Can someone define "oligarchs?"

[Empowerer]

That term is being used more and more around here and it's not clear to me exactly what it is referring to in this context?

Definition please?

[cali]

1. Sure. I personally try to avoid using it but there really isn't a substitute

that isn't long winded.


An oligarchy us a political system controlled by a small number of people at the top.

[Empowerer]

3. Thanks. But what is an "oligarch?"

[Oilwellian]

9. Errr, a member of the oligarchy?

The word has been used around here for the past 15 years.

[Empowerer]

11. That's not a definition

[Oilwellian]

18. Have you ever heard of the phrase "a form of the word?" n/t

[cali]

21. It certainly is. That you don't like it, is irrelevant

[Matariki]

64. How sincere is your original question?

Because that most certainly is a definition. And oligarch is a member of an oligarchy.

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/oligarch?s=t

From the dictionary:

Oligarchy:
1. a form of government in which all power is vested in a few persons or in a dominant class or clique; government by the few.
2. a state or organization so ruled.
3. the persons or class so ruling.

Oligarch:
1. one of the rulers in an oligarchy.
2. a member of an oligarchy

[Empowerer]

71. Let me ask you this way. How do you define "member" of an oligarchy? How do you define "ruler?"

What is the difference between a "ruler" and a "member?"

For example, does having a lot of money automatically make one a member of the oligarchy? Does being part of the government of an oligarchy make one an oligarch?

[Matariki]

78. Why don't you explain your intent of asking the question.

I think the answers are obvious and I think you are being obtuse for some agenda.

What do you mean by 'a lot of money'?

[ChisolmTrailDem]

69. WTF??? Just stop it and get to the damned point! nt

[Empowerer]

74. Wow - this really has gotten your shorts in a bunch.

Take a breath and calm down. I just asked a simple question. If you don't want to or can't answer it, just go focus on something else.

[ChisolmTrailDem]

75. Get to the damned point. What are you getting at here. Spell it out. nt

[cali]

16. Someone who is part of the power structure.

It could be a politician or a corporate CEO or lobbyist.

[Empowerer]

19. That's a pretty broad definition. By your definition, Bernie Sanders is an oligarch

He is, after all, a politician and, therefore, part of the power structure and has been for decades.

Are all politicians, ceos and lobbyists oligarchs? And if not, how do you determine who is and who isn't?

[cali]

24. Did you miss the word 'could'?

Fail, hon.

You can try to play your usual silly games , but you will get called out on it

The fact is that our political system is controlled by big money. It's laughable when anyone tries to deny that fact.

[Empowerer]

37. You obviously didn't read my post

I offered you a chance to refine your definition:

"Are all politicians, ceos and lobbyists oligarchs? And if not, how do you determine who is and who isn't?"

Simple question.

[senz]

48. Oligarchs are UNELECTED and serve themselves, not the people.

An oligarchy is not a democracy.

This is important.

[Empowerer]

63. So ELECTED politicians can never be defined as oligarchs?

[ChisolmTrailDem]

70. Are you trying to say Bernie is an oligarch? Are you??? nt

[Empowerer]

73. No, I'm not-I'm asking if YOU are since he falls within some of the definitions that I've been given

I'm pretty certain that you don't believe that he's an oligarch, but the definitions are so all over the place that some of them are catching him up in their sphere.

It's very easy to throw around terms like "oligarch" and "establishment" - which I find to be a lazy form of political discussion. I'm simply trying to figure out exactly what people here are actually talking about when they use some of these terms. The fact that, with a couple of exceptions, people are having such great difficulty in coming up with a definition that makes any sense when scrutinized is very interesting and informative.

[ChisolmTrailDem]

77. We know EXACTLY what we mean when we say "oligarch" or "oligarchy" and when Bernie says it.

We don't need you to have us guessing about semantics.

And if you think Bernie is an oligarch, then why do you suppose he's campaigning against what you're attempting to define him as? Why would he be campaigning to shoot himself in his own foot?

[Empowerer]

84. LOL! That's the problem in a nutshell

YOU know what you mean, which is great when you're talking to each other. But you're not just talking to each other - I thought the point of these discussions was to communicate with and, possibly persuade people who aren't already in your camp. The fact that you don't seem to care whether anyone who doesn't already agree with you understands what you're talking about speaks volumes.

