omfw the daily beast has gone over the edge

[restorefreedom]

i won't even link to it, but its there

m$m has taken out the cannons. it is beyond vile.

and it will strengthen bernie even more.

edit....here it is

http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2016/01/31/what-kind-of-jew-is-bernie-sanders.html

vile, putrid, scumbags.

namaste, people. stay strong!

[MineralMan]

1. Of what use is this without a link?

Are you talking about their Iowa polling story? Without a reference, it's impossible to even begin a discussion.

Besides, when did the Daily Beast become M$M?

[Agschmid]

3. Probably this...

http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2016/01/31/what-kind-of-jew-is-bernie-sanders.html

[restorefreedom]

4. that is the one.

i could not bring myself to link to it

[Rebkeh]

7. That's actually good, informative article but

with a click-baity title --- which is somewhat typical for The Daily Beast.

Not sure if it's wrong or not, I'm not a Jew so....

[restorefreedom]

5. aschmid linked it in #3 nt

[MineralMan]

30. OK. I didn't find that one when I went to the site.

[TransitJohn]

2. I know what you meant

Insinuating that the British priesthood has gone lumbersexual. Just shameful.

[pangaia]

6. If you are referring to the article I just read, and I must assume you are,

I understand your point.

But...as a fervent Bernie supporter who hopes against hope that Bernie crushes the opposition Monday...

I must say...ummm....there is great historical truth in it, in spite of the digs.

And IF people who read it, can SEE into that truth, then yes, it could help Bernie.

If you feel I am way off base, if you disagree with me, I am more than happy to hear...

[restorefreedom]

8. i understand the historical basis

for jewish secularism/atheism and i see where you are coming from. and you are taking a more benevolent read i think than i am.

the fact that this is being discussed, not in a theology or history class, but as an "important" matter of one of the candidates, makes me want to puke. it is designed not to appeal to the acedemicians, but to the lowest basest prejudices in our society.

beyond shameful imo.

and thanks for your thoughts!

[pangaia]

10. I agree with you about it not being relevant to a candidate's "qualifications."

So many things written about Bernie have really pissed me off, that yes perhaps, I did have a somewhat benevolent take on this one.

I think the idea I was attracted to was the simple concept of doing good, treating others well just as a matter of being a human; whether "Jewish" or whatever. I have always felt THAT is the true Bernie Sanders.

But, I certainly see how sickening it comes off.

In spite of my own 72 year old, over-educated, well-traveled often self-righteousness, I can also be surprisingly naive.

Thank you for discussing it with me.

[restorefreedom]

11. i like bernie's basic philosophy

as you describe it. whether jewish, humanist, or whatever. basically treat people right. but the idea that it makes it into a political discussion, esp given some specific accusations or insinuations that were made, seems to be another putrid version of antisemitism, this time cloaked in the veil of academic analysis.

sometimes selective naiveté or shutting off the nasty feed valve is a healthy way to live. your blood pressure is probably better than mine!

peace

[pangaia]

15. My blood pressure is very good, thanks like 120/60 give or take.

Here's hoping yours is good as well..

I, of course, do see the antisemitism, but maybe not strongly enough until your first reply brought me to re-read the article.


Thanks, again restore..

[restorefreedom]

16. glad to hear it. mine is ok but is being

challenged right now, lol

peace!

[left-of-center2012]

9. "The same is true for Bernie’s atheism"

From the linked article:
"The same is true for Bernie’s atheism"
I've heard Bernie say he believes in God, but he's not a 'practicing Jew".

Isn't 'atheism' the non-belief in a God?

[restorefreedom]

13. apparently atheism is not very popular among voters

so any suggestion that he could be atheist is good fodder for the establishment.

yes, i always thought atheism is a non belief in god. unfortunately, no matter what bernie says about his faith or personal beliefs, the #notgoodenoughbernie crowd will spin it into a vile attack.

[SamKnause]

18. It seems words have no meaning.

People assign the meaning as they see fit.

Spin, lie, twist, omit, enhance, manipulate, insinuate etc. (This is akin to denying climate change,

demonizing higher education, ridiculing the arts, saying the U.S. was founded on

the Bible, etc.)

