Famed atheist professor says 'being raised Catholic is worse than child abuse’
Richard Dawkins says ‘mental torment’ inflicted by Catholic teachings terrible
By DARA KELLY, IrishCentral.com Staff Writer
Published Sunday, December 23, 2012, 8:11 AM
Updated Sunday, December 23, 2012, 8:11 AM
A former Oxford professor, Richard Dawkins, has said that raising a child Catholic is worse than child abuse and that the "mental torment" inflicted by Catholic teachings is worse than any sexual abuse from priests, reports the Daily Mail.
Dawkins is an atheist biologist whose 1976 book "The Selfish Gene" revolutionized the theory of evolution.
His remarks were to be broadcast this weekend by Qatar-based TV network Al Jazzeera.
When asked by interviewer Mehdi Hasan about previous comments he made, Dawkins said: "Horrible as sexual abuse no doubt was, the damage was arguably less than the long-term psychological damage inflicted by bringing the child up Catholic in the first place."
http://www.irishcentral.com/news/Famed-atheist-professor-says-being-raised-Catholic-is-worse-than-child-abuse-184604441.html
That sound you hear is credibility fleeing from the vicinity of Richard Dawkins.
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intaglio
(8,170 posts)The restrictions, the dogma that all humans including children are evil, the oppressive refusal to inform about sexuality, the submission to authority ...
rug
(82,333 posts)I remind you where you are.
intaglio
(8,170 posts)The only Catholic couples I know are childless. I have met ex-Catholics who considered their upbringing abusive but they may be biased. Equally there are reports in groups such as "Ex Christian.Net" that recount the mental tortures they experienced from such upbringing.
All I am saying is Dawkins' position is defensible. On the other hand you choosing to rant about how Dawkins has lost credibility whilst you are within the confines a "safe haven" merely shows arrant cowardice.
rug
(82,333 posts)In addition to your lack of knowledge about Catholic children, you repeat blithely three false statements:
1) "the dogma that all humans including children are evil";
2) "the oppressive refusal to inform about sexuality";
3) "the submission to authority".
Do yourself a favor and check the pap peddled at exchristian.net at a reputble unbiased site.
Now, about "arrant cowardice". There is no one yet bocked from this Group, unlike your other safe haven group which is the model for what you describe.
Rather than soil that record in here, repost it in Religion and you'll learn what arrant cowardice is and is not.
You won't continue it in here.
Oh, BTW, likening child abuse to a Catholic upbringing is indefensible. It shows as little understanding of child abuse as it does of Catholicism.
intaglio
(8,170 posts)intaglio
(8,170 posts)Sorry, it's your OP get the courage to post for yourself.
rug
(82,333 posts)Go on, don't be afraid. I'm there all the time.
intaglio
(8,170 posts)My response was just that, a response
You're done.
Fortinbras Armstrong
(4,473 posts)The major thing I dislike about DU is the tolerence for atheistic bigotry. I have complained about this bigotry when it occurs -- admittedly, often in intemperate terms, but this is because I am strongly opposed to bigotry in all forms. If I were to say nasty things about blacks or Muslims or Jews or atheists, I would be slapped down (I have been slapped down for saying nasty things about atheists -- specifically, when an atheist was whining about "Oh, we atheists aren't accepted in this country", I replied in intemperate terms that he was whining). But say nasty things about Catholics? Why, that's perfectly acceptable on DU.
rug
(82,333 posts)Putting on silk underwear doesn't change the smell of an ass.
olegramps
(8,200 posts)When I went to catholic school at first communion I was given at little prayer book along with scapulars and a rosary. I still have the prayer book which contained an "Examination of Conscience that you were suppose to use prior to confession. Let me digress for moment. Following Vatican II many psychologists who were joined by numerous theologians successfully petition for dropping the requirement that First Communion must be preceded by confession This was latter reinstalled be John Paul II. It was contended by mental experts to possibly be harmful to children. Returning to my little prayer book it's first five in the list all dealt with sexuality. "Did you look at dirty pictures, say nasty things, do nasty things by yourself or others.". I simply ask was this appropriate for six and seven year olds? How about the harmful affects of teaching children that masturbation could land them in he'll for eternity. I am strongly inclined to agree with mental health care experts that this has definitely caused sever problems of guilt in children and adolescents. The fact is that because of expert concern the church toned down it's war on adolescent masturbation saying that immaturity could lessen it's seriousness. Okay, were children harmed? Seems to me that the church has admitted to this fact. As serious as child abuse by pedophiles, that seems a bit overblown.
rug
(82,333 posts)I saw none of that.
