2016 Postmortem
Related: About this forumWe Dissent/ Unfinished Business
It is not enough to allow dissent. We must demand it. For there is much to dissent from.
We dissent from the fact that millions are trapped in poverty while the nation grows rich.
We dissent from the conditions and hatreds which deny a full life to our fellow citizens because of the color of their skin.
We dissent from the monstrous absurdity of a world where nations stand poised to destroy one another, and man must kill their fellow man.
We dissent from the sight of most of mankind living in poverty, stricken by disease, threatened by hunger and doomed to an early death after a life of unremitting labor.
We dissent from cities which blunt our senses and turn the ordinary acts of daily life into a painful struggle.
We dissent from the willful, heedless destruction of natural pleasure and beauty.
We dissent from all these structures -- of technology and society itself -- which strip from the individual the dignity and warmth of sharing in the common tasks of his community and his nation.
-- Senator Robert F. Kennedy
I can only speak for myself. Ive met both Bernie Sanders and Hillary Clinton, and like them both. I believe that they are both good and sincere individuals, who honestly believe that they could accomplish the most good for the people of this nation. Still, I support the Sanders campaign. My support for Sanders does not include any dislike of, or disrespect for, Ms. Clinton.
Rather, it is because Bernie Sanders represents the values that have influenced my thinking and behavior throughout the decades of my being involved in social-political activism. When people in the media or the republican party call Sanderss positions unrealistic or pipe dreams, I dissent.
Last year, the Pope visited the United States. He spoke about the need for social justice. The concepts he spoke of were much the same as those detailed by Senator Robert Kennedy fifty years ago. It would be easy to dismiss them as unrealistic and pipe dreams. But we also learned that the Pope played a central role in discussions between officials in the United States, and in two of our nations enemies -- Cuba and Iran. And, as we have seen, these dialogues resulted in very real advances
..advances in some of the very things that Senator Kennedy had spoken of.
These are the same values that Americas greatest prophet, Dr. Martin Luther King, Jr., fought for. King began his public career struggling for Civil Rights. By the mid-1960s, he expanded his ministry to emphasis economic justice. He understood that there could not be social justice domestically, if the US continued its military approach to foreign affairs. Thats just as true today, as it was in 1968.
The Sanders campaign offers those of us who share these values the best opportunity to advance them. For some of us, they are our ethics; for others, our religious beliefs; and for others, our spiritual reality. Some of us are old, others young; we are male and female; black, brown, red, yellow, and white; we are citizens who believe that Aristotle was correct when he said, The true nature of anything is what it becomes at its highest.
We want America to reach its true nature.
Come, my friends. Tis not too late to seek a newer world.
-- Alfred, Lord Tennyson
Peace,
H2O Man
SamKnause
(13,107 posts)Integrity, sound judgment, and passion.
FEEL THE BERN
H2O Man
(73,556 posts)his wife used the word "integrity" to describe him last night.
SamKnause
(13,107 posts)VulgarPoet
(2,872 posts)eom
H2O Man
(73,556 posts)Much appreciated.
RoccoR5955
(12,471 posts)H2O Man
(73,556 posts)islandmkl
(5,275 posts)H2O Man
(73,556 posts)I am hoping that more conversations here focus on positive issues. And I think that the Sanders campaign provides me with the most opportunities to do so .....both here, and in day-to-day life.
Gregorian
(23,867 posts)As I read your post, these words were going through my mind: "...in order to form a more perfect union...".
As opposed to the disturbing conservative turn that was essentially forced upon the country, I feel a great desire to form a nation which has compassion and generosity.
H2O Man
(73,556 posts)We all have the opportunity to work for that more perfect union. We might not always have full agreement on this forum on specific issues, but we can all be keeping our eyes on the prize.
Hey, we should talk on the phone this weekend. If you have time Friday night or Saturday, let me know. (I'll be visiting my daughter at college on Sunday.)
raouldukelives
(5,178 posts)H2O Man
(73,556 posts)NCTraveler
(30,481 posts)Enjoyed reading.
H2O Man
(73,556 posts)I appreciate it. There are some solid OP/threads on DU:GDP that advocate for both Clinton and Sanders. We should all be reading them with an open mind, and respect for other community members. I never hesitate to "k&r" a good OP, even if I disagree with parts of it.
Last night, while we were watching the "town hall" on CNN, my older son said, "You know, we have two really good candidates. The republicans have idiots. It would make more sense, for the good of the country, if the general election was a contest between the two good candidates, without any of the republicans being in it."
erlewyne
(1,115 posts)Oh, I am Bernie all the way and will vote Democratic. But the
Republican idiots are terrible. The reason I mentioned Kasich
is because he is keeping quiet and he is a snake that doesn't
glide ... he flops. He's afraid of heat.