Bernie has never said he is an Atheist. (Though that would make me love him more.)

This is the interpretation of the writer of this article.

Apparently he has his own definition for Atheist.

Just my 2 cents.

[Jon Ace]

12. People read the Daily Beast? n/t

[olddots]

14. I would rather binge watch reruns of Honey Boo Boo

than read the dailybeast .

[restorefreedom]

17. wow. that is a statement. nt

[DavidDvorkin]

19. It's a pretty good analysis of that aspect of American Judaism

The last paragraph is positive, from my liberal point of view:

But if Sanders wants to call that religious, he’s got a long progressive-Jewish lineage to back him up. When he says he “believes in God in [his] own ways,” he’s not speaking as a quirky, uncombed Socialist from Vermont. However unelectable it may make him, he’s speaking as part of a century-plus tradition of progressive secular Jews who changed the face of America.

[restorefreedom]

21. that paragraph is not horrible as a stand alone piece

other than the inaccurate slam of being "unelectable", but it belongs imo in a discussion of religion and history without bringing pols into it.

this has the unsavory aroma of an antisemitic hit piece all over it. if he had written a generic article about the subject and not mentioned bernie or anyone else in politics, it would be fine. but he is trying to make a connection in people's minds and appeal to their prejudiced reptilian brain.

it is antisemitic pandering cloaked in a cover of thoughtful academic analysis. that is what makes it so vile imo

[DavidDvorkin]

29. I just don't see the anti-semitism.

[JackRiddler]

39. It's also by a writer from the Forward.

This is not an attack, if anything it supports Sanders. This is the New York City normal!

A recent profile in the The Washington Post, headlined “Why Bernie Sanders doesn’t participate in organized religion,” depicted the senator as possessing a quixotic blend of cultural Judaism, kinda-sorta belief in God, and political idealism.

To many Jews, however, this mix is hardly unusual. It’s familiar as chicken soup and matzo: the basically secular, basically atheist Jewish Democratic Socialist, part of the erstwhile 20th-century American Jewish Left populated by the likes of Irving Howe, Woody Guthrie (not Jewish, but married Jewish, raised kids Jewish, sang Jewish songs), Irving Howe, Alfred Kazin, Hannah Arendt, and, later, Gloria Steinem, Bella Abzug, and Yippies like Jerry Rubin and Abbie Hoffman.

The Jewish Left included Socialists, Communists, labor unionists, Zionists, and even future neo-conservatives Saul Bellow, Sidney Hook, Norman Podhoretz and Irving Kristol, who began their biological and political lives in the same social milieu as Bernie Sanders before they turned to the right in the 1960s-’70s. (Their story has been told many times, most recently in Daniel Oppenheimer’s new book Exit Right).

Although culturally Jewish, religiously-nonbelieving Socialism may seem like a quirky blend today, it’s part of Jewish history, complete with red-diaper babies, Socialist Jewish summer camps, and bitter persecution during the McCarthy era before reemerging in the New Left of the 1960s.

Even the Forward, the Jewish newspaper where I also write a column, began its life as a Yiddish Socialist daily, Forverts, edited by Abraham Cahan. (Like everyone on the Left, it was attacked by redder Socialists for being not Left enough.) For many recent Jewish immigrants from Eastern Europe, progressive politics was the new religion, and the only real question was which sect—liberalism, socialism, communism—one liked best.

As the Yiddish joke goes, these Jews knew three worlds: the alte velt, the Old World of Europe; the neue velt, the New World; and Roosevelt.

[LiberalArkie]

20. The article is really very good.

To repeat, this is not true of everyone. Some Hasidic Jews are almost evangelical in their emphasis on personal relationships to God. Many Renewal and Reconstructionist Jews have non-traditional theologies—a bit like Sanders’s—but still emphasize the importance of spiritual experience, ecstasy, or contemplation.

But if we are asking whether Sanders is “religious” in Jewish terms, the reply must be that he is. The question isn’t whether he went to a Passover Seder or stood outside the doors on Rosh Hashanah, and it certainly isn’t whether he believes in a creator deity. Sanders is secular, he is atheist or close to it, and he defines morality in ethical, not ritual or traditional or authority-based, terms.

