2016 Postmortem
Related: About this forumHillary Clinton goes full "John McCain" attempting to exploit a national tragedy for political gain
Remember when John McCain pulled a high-profile stunt during his Presidential campaign--in which he raced to Washington, DC--in an effort to save our country from the looming financial crisis?
Just like John McCain, Hillary Clinton is exploiting a national tragedy and its victims for political gain. She is using the victims of Flint and this environmental crisis as a public-relations gold mine--ripe with photo ops, lofty speeches and plenty of victims to embrace.
Flint will serve as a marketing backdrop, where Clinton will recite memorized soundbytes and slogans while relishing the chance to appear presidential and in command. I'm sorry Mrs. Clinton, but there is nothing that you, your campaign and your media entourage can do on the ground that would make a difference. Just ask John McCain how helpful his mad dash to DC was in neutralizing the financial crisis!
Just like McCain, Clinton's move feels more like a poll-bump ploy that a serious, authentic effort to make a difference.
It's worth noting Clinton's hypocrisy. As a longtime proponent and champion of fracking, which also poisons water--she appears to be unmoved by the pain, suffering and water poisoning that fracking caucuses. I've heard not one emotional speech for the victims of fracking. Not one trip to visit those impacted victims.
I will, however, give Clinton the benefit of the doubt and sincerely hope that she refrains from targeting Flint children and minorities--for campaign purposes. That would be incredibly sad.
There are plenty of Republicans and Democrats on the ground in Flint who are attempting to work through this crisis. President Obama is involved. By inserting her campaign into the epicenter of this crisis--she risks politicizing this situation. Her polarizing presence could derail progress. She is a divisive force that does not need to parachute into Flint and risk mucking things up.
Like McCain, Hillary really should slow down, take a breath and think about what she's doing before she travels down the road to Flint.
Dem2
(8,168 posts)The Sander's camp seems to think the primary process is a game of limbo.
CoffeeCat
(24,411 posts)Bernie Sanders isn't using "We The People" as a political football.
This isn't a game!
Save your outrage for someone who deserves it.
Bernie is honest. Clinton isn't trustworthy and people will see through her Flint gimmick.
Dem2
(8,168 posts)I will look for your response when he does similar - I have a feeling you'll love it!
CoffeeCat
(24,411 posts)Not all of us are so impressed with conceit and obvious campaign ploys.
This situation underscores what I like about Bernie. He does plenty of good behind the scenes. He's a decent man. He doesn't need cameras rolling and CNN following him when he does a good deed.
Hillary's debacle can't even be seen a decent act, because it could backfire.
But for sure, what this act does do--is allows her to get some great footage on the evening news and prominent placements on network television.
Just in time for the NH vote on Tuesday.
Dem2
(8,168 posts)I promise you.
So will I - I think they both should give this national emergency the attention it deserves, it shows leadership.
rhett o rick
(55,981 posts)another of her stunts. Her experience at work.
Dem2
(8,168 posts)I can do the fallacy thing too. Let's keep it on topic please.
rhett o rick
(55,981 posts)The majority of Americans vote no to trusting her motives.
Dem2
(8,168 posts)Everybody here does. Thanks!
AlbertCat
(17,505 posts)I doubt he thought of exploiting victims at all.
What's Super-Hillary gonna do there? Change the water to wine?
Just what this op ed says.... get pics of her talking to victims.... playing Prez. (the real Prez is already on it)... recite carefully reversed sound bites.
riversedge
(70,242 posts)MADem
(135,425 posts)It wasn't Bernie. He couldn't be bothered to give the good people of Flint a mention.
oasis
(49,389 posts)her noble effort in getting the ball rolling.
Arazi
(6,829 posts)And both of them addressed it
http://www.mlive.com/news/flint/index.ssf/2016/02/hillary_clinton_bernie_sanders_1.html
And tbh, Rachel Maddow deserves the lions share of credit for covering Flint's water crisis for many months before that.
Oh and you're another Clinton supporter studiously ignoring the thread about Hillary's vote in support of cluster bombs
http://www.democraticunderground.com/12511140849
Guess she doesn't care too much about those people. No political gain by posing with the mangled bodies caused by her war mongering...