It's hard to make a decision by swapping anecdotes. I'll rely on the expert quoted in the article:
But to your last sentence, comparing this to child abuse is indeed, to understate it, a bit overblown.
Brigid
(17,621 posts)There are far too many of his ilk in the world these days. I have known plenty of people who were brought up Catholic who don't view their upbringing as abusive, whether or not they still practice the faith.
rug
(82,333 posts)Merry Christmas, Brigid!
Brigid
(17,621 posts) 47of74
(18,470 posts)
LeftTurnOnly
(36 posts)Thanks for all of your Catholic posts, rug! Merry Christmas!
rug
(82,333 posts) 
JNelson6563
(28,151 posts)(Disclaimer: I am an atheist, was Catholic much of my life and the church was only ever a source of comfort to me & didn't prompt the change in my belief system.)
Interesting thread on a broad brush statement from Dawkins. I grew up Catholic, including some Catholic school - until 9th grade. I guess we had rather liberal nuns teaching us. No talk of misery in hell, just the absence of God. Catholic school, church and teachings were rather comforting to me, a safe haven from my stormy life at home. My personal experience is so opposite of what Dawkins is asserting here that it saddens me to see him make this statement.
Additionally it is my observation that, while many atheists can be obnoxious on matters of faith, many non-Catholic Christians attack Catholicism just as viciously, perhaps more so.
In the end I'd say there is much back and forth between the various camps but I would say Catholics get the worst of it since it is a common ground between the two groups.
Just adding my .0125 worth while stopping in for a visit.
Julie
rug
(82,333 posts)I had a similar background to yours. While there was plenty of nonsense gong on (which is very easy to ridicule) overall there was a positive, deeply caring message.
Don't be a stranger.
okasha
(11,573 posts)how many of us never experienced the alleged trauma of a Catholic education. My Baptist mother and Episcopalian father sent me to an Ursuline school because of its high educational standards. No talk of burning in hell there, either--just, as you say, being left out of the presence of God and regretting what might have been. And they were fiercely protective of the girls. When I was in sixth grade, several members of a gang came strolling onto the campus, only to be run off, single-handedly, by Mother Paul, who stood maybe 4'10" and must have weighed all of 90 pounds in her winter habit, dripping wet. I have nothing but fond memories of those ladies.
Brigid
(17,621 posts)I have only been a Catholic for a few years, and thus had very few encounters with nuns. But I know that the old-time nuns were not to be trifled with. Rachel Maddow says so. 
musical_soul
(775 posts)because that's just an ignorant thing to say. It's offensive to those who underwent abuse.
This isn't to say that people in the Catholic church can't be abusive. My sister went through some mental abuse being a Catholic daycare once.
For the most part, it's really not that bad for most Catholics. I've been around those kids in Catholic church. They're healthy, happy, full of life. They don't seem like people who have been through mental anguish.
shiningseas1971
(34 posts)and I do not remember ever being told to be ashamed of any feelings we had. I know that we went to confessional and were only told to confess something if it was really bad. This was ohhh about 36 years ago also and our nun didn't wear habits LOL. Our religious studies were only like 30 min a day. I know that once reaching high school, which I didn't attend, there wasn't really any religious studies. I really am sick and tired of people who badger me about believing in God. Oh and how about the, I don't wanna have to look at religious Christmas decorations! What a bunch of whiners! There is a city north of me that is having a court battle about a large cross that is near the city of Frankenmuth, MI. The cross has been there for generations and the atheists are offended by it. Well I don't go around saying that they are wrong and Have to believe in God, so why don't they leave that stuff alone. Sheesh! Comparing Catholic teaching to child abuse! Both of my grandmothers were strict Catholics and didn't even bat an eyelash when I had my daughter out of wedlock.....
rug
(82,333 posts)I was in school too when they transitioned during Vatican II. Interesting times.
