Religion
Related: About this forumReligion Cut Off Her Nose, Science Put It Back On. (Warning: Graphic Image)
Last edited Sun Jul 22, 2012, 12:45 PM - Edit history (1)
Three cheers for science!!
Hip hip, Hooray!
Hip hip, Hooray!
Hip hip, Hooray!
The smile that defies the Taliban: Afghan teenager whose mutilated face shocked the world unveils her new image
An Afghan teenager who was horribly mutilated by her husband under Taliban rule was all smiles as she unveiled her new prosthetic nose for the first time.
Aisha, 19, shocked the world when she appeared on the cover of Time Magazine to lift the veil on the plight of many women in Afghanistan.
Yesterday, she bravely faced the public wearing a prosthetic nose - one that gives her some idea of how she will look after having reconstructive surgery.
Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1319804/Afghan-girl-Bibi-Aisha-nose-ears-hacked-Taliban-rule-gets-new-face.html#ixzz21MstInWj
cbayer
(146,218 posts)world unveils her new image.
Was that too long or did you really think that the Taliban represents "religion"?
immoderate
(20,885 posts)It might not be your religion, but it's surely not rationality, or science, or secular humanism.
--imm
cleanhippie
(19,705 posts)Textbook example.
cbayer
(146,218 posts)cleanhippie
(19,705 posts)cbayer
(146,218 posts)It's not rationality or science or secular humanism. It also does not represent religion, even if it calls itself a religion
The OP's headline was misleading flame bait. It's part of his new path.
cleanhippie
(19,705 posts)Sounds a lot like humblebum's "where you see contradiction, I see confirmation" line.
ellenfl
(8,660 posts)cleanhippie
(19,705 posts)cbayer
(146,218 posts)skepticscott
(13,029 posts)And as early as Post #5. Who wins the pool?
Just out of curiosity, what exactly disqualifies what the Taliban espouses as stemming from religious belief and religious motivation?
alfredo
(60,075 posts)Two were from the UAE
one each from Lebanon and Egypt
TheMadMonk
(6,187 posts)Jim Jones; Branch Davidians; Fundie Momons screwing girls barely into their teens; Orange People; The Exlusive Bretheren; Scientology; Even the supposedly gentle Amish have gotten into the act recently.
Then we can mine the OT for multiple proudly proclaimed examples of God ordained genocide.
The problem is religion. The problem is belief systems which cannot peacefully coexist with any other belief system.
cbayer
(146,218 posts)It's the inability to distinguish between them and the conflating of one into all in order to paint all religion as evil that I object to.
cbayer
(146,218 posts)Do you think it would have been ok if he had said "Muslims cut off her nose"?
Evoman
(8,040 posts)It's monstrous, and it guides them to do horrific things.
cbayer
(146,218 posts)What I object to is the exploitation of this tragic case to score some points in some imagined game by rewriting the headline then proceeding to treat this like a football.
It's no better than what the religious right is doing with the Colorado murders.
Evoman
(8,040 posts)This shit almost makes me cry.....we can help this one woman, but how many more are suffering every god damned day. Women getting acid thrown in their face, being honor raped, having their genitals cut up......it's all because a bunch of fucking neandrethals believe so strongly in the fucking lies written in their shitty religious books.
God I hate religion.
cbayer
(146,218 posts)The local authorities couldn't even do anything.
I know you hate religion and I know you see the worst of it in a glaring way. I understand where you come from on this, though I don't agree with you.
Abuse of women is widespread and not all cases have religious roots. Believe me, I know this to be true.
Evoman
(8,040 posts)This was a lawful act.
Human beings make me sick.
rug
(82,333 posts)"When Aisha was 12, her father promised her in marriage to a Taliban fighter to pay a debt. She was handed over to his family who abused her and forced her to sleep in the stable with the animals.
"When she attempted to flee, she was caught and her nose and ears were hacked off by her husband as punishment."
Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1319804/Afghan-girl-Bibi-Aisha-nose-ears-hacked-Taliban-rule-gets-new-face.html#ixzz21Mzv5zJ3
cleanhippie
(19,705 posts)rug
(82,333 posts)Check your privilege meter.
cleanhippie
(19,705 posts)Pretty sure the Catholic Church operates under a patriarchal system too.
rug
(82,333 posts)With the elimination of religion comes the elimination or patriarchy and misogyny, correct?
cleanhippie
(19,705 posts)rug
(82,333 posts)I am a slave to logic.
cleanhippie
(19,705 posts)Although I fail to see how one can be a slave when its voluntary.
rug
(82,333 posts)humblebum
(5,881 posts)that you are certainly not displaying any affinity towards logic, but are definitely a willing slave to the ideology of radical atheism.
cleanhippie
(19,705 posts)Goblinmonger
(22,340 posts)As my dad would have said: those are some big brass ones, my friend; I'm impressed.
rug
(82,333 posts)Quick, call the authorities!
