2016 Postmortem
Related: About this forumI missed the debate. Did Hillary agree to release her transcipts during it?
Or, is she still looking into it? Does she need help to find them?
SHRED
(28,136 posts)Live and Learn
(12,769 posts)Although it's not funny.
InAbLuEsTaTe
(24,122 posts)Bernie & Elizabeth 2016!!!
PoliticAverse
(26,366 posts)elleng
(131,107 posts)MADem
(135,425 posts)Live and Learn
(12,769 posts)If Bernie had transcripts, I am sure he would have no problem releasing them. i am equally sure he never pandered to the bankers like Hillary does.
MADem
(135,425 posts)He never pandered you say...? LOL!
They gave him money because he gave 'em hell!
NanceGreggs
(27,818 posts)And the only people interested in those transcripts are BSers hoping to find a "gotcha" moment just as Bernie is about to face primaries in states where he is far behind HRC.
No one else cares.
Live and Learn
(12,769 posts)What is she afraid of?
NanceGreggs
(27,818 posts)... you should cooperate fully. Failure to do so points to your being guilty of something."
How about if Bernie releases his phone records, text messages, and emails during the time his campaign stole HRC's computer data, used logos of organizations without authorization/permission, posed as union members to gain access to union-restricted areas?
Don't voters have a right to know what he knew, and when he knew it?
I would think those details are far more relevant than Hillary's speeches - which had nothing to do with the present campaign.
cui bono
(19,926 posts)And according to a Hillary friend and supporter Bernie is going to win millions in his lawsuit against the DNC.
Here's a good interview. Go to around 19 minutes in to hear him talking about how what the DNC did to Bernie was improper. And that they backed down because they knew they were wrong.
http://ianmasters.com/content/january-17-bernie-sanders-has-caught-hillary-surprise-could-we-end-spoiled-brats-running-ira
Direct link to audio: http://ianmasters.com/sites/default/files/mp3/bbriefing_2015_01_17a_simon%20rosenberg.mp3
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Live and Learn
(12,769 posts)NanceGreggs
(27,818 posts)On what grounds? He fired his campaign staffers on the grounds that they were guilty of doing what they'd been accused of doing.
So what it's going to be? He fired staffers he knew to be innocent - or by firing them. he admitted they had engaged in wrongdoing that was a fire-worthy offence?
cui bono
(19,926 posts)What the DNC did was unlawful and didn't follow the rules. They had no right to block access and they cost him by limiting his ability to campaign at his fullest potential.
Why do you think Hillary and DWS backed down so quickly after they were roundly criticized for their bizarre handling of the situation? DWS was completely wrong in all her actions. Going to the press instead of dealing with it professionally. Shutting off his access illegally. This has all been hashed out before. She did everything wrong. And it was all done with a bias to favor HRC and attempt to hurt Sanders.
Now go listen. It's actually an interesting interview. Ian Masters is a great journalist who used to work for the BBC. I think you would enjoy his program, and I'm not being sarcastic.
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Live and Learn
(12,769 posts)Live and Learn
(12,769 posts)campaigning? Of course, those switch daily anyway.
NanceGreggs
(27,818 posts)The ones you just dreamed up in your head?
So g'head - state the promises that Hillary made in transcripts you haven't seen.
Live and Learn
(12,769 posts)But, I am quite certain she did make promises to them since nobody pays that kind of money to hear, "Sorry, we 'Can't Do' a thing for you."
NanceGreggs
(27,818 posts)... and pretending you do is rather silly - don't ya think?
"I am quite certain she did make promises to them ..."
Cool. Please cite the transcript passages that support your "certainty".
Live and Learn
(12,769 posts)I am sure you understand.
NanceGreggs
(27,818 posts)Cite the promises she made.
Live and Learn
(12,769 posts)NanceGreggs
(27,818 posts)... I KNOW what's in the transcripts, but I'm not allowed to say?
Live and Learn
(12,769 posts)Hillary does memes, I don't.
NanceGreggs
(27,818 posts)... between "I can't" and "I won't".
