Debbie and Hillary's Debategate

[mhatrw]

There is no debate that Hillary Clinton's camp drove the original debate schedule set up by DWS as well as the bullshit Republicrap rule that any candidates who participate in any unsanctioned debates would be banned from any subsequent sanctioned debates.

The limited number of debates and the scheduling of the debates on dates and times chosen to minimize the viewing audience were both things DWS did at Clinton's behest. Their transparent strategy was to limit the exposure of Clinton's rivals to protect Clinton's clear frontrunner status.

Now, we are treated to the some sort of bizarre political theater in which Clinton is supposedly at odds with her own wholly controlled surrogate DWS about scheduling in an additional unsanctioned debate. Why? Don't tell me that Clinton does not have power to order DWS to sanction any debate Clinton wants!



So why? Why this transparent ploy of a "disagreement" between Clinton and DWS about the sanctioning of this new debate?

Because Clinton can't lose at this game. If Sanders declines to participate, Clinton and O'Malley will receive hours of free airtime to sell themselves to the electorate on the eve of the New Hampshire primary. And DWS will be given the power to ban Clinton and O'Malley from the two remaining scheduled debates if Clinton feels that such banning would benefit the Clinton campaign. Then Clinton, with the help of her corporate media cronies, will be free not to debate Sanders or schedule any additional unsanctioned debates at her whim.

If Sanders agrees to the participate, the three candidates' participation in an unsanctioned debate will give DWS the power to cancel completely the two remaining scheduled debates if these cancellations would benefit the Clinton campaign. Then Clinton, with the help of her corporate media cronies, will be free not to debate Sanders or schedule any additional unsanctioned debates at her whim.

[orpupilofnature57]

1. Everything she does is exposed, She's never come forth with Anything that isn't exposed by others !

[raindaddy]

40. Hiiliary's Machiavellian Theater..

“I’m ready for the debate, and I hope Sen. Sanders will change his mind and join us,”
-Hillary Clinton

She has to know how transparent she is and how desperate this makes her look. She either doesn't care or she thinks the voters are really stupid..

[orpupilofnature57]

54. YA!!!!! A modern day version of ' The Prince ' Exactly !!!

[Enthusiast]

58. You have nailed it!

[JDPriestly]

59. I hope that if this ploy is carried out, others will state as I have, that I will vote

for every Democrat on my ballot except Hillary. I will not vote for Hillary.

She is absolutely not a person I want in the White House. This kind of game is despicable.


O'Malley and Bernie asked for additional debates for months. And now, Hillary is losing and suddenly wants another debate.

Disgusting. Just disgusting. That's not playing by the rules.

They want to spring a question on Bernie, and I think I know what it is.

They want to ask Bernie the question he was asked at the forum: Do you favor big government. Bernie simply needs to explain that all the fanfare about making our government smaller in the Clinton era has led to an incredible amount of corruption as the work that government should and must do is being done by private contractors who are not as carefully regulated and managed as government employees would be and who play the payola game.

Halliburton is an excellent example. Think about Cheney's special relationship with Halliburton and its role in Cheney's Iraq War. Was that corruption? Was it a pay off? I don't know for sure. You be the judge.

Other examples are private companies that provide support services for our military. During WWII (the last war we really won unless you count Grenada; Iraq is still a war zone), enlisted men cooked and washed the latrines. Now we hire private contractors to do that work. Are we spending less money on it? No.

Then there are the companies that do the NSA's spying for it. Why do we hire private companies to do that sensitive secret work? Is it really so secret if private companies are doing it?

Bernie needs to think this through because, in my opinion, this is the question they think he can't answer and this is the question they want to raise in a debate.

Bernie would be smart to talk about it now in his speeches and explain what has happened to the size of our government.

We are a big country. Of course our government is big.

I'm a 1000%, make that a one million percent Bernie supporter.

Feel the Bern!

[Warren DeMontague]

2. Maybe because between alienating Millennials and advocating prison for medical marijuana users

someone on Hillary's team finally crunched the numbers of DWS's "popularity".

[99th_Monkey]

3. I say lock them both in a room, with no champaign or caviar, until they give us a coherent answer

to Debate-Gate. We're all dying to find out what those two decide is "best for us" little people.

