Yo! Clinton supporters! Let's talk issues.

[Matariki]

Last edited Sun Jan 31, 2016, 07:51 PM - Edit history (1)

Here, I'll start -

What is Clinton's plan to get healthcare to the 29 million folks who are still uninsured?

What is her plan to help the people who *have* insurance but can't afford to use it because of high deductibles and copays?

[Blue_Adept]

1. We've been doing this for the past year

Nobody's interested anymore. It's all down to the numbers and the horse race itself.

[Matariki]

5. issues don't matter

[Blue_Adept]

6. not here and not now

Besides, as we've seen, 90% of people in GDP are Bernie supporters. You're better off finding Hillary supporters elsewhere to find out things from.

[Binkie The Clown]

53. If you use the word "issues" in the HRC group you will be instantly banned, so...

where else is the question to be raised?

[tokenlib]

2. Don't forget those that got marketplace ins and are not renewing....

..because the out of pocket is ridiculously high,

[Matariki]

3. Why won't people talk the issues here?

It's all name calling and meme of the day

[ypsfonos]

4. They don't talk issues

there is no plan except to keep us in chains.

[MisterP]

8. no, sometimes they say you're a bigot and that your denial only serves to prove them right

[Hekate]

29. "Keep us in chains"? WTF is that for a discussion point? What are we, the Soviet Empire?

As to your screen name: I am curious, what kind of "spy" are you the "son of," since it seems to be important enough to you to use it as a handle?

JURY: I am quoting back the poster's own words.

[TheFarS1de]

50. What about a handle ?

Like why would one name oneself after a goddess of witchcraft ? Not really my business but seeing as calling out posters handles is the name of the game ....although the many headed aspect does seem apt .

[Hekate]

52. Eleusinian Mysteries. Triple Goddess, along with Persephone and Demeter....

Demeter, Mother, fruitfulness
Persephone, Maiden (Kore, nameless maiden; later co-ruler of the Underworld as Persephone)
Hekate, Crone (sometimes called The Eldest, one of the original Titans). Goddess of Crossroads, where three ways meet. Choose.

This is not even a thumbnail sketch of the complex mythology involved, but thanks for asking.

[TheFarS1de]

55. I only now the name from my Black metal days

Hecate Enthroned .

[Warren DeMontague]

58. I got mine from this drunken monkey puppet in a wrestling helmet

but the eleusinian mysteries are cool too tho

[Warren DeMontague]

57. Here you go.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=profile&uid=329601&sub=trans





Word to the wise, potential spymasters; if one is going to create a sock account, probably taking the original username and just spelling it backwards isn't the most clever way to go.

[Hekate]

60. Lolz. That is pretty much what I figured. Guess the Secret Decoder Ring led him wrong. nt

[Matariki]

7. Does Clinton have a plan for those shortcomings in the ACA?

anyone?

[Lucinda]

9. Here's an overview:

https://www.hillaryclinton.com/issues/health-care/

Catch a speech or two, she gets more specific in those.

[Matariki]

10. Thanks for the link

I don't really see much there in the way of a plan. Particularly in getting coverage for the people who still don't have it.

How does she plan on slowing the growth of overall health care costs? Is she proposing legislation that will limit charges? Something else?

Is she planning on legislation limiting deductibles?

Thanks?

[Lucinda]

13. She is more specific in her stump speeches, and I think I saw a policy paper link a while back.

I'll go through my bookmarks later and see if I tagged if you'd like to look it over? I'm half asleep right now, or I might have be able to be more specific.

[ljm2002]

15. Truly hilarious...

...just imagine, JUST IMAGINE if a Bernie supporter were to say "He is more specific in his stump speeches, and I think I saw a policy paper link a while back."

Fuckin' funny.

[Lucinda]

16. I have no idea what you mean? A web page overview is not remotely as in depth

as a full policy paper, or a even candidate expanding on their specific plans while talking directly to voters. ANY candidate.

[ljm2002]

17. That is not what we have been hearing over the last several weeks...

...as Clinton supporters have derided the "lack of details" in Bernie's various plans.

Yet on the topic of health care, one of the pivotal issues this election cycle, all we get from Hillary is handwaving verbiage about how she will try and tweak the wonderful system we have.