She never said "I can't". She's pretty much indicated that she won't.
Nor should she. I know you BSers are hoping to find that smoking gun that will ruin HRC's campaign, thus leading to a clear path for BS to win the nomination.
The smoking gun doesn't exist - and it's a rather desperate move on the part of BSers to hope that there IS a smoking gun - because it's the only way BS gets ahead. Too bad he can't win the nomination on his own merits, but has to hope that something - anything! - will take down the front-runner before he faces primaries in states where he is impossibly behind.
Live and Learn
(12,769 posts)NanceGreggs
(27,818 posts)Provide the links.
senz
(11,945 posts)Isn't that nice?
Hekate
(90,793 posts)Live and Learn
(12,769 posts)Hekate
(90,793 posts)Live and Learn
(12,769 posts)Hekate
(90,793 posts)Not hippie; hipster. Seemed entirely appropriate as a term of approval for my friend NanceGreggs.
For further information, Google is your friend.
Live and Learn
(12,769 posts)But the Clintons would have you in prison for life for such things.
Hekate
(90,793 posts)JURY: This is irony, if anything
Live and Learn
(12,769 posts)senz
(11,945 posts)You are right now making me aware of how quickly time passes, how everything grows distant and dim with the passage of time.
Someday you'll understand. In fact, just because you started such an interesting thread, I'll share a poem that captures a bit of it. It's called "Spring and Fall" and it's by Gerard Manley Hopkins. The speaker is addressing a small child who is sad when the leaves drop in the Fall.
Márgarét, áre you gríeving
Over Goldengrove unleaving?
Leáves like the things of man, you
With your fresh thoughts care for, can you?
Ah! ás the heart grows older
It will come to such sights colder
By and by, nor spare a sigh
Though worlds of wanwood leafmeal lie;
And yet you wíll weep and know why.
Now no matter, child, the name:
Sórrows spríngs áre the same.
Nor mouth had, no nor mind, expressed
What heart heard of, ghost guessed:
It ís the blight man was born for,
It is Margaret you mourn for.
senz
(11,945 posts)was ubiquitous in the late sixties, early seventies.
senz
(11,945 posts)He said so several times, both in the media and in the debate right after the data breach. That was when Hill and the DNC started backing off. Hill even said during the debate that she would like to put it in the past.
Now you think Bernie has something to hide? Not likely, Nance. Not likely.
NanceGreggs
(27,818 posts)... for that "complete and thorough investigation"?
Live and Learn
(12,769 posts)senz
(11,945 posts)For all we know, legal action is proceeding behind the scenes. Or may they may have agreed to drop it.
But last any of us saw, he was pursuing an investigation and she was backing away.
cui bono
(19,926 posts)NanceGreggs
(27,818 posts)... why Mister "I have been wronged" Sanders isn't putting forward any facts as to how he has been wronged.
cui bono
(19,926 posts)Please tell me you are just being purposely obtuse. You can't possibly not understand this.
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NanceGreggs
(27,818 posts)... I believe I am aware of what a lawsuit is.
I am also aware that BS has yet to state how he was wronged by anyone. When you initiate a lawsuit in the midst of a political campaign, saying "wait until this gets to court" is not a viable option.
Either BS has the grounds for a legitimate lawsuit or he doesn't. Which is it?
cui bono
(19,926 posts)to the lists. It impaired his ability to run his campaign efficiently.
You are just being purposefully obtuse or else you need to stop arguing on subjects you are ignorant about.
Listen to that interview I posted. It is a supporter and friend of Hillary's saying how DWS screwed the debate schedule up and the firewall issue. He doesn't go into it in detail but he states his thoughts.
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senz
(11,945 posts)He doesn't play those games; those are Hillary games.
See what you can look forward to if Hill wins the nom and GE? A dramatic White House. An uproar a day! At least it wouldn't be boring, right?
NanceGreggs
(27,818 posts)... in this primary campaign. But given DU's 85% to 90% make up, I'd just be inviting a "hide"by a jury of BS supporters, wouldn't I?
senz
(11,945 posts)I'm too sleepy to continue.