MADem
(135,425 posts)What do cluster bombs have to do with Flint? Hmmm?
Gee, let's talk about the Brady Bill, if you're going to go that route! Or how a guy who votes against an authorization can turn around and immediately FUND the very thing he voted against?
Please.
Arazi
(6,829 posts)She's a phony.
If she truly cared she'd be bringing up the contaminated water from fracking - entire state aquifers are getting destroyed but nary a word from Clinton. Her vote in support of cluster bombs brings her lies about "caring" into stark relief.
She doesn't really care - she's looking for a photo op. It's the worst sort of faux concern
MADem
(135,425 posts)And who voted to PAY FOR all those bombs? And continues to vote for appropriations?
And who cares what kind of bomb it is, at the end of the day--dead is dead.
Here's some light reading for you...it looks like there's another candidate who "doesn't really care," to quote you:
http://www.alternet.org/election-2016/bernie-sanders-troubling-history-supporting-us-military-violence-abroad
See, I can dig down into the old archives and haul crap up, too.
malokvale77
(4,879 posts)Why yes, there is. She definitely won't take a bow for any of the carnage, death, destruction and grief she actually had a role in.
elias49
(4,259 posts)But I know that I remember Bernie being out front on this.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/post-politics/wp/2016/01/16/bernie-sanders-calls-on-michigans-governor-to-resign-over-water-contamination-in-flint/
That was January 16.
'Resign.' said Sanders.
Hillary would try to get a subcommittee together to discuss the possibility of drafting language to berate the Flint, MI
administrators for allowing the governor's office to mishandle a serious crisis.
(More language to follow)
Bernie said on"Resign" on January 16.
Hillary's going to go to Flint on February 7th or 8th and muck up the works.
Bunch o nonsense.
ViseGrip
(3,133 posts)where they have a problem there too??????
http://thinkprogress.org/health/2016/01/25/3742655/lead-water-sebring/
Dangerous Levels Of Lead Found In An Ohio Citys Water System
by Alex Zielinski Jan 25, 2016 4:47 pm
Agschmid
(28,749 posts)Odd huh?
MADem
(135,425 posts)riversedge
(70,242 posts)assist other cites when and if she is invited. Just saying.
Punkingal
(9,522 posts)She invited Hillary...why not invite them all?
CoffeeCat
(24,411 posts)She could make more progress with working the phones.
But calling someone doesn't exactly make for great PR opportunities.
Agschmid
(28,749 posts)I don't see more visibility of this issue being a bad thing?
moondust
(19,993 posts)Mayor *may* see an opportunity to ingratiate herself and advance her own career by helping her chosen candidate exploit the local tragedy.
MADem
(135,425 posts)Punkingal
(9,522 posts)Did you even watch?
MADem
(135,425 posts)Clinton brought it up. Bernie was still singing the same one note.
The question asked was generic. HRC CHOSE to focus on Flint.
Punkingal
(9,522 posts)He said this wouldn't have happened in the white suburbs and he also said the Governor should resign. Tell the truth, at least.
MADem
(135,425 posts)I think you're confusing debates. This was almost a month ago that she brought it up, while Sanders stood silently by.
FWIW, all of your "tell the truth" comments--like I'm LYING--say more about you than you perhaps realize.
Not a good look.
Punkingal
(9,522 posts)And I was talking about the recent debate.
Purveyor
(29,876 posts)we Michiganians can break the stranglehold the GOP have on our State gov't.
DanTex
(20,709 posts)and she's drawn praise from the mayor of Flint for her efforts. People who hated Clinton before this will continue to hate her afterwards, no doubt.
CoffeeCat
(24,411 posts)and she will do anything and say anything to get elected.
This stunt certainly underscores all of that.
I mean, seriously. She's attempting to tell us that she's not beholden to Wall Street, while taking their millions.
She's attempting to position herself as a Progressive--despite picking Robert Kagan--the founder of the neocon movement--as one of her closest advisors while she was SOS. While she takes millions in corporate donations. While she brokers billion-dollar deals for Boeing to sell fighter jets to Saudi Arabia--after Boeing donated $900k to the Clinton Foundation.
More smoke and mirrors. I won't apologize for being sick of it.
