicious anti-immigrant legislation that paralleled similar racist bills passed this year in Georgia and Alabama. As a mayoral candidate, Reed called himself “a civil rights lawyer,” leaving out the key detail that his practice represented the corporations that violated civil rights, not the black, brown, elderly or disabled plaintiffs whose rights had been violated. The day before being sworn in as mayor Reed promised local business leaders to deal with downtown “panhandlers” in what he called a “very muscular” fashion. The term “panhandlers” is shorthand for homeless black males, even though any sociologist or person who works with the homeless will tell you that only white homeless men can beg on the street. Unless they are very elderly or handicapped, black men are considered inherently too inherently “threatening” to be successful street beggars. The convention and tourist industry seems to want black men, especially homeless black men out of downtown Atlanta. Hence an obsession for Kasim Reed, and if his wealthy real estate backers is closing down the large homeless shleter at Peachtree& Pine, at the edge of downtown Atlanta only a mile from the site of Occupy Atlanta where hundreds of men, many of them gainfully employed, sleep every night."

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
http://blackagendareport.com/atl-shady-land-deal-tyler-perry


Atlanta Mayor Kasim Reed To Give Half Square Mile of Public Land to Tyler Perry on Fake Job Claims, No Public Input

--Bruce Dixon

Atlanta Mayor Kasim Reed wants to give Tyler Perry a half square mile of public land at a ridiculously low price based on fake job creation predictions with no public scrutiny or input. Tyler's existing Atlanta studios have had little or no positive impact on the economic life of their surrounding community. Once again the black political class proves itself every bit as myopic, greedy and anti-democratic as their white counterparts.

(Snips)

"Nobody celebrates themselves more tirelessly and uncritically than black America's wealthy and empowered political class of millionaire entertainers, business types, preachers and politicians. Unfortunately, black folks outside that charmed circle also tend to applaud the glittering wealth of black celebrities without bothering to look at where that wealth comes from."

"Last year in Black Agenda Report, we talked about near-billionaire former NBA star Junior Bridgman, who owns more than a hundred Applebees and Wendys restaurants, and spends millions each year lobbying Congress and state legislatures to keep his workers' wages nice and low. There's Earvin “Magic” Johnson, who's a major partner in Sodexo, a firm that privatizes food service in prisons, public schools and charter schools, and janitorial service in schools as well, making tens of millions a year relentlessly cutting jobs, wages and quality of service. And in Atlanta, there's Tyler Perry."

"Atlanta Mayor Kasim Reed is trying to rush through a deal with as little public scrutiny or input as possible that will give Tyler Perry more than a half square mile of public land – 331 prime acres of former military base less than four miles from downtown Atlanta, for a mere $30 million, to build new production studios and whatever else he might want to do. If Atlanta doesn't hurry up and and give Perry this land, Reed says, Perry might take the 8,000 new jobs he claims his studio might create somewhere else, like neighboring Douglass county where Perry reportedly owns more than 1,000 acres. Never mind the fact that Perry's existing Atlanta studios have been sketchily constructed and maintained, and had little or no positive economic impact on their surrounding neighborhood."

"Atlanta mayors have a tradition of lying about how many jobs will be created when they give public resources and land to their friends. Previous Atlanta Mayor Shirley Franklin claimed her Atlanta Beltline boondoggle would create 40,000 temporary and 30,000 permanent new jobs if only Atlanta would divert $140 million away from the public schools every year for twenty-some years. Mayor Reed absurdly claims Tyler Perry's new studio will create 8,000 new jobs. In the real world a studio the size of Perry's will use a tenth, a twentieth or less of 331 acres, and most of the 800 or fewer– not 8,000 jobs there will be professional and managerial folks already working for Tyler Perry."

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
http://blackagendareport.com/content/black-politics-over-black-politicians-no-longer-believe-social-justice-possible

--Bruce Dixon

Black Politics Is Over: Black Politicians No Longer Believe Social Justice Is Possible

(Snips)

"If the black elite can't stop gentrification, they can at least get paid. Thousands of black politicians and ministers were heavily engaged in peddling sub-prime mortgages to black people, after failing to protect their previous neighborhoods from demolition. If the black elite won't help us oppose wars, they can at least get paid. The last two Congressional Black Caucus legislative summits have featured numerous workshops on how to do business with the Pentagon and Homeland Security, but next to none on how to make the antiwar, pro-peace sentiments of our communities heard in anything like their actual number. Black politics, and the black elite that practices them, have become unmoored from democracy. Getting paid, and in some cases, getting elected are all that matters."