NanceGreggs
(27,818 posts)... you'll never "hear" on DU - because the 85% of BS supporters here are in control of what gets said what gets hidden.
So whatever you "hear" is always going to be what one group of people have to say.
Maybe you're happy with that. Most people aren't - which explains DU's current lack of traffic.
Live and Learn
(12,769 posts)NanceGreggs
(27,818 posts)Sweet Jesus, is this another one of those CT theories?
Live and Learn
(12,769 posts)NanceGreggs
(27,818 posts)... why hasn't he come forward with the "facts" that prove he's been wronged?
And how does he explain firing staffers who were completely innocent of wrongdoing?
Live and Learn
(12,769 posts)Voice for Peace
(13,141 posts)There was no evidence of theft by Sanders' campaign.
50-50 speculation of theft by/from both sides; w a bonus smokescreen/panick attack from DWS. Never proof of any theft.
Has lying come back by popular demand?
NanceGreggs
(27,818 posts)... despite there being "no evidence" of any wrongdoing on their part?
Is that really your final answer?
Live and Learn
(12,769 posts)I guess you don't care about that. Hillary certainly never did. But then, rules don't really apply to the rich do they?
Live and Learn
(12,769 posts)InAbLuEsTaTe
(24,122 posts)Bernie & Elizabeth 2016!!!
NanceGreggs
(27,818 posts)InAbLuEsTaTe
(24,122 posts)NanceGreggs
(27,818 posts)I just point that out, because you obviously haven't noticed.
Live and Learn
(12,769 posts)NanceGreggs
(27,818 posts)... is about Hillary releasing speech transcripts. So why is Kissinger being brought up - other than to change the topic?
Live and Learn
(12,769 posts)NanceGreggs
(27,818 posts)It seems rather obvious why BS supporters constantly want/need to change the subject.
Live and Learn
(12,769 posts)senz
(11,945 posts)NanceGreggs
(27,818 posts)So this whole thread is about someone missing the debate?
What would the point of such a thread be? Are we all meant to opine on the fact that someone missed the debate?
What are we supposed to say? "Sorry you missed it"?
The OP includes a reference to HRC releasing transcripts. Are we supposed to ignore that? If so, why was it posted as part of the OP?
Live and Learn
(12,769 posts)It really isn't that hard. I am sure you CAN get it if you try.
senz
(11,945 posts)There may very well be old DUers still wandering around in earlier versions of the website...
Live and Learn
(12,769 posts)NanceGreggs
(27,818 posts)... "I missed the debate. Did Hillary agree to release her transcipts during it?"
If deflection away from that topic was not deemed necessary, a sub-thread changing the topic would also not have been deemed necessary.
Live and Learn
(12,769 posts)2pooped2pop
(5,420 posts)A gotcha moment which is why we will never see them. A corporation does not pat anyone to come and tell them to cut it out.
They pay you to come make a positive speech on them so that they can put some money in to your account so that it looks legit.
dreamnightwind
(4,775 posts)Here, I'll help her out:
Live and Learn
(12,769 posts)cui bono
(19,926 posts)Then anonymous hacked her teleprompter and she started reading one of them to the crowd.
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Live and Learn
(12,769 posts)senz
(11,945 posts)Purveyor
(29,876 posts)Live and Learn
(12,769 posts)cui bono
(19,926 posts)Cuz I see her doing that A LOT.
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chillfactor
(7,584 posts)no? didn't think so.
cui bono
(19,926 posts)No? Didn't think so.
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Hekate
(90,793 posts)....about these things, and when he knew it.
You just keep pushing that bogus meme about Hillary, and you might find a startling amount of pushback.