Not good enough, Hillary.

[Lucinda]

21. She didn't say she would "try" - She has been very specific about her plans.

Research is your friend.

[ljm2002]

23. Here is her healthcare "plan"...

...from her own web site:

https://www.hillaryclinton.com/issues/health-care/

Defend the Affordable Care Act. Hillary will continue to defend the Affordable Care Act (ACA) against Republican efforts to repeal it. She'll build on it to expand affordable coverage, slow the growth of overall health care costs (including prescription drugs), and make it possible for providers to deliver the very best care to patients.

Lower out-of-pocket costs like copays and deductibles. The average deductible for employer-sponsored health plans rose from $1,240 in 2002 to about $2,500 in 2013. American families are being squeezed by rising out-of-pocket health care costs. Hillary believes that workers should share in slower growth of national health care spending through lower costs.

Reduce the cost of prescription drugs. Prescription drug spending accelerated from 2.5 percent in 2013 to 12.6 percent in 2014. It’s no wonder that almost three-quarters of Americans believe prescription drug costs are unreasonable. Hillary believes we need to demand lower drug costs for hardworking families and seniors.

Transform our health care system to reward value and quality. Hillary is committed to building on delivery system reforms in the Affordable Care Act that improve value and quality care for Americans.

Hillary will also work to expand access to rural Americans, who often have difficulty finding quality, affordable health care. She will explore cost-effective ways to broaden the scope of health care providers eligible for telehealth reimbursement under Medicare and other programs, including federally qualified health centers and rural health clinics. She will also call for states to support efforts to streamline licensing for telemedicine and examine ways to expand the types of services that qualify for reimbursement.

Hillary is continuing a lifelong fight to ensure women have access to reproductive health care. As senator, she championed access to emergency contraception and voted in favor of strengthening a woman’s right to make her own health decisions. As president, she will continue defending Planned Parenthood, which provides critical health services including breast exams and cancer screenings to 2.7 million women a year.

I see her naming some problems and stating she will fix them -- not HOW she will fix them, though -- i.e., no specific policy proposals here.

[Lucinda]

26. That is just an overview - she is more specific in her stump speeches and here:

https://ballotpedia.org/2016_presidential_candidates_on_healthcare

You can find more specifics.

[riversedge]

38. As you note--she has laid out many of her plans in sections during her speeches, along with funding

of her proposals. Many proposals came about during her listening session, small town halls --and she listened to folks and their specific problems---such as financial support for care-givers, Alzheimer, drug addition, prison reform


This searchable website lays them out in detail.


https://www.hillaryclinton.com/briefing/statements/2015/09/29/cadillac-tax-aca-statement/

[Uponthegears]

40. Oh look

After being confronted, you started to play ball.

GREAT

Let's talk.

Your link was to Hillary's plan to eliminate the Cadillac Plan tax.

Let me say right up from that I agree with that position because a lot of so-called "Cadillac Plans" are part of union-negotiated benefit packages that workers accepted in lieu of higher pay. Taxing THOSE PARTICULAR Cadillac Plans is unfair.

The interesting thing about that particular issue is that it is part of the ACA that is targeted BIG TIME by the REPUBLICANS.

Hillary, champion of Republican causes!

Okay, that was pretty snarky, so let's talk a little more seriously about her other plans . . . more coverage for certain diseases? great . . . not a major problem . . . reducing out of pocket expenses? . . . no discussion about how she is going to pay for it . . .
what is missing? . . .

Yep, that's right, what is Hillary's plan for providing health care to the tens of millions of people left uncovered when the USSC struck down the "continued Federal health care grants only if you expand Medicaid" provision of the ACA. What is her plan for providing the millions of the most vulnerable Americans cut loose under the ACA with ANY healthcare whatsoever . . . oh, and . . . how is she going to pay for it???????

[Lucinda]

56. Yep. The same process she used during her Senate run. She is a public servant

down to her toes, and what better way to find out what's needed than to go to the source...

Thanks sooo very much for the excellent link!

[libdem4life]

28. as per Chelsea, millions and millions of Americans would have no health care...