"Atlanta, which billed itself as Black Mecca for a generation, is a great illustration of the cynical bankruptcy of the black political elite. Although proudly ruled by a black elite for a generation, and with an unbroken string of black mayors going back to 1973, a full one third of black Atlanta is below the poverty line. The city has the fifth highest rate of black poverty in the nation, surpassed only by Cleveland, Portland, Long Beach and Milwaukee. Atlanta's once-proud Grady Hospital which served all comers in Fulton and Dekalb counties has been privatized, and many of its services ended after state officials withheld its funding to deliberately provoke a “crisis.” A court recently dismissed the cases of dialysis patients who sued Grady hospital when it ended the life-sustaining procedure, because the plaintiffs had died. Thanks to the Belt Line real estate scam, Atlanta's public school revenues have been compromised twenty years into the future to subsidize yuppie shopping and residential construction. Republicans and Dems on the state level, along with the bipartisan chamber of commerce types have been agitating for the state seizure and eventual privatization of MARTA, the regional transportation authority."

"Atlanta's new mayor, Kasim Reed pledged to the chamber of commerce the day before his election that he would deal in a more “muscular” fashion with downtown panhandlers. The new administration is only days old. But Reed was campaign manager to the previous mayor Shirley Franklin. Reed's first major appointment was his pick of Peter Aman as the city's chief operating officer, responsible for overseeing the police, fire, parks, public works and other vital municipal operations. Aman is not a man who knows how to make jobs and justice and transit and education happen in Atlanta neighborhoods. Aman is a partner at the global business consulting firm Bain and Co. Aman wrote the previous mayor's transition report, which called for the “monetization” – a fancy word meaning privatization --- of every city service in sight during Franklin's first term. The only reason it didn't happen was that the highest profile privatization engineered by the black mayor before Franklin unraveled in spectacular fashion in Franklin's first few months."

"Black politics, in the sense of elected officials that work to uplift the black community, is over. It's not over because inequalities are gone, or even lessened much. It's not over because we have achieved anything like economic or social justice. Black politics as we knew it is over because our elected leaders have given up on economic justice, and many of us have given up on them. It's been a long time coming."

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

http://www.blackagendareport.com/movement_needs_to_say_what_it_wants

Demand Nothing, Get Nothing: The Movement Needs to Say What It Wants

--Glen Ford

(Snip)

"A dozen student activists from the Atlanta University Center (#AUCShutItDown) last week put their fists up, shouted “Black Lives Matter” and sang songs at a Democratic Party rally for Hillary Clinton, interrupting the candidate’s litany of lies and thoroughly embarrassing Atlanta mayor Kasim Reed, former mayor Shirley Franklin and Rep. John Lewis, representing the city’s Black Misleadership Class. Clinton seemed surprised and confused. Hadn’t she neutralized that “Black Lives Matter” crowd? Clinton whined that she’d been meeting with #BLM and planned more talks with them. Members of the crowd shouted, “Hillary, Hillary" and “Let her speak.” Loyal Black Democrats formed a shield in front of the war criminal. Congressman Lewis, who is said to be scheming to have Selma’s Edmund Pettus Bridge named after himself, put his arms on a protester’s shoulders, urging them to desist, and the group left shortly afterwards. “I am glad the congressman and the mayor have my back," said Clinton."

“Loyal Black Democrats formed a shield in front of the war criminal.”

"Of course they have her back. The Democratic Party is the greatest impediment to independent, self-determinationist politics in Black America. Its near-hegemonic presence has prevented the emergence of a Black oppositional movement for two generations – which is why it was possible to impose a mass Black incarceration regime so pervasive that one out of eight prisoners on the planet is an African American. Kasim Reed, Shirley Franklin, John Lewis and their ilk facilitated the establishment of the Mass Black Incarceration State."







loyalsister

(13,390 posts)
103. I think a better answer would have been "I don't know"
Sun Feb 14, 2016, 03:11 PM
Feb 2016

But, a rule of political candidacy is to exude confidence. I don't know anyone who is not white who believes race relations have improved under Obama. Immediately after he was elected, bigots began to feel comfortable letting their hateful flags fly. I think it must be a very sad thing for him to know he is sending his girls out into a world that unleashed that wave in response to him.

NurseJackie

(42,862 posts)
109. Sanders has missed many opportunities and somehow keeps making things worse. At this late hour ...
Sun Feb 14, 2016, 05:59 PM
Feb 2016

... I think it's pretty safe to say that HE BLEW IT!!

Latest Discussions»Retired Forums»2016 Postmortem»Atlanta mayor: Sanders 'd...