JURY: Post is in context of thread about Hillary's "transcripts of speeches," and whether this nonissue should have been inserted into the debate tonight. Some of us have been asking for Bernie's records to be released simultaneously -- indeed for ALL candidates, especially GOP, but the focus always comes back to just the one Democrat. It seems relevant to mention that there might be pushback.
cui bono
(19,926 posts)It's because she got paid a LOT of money to make those speeches. She got paid by Goldman Sachs and the health insurance industry mostly. They play a large part in the problems of this country. Remember the crash in 2007 that we are still recovering from? Now, there is talk of regulating banks better, there is talk of breaking them up. This talk is not coming from Hillary, it's coming from Bernie.
Hillary has shown in the past that donations can sway her 'opinion' on issues/bills (bankruptcy bill for one). So it stands to reason that these extremely large amounts of money are being paid for a reason. Therefore, we would like to know what she said in those speeches to them. Especially after that comment she made about... something about it's not fair that they get all the blame and the people who got foreclosed on get none. It's important for voters to know if the money will buy them influence. Generally people give money to politicians they know will carry their water.
Now, you mention "ALL candidates, especially GOP". Why do you even bring up GOP candidates? This is a Democratic Primary happening now. It doesn't matter what the GOP said, unless of course you want to deflect from HRC's speech content and make up a non-sense reason why she won't release her transcripts. Any GOP speech transcripts are a non-issue at this point, so for her to make that excuse that she will do it if ALL candidates do it is incredibly lame and insulting to the American people.
What records of Bernie's are you asking to be released? Speech transcripts? You mean like the ones where he made just over $1800 dollars (no, I didn't miss any zeroes) and donated that money to charity? What kind of influence do you think zero money can buy? That is a complete non-issue.
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Hekate
(90,793 posts)....an endless fishing expedition aimed at taking down just one person.
JURY: This is my personal opinion, for which I believe there is some basis -- but my opinion nonetheless.
Live and Learn
(12,769 posts)Hillary's did. Let's just call for all transcripts that were made.
Hekate
(90,793 posts)As for "ego" determining the existence of transcripts -- those are simply the notes one speaks from. I'm active in my own community, and in teaching classes, speaking before the County Board of Supervisors, the School Board, and Veterans' groups, I use prepared notes. They ensure that I cover all the points I want to cover (did I remember to say thank you?) and that I don't ramble past my allotted time. I add pencil marks to pace my delivery.
It's not a big thing and it's not a mystery.
Bernie does ramble -- extensively. He repeats himself often. Perhaps he never uses prepared notes. I don't know. How can we know unless we demand that he produce them?
We need all his emails relating to the data breach as well. That business with the campaign staffers who pretended to be union members and/or hotel employees to gain unauthorized access -- there's got to be an electronic trail of how that idea was hatched. It's critically important that the American people know all of this, get to read the raw material, so that we can judge for ourselves.
It's time to demand this information from Bernie in the name of transparency. If he is innocent, then he has nothing to fear from this exposure.
JURY: This is a discussion. I am illustrating a point for comparison, not accusing anybody of anything.
Live and Learn
(12,769 posts)Hekate
(90,793 posts)JURY: That there is a DU smilie.
Live and Learn
(12,769 posts)cui bono
(19,926 posts)If you tell me perhaps I can explain this in a better way so that you will understand it.
In the primary each party runs against only people from the same party. So it makes no difference what the other party candidate's are beholden to at this time. We only have to choose from the Dems now. Besides, we already know the GOP are all puppets.
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Live and Learn
(12,769 posts)Live and Learn
(12,769 posts)taking donations from Super-Pacs, taking huge sums of money to increase her personal wealth for speaking fees to bankers, throwing people off of welfare and into the streets or prison, hallucinating bullets being shot at her, calling the women that accused her husband of illegal acts liars, taking money from private prisons and supporting not so free trade agreements.
Oops, she didn't even admit that all of those were 'little mistakes', just the killing hundreds thousands from her IWR vote, using a private server for classified emails and her hallucinations.
Hekate
(90,793 posts)JURY: I'm being ironic again. If 11 hours in front of the Benghazi Committee didn't break her will, perhaps the old trial for witches will do so.
Live and Learn
(12,769 posts)I can't vouch for.