But if Sanders wants to call that religious, he’s got a long progressive-Jewish lineage to back him up. When he says he “believes in God in [his] own ways,” he’s not speaking as a quirky, uncombed Socialist from Vermont. However unelectable it may make him, he’s speaking as part of a century-plus tradition of progressive secular Jews who changed the face of America.



This is a very good article explaining the way Jewish people think. Most are not "evangelical". Their faith is a faith of "deeds" not of creed. The author further states: In college, I remember a teacher of mine, an Orthodox rabbi, telling me that “To be a good Jew, you need to believe in one God, or fewer.”

Thank you the article explains a lot I have forgotten about some Jewish people I worked with as a young adult.

[restorefreedom]

23. on its face, it is not a bad historical article

the fact that the author links bernie into it and makes some accusations about his young life imo is designed to appeal to some undercurrent of antisemitism/antihumanism.

at least it seems to me. leave bernie out of it and he might have had a nice academic piece.

and in conjunction with hillary all of a sudden touting her christianity all over the place, it seems designed to show a contrast that some will be only too happy to exploit for politicsal points.

i know i have become quite jaded, but that is how i see it.

glad you found something positive in it, though

[LiberalArkie]

25. I think what it does is explain why Bernie is the only candidate out there that

people have not heard saying "Praise God" "Thanks to the Lord" etc. It explains really why people of the Jewish heritage started things like ACLU and most of the Liberal politics we have today. They stress DEEDS more that faith. The "self professed Christians" stress faith more than deeds. That is why they have no problem going to church on Sunday and on Monday through Friday kicking people out of their homes, ripping them off through various means and "praising God" the whole time.

I do not like Daily Caller, but the author did sneak a very good article into a very right wing site. Try re-reading it with that in mind and forget about the site.

[JackRiddler]

40. What are the accusations, however?

[mikehiggins]

22. Hard pressed to think this anti-Semetic

Like the author I have known many jews like Bernie. At times folks have mentioned that, seriously, my best friends are Jews, except for that Puerto Rican guy, and my Irish American cousin. I own that without any embarrassment.

I would rather an upright, ethical person be President than a lying sack of crap who can put his hand on a stack of Bibles and claim his "christianity" offsets his support for a way of life even the Pope condemns.

So, this article gets a "pretty much good for Bernie" rating from me.

[oberliner]

24. What is your issue with this article? It is thoughtful and positive about Bernie

I don't understand what you object to here.

As the the article says:

"He’s speaking as part of a century-plus tradition of progressive secular Jews who changed the face of America."

That is absolutely spot on.

[SusanCalvin]

26. Interesting article, but

With a lousy title and intro.

It didn't tell me anything I didn't already know, but I imagine I'm in the minority there.

[NCTraveler]

27. It appears to be very supportive of Sanders.

I also saw some pretty solid excerpts.

"But secular, progressive Judaism is, itself, a kind of religion. While dispensing with the God of the alte velt—if the Enlightenment didn’t kill him, the Holocaust certainly did—leftist Jews of the 20th century maintained a prophetic, religious zeal for justice."

[cali]

34. WHAt KIND OF CHRISTIAN IS HILLARY?

[NCTraveler]

36. Go read about it.

I have no clue what your reply has to do with the excerpt. I think there have been some recent articles about Clinton and religion. Google.

[cali]

37. It's a "when did you stop beating your wife"? question

[JackRiddler]

41. I think you're misunderstanding this, comrade.

It isn't that at all. It's a profile of his religious beliefs of the kind one sees of every candidate. It's also not history, by the way - this is describing half the people I know in New York. Just a bit older than they used to be.

[Squinch]

28. I don't see the problem. If you are suggesting it's anti-semitic, it just isn't.

[cali]

31. The problem is the title which absolutely carries the burden

of historical anti-semitism

[Squinch]

32. What if there was an article which asked, "What kind of Protestant is Hillary?" Would that be

offensive?

[cali]

33. That's not analogous obviously.

It would have to be what kind of Christian is Hillary. But even so, it's obviously different

[Squinch]

35. OK, then, an article that asked "What kind of Christian is Hillary?" Is that offensive?

You say it's obviously different. How is it different?

[MisterP]

38. not at all (except for the title)