Bernie would just throw them under the health care bus.

[Armstead]

18. That's not fair...She is trying to make a good faith effort

[ljm2002]

19. Who are you talking about...

...Clinton, or the poster I replied to?

Either way, what I said is true and anyone who has been reading these boards for the last 3 months knows it.

[Armstead]

24. the poster

[Matariki]

22. Thank you.

[Lucinda]

27. This one was handy, but not the one I was thinking of:

https://ballotpedia.org/2016_presidential_candidates_on_healthcare

Hits all the candidates, has quite a few of the proposals she released in 2015, with supporting links.

[Matariki]

47. Again, thanks. Lots of info at that link.

This is interesting: "On October 21, 2015, Clinton said she had “serious concerns” about Aetna’s planned acquisition of Humana and other mergers between health insurers. "As we see more consolidation in health care, among both providers and insurers, I'm worried that the balance of power is moving too far away from consumers," Clinton said."

I'm glad to see her addressing that. Wondering what can be done to prevent it though? Anti-monopoly laws? Refining the ACA? Of course, single payer would take care of that problem, but admittedly the will to get there isn't so great in the Congress that we have.

To me, the healthcare issue is a big deal. I've known far too many people who have died, very possibly because of delayed care, because they couldn't afford to go to the doctor.

[Lucinda]

54. Health care is a biggie for me too. I am fairly lucky that my only real issue

is that one of my prescriptions isn't covered via disability. And it's pretty expensive. I know people with ACA coverage that wont seek medical help because the copays are too high. I'm glad that both of those issues are things she is advocating for. I'm so sorry to hear that you've lost people because of lack of care. To me there is no acceptable reason that anyone should have to go without food, shelter, or medical care. We waste billions of dollars that could make such a difference in peoples lives.

I'm not sure where she is on the specifics for consumer protection regarding the health care mergers. I know in the finance industry she talks about oversight and penalties being applied to help prohibit too much consolidation. There also may be things already on the books that may need to be enforced that could provide protection. It's an area I am definitely not up to speed on.

Riversedge gave me this link after I replied to you earlier and it's pretty good. It is searchable, but you can also use the drop down menu just above the video to find fact sheets, videos, and all sorts of info - there are health care related items , as well as other policy positions:

https://www.hillaryclinton.com/briefing/factsheets/


Lucinda

edited to credited riversedge for giving me the link

[Matariki]

12. I do appreciate the link

I'm wondering if Clinton's supporters will talk about the specifics of her positions and policies, rather than point to speeches.

Not to be snarky, but to try and get policy discussions happening here on DU rather than just name calling. My support for Sanders is based on his policy positions, which align with my own. I'm very clear on what his positions are. I'm not clear on what Clinton's are. I would very much like to see a woman President in my life time but I'm going to vote on policy first.

[Lucinda]

20. Policy discussions don't happen here. Not In GDP. Not often anyway.

It would be nice if they did though. Too many people don't seem to want to explore what the candidates are proposing.

I don't understand voters who don't research candidates. It's simple enough to watch them, and follow up when you have specific questions. I also don't quite get asking message board posters to give you anything but their own opinions about the candidates. Why would you want filtered information? Anyway, it's bedtime for me.

[Matariki]

11. What is Clinton's plan for Social Security?

[ChairmanAgnostic]

30. What plan for Social Security?

Except do Goldman Sachs' bidding and privatize it, allow Sachs to profit from it, and raise retirement ages to allow Sachs to maximize its profits.

[Hoyt]

37. You have a link to that?

[riversedge]

32. Why not do your own work and do some research instead of just asking others to do the

work for you???

[Matariki]

41. Because I would like to see DU discuss policy, not just toss snark

your post isn't helpful

[JRLeft]

14. Nothing they should pull themselves up by their bootstraps.

Last edited Sun Jan 31, 2016, 08:00 PM - Edit history (1)

The Wallast Street way is the only way.

[Hekate]

25. Why bother? Every time any of us has tried for the past many months, we get shouted down

That does not mean you (plural) have "won" -- it just makes you yuuuuge shouters.