Live and Learn
(12,769 posts)DefenseLawyer
(11,101 posts)So I'm not sure what paid speeches by Senator Sanders you would be talking about. I think that's what is called a red herring.
senz
(11,945 posts)trying to pit Bernie against Obama several times, and Ted Kennedy once, while portraying herself as their bosom buddy allies (perhaps forgetting her Clintonian outrage at Ted's 2008 endorsement of Obama and her current awkward, brittle pretense of camaraderie with the President.) None of it made sense, rang true, or was in any way factual; it was all gratuitous insinuation and accusation delivered with big smiles, as though she were having the time of her life. Bernie was caught off guard and, as is often the case with him when faced with pure malice and/or dishonesty from someone he considers a colleague, he was momentarily speechless with surprise -- which seemed to delight her. She was a real charmer.
Bernie was, as always, too polite. After her final round of baseless accusations of Bernie's so-called offenses against Obama, Bernie could only mention that "only one person here has ever run against Obama," at which point Hill stiffened at little, but then he left it at that. Any one of us could have filled in with her numerous verbal excoriations and racist insinuations against the President.
It was an oddly disjointed debate and I don't recall that Hill's million dollar "speeches" ever came up.
Live and Learn
(12,769 posts)senz
(11,945 posts)but then I love the guy.
Live and Learn
(12,769 posts)senz
(11,945 posts)He deserves to feel that good.
Okay, goodnight L&L.
Live and Learn
(12,769 posts)Lil Missy
(17,865 posts)And, the only people who care about her damned speeches and their transcripts are Hillary Haters. It's a setup for a witch hunt by people who would never vote for her anyway.
Frankly, I think she should tell them to go piss up a rope.
senz
(11,945 posts)Prospective employers have every right to know the job applicant's résumé. Hill's most recent job was as speech-giver; she did it for several years. We, as her prospective employer, have a right to know how she performed her duties. If she doesn't want us to know, then perhaps she should withdraw her application.
Live and Learn
(12,769 posts)But I don't see Hillary disagreeing with the practice. Bernie has refuted it.
cui bono
(19,926 posts)What on earth does the GOP have to do with any of this?
Now even though you just lost the argument by saying:
I will still explain to you why that makes no sense.
Here, cut and pasted from another post of mine:
It's because she got paid a LOT of money to make those speeches. She got paid by Goldman Sachs and the health insurance industry mostly. They play a large part in the problems of this country. Remember the crash in 2007 that we are still recovering from? Now, there is talk of regulating banks better, there is talk of breaking them up. This talk is not coming from Hillary, it's coming from Bernie.
Hillary has shown in the past that donations can sway her 'opinion' on issues/bills (bankruptcy bill for one). So it stands to reason that these extremely large amounts of money are being paid for a reason. Therefore, we would like to know what she said in those speeches to them. Especially after that comment she made about... something about it's not fair that they get all the blame and the people who got foreclosed on get none. It's important for voters to know if the money will buy them influence. Generally people give money to politicians they know will carry their water.
Now, you mention "ALL candidates, especially GOP". Why do you even bring up GOP candidates? This is a Democratic Primary happening now. It doesn't matter what the GOP said, unless of course you want to deflect from HRC's speech content and make up a non-sense reason why she won't release her transcripts. Any GOP speech transcripts are a non-issue at this point, so for her to make that excuse that she will do it if ALL candidates do it is incredibly lame and insulting to the American people.
http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1251&pid=1210103
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Live and Learn
(12,769 posts)silvershadow
(10,336 posts)Live and Learn
(12,769 posts)"I'll look into it"
"We Can't Do it."
"Cut it Out."
"That will never come to pass."
"It will never, ever, happen."
"I made a mistake"
virtualobserver
(8,760 posts)in 30 days, then we get to ask for a vowel.
Live and Learn
(12,769 posts)bigwillq
(72,790 posts)Live and Learn
(12,769 posts)Oops, should "I have quoted that? Does Hillary own all doom and gloom phrases now?