Now, if you just want to sit around talking to each other about how great you and your candidate are, that's fine. But don't be surprised if you don't win any converts to your side. Just preaching to the choir doesn't get you very far.

And, FYI - I don't think that Sanders is an oligarch nor have I ever said or even implied such a thing. And I don't think that YOU believe he is one either. I'm simply pointing out that your use of the term based on such an imprecise definition - a definition that you are having such great difficulty articulating- suggests that you might want to come up with better, more precise definition if you are going to continue using the word.

Of course, if you're only interested in talking with other Sanders' believers and don't care what anyone thinks, that's another thing.

[ChisolmTrailDem]

87. Are you going to get to the point before I put you on ignore? nt

[Empowerer]

88. Why don't you just put me on Ignore now?

[ChisolmTrailDem]

90. Okie-dokie, buh-bye. nt

[senz]

76. If they are also members of the unelected ruling group, they could be.

If, for instance, Charles Koch got elected to office, he would still be a major oligarch.

But, we often refer to elected representatives who frequently vote, or otherwise use their office, to provide money and/or power to oligarchs as oligarchs. It would be more accurate to call them something like "lackeys of the oligarchy" or oligarchy servants, etc.

[DanTex]

23. Bernie Sanders, for example.

[cali]

32. Nope. More like the Koch Brothers or Lloyd Blankfein

[senz]

49. Bernie Sanders is a democrat, not an oligarch.

Bernie believes in government by the many, not the few.

That is democracy.

It's shocking that you don't know this.

[Empowerer]

61. Are all Democrats exempt from being defined as oligarchs?

[senz]

66. You don't know the difference between "democrat" & "Democrat?"

A "democrat" (small d) is a person who believes in or supports democracy.

Oligarchy is NOT democracy. You do understand that, don't you?

[Empowerer]

68. I do - I didn't realize you were making the differentiation. My bad.

[senz]

72. Thanks. It helps to keep in mind that

democracy and oligarchy are in opposition to one another, and our government was formed to operate on democratic principles, not oligarchic principles.

Few would ever go to war to fight for oligarchy.

[cantbeserious]

2. Know Thy Enemy - Oligarchs, Corporations, Banks And Their Media Minions And MIC Henchmen

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/oligarchy

Full Definition of oligarchy

plural ol·i·gar·chies
1: government by the few
2: a government in which a small group exercises control especially for corrupt and selfish purposes; also : a group exercising such control
3: an organization under oligarchic control

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oligarchy

Oligarchy (from Greek ὀ??????ί? (oligarkhía); from ὀ?ί??? (olígos), meaning "few", and ἄ??? (arkho), meaning "to rule or to command&quot [1][2][3] is a form of power structure in which power effectively rests with a small number of people. These people might be distinguished by royalty, wealth, family ties, education, corporate, religious or military control. Such states are often controlled by a few prominent families who typically pass their influence from one generation to the next, but inheritance is not a necessary condition for the application of this term.

[Empowerer]

5. I know what an oligarchy is. I'm asking how people define the term "oligarch," which is frequently

used here.

[cantbeserious]

14. Here You Go

oligarch ? plural oligarchs)

A member of an oligarchy, someone who is part of a small group that runs a country.

[restorefreedom]

15. i imagine it is one who participates in the running of an oligarchy

i would consider the koch bros for example, as oligarchs (part of the oligarchy)

ol·i·garch
ˈäləˌɡärk/
noun
1.
a ruler in an oligarchy.
2.
(especially in Russia) a very rich businessman with a great deal of political influence.


notice the refernce to russia....interesting.

[Armstead]

31. Your questions are silly because you don't care about the answers

You ask a question and no matter what the answers you blankly say "Not good enough, not good enough."

Os water wet?

Yes?

No I know is water wet, but is water wet? What do you mean by wet?.....ad nauseum

[Empowerer]

33. You have no idea what I care about

Please go try to read someone else's mind.

[restorefreedom]

8. excellent definition, cbs! nt

[cali]

26. You are playing a game. Poorly.

[cantbeserious]

35. Please Explain

eom

[nashville_brook]

39. looks like cali meant that for The Empowerer

i would, at least.

geh.

[cantbeserious]

40. Roger That

eom

[senz]

46. Oligarchs are UNELECTED rulers. The OPPOSITE of democrats.

That is the problem with oligarchy (rule by the few): it is not democratic.