[restorefreedom]

11. no champaign? they just rigged the debate schedule,

they didn't kill somebody...

have you no heart?

[99th_Monkey]

12. Nope. Just cheap red wine and nachos.

I know that's pretty odious but gee whiz .. how long have they had
already and they still can't get clear between them WTF they even
want.

Yep, I'm being a hard-ass, but not without good reason.

[restorefreedom]

15. wow, box wine and nachos?

when do i show up? *snort*

this whole thing is getting beyond ridiculous, but i can't say i am surprised.....

[99th_Monkey]

17. How is it possible to be really surprised by anything anymore this cycle?

My Surprise-Processor broke-down from overload long ago.

[restorefreedom]

27. i could smell the smoke here!

my head has spun around more times than linda blair

ba da chaaaaaa

[99th_Monkey]

33. LOL- peace to you restorefreedom.. n/t

[restorefreedom]

38. back atcha 99th monkey! nt

[Health Wagon]

29. Mogen David.

Gotta support Israel, you know?

[restorefreedom]

31. mad dog....hmmmm maybe i'll go with beer

beer and nachos....sounds good.

wasn't suggesting it as a political move however....

[libdem4life]

4. Call me an optimist, but I think somewhere an adult will appear and sort it out. n/t

[SusanCalvin]

51. You're an optimist. Now call me a cab. ;->

I'm still trying to find just a description of what happened, apparently while I was at work. All I've found so far is commentary such as this OP, but it sure does sound like a setup so far.

[cali]

5. Brilliant post. You nail it.

[farleftlib]

6. Abso-freaking-lutely

They are completely transparent and I hope they don't think they're fooling anyone with this NH con-game.

Great post.

[BeanMusical]

45. "I hope they don't think they're fooling anyone..."

They have a very low opinion of us proles and believe that they are so clever. Makes me sick.

[AtomicKitten]

7. After 27 debates in 2008, Hillary accused Obama of being afraid to debate her.

Opportunism, thy name is Hillary.

[tecelote]

8. When everybody tells you that you can't lose.

It's gotta really hurt when you lose... again.

[Marty McGraw]

30. SNL will have a bar scene

with her and RMoney Reminiscing

[BeyondGeography]

9. Too Clever by Half would be a good title for this saga

Their original strategy has managed to make everyone look bad at one point or another. Ham-handed power play.

[bvar22]

10. DURec.

The Democratic Party Leadership is very, VERY broken,
and needs to be carried out with the trash.

[jalan48]

13. Hillary just can't believe people don't get that it's her turn!

I mean, she's played along with all the right people, said all the right things and is ready to reward all those who have paid, er, helped her to get this far. Damn it America, wake up and understand Hillary is meant to be the choice!

[retrowire]

14. You say there's no debate that Hillary drove the original debate schedule set up right now

But I'm currently in a debate with someone about that right now... sigh...

[gordyfl]

16. Good Stategy by Hillary

Hillary will say "I was willing to debate for the people of NH. Bernie would not."

If Bernie debates, it gives her a chance to close the gap in NH.

If Bernie accepted, I think DWS would sanction this unsanctioned debate. A favor to Hillary.

Politically speaking, good move by Hillary.

[mhatrw]

19. Do you really think DWS is anything more than a piece on Clinton's checkerboard?

I would have said chessboard, but her two most recent campaigns belie that metaphor.

[gordyfl]

24. Or Tic-Tac-Toe

This election has gotten very interesting, to say the least.

[mhatrw]

26. LOL

[JonLeibowitz]

20. Not if she wants my vote in the general. n/t

[ellennelle]

23. really?

manipulating the rules of the game from the get-go, then changing them midstream, and doing so in such a way as to completely lock in your opponent? hahaha, too clever by half.

that's not even good sportsmanship in TV wrestling, my friend.

[morningfog]

52. Lol. Have you looked at the gap in NH?

Hillary had no chance there, at all, to close the gap.

Hillary looks desperate here. And she looks like she was colluding with DWS. Hillary suggested, before Bernie called DWS bluff, that DWS could sanction it it all three agreed.

Bernie said her wouldn't do it if not sanctioned, after talking to DWS. And DWS came out and said no way, it will not be a DNC debate.