Goblinmonger
(22,340 posts)Just usually don't see the RCC members trying so hard to point to patriarchy as a problem in a religion.
rug
(82,333 posts)benedictxvi@vatican.va
cleanhippie
(19,705 posts)And that religion and its ideology was directly responsible for this woman's mutilation. No god saved her, but science sure did.
rug
(82,333 posts)rug
(82,333 posts)yet.
cleanhippie
(19,705 posts)cbayer
(146,218 posts)skepticscott
(13,029 posts)It's very healthy for the group to have these kinds of mutual...admiration...societies spring up. Adds to the diversity, which is a Great Thing.
cleanhippie
(19,705 posts)The more people that see things like this, the better.
2ndAmForComputers
(3,527 posts)cbayer
(146,218 posts)barbtries
(28,810 posts)and it does not appear that there were any consequences to the sick fucks who did this to her.
cleanhippie
(19,705 posts)azurnoir
(45,850 posts)cleanhippie
(19,705 posts)While I am unsure of the exact denomination, in this particular case, it falls under the umbrella of Islam, much the same way methodist or baptist falls under the umbrella of Christianity.
People all over the world, from all religious belief systems, can rationalize such acts of barbarism under the banner of their faith. Right here in this country, despicable acts are committed daily under the banner of "religious freedom." This is not some new thing, nor do I see it ending anytime soon.
azurnoir
(45,850 posts)my question was pretty straight forward your answer however was not
cleanhippie
(19,705 posts)Not sure how I could be anymore straight forward. You asked what belief system, and I told you. AND provided you some context, so that you would not be able to misconstrue my response.
You have a really, really, nice day.
azurnoir
(45,850 posts)as for your dancing around a straight answer I'll take that as an answer your OP speaks for itself , I note you only targeted ONE religion as if the girl in the photo was common practice in that religion under the IMO tissue paper thin guise of science vs religion
you really are funny.
azurnoir
(45,850 posts)struggle4progress
(118,330 posts)that Aisha had fled, the police nonetheless did have long memories, and this week arrested one of the suspects. It would have taken 100 armored vehicles to go in there to that village, said the district police chief, Mohammed Gul. Sooner or later, though, everyone in the area comes to the bazaar in the Chora district, in south-central Oruzgan Province. When Aishas father-in-law, Sulaiman, showed up, the police were waiting ... The provincial police chief in Oruzgan was scathing in denouncing the crime and its perpetrators. Sulaiman pointed a gun at her head while the other men, his sons, sliced off her nose, said Brig. Gen. Juma Gul Himat. Sulaiman then took her amputated nose and proudly showed it off around the village. It is rare for the police in Afghanistan to intervene when local villagers impose punishments for social crimes, even severe ones such as flogging and stoning, which are allowed under Shariah law, the legal code of Islam based on the Koran. There is no Shariah law provision, however, for cutting off nose and ears of a runaway child bride ...
Arrest Made in Afghan Disfigurement Case
By ROD NORDLAND and TAIMOOR SHAH
Published: December 7, 2010
http://www.nytimes.com/2010/12/08/world/asia/08afghan.html?_r=1
... The suspect, Sulaiman, who like many Afghans has one name, was released with the knowledge of the governor in south-central Oruzgan Province, said the provincial attorney, Ghulam Farouq. Police officials had said that Mr. Sulaiman, the womans father-in-law, had confessed to taking part in the mutilation in 2009, though Mr. Farouq said he had recently insisted he was innocent. On Monday, Mr. Farouq gave two different reasons for the release of Mr. Sulaiman: that there was no one in Afghanistan to press the case against him because the victim is now in the United States and that he did not cut off the girls nose himself. If someone commits a crime, then nobody else should be punished or arrested, Mr. Farouq said. The crime was committed by his son, Quadratullah, and this innocent guy was imprisoned for 11 months. The governor of Oruzgan Province could not be reached for comment on Monday ...