Democracy is rule by the people. Our democracy is a representative democracy. We elect our representatives and they are accountable to us.

[cantbeserious]

47. Roger That On All Accounts And Particulars

eom

[99Forever]

4. Try this:

https://www.google.com/

[Empowerer]

12. I'm not asking for a google search - I can do that myself. I'm asking how people HERE are defining

it since it's being used so frequently.

Not a difficult question. If you're using the term, you should be able to define it.

[comradebillyboy]

44. At DU an oligarch is anyone who supports Clinton.

For example the head of Planned Parenthood has been called an oligarch at DU. Any prominent Democrat who has endorsed Hillary is called an oligarch at this site. Anyone who doesn't support Bernie is an oligarch at DU now days.

[senz]

54. This is absurd.

The head of PP is not technically an oligarch because she doesn't exert direct, secretive control of our government. If someone called her an oligarch, it was probably because some at DU consider her organization more oligarchic than democratic.

Always balance oligarchy against democracy. That is government by the few vs. government by the many. The United States was formed to be a democracy. We have moved toward oligarchy as unelected individuals exert increasing control over our country.

[redstateblues]

59. Boom. Nailed it!

[restorefreedom]

6. the strict definition

ol·i·gar·chy
ˈäləˌɡärkē/
noun
a small group of people having control of a country, organization, or institution.
"the ruling oligarchy of military men around the president"
a country governed by an oligarchy.
"the English aristocratic oligarchy of the 19th century"
government by oligarchy.


basically, in this context, it probably refers to the extremely wealthy (kochs etc) and the pols that answer to them. very small number of people over a large country.

[reformist2]

10. A clique of rich people who use their money and power to influence - and control - the government.

[Empowerer]

13. Thanks

[senz]

55. Technically, those are plutocrats, but oligarchs can also be plutocrats.

Oligarchy is rule by the few. Plutocracy is rule by the rich.

Bernie Sanders could have used the term plutocracy instead of oligarchy, but oligarchy is the broader term.

[NurseJackie]

17. Used so often as a "catch-all" epithet that it has lost all meaning.

It's become almost comical.

[Kilgore]

27. I agre

[Bobbie Jo]

38. Last year, it was "authoritarian."

Every other post.

[whatchamacallit]

42. They're not mutually exclusive

[NurseJackie]

43. Well, at least they're consistent.

[cantbeserious]

41. Your Opinion Only - Others See The World Differently

eom

[treestar]

82. In as dark a way as possible

[cantbeserious]

86. Thank You For Sharing These Truths About Your Personality

eom

[Armstead]

79. Yes I laugh every day.....

It's so HILaryous to endlessly read new reports of the obscene concentration of wealth, and the endless examples of Big Monopolistic Corporations buying policiesd and politicians.

I split my sides. "Ha let the peasants rot."

[treestar]

81. +1

It just means those evil successful rich people. They must all be corrupt. I guess that does make us feel better about being average ourselves.

[senz]

91. If you care about your rights and freedoms

you should try to understand the term. The difference between democracy and oligarchy is important.

[leveymg]

20. C Wright Mills described them in detail. Read "The Power Elite"

What's your point?

[Oilwellian]

22. I think it's an attempt to empower us

[cali]

28. It's silly and none too swift game playing.

[leveymg]

36. Orwell got it right. Control the language and control the politics.

Guess the upcoming version of the revised Newsweek dictionary doesn't contain that word.

[nolabels]

57. An even simpler analogy, ignore the rats and eventually they will take over

What is going on now is that many new types of communication are being invented and exercised that are crossbred mixture of or even something invented out of whole cloth. That idea that one could bastardize the language and own most of the ways to communicate with any mass of people is being turned upside down.

[DanTex]

25. An oligarch is someone who doesn't support Bernie Sanders.

[R B Garr]

29. LMAO! YES, it truly is that simple.

You nailed it.

[cali]

30. Nope. Not even in the same city as the ballpark, dear Daniel.

[cascadiance]

34. Yep, one of the few politicians they can't pay to control them...

... to do their bidding in subjugating the rest of this country to their will.

[BlueMTexpat]

52. Spot on! eom

[treestar]

83. Yep!

[Hoyt]

45. A derisive term used by Sanders supporters against Clinton supporters. Kind of like Establishment,

Third Wayer, Republican Lite, and such.