Hillary is left looking like she wanted/needed it, expected DWS to have her back AND Hillary will not join in calling for more sanctioned debates to be scheduled.

Hillary lost this round.

[FlatBaroque]

57. If Bernie debates, it gives her a chance to close the gap in NH.

False

[gordyfl]

61. When I Said "Close the Gap"

I meant she had "a chance", or an opportunity to close the gap (a little).

[PoliticAverse]

18. That's an incredibly cynical analysis...

Clearly you understand politics at a very high level.

[JonLeibowitz]

22. +1.

[Omaha Steve]

21. Fire DWS donate to Democratic Underground for Tim Canova FL-23 here

Democratic Underground for Tim Canova FL-23: https://secure.actblue.com/contribute/page/du4timcanova

[Ivan Kaputski]

56. ^^^

[jwirr]

25. IMO DWS is in trouble - people want her out and Hillary who

is also in trouble are trying to help each other.

Hillary is trying to make it look like DWS is refusing to listen to her about another debate so she is going to set one up herself. That fixes DWS's problem with the party members - she is not working for Hillary.

Hillary also needs another debate before NH (not that I think it will do her any good) and she was hoping that she could get it by using Bernie and Martin to agree.

It is just another you scratch my back and I'll scratch yours game.

[Health Wagon]

28. What's the word I'm looking for?

Catch-22.

[asuhornets]

32. You wrote a rather long piece there.

But it is a conspiracy commentary with a little bit of magical thinking.

[wyldwolf]

41. Yes

He presents a left wing conspiracy theory as a fact then builds his case around it.

[mhatrw]

42. Nobody buys the idea that Hillary and Debbie are at loggerheads on sanctioning this debate.

Everybody, even you, knows that DWS would happily sanction this debate if Hillary actually wanted her to.

[wyldwolf]

43. 'Everybody knows'

'Some people say.'

[mhatrw]

50. Devastating counteranalysis.

I concede.

[awake]

34. A Clinton and O'Malley only debate would help O'Malley as well as Bernie

O'Malley would get face time with out having to share the stage with Bernie at the same time Hillary will have increased O'Malley's stature to an equal. O'Malley could start taking votes from Hillary further eroding her chance to beat Bernie. While Bernie will be able to have the stage to him self in the remaining "DNC Sanctioned Debates" This is a WIN WIN for Bernie and if the unsanctioned debate does not go forward then Hillary will look disingenuous for backing out of a debate that she said she would do she also looks desperate at the moment for even wanting a unsanctioned debate.

[grasswire]

35. AND...if Sanders agrees to this one, Hillary could then pull out.

It could just be a trap for him.

Ugly stuff. Very ugly, Hillary.

[DrBulldog]

36. You got a major point wrong.

DWS, by prior agreement, CANNOT sanction any proposed new debate unless both Bernie and Marin agree to participate.

[mhatrw]

37. So what? She can just choose not to enforce her own rules.

Do you really think DWS will ban Hillary from any sanctioned debate Hillary wants to participate in regardless?

[BeanMusical]

46. +1

[George II]

39. Isn't there a separate forum for conspiracy theories?

[Unknown Beatle]

44. Since the mid-1960s, the phrase has denoted explanations that invoke conspiracies without warrant.

The term conspiracy theory has acquired a derogatory meaning, and is often used to dismiss or ridicule beliefs in conspiracies.

Some philosophers have argued that belief in conspiracy theories can be rational.

Let me ask you something, George II, do you believe in the "magic bullet" theory, the theory that one bullet's (only one single bullet fired from L. H. Oswald's rifle) trajectory traveled around two human bodies and finally killed JFK? If you don't believe that, then you're a conspiracy theorist.






First three sentences taken from Wikipedia.

[BeanMusical]

48. Yes, it's called the Hillary Clinton Group.

[Lorien]

55. ...

?c=2

[BeanMusical]

47. Kick and R

[ViseGrip]

49. Spot on!

Kick!

[mhatrw]

53. I LOVE the response of Sanders' campaign to this transparent ploy!

link

As pangaia so astutely observed, "Damn these guys are smart !!!!!!!"

[cannabis_flower]

60. What if they gave a debate and no one came..

Spread the word to boycott the Clinton/O'Malley debate.