The idiots ahead of him ... they can't last.
Can they???
Hillary is in trouble and knows it ... she has to flipflop because
her sponsors are, well, idiots.
H2O Man
(73,556 posts)What I've been told is that Kasich plans to drop out, if he doesn't place in the top three in the NH primary. Off camera, he is beginning to pout .....believing that he offered the republican party its most realistic chance for victory. But he's been ignored, not only by the voters, but in his mind, the establishment and the media.
The establishment elders have urged him to step aside, so that their "lane" becomes less clogged. They are, sadly, divided between those who hope Jeb can be brought back to life, and those who think Rubio makes the stronger candidate. More, either of those two would definitely have Kasich on their short list for VP.
erlewyne
(1,115 posts)Excellent answer. I just thought he quit.
I live in Ohio and the local (small town)
newspapers do not mention him and OHIO
is very GOP.
I get national news here on DE.
I had expected him to be #1,2, or 3.
I don't have to tell you that the guy is a brat! He puts on this calm, rational act when he's in public -- like in the debates. But he really believes that it's a terrible, personal insult that he isn't the leading republican at this time. And I believe that those around him have their work cut out for them, in trying to keep his cranky side from coming out in public. Ha!
suffragette
(12,232 posts)H2O Man
(73,556 posts)I appreciate it!
SammyWinstonJack
(44,130 posts)H2O Man
(73,556 posts)angrychair
(8,699 posts)Well-spoken, intelligent discourse should always be respected and held in the highest esteem.
Thank you for the read and the profoundly well-rounded and thought out position you have taken in your endorsement of Sanders as your candidate.
H2O Man
(73,556 posts)I believe that most -- if not all -- of those supporting Senator Sanders understand that this is far more than an "ordinary" presidential election. And that's not to imply that presidential elections are anything less than extremely important, for they are. Yet, 2016 poses very serious problems, and also a unique response to those problems. I appreciate that Bernie Sanders is willing to step up to the plate for America.
zeemike
(18,998 posts)But I differ on my view of Hillary Clinton...I don't trust her
And if I had to point to one thing that made me feel that way it is when she laughed and said "We came, we saw, he died"...to me that says she thinks killing is just a game to be played and I can never respect or trust people like that.
I understand hat many people, including Sanders supporters, dislike Hillary Clinton. And I appreciate why they don't trust her. More, I know why people find her campaign to be at times offensive.
For whatever reason, as I started writing this, I remembered an incident from many years ago. It was when I worked at the mental health clinic. (I organized my co-workers to engage in voter education and registration, for Bill Clinton's election and re-election. This, however, has nothing to do with the point I want to make.) Anyhow, there was a young therapist working there, who used to seek my assistance on many of her cases.
One afternoon, she came into my office, very upset. The supervisor had met with her, and said that she didn't fit in, and should seek another job. The young therapist became defensive; the supervisor told her that she didn't have any friends at the clinic. The therapist said that she and I were friends; the supervisor said, "Oh, Pat. He doesn't count. Pat likes everybody."
In Ms. Clinton's case, obviously, I am far, far from alone in liking her. But I recognize that she isn't popular among a segment of the Democratic Party, or among the Democratic Left.
zeemike
(18,998 posts)But I don't like to speak of liking of disliking someone, particularly someone I don't even know.
And I separate like from trust because I can like someone but not trust them.
I have had good friends that were alcoholics and I liked them just fine, but from experience I knew they were not to be trusted. So it is quite possible that I might like Hillary if I knew her...I know I voted for her husband twice but my trust in him was not justified.
I don't like Debbie Wasserman Schultz. I think that she has far more in common with Marko Rubio, than she does with me. I do not think she attempts to be honest, and do good for other than her social class.
Uncle Joe
(58,364 posts)Thanks for the thread, H2O Man.
H2O Man
(73,556 posts)Enjoy the debate tonight.
Uncle Joe
(58,364 posts)H2O Man
(73,556 posts)on the internet? I think their web site should have it.
I think tonight's debate is going to be extremely important. And entertaining.
Uncle Joe
(58,364 posts)tonight's debate will be extremely important.
I will definitely view it, just not on T.V.
ms liberty
(8,577 posts)You've expressed my own feelings in the best way. Thank you!
H2O Man
(73,556 posts)I appreciate it!