[cherokeeprogressive]

51. Unless you can point out a few rich DUers, I'd say you're full of crap, and like the OP...

You have no idea what the word means.

[Empowerer]

62. Let's be clear-I know what the word means, but it is used in so many different ways on DU,

I am trying to determine what YOU think it means.

[cherokeeprogressive]

92. Government OF the Rich, BY the Rich, FOR the Rich.

I thought I made that clear.

[senz]

56. Words have meaning and communication is more than verbal warfare.

The Clintons show a preference for oligarchy over democracy by allowing the government to serve the interests of the oligarchs -- as opposed to serving the interests of the people.

The important thing to keep in mind is that oligarchy (rule by the few) is not democracy (rule by the many). The United States was formed as a democracy.

It's actually a very important distinction. As power is directed away from the many to the few, the people (the many) are disempowered. That was not supposed to happen in our government. It is a big deal. It is, essentially, a coup.

[Empowerer]

67. Actually, the U.S. was not formed as a democracy. It was formed as a republic to be ruled by the few

That few has expanded somewhat over the years (for example, conversion to the popular election of Senators), but it is still governed by a small group of people (President, Congress, state legislatures, county commissions, mayors, city councils, etc.) who are elected by a larger group (those who vote) to represent the interests of the whole.

By the definitions given by some here, it sounds like the U.S. was intended to be an oligarchy and the only way to change it is to scrap the Constitution and start over again with a pure democracy where every decision is made by all of the people, not just their representatives on their behalf.

[senz]

89. Not true. The ultimate power resides with the people through their vote.

Remember: "demos" means "people." So democracy means rule by the people. Democracy and republic are not mutually exclusive terms. A republic is a form of government, and in the beginning, it primarily meant we would no longer be a monarchy. Republic was opposed to monarchy. So our form of government is a republic, but the basic operating principle was (and is) democracy. The people rule.

Our president and elected representatives are not our rulers. We are their rulers. They serve at OUR will. We do not serve them. If we don't like them, we vote them out of office. Because citizens, through the vote, rule the country. That's how it was set up.

Originally, AAs and women were not considered citizens, but we changed that. We are a better democracy now.

Pure democracy does not work on a scale as large as that of a modern nation. Ours is a representative democracy. But the ultimate power still rests with the people, so it is a democracy.

I personally think our Constitution is a thing of beauty that, if followed, preserves our rights and freedoms and that we should vigorously resist any attempt to "scrap" it.

I hope all this is clear; am getting tired.

[treestar]

85. Yes. Authoritarian, bankster, corporatist

1%er, parasite

[Matt_R]

94. Can you explain how Hillary is not Establishment, Third Wayer, Republican Lite?

[cherokeeprogressive]

50. What part of this confuses you?

"a very rich businessman with a great deal of political influence."

Took me all of ten seconds on Google and pretty much sums it up exactly.

[Empowerer]

53. Thanks.

You're one of only two people in this thread that actually provided a clear definition of what they think an oligarch is.

[enid602]

58. Venezuela

Well, Venezuela elected a bus driver as President to take power away from the oligarchs, redefine the economy, and address income inequality. Maduro did shake thing up there, but with predictable results. Hope he's kept up his commercial driver's license.

[okasha]

60. Here's a list of examples. You can generalize from it.

Planned Parenthood
Human Rights Campaign
Emily's List
NAACP
NARAL
League of Conservation Voters
Congressional Black Caucus
John Lewis
Dolores Huerta
Gabby Giffords
Victims of police violence
Disenfranchised voters
Single parents
Transpersons
Lily Ledbetter

Just a few at random, but you get the idea.

Oh. Everyone who's ever drunk champagne from a flute

[Matariki]

65. Right. Because the idea that a small group of wealthy people have enormous influence

is magic unicorns and rainbows.

[treestar]

80. It is used inaccurately here

for the hysterical claim that the US is an "Oligarchy" when clearly it is not. Sort of like when you see insistence that the US is a "police state." Some people want apparently to be victims of dark operations by secretive evil cabals.

https://www.google.com/webhp?tab=lw&ei=205OVvSUEcSt-QGTt4T4AQ&ved=0CAQQqS4oAQ#q=oligarchy+definition

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

93. Those who have the gold make the rules.