Suspect in Mutilation of an Afghan Woman Is Freed
By ALISSA J. RUBIN
Published: July 11, 2011
http://www.nytimes.com/2011/07/12/world/asia/12afghanistan.html?_r=1&hp
barbtries
(28,810 posts)it really hurts that this goes on. i'm a woman. i am, in spite of all the bullshit going on, fortunate to be a woman in the US.
cbayer
(146,218 posts)in some kind of imaginary game.
Complete with full pages of rofl's, *snaps*, *bwahahahas*, etc.
It's hard to understand.
barbtries
(28,810 posts)i glanced down and saw for the first time what you were talking about. thank you again because now i can just leave this thread.
Evoman
(8,040 posts)just don't get or keep denying.
Religion is harmful.
Religion is not all fucking flowers and rainbows and MLK.
Even though, stupendously, some people on here are still denying that simple fact.
cbayer
(146,218 posts)I don't think there is any denial here that religion can be harmful, has been harmful and is currently harmful in many ways.
But I would hate to miss the flowers, rainbows and MLK because I can't see past that.
Evoman
(8,040 posts)How many times have we had people here tell us that someones horrible actions is not because of their religion, even when the killers/rapists/abusive parents SAY it is their religion that drove them?
Every fucking time crusades or something like that comes up, it's always blamed on material greed, or land expansion, or politics. Never religion.
I'm sorry cbayer....you must have some sort of blindness not to see the rampant denial of the harm of religion, and the copious use of the No True Scotsman fallacy.
cbayer
(146,218 posts)To conflate them with all the believers that post here would be unfair.
And just because some lunatic says the bible told them to do it, doesn't always mean much. Those stories are worth reading closely. Paranoid schizophrenics often incorporate religious themes into their delusions as a way to make sense of them.
Of course, I will admit that religion provides them with a lot of material.
The fact is, we are not all Scotsmen.
LARED
(11,735 posts)A point some people seem to keep denying
2ndAmForComputers
(3,527 posts)Therefore, random unprotected sex is totally safe and should not be criticized.
cbayer
(146,218 posts)That sucks.
humblebum
(5,881 posts)never to breath fresh air again.
cleanhippie
(19,705 posts)struggle4progress
(118,330 posts)and the anticipated multiple operations will stretch over several years
I bet a lot of the folk who've helped her are Muslim themselves
cleanhippie
(19,705 posts)Too bad they were nowhere to be found when it was happening.
azurnoir
(45,850 posts)so all Muslims all 1.5 billion of them should stampede to Afghanistan? but on that thought where were the atheists when this was happening, surely there are some among the Nato forces there, why didn't they do something?
see makes about as much real sense as anything here
cleanhippie
(19,705 posts)welcome to irrelevancy.
azurnoir
(45,850 posts)but IMO your line of reasoning in comment #47 resembles those who said where are the Muslims expressing their sorrow, disgust with, anger at, at 9/11
cleanhippie
(19,705 posts)Because its irrelevant.
azurnoir
(45,850 posts)that broadbrush an entire group or make statements like the one in #47 to be something other than irrelevant, I'll allow you to fill in the adjective
cleanhippie
(19,705 posts)azurnoir
(45,850 posts)although I am curious what would you like for me to say?
it should be noted that while science helped this girl, it could also be said that a different branch of science is helping to keep the anarchy in Afghanistan going
It should also be noted that this is only one girl out of hundreds who have either been mutilated or attempted suicide by immolating themselves and are left horribly disfigured as a result, what is truly sad is that the take over by these monsters called the Taliban could have been averted unfortunately those who could have helped were too busy with other things, maybe science will help them too, but as things stand can it or will it be used prevent more from becoming victims, or will it be used in Afghanistan to create more victims of different kind and is that any better?
2ndAmForComputers
(3,527 posts)Kavik1
(1 post)Where were the atheists? Perhaps in the US military, who gave her emergency care to save her from dying of blood loss. Perhaps in the doctors and psychiatrists who helped her through months of mental and physical anguish. Why didn't they do something? They did. The USA did. Christians, jews, atheists, who knows, but they did do something.
And you end you say " that makes about as much sense as anything here"
Really? So because you feel you've managed to disprove ONE bit of information (despite the fact that if you actually read her story you'd notice that the USM helped her...) So because you feel you've managed to disprove ONE bit, you can suddenly say "haha, nothing else you said makes any sense either!"
At first I felt bad for you when you were being ridiculed.
However that feeling quickly passed.
demguy_5692
(41 posts)Anyway, best of luck to the girl.