[riversedge]

31. That is true--and note the vile RW name calling of Clinton supporters in the OP

[Uponthegears]

34. And note

The continued failure by the above poster to address a substantive issue. Please note also that Hillary supporter Lucinda DID address a substantive issue and was treated with respect.

[riversedge]

39. Calling Hilllary supporters a RW vile name call is NOT respect.

[BigGLiberal]

33. You start your OP with "Clintonistas" and you want to talk issues?

No, I think not.

[Uponthegears]

36. See #34

[Matariki]

42. I wasn't aware that was a problematic term

is it the equivalent of 'Bernie Bros'? I can change the subject line, although I expect I'd get criticized for doing so.

[RufusTFirefly]

35. Thank you! Thank you! Thank you!

Personally, I'm supporting Bernie not because I find Hillary to be disingenuous and unlikeable. I'm supporting Bernie because I admire his record, his ethics, his courage, and his consistency and am largely in agreement with his goals and policy proposals. Although Hillary and I see eye to eye on some issues, we have basic disagreements on many others. I find her votes on key issues (e.g. Iraq war, PATRIOT Act) deeply disappointing, her hawkish record as Secretary of State deeply disturbing, and her tendency to flip-flop (e.g. Keystone, TPP, and marriage equality) very disorienting.

A well-done commercial or a good performance in a debate is highly unlikely to change that.

[Matariki]

44. I'm standing in pretty much the same place you are.

And I really would like to see dialog here, instead of constant shallow jabs - from both sides.

I have some very close friends who I respect a great deal who support Clinton and we're able to talk about the election and the issues without insulting each other. For the most part their support is primarily because they really want to see a woman president. They will admit that Clinton's record doesn't match their own values in many ways, but feel that a female president is so long overdue that as long as she's a Democrat, that overrides everything else. I don't agree with them obviously, but I do understand where they're coming from.

[RufusTFirefly]

49. Yes. It is a colossal embarrassment that we've gone this long...

... without a woman president.

I'm afraid we need to wait a little longer. And not because we aren't ready.

I wouldn't vote for Carly Fiorina on that basis. I would've voted for Elizabeth Warren though. Or Barbara Boxer for that matter. But not Dianne and not you-know-who. Policy still matters. There's no doubt that some who oppose Hillary Clinton are misogynist, just as many who opposed Barack Obama were racist.

That said, the country will not be well served by another neo-con, regardless of race, religion, or gender.

[Recursion]

43. While we're here, I'll be happy to tell you O'Malley's

https://martinomalley.com/policy/health-care/

Under O'Malley, Maryland adopted what has been praised as "the boldest proposal in the US" to make health care affordable. Maryland's global budgeting system has seen the only decrease in hospital costs in the nation.

One part of that global budgeting system is that hospitals must charge the uninsured the same amount they charge Medicare for the same procedure, as well as make those prices public.

The currently uninsured population is mainly two groups: recent immigrants and people in states that did not expand Medicaid. O'Malley would remove the waiting period for immigrants to enroll in Medicaid, and would fully fund the Medicaid expansion so that the remaining states would accept it.

O'Malley would also make it a priority to expand the funding of Federally Qualified Health Centers, who provide affordable primary, dental, and behavioral care in hundreds of underserved communities.

[Matariki]

45. +1

Thank you.

It sounds like his plan is to build on the ACA? It's so unfortunate that the plan varies from state to state.

[Recursion]

46. It is an unfortunate legacy of our Federal system; Obama alluded to this in 2009

when he said "if we were starting from scratch, I'd want single payer".

O'Malley's plan is the only plan of the three (not to mention the GOP!) that directly addresses provider costs, both by requiring price parity and transparency, and increasing FQHC funding (this, I think, is ultimately where we're going to get universal healthcare from).

[Matariki]

48. That's a very good provision

and unfortunate that it wasn't written into the ACA. Of course part of the ACA is to punish people for not having insurance.

[Recursion]

51. The ACA tripled FQHC funding

That was Sanders's demand before he would vote for it.

[Warren DeMontague]

59. I respect HRC's stated intent to leave Marijuana policy to the states, but in that case she should

both come out forcefully for the CARERS act and echo Sanders' proposal to remove marijuana from the CSA, not just reschedule it.