DanTex
(20,709 posts)For the rest of us, she's going to Flint at the request of the mayor to help with the water crisis.
CoffeeCat
(24,411 posts)However, I do think that the public, in general, will see through this.
Before she's even landed in Flint, NBC has a story that includes a quote from a Flint resident. He specifically says that she won't help and he doesn't want her there.
She's smack-dab in the middle of a heated primary campaign and behind significantly in NH.
I think most will judge this as they did with McCain.
It's incredibly transparent.
Even if she did have the best of intentions, there is the air of exploitation there. The state of her campaign lends credibility to those claims.
DanTex
(20,709 posts)more reporters under the bus.
The McCain analogy is absurd, as you know. McCain wanted to skip a debate, and the people in DC didn't ask him to go there, they didn't want him there. She is in Flint at the mayor's request. I don't see the negative angle unless people are already committed Hillary-haters.
We'll see.
elias49
(4,259 posts)She talks big.
Andy823
(11,495 posts)She was invited by the mayor to come there, and I am willing to bet money if the mayor had invited Bernie, he too would have gone, or do you think think he would have refused?
rhett o rick
(55,981 posts)Nye Bevan
(25,406 posts)It almost seems that some will attack Hillary whatever she does.
CoffeeCat
(24,411 posts)There is nothing wrong with speaking about the issue and discussing it. The entire situation is a horrifying tragedy.
I have praised both Bernie and Hillary for drawing attention to Flint.
However, high tailing it into the epicenter of the crisis is exploiting the situation. And the victims.
Empowerer
(3,900 posts)But I know that facts have little to do with the narrative that some people wish to spread . . .
Response to CoffeeCat (Original post)
Post removed
HassleCat
(6,409 posts)Until we see what she does and says, and how her campaign people spin it after the fact. She might be sincere. Sometimes she is.
rhett o rick
(55,981 posts)Here's an abc poll that gives Sanders a 48% to 36% lead in the trust department. http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/clintons-advantage-hits-campaign-low-lags-trust-leading/story?id=36524847
I saw another Iowa poll that had Sanders leading in trust 84% to 11% over Clinton.
OilemFirchen
(7,143 posts)HooptieWagon
(17,064 posts)...oops, probably not. What was I thinking?
intheozone
(1,103 posts)monmouth4
(9,708 posts)she just hoped she would stay out of he way. LOL.
livetohike
(22,145 posts)their welfare for decades.
rhett o rick
(55,981 posts)emphasis on helping American children.
CoffeeCat
(24,411 posts)I wonder how many of those children Clinton visited in their hometowns.
And the tens of thousands of children who were orphaned during the Iraq war? I'm assuming that Clinton went over there in an attempt to solve their problems, right?
After all, she cares so much about children.
rhett o rick
(55,981 posts)99Forever
(14,524 posts)... that happen to have brown skin and are unlucky enough to have been born in a nation with huge oil deposits...
Then it's cluster bombs away!
DavidDvorkin
(19,479 posts)And (Bill) Clinton Derangement Syndrome.
CoffeeCat
(24,411 posts)three days before a state primary vote.
I can't imagine Obama doing something like that. I can't imagine Bernie doing it either.
But look! There's Hillary doing it. We don't even have to imagine.
Skwmom
(12,685 posts)to see that undercurrent.
hifiguy
(33,688 posts)madamesilverspurs
(15,805 posts)Now she's actually getting dissed for giving a damn.
This is getting beyond pathetic. I swear, the more some people trash Hillary the farther away from Bernie I'm inclined to go.
Number23
(24,544 posts)But I'm sure the folks rec'ing and agreeing with this kind of crap will be along to remind black people how much they care soon enough.
immoderate
(20,885 posts)--imm
Metric System
(6,048 posts)Response to CoffeeCat (Original post)
1000words This message was self-deleted by its author.
Satch59
(1,353 posts)Hillary could save someone from a burning car or hell, even suspend her campaign and throw her support to Bernie and she would still get criticized...
Some of these Bernie supporters walk around with horse blinders on or act like lemmings...seems more of a social media fashion to support him with their same old responses and their hate...it's getting old and laughable now. Can't imagine Bernie would respect some/most of them here: he deserves better...